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The IRV movement in most of the country is third party or independent activists. And who are the bulk of the "verified voting" movement? Democrats. Now myself, I tend to vote for a lot of democrats, yet i don't identify with their party.
Fairvote was started 18 years ago in Cincinnati after a campaign where Rob Richie was political director and they got their butts whooped by the corporate elite, Democratic and Republican Parties, working on a Single Transferrable Voting campaign to reform Cincinnati's election system. Also, Rob Richie's dad was part of the movement to implement PR and Richie is a second-generation election reformer. Fairvote was him and his wife crashing at someone's house trying to help a campaign 17 years ago. But you obviously have never actually met the Fairvote people nor know anything about them, Chris. It reminds me of Bush when he used to tell us "They hate us for our freedoms." I think you hate us because we are well organized and dedicated to our cause.
Furthermore, it has never been my assertion that IRV couldn't be done accurately and transparently. I don't think I need to prove that. Audits/hand counts are not mutually exclusive with IRV. Expecting IRV advocates to come in and ask for a shift in how votes are cast and tabulated as well as to also take on the voting software/hardware industry is RIDICULOUS. Besides, if we all started doing your jobs, what would you folks do?
Change comes in increments... just look at Obama. It certainly hasn't happened over night. That local jurisdictions have locked themselves into machines with contracts and hundreds of millions in costs, yet with you and your anti-IRV democrat colleagues, you seem to want to point the finger at the Fairvote movement for the shitty decisions your elected democrats and republicans have made in selecting these machines. You cry wolf about certification (in your state) as if anyone in the verified voting movement really sees that as something significant (i mean, all those machines in Florida were certified; big deal!).
It is not the fault of IRV that election officials resist audits. I learned about statistically significant audits at the Fairvote conference (like in Minnesota) and have been an advocate ever since. but you would know that, because you didn't attend the conference.
I want to state for the record that I believe the vast amount of data on IRV stands on its own, and that i decided a while ago to stop responding to these life-lacking critics who were recruited to come here by those opposed to IRV. They have no research to back up their claim. Just tired talking points playing on the movements' fears. But when i read some real research and data--something worthy of a response--you can count on me for a rebuttal. I find Ms. McCloy and Mr Telesca's responses on IRV to be pathetically devoid of any real scientific inquiry. "They hate us because...."
i just could spend my time educating 10 new people as spend my time writing this email. And most Americans want more choice, less negative campaigning, less government waste, and like the process of ranking candidates.
So I just want it to be clear: My silence isn't about feeling resignation... it is about focussing my energies. See, my movement is in Florida, not NC, so i don't need to waste my time on two partisan democrats from there who are happy with the two party oligarchy. Just notice in Chris's note the indignation that an election reform activist could work with a Republican (GASP!). Funny, how the truth comes out if you are paying attention. Fairvote, and I, are nonpartisan. I had a Republican sponsor in Sarasota City with IRV, and now I have 2 Republicans and one Democrat who support IRV there. With 78% support of the electorate in my community (with a record turnout of 28% in a special election for the last 10 years at least) we got votes from across the spectrum. I am not part of your Blue Herd. I don't follow herds. Not even Green Herds.
It also goes without saying that if any of my Florida colleagues need to understand something, I am here for YOU. :-) Next generation voting systems that ensure less wasted votes (wasted votes: votes that don't count to elect someone) and greater diversity of competition. I can see why Democrats don't want competition. I really do understand that concept.
Anthony Lorenzo
Re: Why do Special Interests Hate IRV
Posted by: "Chris Telesca" cjtelesca@... cjtelesca
Sun Jun 21, 2009 10:15 am (PDT)
Posted by: "Chris Telesca" cjtelesca@... cjtelesca
Sun Jun 21, 2009 10:15 am (PDT)
Well I would say that FairVote is a special interest - and they and
their "election reform" allies love IRV.
And there is nothing in this article about the negative effects IRV has
had on transparent elections, election integrity and verified voting.
But you should also ask yourself the question - why is it that the
majority of your verified voting and election integrity advocates tend
not to like IRV?
One thing that IRV advocates don't mention is that progressives didn't
need IRV to win elections before. But why is FairVote so interested in
making sure that Republicans don't win elections in Burlington - when
Rob Richie himself stuck the name of a Republican lawmaker from South
Carolina on an op-ed piece not long ago? Why does Rob pick on the
Republicans in one district to help IRV, and then side with them in
another state to push IRV? Is that talking out of both sides of your mouth?
Chris Telesca
Wake County Verified Voting
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