Josiah,

I didn't dump any baseless charges and insults onto Gary and you.

I did say, with smiley face, that I hoped the impeccable secret source
wasn't Gary Mack. But at that time I thought you were going to reveal
that she didn't say she stepped into the street at all.

As it turns out, Gary has confirmed that just three hours after the
assassination, she said she stepped into the street. Given that this
is damaging to your case (and his), I now agree that his authority is
impeccable.

Let me summarise, from MY point of view, where we are now:

1. It has been established, without any doubt, that the extant Moorman
Polaroid could NOT have been taken from the street by someone of
Mary's height. It is, in fact, completely consistent with the Zapruder
film's location of her lens.

2. Mary said, just three hours after the assassination, and has
repeated to this day, that she stepped out into the street. IGNORE THE
QUESTION OF WHETHER SHE TOOK THE PHOTO FROM THE STREET.

3. Both Mary and Jean describe Jean waving and trying to get the
President's or Jackie's attention.

4. The Zapruder film shows the two of them stuck on the grass like
frozen turkeys:

http://www.assassinationscience.com/johncostella/jfk/clip_C.mov

5. The Nix and Muchmore films are consistent with the Zapruder film.

6. To my knowledge, no one else described Mary stepping into the street.

The net results are:

A. The Moorman Polaroid joins the Zapruder, Nix and Muchmore films as
presenting a consistent depiction of the assassination.

B. Mary Moorman either was and is a complete liar, or the photographic
evidence is fraudulent.

C. If in B the former is the case, then the Moorman Polaroid is
impeached as evidence -- its admissibility relies on the testimony of
the photographer.

D. If the latter is the case, then the only possible explanation I can
see for no one else seeing her step into the street is that she did it
AFTER THE LIMO STOPPED AND THE MOTORCYCLES DISPERSED.

As I've said plenty of times, I don't like relying on the Moorman
Polaroid as telling us anything at all. What surprises me the most is
that Gary's revelation shows that the issue of WHETHER SHE STEPPED
INTO THE STREET, regardless of where the photo was taken from, is the
key issue here. THAT's the event that does not appear in the Zapruder
film. The Polaroid is irrelevant in all this.

My apologies to David Lifton, who has understood this all along, and
has tried to make me understand. I recommend that anyone who hasn't
read his section in "Pig on a Leash" should do so. (And let me also
say that I haven't communicated with Lifton on this issue since 2006,
when he dug out his transcript.)

I also give my apologies to Gary and Tink. Although I didn't state it
as vehemently as Jim, past behaviour didn't prepare me for them giving
us this explosive and unequivocal evidence confirming Lifton's
transcript, and filling in the missing pronoun.

I think we've all learned a lot in the past week.

John


--- In jfk-research@yahoogroups.com, "gumshoe882000" <gum226@...> wrote:
>
> You hopeless ninny. You still don't get it.
>
> We've been arguing over what should go in the blank where Lifton's
> transcript reads [Unclear]. Instead of speculating, Gary Mack
> listened to a clear copy of the tape and reported what was there.
> That's what I reported. After dumping baseless charges and insults
> onto Gary and me, you get taught a lesson in integrity. And then...
> you still don't get it.
>
> No, the Moorman photo has not been altered. None of the photos taken
> in Dealey Plaza that day have been altered.
>
> Josiah Thompson
>
>
>
>
> --- In jfk-research@yahoogroups.com, "John Costella" <jpcostella@>
> wrote:
> >
> > I'm confused. If this is the same segment of tape that Lifton was
> > transcribing, then wasn't she describing the moment that she took
> the
> > photograph?
> >
> > To be in the street, right at the car, she had to be out there when
> > the limo came to a stop. She didn't say she stepped out a minute
> > before the car arrived, or was where the car had gone.
> >
> > Gary is therefore confirming that Mary has always maintained that
> she
> > stepped out into the street to take her photo. No wonder he had such
> > trouble with her for that more recent interview (see Jim's cut from
> > Lifton's "Pig on a Leash" chapter from The Great Zapruder Film
> Hoax).
> >
> > Curiouser and curiouser. Have we now moved to the point of doubting
> > the authenticity of the Moorman Polaroid in toto?
> >
> >
> > This is what we now have (inserting Gary's information):
> >
> >
> > Q: Hello, Mrs. Moorman?
> >
> > A: Yes.
> >
> > Q You took the picture just after the shooting, or just before?
> >
> > A: Evidently, just immediately, as the. . . Cause he was, he was
> > looking, you know, when (ever?) I got the camera focused and then I
> > snapped it in my picture, he slumped over.
> >
> > Q: What type of picture was this.
> >
> > A: A polaroid picture.
> >
> > Q: About how close were you?
> >
> > A: (background talk, as she discusses it; can't make out)
> >
> > Q: Fairly close.
> >
> > A: 10 or fifteen foot, I, no more (unintell). . . Because I fall
> > behind my camera.
> >
> > Q: This was right at the underpass?
> >
> > A: Yes, just a few feet from the underpass (continues, but she is
> cut off)
> >
> > Q: Were you up on that grassy bank there?
> >
> > A: Yes, that's where we were and I stepped out in the street. We
> were
> > right at the car.
> >
> > Q: Uh Huh.
> >
> > A: (he has cut her off, and she is continuing). . . She (?). . .
> Hollered.
> >
> > Q: Did you see any suspicious person, in conn. . . ?
> >
> > A: Yeah, of course, I have, I was just uh you know (unclear word)
> my
> > camera,
> >
> >
> > > From: "Gary Mack" <GaryM@>
> > > To: "Josiah Thompson" <gum226@>
> > >
> > > Hi Tink,
> > >
> > > At your request, I listened to part of the 11-22-63
> > > KRLD radio interview of Mary Moorman, which was broadcast around
> > > 3:45pm local time. (The original unedited tape and other KRLD in-
> > > house copies are preserved at The Sixth Floor Museum.) While
> there
> > > may be lower-quality recordings elsewhere, the Museum's tapes are
> > > very clear. Here is the relevant portion concerning where she
> stood:
> > >
> > > Jay Hogan: Were you up on that grassy bank there?
> > > Mary Moorman: Yes, that's where we were and I stepped
> > > out in the street. We were right at the car.
> > >
> > > So Mary's memory was that they stood on the grass and
> > > then stepped into the street. Exactly when that happened is not
> clear
> > > from this interview.
> > >
> > > Gary
> >
>