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Saving Cerberus...   Message List  
Reply | Forward Message #663 of 776 |
Re: [maritime_history_downunder] Re: Saving Cerberus...

Dear Ted
 
Regarding saving a modern naval ship. The problem we in the maritime preservation world have is that we cannot hope to save examples of every significant vessel (unlike the case of locomotives in some railway museums). We have to choose. I don't think there is sufficient justification for preserving another relatively modern warship; after all we already have the following post-war Naval ships in museums: Vampire, Advance and two Oberon class submarines (yes 2!!), and there is talk of a number (yes a number!!) of Fremantle class patrol boats also being preserved. I am not saying that another ship would not be interesting or would not be of historic value. Just that if a choice had to be made between saving the Cerberus or preserving the HMAS Sydney, I would vote for the Cerberus.
 
I am afraid it will be hard enough to find a way to save just the Cerberus! I take your point that it would be much better to lift the remains of the ship and take it ashore for proper conservation, display and interpretation. However, I fear that the funds necessary may be difficult to find in time to save the vessel; what with the current economic situation and competition from other worthy maritime preservation projects in Melbourne. That is why I was alluding to the possibility of a more commercially driven solution.
Could the motiving factors behind Governments spending $5.8 million of taxpayer's money on making the Adelaide a dive-wreck be somehow harnessed to stabilize the Cerberus? Is there any possibility of a partnership with a private enterprise or community facility to reduce the ongoing costs or at least generate business activity? For example, could Cerberus on piles become part of the premises of a yacht club in the area? A big advantage of keeping the ship where she lies is that you do not have to dedicate expensive land to her preservation and she is kept in context of her history for the last 80 years or so, maintaining a link with the local community.
 
Please feel free to ignore my musings if you feel you have good chances of success. But otherwise perhaps they might provide a foothold for a viable future plan, even if it is regarded as just an interim measure.
 
Best regards
Mori
 

 
On Wed, Jul 15, 2009 at 10:49 AM, Iron Duke <i_ron_d_uke@...> wrote:


Myself I hope the Government actually preserves at least one of the recent generation of RAN Warships as a museum site, rather than a dive wreck.

The state of play with Cerberus is that she needs urgent external support to avoid a major collapse that would end any chance of preserving her.

There are a couple of proposals on the table for after this, including raising her out of the water at her current location & even lifting her whole & moving her to dry land for an eventual restoration. Of the two, the latter is more expensive, but would certainly provide very good long term value in terms of Australian maritime heritage, education & tourism.

The job could certainly be done, if you look at the restoration of ships like HMS Warrior, SS Great Britain & HMS Gannet, in the UK. And if it was done Australia would end up with a truly unique surviving warship, that was in fact the genesis of all the major Battleships from 1870 up to HMS Dreadnought in 1904.
Many thanks for your help.
Ted



--- In maritime_history_downunder@yahoogroups.com, Mori Flapan <mflapan@...> wrote:
>
> Dear Ted
>
> I have added the exhibition to the group calender.
>
> I was reflecting on the ship's problems when I thought about what Government
> is about to spend on sinking the Adelaide off the Central Coast of NSW. The
> press release reads:
>
> *The Commonwealth Government will contribute up to $5.8 million to the
> project, to prepare the ship and ensure environmental hazards are removed,
> and to then sink the ship in the coastal waters off Terrigal NSW.*
>
> *Senator Faulkner said: "The Commonwealth is delighted that ex-HMAS Adelaide
> will become a major dive attraction and provide significant benefits for the
> Central Coast of NSW."*
>
> It seems ironic to me that such sums are being spent on sinking a modern
> naval ship for the enjoyment of a relatively small section of the community
> for a finite period of time when preserving the Cerberus brings access to a
> much more historic "dive wreck" to very many more persons including school
> children, and for many more decades to come.
>
> The motivator behind the Adelaide must be the business plan that comes with
> the scheme. It would be interesting to understand the economic justification
> behind the government financing the scuttling of these former RAN warships.
>
> Could the Cerberus be stabilized by an internal support frame where she lies
> and be used as a restaurant or something similar? It is not as good a
> solution as a proper museum preservation, but it might be much better
> option than just letting her fall apart. This proposal would see only the
> topsides preserved where she lies. I have not seen her for many years now,
> but in the 1980s, there was still plenty of the ship still there to work
> with. It would be a similar proposal to the Duke & Orr's dry dock
> renovations. but with the Cerberus' topsides resting on concrete piles.
> Polly's dock renovations have cost $11 million. Possibly a similar amount
> might be enough to support the Cerberus. Compare this against $5.8 million
> for creating the Adelaide dive wreck.
>
> Best regards
> Mori
>
> .
>
>
> On Tue, Jul 14, 2009 at 12:38 PM, Iron Duke <i_ron_d_uke@...> wrote:
>
> >
> >
> >
> > Most of you will know of the Ironclad Monitor HMVS Cerberus, built in Britain
> > in 1868, that was once the Flagship of the then Colony of
> > Victorias Navy. Since the 1920's she has been acting as a breakwater near
> > Melbourne & there has been an ongoing campaign to save her. She is now
> > listed as a heritage site by both the Victorian State & National
> > Australian bodies & even the Government has, at last, coughed up a little
> > money to help save her from collapse. However time is rapidly running out
> > for this important historic ship. My better half runs an art gallery &amp;,
> > in
> > association with the 'Save the Cerberus Alliance' we are putting on a
> > special Save the Cerberus exhibition featuring new original artworks,
> > featuring Cerberus, by about a dozen contemporary Australian artists. The
> > Exhibition will also include 19th Century paintings of the ship,
> > photographs, a model of HMVS Cerberus & assorted artifacts from the ship
> > including a giant 10 inch shell. The exhibition will run from 7th-18th
> > October 2009. Should anyone be in or near Melbourne during those dates,
> > please do come along. We hope the opening will include the participation
> > of Victorian Navy reenactors in full 19th Century Naval rig. A proportion
> > of the proceeds of all sales will go to the Save the Cerberus group & we
> > also hope to generate much publicity for this worthy charity. Below are a
> > few useful links with further details... Ted
> >
> > http://www.cerberus.com.au/
> >
> > http://www.pivotalgalleries.com/
> >
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/RoyalNavy_from_1789/
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> Mori Flapan
>
> Mori Flapan's website:
> http://www.boatregister.net
>
> The Register of Australian and New Zealand Ships and Boats:
> http://www.boatregister.net/RegisterMenu.htm
>
> Word Template to help organise information on a boat that you might like
> to contact me about:
> http://www.boatregister.net/ANZRegisterForm.doc
>
> Key to References used:
> http://www.boatregister.net/RANZS_References.htm
>
> Maritime History Downunder Group:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/maritime_history_downunder/
>




--
Mori Flapan

Mori Flapan's website:
http://www.boatregister.net

The Register of Australian and New Zealand Ships and Boats:
http://www.boatregister.net/RegisterMenu.htm

Word Template to help organise information on a boat that you might like
to contact me about:
http://www.boatregister.net/ANZRegisterForm.doc

Key to References used:
http://www.boatregister.net/RANZS_References.htm

Maritime History Downunder Group: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/maritime_history_downunder/


Wed Jul 15, 2009 1:31 am

mflapan1
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Message #663 of 776 |
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Most of you will know of the Ironclad Monitor HMVS Cerberus, built in Britain in 1868, that was once the Flagship of the then Colony of Victorias Navy. Since...
Iron Duke
ayedid2
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Jul 14, 2009
2:38 am

Dear Ted I have added the exhibition to the group calender. I was reflecting on the ship's problems when I thought about what Government is about to spend on...
Mori Flapan
mflapan1
Offline Send Email
Jul 14, 2009
4:25 am

Myself I hope the Government actually preserves at least one of the recent generation of RAN Warships as a museum site, rather than a dive wreck. The state of...
Iron Duke
ayedid2
Offline Send Email
Jul 15, 2009
12:50 am

Dear Ted Regarding saving a modern naval ship. The problem we in the maritime preservation world have is that we cannot hope to save examples of every ...
Mori Flapan
mflapan1
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Jul 15, 2009
1:32 am

Yes I agree one cannot save everything, but I also think we often end up saving next to nothing. I'm sure that people have looked at commercial partnerships...
Iron Duke
ayedid2
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Jul 15, 2009
3:31 am

Dear Ted, Mori and All, Saving Cerberus is a complex and expensive exercise with no simple solutions. Current efforts are probably the last chance, after...
shiprexau
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Jul 15, 2009
7:52 am
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