OK, I get it. There was no reason whatever that the Athenians scoffed. You are
the most open-minded guy here, Roy.



To: evangelicals_and_jws@yahoogroups.com
From: parkrome@...
Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 02:43:43 +0000
Subject: [evangelicals_and_jws] Re: Resurrection and Reality







--- In evangelicals_and_jws@yahoogroups.com, Bryan Peters <collinegate@...>
wrote:
>
>
> So, I guess there was really no reason that the Athenians scoffed. You are the
smartest guy here, Roy.

Roy
There is the most obvious of reasons if you simply take Epicureans and Stoics
for what they historically believed, as I reiterated and as was historically
referred in Barry's quote. These Greek philosophers denied any kind of immortal
life in any form.

One doesn't have to be particularly smart to understand this. He just has to be
a little bit open minded, enough to read the clearly stated facts.

Roy

> To: evangelicals_and_jws@yahoogroups.com
> From: parkrome@...
> Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 01:59:09 +0000
> Subject: [evangelicals_and_jws] Re: Resurrection and Reality
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --- In evangelicals_and_jws@yahoogroups.com, Bryan Peters <collinegate@>
wrote:
>
> Roy,
>
> I'm afraid you are acting somewhat like a jerk would act, if a jerk was ever
to
> be on this list. Is there really an honest point to be made contesting the
idea
> that the general philosophical thinking of the time was that enlightened men
> would -- and should -- escape the prison of the body and live as dis-embodied
> souls? Is it really controversial for me to note that the reason the Athenians
> scoffed at St. Paul's mention of the enlightened teacher who was resurrected
is
> because it ran counter to the entire way of thinking at the time?
>
> Roy
> It only ran counter to their own particular philosophy which was only one of
many different forms of philosophy practiced by different groups of Greeks.
>
> Your attempt to render monolithic all of Greek philosophy is preposterous to
any student of Greek history.
>
> You could have singled out certain Greek sects, like the Epicureans or Stoics,
as examples of Greeks who disbelieved in any immortality of the person without
implying this of all Greek philosophy, or that it was even dominant of all Greek
philosophy. You could have put that into context of what was written in the
account cited. That would have been accurate.
>
> But, instead, you preferred to extrapolate one or two Greek sects into the
whole of Greek philosophy, and treat it as though it was monolithic. You had the
choice to accurately define Epicurean and Stoic beliefs about immortality of
persons in ANY form or body, but you didn't.
>
> You could have responded to the actual many many counterexamples I cited
against your monolithic claim. But again you didn't.
>
> You could have argued how it was implied that one form of resurrected body was
in the focus of the "Athenians" as opposed to another form of resurrected body
when they believed in neither and would treat them as of no consequential
difference from their point of view. Again you didn't.
>
> The "enlightened" Epicureans did not think they would escape their bodies and
continue to "live as disembodied souls", as your standard of Greek philosophy
states above. They believed that any souls were atoms of the same sort as human
bodies and died and dissapated with the death of the human body. The Stoics had
a somewhat similar disposition to the notion of individual souls existing
independently after death as a living thing.
>
> Bryan
> I think the answers are no and no. But, as always, a genuine delight
conversing with you, Roy.
>
> Roy
> Evidence and facts are important to some persons, not to others.
>
> Roy
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> __________________________________________________________
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>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>









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