Where is everybody -- showed under?  :-)

What's the best (for the $$) photo quality printer?  I know that the
dye-subs are wonderful, but quite pricey.  I want an inkjet that will
do 8.5x11 paper as it will be used for other things as well.

Thanks!
Susan
-----
Susan Baker Farmer
sfarmer@...
http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/Genealogy/Images

I have the HP 7350 - that I think is selling for 199.00 now.

It uses a color and black cartridge for day to day work and has the
ability to swap the black cartridge for a photo cartridge (additional
colors) for when I print color photos.

The key about this printer is the lasting quality of the ink has been
reported at 75 - 80 + years - when used on HP Premium Plus paper.

The prints are gorgeous and I wanted the ability to print scanned or
digital photos for archival purposes.

In addition - you can use the printer to 'read digital cards' so that
was one less piece of hardware on my desk.

For day to day printing (emails, etc that I am not mailing) I print on
econo-mode - and it is fast and cost effective.

My son and daughter-in-law purchased this as well after seeing the
quality of the prints.

Kay
-----Original Message-----
From: Susan Farmer [mailto:sfarmer@...]
Sent: Tuesday, February 25, 2003 10:22 AM
To: genphoto@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [genphoto] Photo Quality Printer

Where is everybody -- showed under?  :-)

What's the best (for the $$) photo quality printer?  I know that the
dye-subs are wonderful, but quite pricey.  I want an inkjet that will
do 8.5x11 paper as it will be used for other things as well.

Thanks!
Susan
-----
Susan Baker Farmer
sfarmer@...
http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/Genealogy/Images


GenPhoto http://groups.yahoo.com/group/genphoto/
Post message: genphoto@yahoogroups.com
Subscribe:  genphoto-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
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I have an HP G85 printer I got about 1 1/2 years ago. It is also a copier,
scanner and a fax machine. It uses black and color ink.  I love it. If I
don't want to save the photo, I just copy it (instead of a scan) and it comes
out identical to the photo copied. The cost was about $450.00 at Staples but
it was worth it for many projects from craft work to genealogy to home work.
     Lynn


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I also use a HP G85. It does really great quality copies of photos. Staples
no longer sells it however, I found a refurbished one a few weeks ago on an
Ebay auction for about $170 plus $30  for shipping. Sometimes refurbished
electronics are even better than new ones because they have been tested.

Linda


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Looking for recommendations on a good (color) scanner.
The HP G85 printer has been talked about recently, but is it a good scanner?
Is it a good "all-in-one" machine?
Or better to get separate printer and scanner?

- Tom Knox

I think it is great. I have had separate machines but this does good scans.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Tom,

I think the HP G-85 is a GREAT multi-function printer, scanner, copier &
fax,  AND it's all in COLOR to boot.

But the G-85 is being replaced by the HP 6110 and 5110.  Just saw both the
5100 & 6100 series in Micro-Center this week.

I think the 5110 was $159 and the 6110 was $299 less 20%.

Don't know if you have a Micro Center near you.  They are new to me (in the
Detroit Metro area) and seen to have some very good prices.

Micro-Center:
http://www.microcenter.com/single_product_results.phtml?product_id=0149328

Good luck,

Tom in Michigan

  -----Original Message-----
From:  Tom Knox <knox@...> [mailto:knox@...]
Sent: Thursday, February 27, 2003 2:20 PM
To: genphoto@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [genphoto] A good scanner?

Looking for recommendations on a good (color) scanner.
The HP G85 printer has been talked about recently, but is it a good scanner?
Is it a good "all-in-one" machine?
Or better to get separate printer and scanner?

- Tom Knox


GenPhoto http://groups.yahoo.com/group/genphoto/
Post message: genphoto@yahoogroups.com
Subscribe:  genphoto-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
Unsubscribe:  genphoto-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
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I'm trying to figure out how to get a decent scan from that really
coarse (and crappy) matte finish paper that was *so* populat in
the 1970s.  When I scan at 300 dpi (as I do for all images), I
get little white blips where the light is eflecting on the
undulations in the paper.  I did a rough count and came up with
72per inch horizontally -- in alternating rows
and 120 per inch vertically -- like so ...

  -   -   -   -   -   -   -   -
    -   -   -   -   -   -   -

My scanner (Umax) allows for descreen for magazine and newspaper --
and I can manually set the descreen values.

Anybody had any success with scanning this type of paper surface?

Thanks!
Susan
-----
Susan Baker Farmer
sfarmer@...
http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/Genealogy/Images

the only way I have found to copy them is wet.  I run the print through an
archival washer for about ten minutes, then pull the wet print and place it
on the scanner. It is important to check that there is no rubber stamps or
ink on the back of the print, and also that there is no retouching or
spotting on the front (which would be removed by the water)  If this is a
fiber print, dry the print face down on a fiberglass screen as described in
Ansel Adams' book "The Print" available at any library.  if it is RC, use a
heat lamp.  best of luck
--
Thomas Robinson
441 NE Jarrett St.
Portland OR 97211-3126
USA
503-460-0415
> From: genphoto@yahoogroups.com
> Reply-To: genphoto@yahoogroups.com
> Date: 10 Mar 2003 19:26:32 -0000
> To: genphoto@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [genphoto] Digest Number 387
>
> GenPhoto http://groups.yahoo.com/group/genphoto/
> Post message: genphoto@yahoogroups.com
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> editor@...
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> There is 1 message in this issue.
>
> Topics in this digest:
>
> 1. scanning 1970 matte paper
> From: Susan Farmer <sfarmer@...>
>
>
> ________________________________________________________________________
> ________________________________________________________________________
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 11:53:39 -0500 (EST)
> From: Susan Farmer <sfarmer@...>
> Subject: scanning 1970 matte paper
>
> I'm trying to figure out how to get a decent scan from that really
> coarse (and crappy) matte finish paper that was *so* populat in
> the 1970s.  When I scan at 300 dpi (as I do for all images), I
> get little white blips where the light is eflecting on the
> undulations in the paper.  I did a rough count and came up with
> 72per inch horizontally -- in alternating rows
> and 120 per inch vertically -- like so ...
>
> -   -   -   -   -   -   -   -
> -   -   -   -   -   -   -
>
> My scanner (Umax) allows for descreen for magazine and newspaper --
> and I can manually set the descreen values.
>
> Anybody had any success with scanning this type of paper surface?
>
> Thanks!
> Susan
> -----
> Susan Baker Farmer
> sfarmer@...
> http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/Genealogy/Images
>
>
>
> ________________________________________________________________________
> ________________________________________________________________________
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>

Two suggestions for rough surface photos:

1. Rotate the photo 90 degrees and scan again.  The direction of the light
within some scanners can maximize or minimize the pebbly surface.   Try all
four rotations and see what looks best.  (Rotation is also a partial remedy
in scanning wrinkled and torn photographs.)

2. Some scanner software has  an "unsharp" or sharpening setting that is
"On" as a default.  Set it Off.  Sharp/unsharp accentuates pebbly
surfaces.  Even on a smooth surface, Unsharp can generate unwanted
noise.  (If you need sharpening, unsharpening or descreening, apply them
later in an image editing program, where you have some control over the
magnitude of correction).

Patty Fagan
Boston

>I'm trying to figure out how to get a decent scan from that really
>coarse (and crappy) matte finish paper that was *so* populat in
>the 1970s.  When I scan at 300 dpi (as I do for all images), I
>get little white blips where the light is eflecting on the
>undulations in the paper.  I did a rough count and came up with
>72per inch horizontally -- in alternating rows
>and 120 per inch vertically -- like so ...

Susan Farmer <sfarmer@...> writes:
>I'm trying to figure out how to get a decent scan from that really
>coarse (and crappy) matte finish paper that was *so* populat in
>the 1970s.  When I scan at 300 dpi (as I do for all images), I
>get little white blips where the light is eflecting on the
>undulations in the paper.

In addition to Patty's suggestion for a 90 degree rotation, I would
also suggest scanning the photo rotated 45 degrees on the scanner
bed.  I've had some luck with that.

If you have access to a copy stand, with a lot of patience in
adjusting the lights you should be able to reduce most of the
reflections.  A piece of non-glare glass over the photo will help
too.  You  can either mount a digital camera on the copy stand or a
traditional film camera and then scan the resulting negatives or
prints.    I've had a few photos that would just not scan well at
all, but worked pretty well with a copy stand.

good luck

--
Michael Bell
MBell@...

Patty,
A great tip that I've never read before. Used smooth surface paper when we
were printing our own BW pictures in a home darkroom and they scan easily.
Sometimes the magazine setting works well for early school or department
store color portraits.
Elizabeth

----- Original Message -----
From: "Patty Fagan"
> Two suggestions for rough surface photos:
> 1. Rotate the photo 90 degrees and scan again.  The direction of the light
> within some scanners can maximize or minimize the pebbly surface.   Try
all
> four rotations and see what looks best.  (Rotation is also a partial
remedy
> in scanning wrinkled and torn photographs.)

I am ready to think about buying an archival printer. Can someone tell me
anything about them? What is the #1 printer for archival printing? I know
about the $700-$800 Epson printer, but what about dye sub printers? Or color
laser (expensive!). I am totally confused. I read about dye sub, but my
sister who works in the industry says they fade quickly.

I don't want my prints to last 40 years, I want them to last longer than
that. I want to know my GREAT grandchildren will be able to see them one
day.

I am not only the family historian/genealogist, I also scrapbook. At this
point I only use my laser printer to make things for scrapbooking. I would
really love to use color, as well as the thousands of color graphics I have
collected.

I am also hoping to scan antique photographs and be able to share those I
have collected over the years. I am not talking about scanning to disk. I
know that is an option, but I would like to print out photographs and know
they are the best they can be. It just seems like something should be out
there that would make these things last.

I have post cards that are more than 100 years old and most of the look
great as far as the color goes. I know nothing about printing, but what were
these printed with that made them last so long?

Any ideas, web page suggestions, etc. welcome.

Sincerely,
Jann

I too am ready to buy a good archival printer, but have put it off
because it's so complicated. I am making heritage albums for my
children - and grandchildren and great-grandchildren. I have the
photos but would like to do the captions and journaling with my
printer. I look forward to some good advice on this subject.

Marilyn Mills Hesse

----- Original Message -----
From: "Jann G" <jann_grimes@...>
To: <genphoto@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2003 8:21 AM
Subject: [genphoto] Archival Printer


> I am ready to think about buying an archival printer. Can someone
tell me
> anything about them? What is the #1 printer for archival printing?
I know
> about the $700-$800 Epson printer, but what about dye sub
printers? Or color
> laser (expensive!). I am totally confused. I read about dye sub,
but my
> sister who works in the industry says they fade quickly.
>
> I don't want my prints to last 40 years, I want them to last
longer than
> that. I want to know my GREAT grandchildren will be able to see
them one
> day.
>
> I am not only the family historian/genealogist, I also scrapbook.
At this
> point I only use my laser printer to make things for scrapbooking.
I would
> really love to use color, as well as the thousands of color
graphics I have
> collected.
>
> I am also hoping to scan antique photographs and be able to share
those I
> have collected over the years. I am not talking about scanning to
disk. I
> know that is an option, but I would like to print out photographs
and know
> they are the best they can be. It just seems like something should
be out
> there that would make these things last.
>
> I have post cards that are more than 100 years old and most of the
look
> great as far as the color goes. I know nothing about printing, but
what were
> these printed with that made them last so long?
>
> Any ideas, web page suggestions, etc. welcome.
>
> Sincerely,
> Jann
>
>
> GenPhoto http://groups.yahoo.com/group/genphoto/
> Post message: genphoto@yahoogroups.com
> Subscribe:  genphoto-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
> Unsubscribe:  genphoto-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> IT MAY TAKE SOME TIME BEFORE MAIL STOPS! ASK YAHOO ABOUT IT! NOT
ME!
> Please do not try to contact me at the Yahoo Groups list owner
address, use editor@...
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>

Hi Marilyn

I also thought of buying a good quality printer at $800 Australian, plus paper
and ink.
The cost would be well over $1000.00.
The cost of having them done at a photo shop is $1.50 each if you get 6 or more
done at once.
$1.50 into $1000.0 is 666 photos, and the photo shop photos are on thicker paper
and have some sort of
clear coating over the ink and are better.

I decided to spend some of the money on a CD burner instead.

Stephen
Hillarys
Western Australia

Marilyn Hesse wrote:

> I too am ready to buy a good archival printer, but have put it off
> because it's so complicated. I am making heritage albums for my
> children - and grandchildren and great-grandchildren. I have the
> photos but would like to do the captions and journaling with my
> printer. I look forward to some good advice on this subject.
>
> Marilyn Mills Hesse
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Jann G" <jann_grimes@...>
> To: <genphoto@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2003 8:21 AM
> Subject: [genphoto] Archival Printer
>
> > I am ready to think about buying an archival printer. Can someone
> tell me
> > anything about them? What is the #1 printer for archival printing?
> I know
> > about the $700-$800 Epson printer, but what about dye sub
> printers? Or color
> > laser (expensive!). I am totally confused. I read about dye sub,
> but my
> > sister who works in the industry says they fade quickly.
> >
> > I don't want my prints to last 40 years, I want them to last
> longer than
> > that. I want to know my GREAT grandchildren will be able to see
> them one
> > day.
> >
> > I am not only the family historian/genealogist, I also scrapbook.
> At this
> > point I only use my laser printer to make things for scrapbooking.
> I would
> > really love to use color, as well as the thousands of color
> graphics I have
> > collected.
> >
> > I am also hoping to scan antique photographs and be able to share
> those I
> > have collected over the years. I am not talking about scanning to
> disk. I
> > know that is an option, but I would like to print out photographs
> and know
> > they are the best they can be. It just seems like something should
> be out
> > there that would make these things last.
> >
> > I have post cards that are more than 100 years old and most of the
> look
> > great as far as the color goes. I know nothing about printing, but
> what were
> > these printed with that made them last so long?
> >
> > Any ideas, web page suggestions, etc. welcome.
> >
> > Sincerely,
> > Jann
> >
> >
> > GenPhoto http://groups.yahoo.com/group/genphoto/
> > Post message: genphoto@yahoogroups.com
> > Subscribe:  genphoto-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
> > Unsubscribe:  genphoto-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> > IT MAY TAKE SOME TIME BEFORE MAIL STOPS! ASK YAHOO ABOUT IT! NOT
> ME!
> > Please do not try to contact me at the Yahoo Groups list owner
> address, use editor@...
> >
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> >
> >
>
> GenPhoto http://groups.yahoo.com/group/genphoto/
> Post message: genphoto@yahoogroups.com
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>
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My scanner went out two or so years ago and now I use my digital camera to
copy all my photos. Adobe Photo Shop Elements 2 is very good to caption
photos.
Harry

>I don't want my prints to last 40 years, I want them to last longer than
that. I want to know my GREAT grandchildren will be able to see them one
>day.

I know a few folks who have worked their magic with Photoshop and then
uploaded to Walmart.  The print comes to the local store printed on Fuji
Archival paper, which was projected to have a lifespan >100 years.  I
haven't followed any recent tests, though.

Cost isn't much.  Seems like about 0.30 each (US).

Mark

I think the new digital printers are great, and the better inks will deliver
a more permanent print than any color chemical print generally available and
I would encourage anyone interested in quality printing to go this
direction.  Having said that, digital printing does get complicated.  The
biggest problem is getting a color printer to make black and white prints.
Since colors are used in equal blends to produce gray highlights, the color
balance must be exact.  This is nearly impossible because of metamarism.
This means that color inks change their appearance depending on whether it
is viewed in daylight or artificial light.  These prints look a bit green
under a lamp and a bit purple under daylight.  Many people will never notice
this difference, or will readily accept it for what it is, but it is
noticeable.  Photographers who want dead-on straight black and white
generally buy a second printer and load it with custom inks (usually black
and several shades of gray). One good workaround that may be useful to the
members of this particular list is to print black & white as sepia.  the
photoshop default "sepia" works great with the 2200 and Lepp's profile (see
below for download).

I have the Epson 2200, which is one of the the standard archival printers
used by photographers.  There is several other Epson models too.  To the
best of my knowledge, no other manufacturer except Cannon has archival
printers under $1000.  The best source of independent testing information
about life expectancy ratings is http://www.wilhelm-research.com/  Also,
many list members of the groups mentioned below conduct their own
accelerated aging tests, check the archives.

I recommend this as the best overall printer group for digital photo
printing:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Epson2000P/

The group that discusses making black and white digital prints is
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/
Most of these people buy a stock printer, and then from a third party buy
ink and cartridges, sometimes this requires modification of the printer, and
special software.

It is expected that Epson will issue a new RIP next month that may clear
this up somewhat (or may not).   The new model Epson printer with new inks
is probably coming out in November, and it is widely expected that may
control metamerism to a greater degree.  Some of the smaller epson printers
offer "black only", which is to say the black & white print is printed with
only the one ink.  they look allright, you could hang them in a restaurant,
but they are substandard photo quality and a comparison will show you the
enormous difference.

After spending the last year reading all of the lists, and trying everything
i could, I would recommend to the members of this list the Epson 2200 with
Epson Heavyweight Matte paper, and the Epson matte black ink (not photo
black).  If your need top quality black & white without metamarism, join the
fray on the digital black & white list because products are changing weekly.
You will likely want to consider a Epson modified for quad tone b&w inks.
For archival purposes, I would stick with only the known archival
combinations of paper and ink, they must be considered together.

If you buy a printer, you may need additional software to manage the color.
Some of the software profiles are now free downloads on the Epson 2000p
list's files section, and I use them and they are quite good, you would have
to pay $75-$500 for this kind of software to buy it.

Best of luck
--
Thomas Robinson

If there is a COSTCO in your area good color or black and white photos in the
JPEG mode can be had for only 14 cents. Walmart works fine also, prints are
29 cents each. Beats the heck our of all the photo Kiosh the current photo
mags are touting lately. Two dollars for a 4x6 print is a little heavy.
Harry

I have good luck printing black and white photos on my Epson printer, just
tell it to print in black when in the properties mode.
Harry

A recent PC magazine article recently made a similar recommendation -
take digital photos and upload them to a photo printing site.
You can get a lot of photos for the cost of a photo printer and the
never-ending supply of ink cartridges.  And the quality is as good
or better.
I believe I'll be doing this from now on.
Dick Martin

Mark wrote:
>>I don't want my prints to last 40 years, I want them to last longer than
>
> that. I want to know my GREAT grandchildren will be able to see them one
>
>>day.
>
>
> I know a few folks who have worked their magic with Photoshop and then
> uploaded to Walmart.  The print comes to the local store printed on Fuji
> Archival paper, which was projected to have a lifespan >100 years.  I
> haven't followed any recent tests, though.
>
> Cost isn't much.  Seems like about 0.30 each (US).
>
> Mark
>
>
> GenPhoto http://groups.yahoo.com/group/genphoto/
> Post message: genphoto@yahoogroups.com
> Subscribe:  genphoto-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
> Unsubscribe:  genphoto-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> IT MAY TAKE SOME TIME BEFORE MAIL STOPS! ASK YAHOO ABOUT IT! NOT ME!
> Please do not try to contact me at the Yahoo Groups list owner address, use
editor@...
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>

Before you use a web printer, check the life expectancy of their prints by
asking what kind of paper and ink they use.  Many of them are making prints
that have less than ten year life before fading (some are less than six
months before the least stable color shifts by 15%).  The Wilhelm site
www.wilhelm-research.com is the best source of life expectancy ratings. He
also is the person who supplies the life expectancy ratings to PC magazine,
although I am not certain if that is the specific magazine referred to in
Dick Martin's post.
Tom Robinson

Hello, I am new to this list and am enjoying reading through some of
the previous posts.

As video producers of some 10 years, my partner and I have begun to
produce Video Biographies here in Australia. This list has already
been a great help.


Cheers, Stuart
Perth, Western Australia

Will the genphoto list owner contact me privately
as soon as possible?
Thank you.

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com

Hi Group:
Just wondering if any one out there has had any experience with putting music
on CD's that have JPEG images on them. Seems to me that it would be nice if I
could do this on CD's I create and send to family and friends.
Thanks
Harry Short

Harry,

Jasc just put out Paint Shop Album 4 which allows you to make a video CD and
add mp3 files as well.  By the way, my first husband was a Short from
Cedartown, GA.

Judith Marcum
jbmarcum@...
----- Original Message -----
From: <HDMShort@...>
To: <genphoto@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, June 18, 2003 11:52 PM
Subject: [genphoto] CD Music


> Hi Group:
> Just wondering if any one out there has had any experience with putting
music
> on CD's that have JPEG images on them. Seems to me that it would be nice
if I
> could do this on CD's I create and send to family and friends.
> Thanks
> Harry Short
>
>
> GenPhoto http://groups.yahoo.com/group/genphoto/
> Post message: genphoto@yahoogroups.com
> Subscribe:  genphoto-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
> Unsubscribe:  genphoto-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> IT MAY TAKE SOME TIME BEFORE MAIL STOPS! ASK YAHOO ABOUT IT! NOT ME!
> Please do not try to contact me at the Yahoo Groups list owner address,
use editor@...
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>

Judith:
Thanks for the information. No Shorts related to me were from Georgia.
Harry S

Have no idea who isaacnowy.net  is !
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> Judith:
> Thanks for the information. No Shorts related
> to me were from Georgia.
> Harry S
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This person had subscribed - then every post to the group bounced messages to
him.
I have unsubscribed him from the group - so  hopefully things will stop
bouncing.

Sorry about that.
Dawn - Moderator

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hello, I am happy to find this group!
I need lots of advice on scanning and saving our parents many photo albums
from the early 1930's.
I would like to put the better photos on cd's and make copies of the cd's
for other members of the family.
I have some experience in scanning [Plustek Optic Pro 12000T] but have not
created an album or cd from
the photos that I have scanned.  I have a Kodak camera and use their Easy
Share program.
Are there other software programs that I need?
Any suggestions appreciated.
Marge
http://familytreemaker.genealogy.com/users/c/a/s/Marjorie-Casteel/index.html?Wel\
come=1056745788