Does anyone have a list of books found in Dodgson's library?  I know
there have been various discussions on works he read or owned and I
was just wondering if anyone had compiled a list of such things.
Thanks,
Lysette

"lysettenwar" <lysettenwar@...> wrote:
> Does anyone have a list of books found in Dodgson's library?  I know
there have been various discussions on works he read or owned and I
was just wondering if anyone had compiled a list of such things. <

Not exactly. In 1997, Jeffrey Stern brought out a pamphlet called "Lewis
Carroll Bibliophile: a study including a facsimile edition of the catalogue
of the auction sale following C.L. Dodgson's death..." Published by White
Stone, of Luton. A library might either have a copy, or be able to borrow a
copy for you from another library. It isn't a complete list of the books
Carroll owned -- the sale went in sections, and the auction lists weren't
preserved for all the sections. So a book not listed might be one he owned
anyway. (And, of course, he no doubt read some books that he didn't own and
very likely didn't read some of the books that he did own.)

He included mentions of what he'd read in his diary entries and sometimes in
his letters, so that these are also useful for tracking such information.

Ruth Berman

This is an important announcement about the archives  of the Lewis
Carroll discussion group.

From Thursday August 7 all attachments presently in the archives are
going to be deleted and will not be retrievable.

So can I ask anyone who has sent attachments of work, links etc by
this method and who doesn't want the data to be lost, to retrieve
their attachments from the archives and send them to me, so that I
can load them safely as photos or files.

If you don't do this then your information will be lost permanently
in three days time.

Thanks for your attention

Mike Leach
(list owner)

After doing the job for nearly 12 months, Keith Sheel has decided he
needs to stand down from the position of moderator, and therefore
once again I am looking for a volunteer to take on the onerous
responsibility.

So..."if you can keep your head when all around are losing theirs and
blaming it on you" you are the man/woman for this job! Do please
email me offlist if you'd like  to volunteer.

Keith will be staying on until a replacement can be found, and I
think we will all want to express our thanks to him for the good and
conscientious job he has done. I'm sure he will be missed.

Mike

From: mikeindex2001

To: lewiscarroll@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Tuesday, August 05, 2003 12:32 AM

Subject: [lewiscarroll] Moderator Retiring

After doing the job for nearly 12 months, Keith Sheel has decided he
needs to stand down from the position of moderator, and therefore 
once again I am looking for a volunteer to take on the onerous
responsibility.

So..."if you can keep your head when all around are losing theirs and
blaming it on you" you are the man/woman for this job! Do please
email me offlist if you'd like  to volunteer.

Keith will be staying on until a replacement can be found, and I
think we will all want to express our thanks to him for the good and
conscientious job he has done. I'm sure he will be missed.

Mike



to unsubscribe  send a blank email to: lewiscarroll-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

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Hi Kate (and everyone),

No. I will not be leaving the list. I will still need to keep up with
matters LC and this is the place to do it. Although discussions do
take place which are on areas that don't always interest me as an
individual.

My decision came about because of the fansite I own. As Kate knows,
it is dedicated to Hayley Westenra, a young NZ soprano. She is signed
to Decca Classics, the largest classical label in the world, and has
just released her first international album - which is going to be
vey big, by the way. Anyway, coupled with the website is a discussion
group, a chatroom and a forum. The URL of my website is
http://www.hayley-westenra-international.com if anyone is interested
in coming along to see what it is all about. Since June, I have seen
the visits to the website increase more than thirteen-fold. As well
as that, I am co-owner on three other discussion groups and moderator
on two more. All connected with my first love - music. These were on
top of moderating this list. Fortunately, it is usually the case that
this list needs very little input from the moderator. However, with
all the others and Hayley currently on an eight month world tour,
which means trawling the internet for news items breaking from the
four corners of the planet, it was becoming very difficult to read
the posts from all the lists. As things worked out, this list has
been rather quiet just recently, but if the number of posts were to
increase, things could easily become unmanageable.

As a result, I felt it prudent to hand over the reigns to someone
else before finding myself in the position of being derelict in my
duties to our members.

With the other lists, I am fortunate enough to have fellow moderators
who step in and take care of things if my attention is demanded
elsewhere. With this list, Mike is very much a hands-off listowner,
leaving moderatorial decisions entirely in the hands of the
moderator. I know that I could no doubt have called on his
assistance. But I would have no idea for what duration that would be
the case.

So, basically, I am returning to the ranks and letting someone else
run with the baton for a while. So, does being moderator interest
anyone? It really isn't that difficult.

Keith S.

"keithss2001uk" <keith.ss@...> wrote:
> I will not be leaving the list. I will still need to keep up with matters
LC and this is the place to do it. <

Thanks for the work you've put into moderating -- glad you'll still be a
participant!

I mentioned a couple of months back that a local children's theater,
"Theatrix" (a theater company for youngsters who are home-schooled, to give
them some of the kind of extra-curricular activities schools can provide)
did an "Alice in Wonderland" this spring. This August they're repeating it
as part of the Minneapolis "Fringe Festival" of the arts, and a neighborhood
newspaper, the "Southwest Journal," ran an article on it ("Art Spotlight:
Homeschooled kids take center stage at Theatrix," July 24-August 6, 2003, by
Bob Gilbert, pp. 1, 26). I'll be sending copies of the article for mention
in "Bandersnatch" and "Knight Letter."

The article doesn't say what adaptation of the story they're using, but it's
probably something standard; the article does say, however, that Kira
Bundlie (now 23, and one of the founders of Theatrix 8 years ago, along with
her mother Susan Bundlie and friend Zanna Joyce) "has written nine original
songs for the cast of 38, ages 6 to 17. Two of the songs are from the
original Lewis Carroll text, the other seven are original Bundlie." They
give as a sample a verse of "Consistent Inconsistency," her song for the
White Rabbit to sing, complaining that he is always late and thus
consistently inconsistent. Zanna Joyce directed the production, and the
article quotes her as saying: "'Alice in Wonderland' doesn't fit in any
particular mold. Some people don't like the story because it's not a
destination story and doesn't have a moral. It was written during Victorian
times, and Alice's was a fairly rigid childhood." Gilbert adds (evidently
paraphrasing more of Joyce's comments on the production): "Pressured to grow
up and be a lady, Alice instead falls down a rabbit hole and ends up in a
magic land."

The article is illustrated with some photos of the cast in rehearsal. If
people  interested in stage-versions of "Alice" want to contact the paper to
ask for copies, their address is The Southwest Journal, 1115 Hennepin Ave S,
Minneapolis MN 55403 USA, and their email address is info@... --
the email address would probably be the easiest way to find out price plus
postage costs for it.

Ruth Berman

Page 112 Chapter "House on your back" - Foundations

CHIP: When my feet get hot, I have a mental picture of the Red Queen
bellowing "OFF WITH HIS BOOTS!". And off they come........

Jim Buch

Please help me welcome two new members, meckert84 and
harinathraji to the Lewis Carroll Discussion Group.

With our large membership, there is always lively discussion
about our favorite subject -- Lewis Carroll. So whatever your
interest in Lewis Carroll might be: his writings, his
photography, his mathematics, or something else entirely; you
will find people from absolute beginners to the experts
interested in what you have to say.

You will find our members to be friendly and anxious to help
whenever we can. Please do
feel free to ask a question – someone will answer it. You are
each welcome to join in any current discussion, or start a
discussion of your own.

Why not break the ice by posting a little about yourselves to the
list
by way of an introduction?

Thank you for joining the list and we hope you both enjoy being
members!

AnnOxford

Please help me welcome two new members, meckert84 and
harinathraji to the Lewis Carroll Discussion Group.

With our large membership, there is always lively discussion
about our favorite subject -- Lewis Carroll. So whatever your
interest in Lewis Carroll might be: his writings, his
photography, his mathematics, or something else entirely; you
will find people from absolute beginners to the experts
interested in what you have to say.

You will find our members to be friendly and anxious to help
whenever we can. Please do
feel free to ask a question – someone will answer it. You are
each welcome to join in any current discussion, or start a
discussion of your own.

Why not break the ice by posting a little about yourselves to the
list
by way of an introduction?

Thank you for joining the list and we hope you both enjoy being
members!

AnnOxford

Thank you, Mike, for your welcome and your confidence in me. I
shall try to meet the high bar set by my predecessor, Keith. And
Keith, I wish you well in your exciting new endeavors. But don't be
a stranger!

Since joining this list a short time ago, I have learned a great
deal of all things "Lewis Carroll."  (i.e. how to make my credit
card groan by purchasing and reading all of the texts written by
many of our own members, which led me to other texts and so
on, and so on, and so on....  Way too much temptation!)

Until this month, actually, I have been delighted that our
discussions are usually running at high pitch. (I'm beginning to
wonder if all of our UK members have escaped the island for
cooler climbs -- understandibly so!) And of course it is traditional
vacation time for most Europeans and even those of us in the
US rushing about, trying to fit it all in before school starts. So
please, everyone return to us safely!

I am quite exicted about my new responsibilities here. I will
attempt be here at all times to help with questions or concerns. If
I can't, I will find someone who can.

Ok, before I get v'klempt, discuss amongst yourselves. I'll give
you a topic:  Lewis Carroll was NEVER Charles Dodgson.
Discuss!         JUST KIDDING!
Ann

Chloe Nichols  wrote:
> In studying another author, I often come across the label "magical
realism" as applied to his work.  This term seems also to be applied rather
freely to Carroll, though it does not always appear to fit the label.
Well--does he, is he?  <

The term "magic realism" was invented to describe the works of various Latin
American authors whose works are "realistic" during most of the action, but
include various supernatural or fantastic events. It also includes authors
like Borges whose stories would otherwise be called primarily "fantasy." The
extended use of the term seems to represent a way of avoiding the word
"fantasy," which some critics seem to feel should be used only for bad
fantasy (as some critics seem to feel that only bad science fiction is
science fiction, and anything of the sort that's good must be utopian or
dystopian fiction, magic realism, surrealism, or any other term not used as
part of the title on a magazine of popular fiction). Reviews of Jasper
Fforde's "The Eyre Affair" have been calling it surreal fiction, for
example, rather than admit that it's fantasy. So whether the term "magic
realism" applies to Carroll or not -- there's probably no consensus, and
maybe not even a strong majority opinion.

Ruth Berman

Anyone keen on Lewis Carroll's Logical works?  After all, he was
first and foremost a Logician.

Anyone keen on Lewis Carroll's Logical works?  After all, he was
first and foremost a Logician.


This is what I call a topic! I'm joining in this suggestion
Adas


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--- In lewiscarroll@yahoogroups.com, "S. M. Ross" <calscholar@y...> wrote:
> Anyone keen on Lewis Carroll's Logical works?  After all, he was
> first and foremost a Logician.

They appeared to me to be not easy to read (Symbolic Logic Parts I and
II).

His explanations tended to not meet with my expectations - having been
trained in higher mathematics in the middle third of the 20th century.

In his time, there may have been a much different expectation by the
reader. And, his intended reader may have been much more of a
non-mathematician.

The claim of Lewis Carroll being first and foremost a Logician
probably isn't consistent with his published bibliography on his
mathematical works. He seems to have been first a geometer in his
mathematical works.

His work on Symbolic Logic was published very near his death. "The
Game of Logic" wasn't published untill 1886, just twelve years before
his death.

It is easy to make a claim that he was first a Poet, as the name Lewis
Carroll was to be the pen name he was to use for publishing poetry so
as not to "interfere with his mathematical academic writings". This
was in 1853, when he was just 21 and was still an undergraduate and
wasn't publishing much in the field of mathematics.

It is also easy to make a claim that he was foremost a writer of
letters, as the bulk of his letter writing dwarfs his poetry and
fiction book by a large amount. Not everybody likes this assertion,
however.

Jim Buch

>Her name is Ann Meyer, she joined the group a few months ago, and has been a
>soft-spoken contributor on a number of discussions. I'm sure everyone will like
>to welcome her to her new post, and  maybe she would like to post a few words
>her of her own by way of introduction.

Been on holiday, hence the late response. Welcome, Anne!

I was also in Oxford for a weekend and took the opportunity to photograph
Tom Quad etc, but was very disappointed that the rectory garden is out of
bounds (and sight) of visitors.

Best,

Bryan

_______________________________________________ http://www.bryan-talbot.com

Nice prints! Visit:

http://podgallery.com/talbot

Brand new Luther Arkwright website!

http://www.modernvikings.com/luther-arkwright/

--- In lewiscarroll@yahoogroups.com, "Lauren" <AnotherShrubbery@a...>
wrote:
>I am supposed to find some cool, contemporary music
> that could go along with this animation.  Can anyone think of a band
> or song that would lend itself to this?  They're even asking for
rap,
> or just something modern and different, not Jefferson Airplane :) So
> far all I can think of is the Tom Waits Alice album, but it might be
> too gloomy.
>   Any thoughts would be appreciated.

I can't think of anything less appropriate for an Alice animation than
rap music, or any modern music for that matter. Why not find something
at least reminiscent of the Alice time period?

Alice rapping. God help us!

Please help me welcome new member, onyx0072004 to the
Lewis Carroll Discussion Group.

With our large membership, there is always lively discussion
about our favorite subject -- Lewis Carroll. So whatever your
interest in Lewis Carroll might be: his writings, his
photography, his mathematics, or something else entirely; you
will find people from absolute beginners to the experts who are
interested in what you have to say.

You will find our members to be friendly and anxious to help
whenever we can. Please do
feel free to ask a question – someone will answer it. You are
welcome to join in any current discussion, or start a
discussion of your own.

Why not break the ice by posting a little about yourself to the list
by way of an introduction?

Thank you for joining the list and we hope you enjoy being a
member!

AnnOxford

Thank you, Bryan, for the welcome!
Oh, to be in Oxford..... lucky you!
Ann



--- In lewiscarroll@yahoogroups.com, Bryan Talbot
<bryan.talbot@b...> wrote:
> >Her name is Ann Meyer, she joined the group a few months
ago, and has been a
> >soft-spoken contributor on a number of discussions. I'm sure
everyone will like
> >to welcome her to her new post, and  maybe she would like to
post a few words
> >her of her own by way of introduction.
>
> Been on holiday, hence the late response. Welcome, Anne!
>
> I was also in Oxford for a weekend and took the opportunity to
photograph
> Tom Quad etc, but was very disappointed that the rectory
garden is out of
> bounds (and sight) of visitors.
>
> Best,
>
> Bryan
>
> _______________________________________________
http://www.bryan-talbot.com
>
> Nice prints! Visit:
>
> http://podgallery.com/talbot
>
> Brand new Luther Arkwright website!
>
> http://www.modernvikings.com/luther-arkwright/

>
> Alice rapping. God help us!

Amen to that, Joseph!!!

However, I can hear the possibility of something in a jazz form
working (sorry no concrete suggestions at the moment), much
the same way it worked for Peanuts.

Ann

>
> I can't think of anything less appropriate for an Alice animation than
> rap music, or any modern music for that matter. Why not find something
> at least reminiscent of the Alice time period?
>
> Alice rapping. God help us!

Not that I'm suggesting it but The Shadows released an instrumental in the
60s entitled ALICE IN SUNDERLAND. It's pretty forgettable.

I thought that Ravi Shankar's score for the Jonathan Miller ALICE worked
very well.

Bryan

_______________________________________________ http://www.bryan-talbot.com

Nice prints! Visit:

http://podgallery.com/talbot

Brand new Luther Arkwright website!

http://www.modernvikings.com/luther-arkwright/

Please help me welcome new member, madteaparty03 to the
Lewis Carroll Discussion Group.

With our large membership, there is always lively discussion
about our favorite subject -- Lewis Carroll. So whatever your
interest in Lewis Carroll might be: his writings, his
photography, his mathematics, or something else entirely; you
will find people from absolute beginners to the experts who are
interested in what you have to say.

You will find our members to be friendly and anxious to help
whenever we can. Please do
feel free to ask a question – someone will answer it. You are
welcome to join in any current discussion, or start a
discussion of your own.

Why not break the ice by posting a little about yourself to the list
by way of an introduction?

Thank you for joining the list and we hope you enjoy being a
member!

AnnOxford

I have included below the full text of an article from today's Washington
Post that I found while I was skimming the paper (online) during lunch at
work.  It's about a play that is going on in Washington DC this month.
It's not about Carroll's Alice as such, but based (loosely I might add)
on his characters.  This is just so "out there" that I thought I would
share it with the rest of you.

Has anyone out there heard of or seen this?  If so, what do you think?

Enjoy!

-Karen



  'Painted Alice': Something to Tease the Palette

  By Jane Horwitz

    "Painted  Alice," a charmer of a play by William Donnelly, starts like
a modern melodrama, with artists and lovers on the rocks. And just as it
threatens to become tedious, kaboom, Donnelly's script and Theater
Alliance's inventive production, directed by Jeremy Skidmore, open up
like a big, treat-filled pantry.

   When we first meet Alice, an artist in her twenties, she's standing in
front of a blank, unframed canvas, which is suspended at eye level
against a "wall" of white cloth. Desperate for confidence and
inspiration, she's listening to a mawkish self-help tape. But that canvas
silently screams her lack of both.

  It is the center point, the vanishing point in her bare living space.

   Alice, played with a nice mixture of edge and bemusement by Kathleen
Coons, grabs her palette and brushes and approaches the canvas fearfully,
as if it were a snarling dog. Nothing comes. Finally, she flips it a rude
gesture.

   Her lover, Dinah (Diane Cooper-Gould), tries to cheer her up, but Alice
can't be bothered. She hurts Dinah's feelings and hasn't a clue that she
did.

   An abrasive, overdressed art aficionado (Rena Cherry Brown) drops by to
check on the status of her commission. Alice has covered the canvas with
a cloth, but the woman senses she's being bilked. She wants results. She
also announces that an artist they both know has committed suicide --
taken pills and crawled into a dryer. Her stuff might be worth something,
as long as her suicide was art-related and not over anything personal.

   Alone and miserable, Alice hears her self-help tape insult her by name.

  Uh-oh. Disoriented, she spies Dinah and a trendy male artist looking
chummy inside her blank canvas, as if in another dimension.

   Lights change, colors swirl, the canvas opens like a trap door and a
black-clad figure yanks Alice through it. When the lights come up again,
Alice has left her white-on-white apartment and entered a looking-glass
world made of great bolts of color-splashed cloth -- yellows, reds,
purples, greens. The wood frame back of her canvas remains at the center
of Tony Cisek's not-lavish but striking, cleverly conceived set. The
painted dropcloths radiate in all directions from Alice's canvas. Dan
Covey's lighting, from stark white to mixed color, intensifies the
trippiness of the transformation.

  Like the little girl in Lewis Carroll's "Alice's Adventures in
Wonderland" and "Through the Looking-Glass" (on which Donnelly has
loosely based his play), this Alice must go on a journey through nonsense
to get back to something resembling sense.

  "Don't point at the work, ma'am," barks a security guard (Jason Lott) as
Alice stares at tiny watercolors held up by cast members. These were her
childhood creations, she exclaims, whereupon the guard declares a Code 5
-- "fraudulent assertion of authorship." Poor Alice has been shoved into
a realm where good is bad, true is false, and there's just no accounting
for taste. She sits in on a support group for artists.

  "My name is Griffin and I'm an artist," says one obnoxious self-promoter
(Lott again). "Hello, Griffin," intone the others. The wimpy, whining
Sheldon (Mando Alvarado) wonders why his endless series of works inspired
by his own leg sore don't sell. They close the group session singing, "We
the tortured artists, so miserable and sad. . . . We tell you what the
world's about by putting things in pee." A wise old art maven named
Vermiller (Brown again) tells Alice to "be the scourge of the universe,
destroy those that love you best. That is where all the good stuff comes
from. Domestic bliss equals artistic death." She's a critic, of course.
Oh, good.

   Brown does one acidly funny turn after another, but Vermiller is her
pièce de résistance. In heavy Central European accent, puffing on a
cigarette in a holder, she juts her head in front of her body like some
royal pigeon.

  Costume designer Kate Turner-Walker has run with the opportunities
afforded in Donnelly's script. Alice wears modern urban gear, but for
everyone in the looking-glass world Turner-Walker goes for electric
colors and hip whimsy.

   Donnelly does a pretty fine job of pulling -- indeed, yanking -- the
leg of the contemporary art world, a domain that often and with great
pretentiousness seems to do that very thing to the rest of us. He and his
Alice are asking, "Can you be obsessed with making art, be true to your
vision, dare to starve and be unpopular and still have a life?"

  Or can you sell out just a little and live with yourself? Can you be
obsessed with any calling and still have a life? It may not be the big
question, but it's an awfully interesting one, not asked all that often
in contemporary theater. Near the play's end, a successful artist remarks
to Alice that he wishes he could make "a nice day." This gives our Alice
pause. She wants another stab at the real world.

  Sentimental, perhaps. But smart and accessible, too, for a play about
making art.

   There are moments in "Painted Alice" when the whimsy lags, when the
archness droops a little. There are instances when the actors, all except
Coons playing multiple roles, swallow lines, which can be a problem in
the often-hollow acoustics of the H Street Playhouse.

  But director Skidmore and his gifted cast and designers have clearly
been having a ball with Donnelly's play.

   "Painted Alice" asks big questions, but they're writ small and funny.

    Painted Alice, by William Donnelly. A Theater Alliance production
directed by Jeremy Skidmore. Sound, Mark Anduss. Approximately 2 hours 15
minutes. Through Sept. 7 at the H Street Playhouse, 1365 H St. NE. Call
800-494-8497 or visit www.theateralliance.com.

Sounds very interesting but the link:

> www.theateralliance.com.

Doesn't seem to work, at least not with my computer.

Bryan

_______________________________________________ http://www.bryan-talbot.com

Nice prints! Visit:

http://podgallery.com/talbot

Brand new Luther Arkwright website!

http://www.modernvikings.com/luther-arkwright/

I worked on my computer, using I.E., however you can also try
http://www.theateralliance.com/index1.htm , which is the only link from
www.theateralliance.com.



On Fri, 15 Aug 2003 00:49:09 +0100 Bryan Talbot
<bryan.talbot@...> writes:
> Sounds very interesting but the link:
>
> > www.theateralliance.com.
>
> Doesn't seem to work, at least not with my computer.
>
> Bryan
>

07/22/01 - Senator Lewis Carroll has proposed several additions to
the Endangered Species list.  These include:  The jabberwock, which
is being hunted into extinction by vorpal sword-wielding poachers for
its claws and teeth which are sold on the black market; the mimsy
borogove, which is being used for laboratory experiments; the mome
rath, which is being poisoned by farmers due to its eating of
grain stored in silos; and the tumtum and tulgey trees, which are
being logged at alarming rates.  Said Senator Carroll about the
Jabberwock: "Too many beamish boys go galumphing around with the
uffish thought that this manxome creature's whiffling should be
silenced.  They even buy burbling calls at GI Joe's to hunt them,
when they could just get a Jubjub license or Bandersnatch tags and
catch their limit in just one frabjous day!"