Sharon C. thought you would be interested in this action alert from
ActForChange.com - the resource center for people with progressive values.

Sharon C. wrote: Hi Everyone - thought others might be interested in this one!

ABC: Cancel Biased 9/11 "Docu-drama"

To take action on this issue, click this link or copy and paste it into your
browser:

http://www.workingforchange.com/activism/action.cfm?itemid=21330



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Hi, what rules are you talking about?
I have been studying Eckankar for a few years alone...
Tomorrow is the first time I am meeting with an Eckist.

It took me a couple of years to finally contact one in my area.
Do you find that to be unusual or uncharacteristice for a cult?

Now I am scared to meet this Eckist tomorrow...

I am glad I found this forum...it seems that in my second
conversation with her over the phone she said stuff that put me on
guard...
She said "We can use the help" I thought "uh oh, another user"

           She started to hint about driving together out into
oshkosh...
           for an hours worth chanting sessions...that bugged me...
           For our meeting tomorrow, which is on the way to her house
           she made hints for me to pick her up on the way...
           This kind of thing makes me wary...

Other than this person...I have yet to come into contact with an
Eckist, although I have tried so many times to get in touch with
them...This lead me to thinking that this can't be a cult, otherwise
they would have already invaded my space...maybe it is just this
women, but she did not give me good "vibes"...so I know that I must
not offer her to do anything for her, or even to offer my services to
of ECKANKAR...

I am very interested in knowing what the rules were that
you "couldn't take...I am a very free and open-minded person and hate
rules...
which are distinctly different from spiritual laws

Your response would be very helpful and very appreciated at this
time...

Sincerely and respectfully, macmille2000

Oh God!



I suggest you read the archives here.  Lot’s of good stories to learn from.



Swordansar



From: eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com [mailto:eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com]
On Behalf Of macmille2000
Sent: Sunday, October 01, 2006 5:58 PM
To: eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [eckankartruth] What rules?



Hi, what rules are you talking about?
I have been studying Eckankar for a few years alone...
Tomorrow is the first time I am meeting with an Eckist.

It took me a couple of years to finally contact one in my area.
Do you find that to be unusual or uncharacteristice for a cult?

Now I am scared to meet this Eckist tomorrow...

I am glad I found this forum...it seems that in my second
conversation with her over the phone she said stuff that put me on
guard...
She said "We can use the help" I thought "uh oh, another user"

She started to hint about driving together out into
oshkosh...
for an hours worth chanting sessions...that bugged me...
For our meeting tomorrow, which is on the way to her house
she made hints for me to pick her up on the way...
This kind of thing makes me wary...

Other than this person...I have yet to come into contact with an
Eckist, although I have tried so many times to get in touch with
them...This lead me to thinking that this can't be a cult, otherwise
they would have already invaded my space...maybe it is just this
women, but she did not give me good "vibes"...so I know that I must
not offer her to do anything for her, or even to offer my services to
of ECKANKAR...

I am very interested in knowing what the rules were that
you "couldn't take...I am a very free and open-minded person and hate
rules...
which are distinctly different from spiritual laws

Your response would be very helpful and very appreciated at this
time...

Sincerely and respectfully, macmille2000





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I recieved a permission letter yesterday...this morning a I wrote you
all a really important post...urgent to me...and I hope it went
through...PLease please please let me know if it got through...

I am just a person seeking guidance, definitely not eckist...spent the
night on the Inet and found some really awful info about the group...I
hope my last post got through...because I wanted to share what I found
and the spirit/mental crisis I went through last night after I read an
xeckist womans two letters of Harold Klemp...I want to know what others
think about this...it totally...turned me around...

I am broken-hearted...I thought that it was the definite path...now I
am on very shakey grounds after researching...I need some help from
friends who understand how upset I am about this new enlightenment
about the eck cult...

Sincerely and always with respect, macmille2000

I promise you that I am not an eck infiltrator...I am a lonely seeker
with a very broad mind about spirituality...

That is why I have been so very disheartened...I searched all over
and found documents from long-time Xeckists who wrote to the
present "Mahanta" and found out that Twitchell made up that
name...How can I pray to a made up name? I know Jesus was who He
was...now who is Harold Klemp, that I was so enchanted with???

I went to this one link last night, that blew me away...

http://www.thetruth-seeker.com/openletter.aspnt

I sent this link to an eckankar group at beliefnet.com, asking for
comments last night,
and today, it seems like someone left the link out of my post and it
wasn't me!!!!

This morning I cancelled my meeting with this eckist...because of
what I read on the above link. Oh...her expected response was that it
was the Kal forces, all other religions attack eckankar...blah blah
blah...blah...blah...blah...Eventually she allowed me to get a word
in edgewise...I told her that I was not ready to take the next step
yet and that what I had read on the INet had made me to upset to meet
her today...the conversation ended with her offering her friendship
anyway...I think she was a really needy women who needed me to take
her out to Eck meetings...she doesn't drive...that was just enought
to turn me off...basically I told her I would call her I would pray
about this issue...and I needed my space in order to decide for
myself.

No I am not selfish...I am tired of doing service for others...it has
worn me to a frazzle...it gave me a nervous breakdown, and now I feel
it is my right to sit down and recieve...the truth...

Ya know, if a religion can be made up like that...then each
individual on this planet can make up their own religion and laws and
keep it to themselves...maybe God gave us so much personal freedom to
realize that we are each our own church inside!!!

Love...macmille2000

Ps thank you for giving me the permission to post on this site...I
really was close to falling apart emotionally last night!!

Today I feel free!!!

Hi "Mac" -

I just "got here" today & approved your 2nd two posts.  New members
are on automatic "moderation" but I just changed your settings so your
posts will show up here shortly after you "send" them.

I know it's all a big shock, but just be happy you found out now
instead of in 10 or 20 years!

Anyway, I just sat down here at "the beast" and I'm not "working"
right now, so this is going to be short and hopefully tomorrow morning
I'll be able to write a bit more.  In the meantime, just keep reading
the archives, the links, and the files - one of these days I've gotta
get to organizing the links & files to make it faster & easier for people.

You might want to take a little time "off", even just a day or two,
and instead of reading eckstuff & thinking about it constantly, rent a
really funny video or two, go for a nice walk in the woods or
something...get away from it all & relax, and just do "normal" things!
   And, if you haven't yet gotten to it yet, check out:
http://www.geocities.com/eckcult/masters.html  - it's *so* true and
you might find it comforting right now.

Problem is, when you're out and "recovered", even when you've had the
best intentions about staying around to help out others, it sort of
gets "old" and boring and totally uninteresting, and we're all just
happy to be "out" and enjoying life....especially me!  <gg>  So ET
isn't really very active.

So, I'll get back to this tomorrow morning - usually I'm a bit more
chatty when I wake up...actually, *before* I wake up, while I'm
working on it.  <gg>  Once I'm really awake I don't really feel like
being at the computer, especially if it has anything to do with "the
eck", which to me is something brown & yukky that you don't want to
step in!   And I've been out since '98, so anything & everything I can
possibly say to you, I've already typed more times than I can
remember, and to be honest I'm just a bit burned out doing the "broken
record" thing.  Whatever energy & motivation I have, I'd like to put
towards the new & hopefully totally comprehensive new website where I
hope to say everything I can possibly think of once & for all and
never have to type anything to do with ekult again!!

Hope everyone's having a great day, and that anyone who lives where
it's turning Autumn is enjoying it as much as I am!!!

And while I'm here - I'm going to have another new grandbaby,
everyone!!!!   Don't know what I'm going to do, I'm already 1,000%
blessed & thrilled with the ones I've already got, especially my
favorite little buddy, Codybear!!

Hugs,

Sharon








--- In eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com, "macmille2000" <ccaggia@...> wrote:
>
> I promise you that I am not an eck infiltrator...I am a lonely seeker
> with a very broad mind about spirituality...
>
> That is why I have been so very disheartened...I searched all over
> and found documents from long-time Xeckists who wrote to the
> present "Mahanta" and found out that Twitchell made up that
> name...How can I pray to a made up name? I know Jesus was who He
> was...now who is Harold Klemp, that I was so enchanted with???
>
> I went to this one link last night, that blew me away...
>
> http://www.thetruth-seeker.com/openletter.aspnt
>
> I sent this link to an eckankar group at beliefnet.com, asking for
> comments last night,
> and today, it seems like someone left the link out of my post and it
> wasn't me!!!!
>
> This morning I cancelled my meeting with this eckist...because of
> what I read on the above link. Oh...her expected response was that it
> was the Kal forces, all other religions attack eckankar...blah blah
> blah...blah...blah...blah...Eventually she allowed me to get a word
> in edgewise...I told her that I was not ready to take the next step
> yet and that what I had read on the INet had made me to upset to meet
> her today...the conversation ended with her offering her friendship
> anyway...I think she was a really needy women who needed me to take
> her out to Eck meetings...she doesn't drive...that was just enought
> to turn me off...basically I told her I would call her I would pray
> about this issue...and I needed my space in order to decide for
> myself.
>
> No I am not selfish...I am tired of doing service for others...it has
> worn me to a frazzle...it gave me a nervous breakdown, and now I feel
> it is my right to sit down and recieve...the truth...
>
> Ya know, if a religion can be made up like that...then each
> individual on this planet can make up their own religion and laws and
> keep it to themselves...maybe God gave us so much personal freedom to
> realize that we are each our own church inside!!!
>
> Love...macmille2000
>
> Ps thank you for giving me the permission to post on this site...I
> really was close to falling apart emotionally last night!!
>
> Today I feel free!!!
>

Re: Hi Sharon...

Hi again, Sharon!

Thanks so much for writing...you do a great service by keeping this website...
It is absolutely understandable that you would get burnt out doing all this
writing
about something you really want to let go of, totally and completely.

I am honored that my posts are being accepted! I know you can relate to how much
your forum is helping me today.

Please, do not feel obligated to have to return all the posts I may be
writing...so far I have received very helpful responses from others from your
posting group.

Yeah, I think I will spend the next day or two totally doing
easy-going...non-spiritual-related stuff...watching Animal Planet is my first
choice, and since October is my favorite month, I am going to be doing just as
you suggested...enjoying the beauty that this time of year offers. Maybe
expressing some fun things in my artwork...have lunch with a true friend...

I am joining the Red Hat Society in my areano, it is not another cult... (they
have chapters all over the world) (google Red Hat Society if you are curious...)

just a group of middle-aged to very aged woman who want to go out together and
have fun...Red Hat Society is all about girls just wanting to have fun...!!!

the only requirement is you gotta wear a red hat to all Red hat gatherings(very
dogmatic...lol)...and you also have to wear a purple shirt or dress...(God says
I gotta wear this if I want to have fun LOL)

it causes some attention at restaurants and other public places...but it is just
all in good fun...nothing else is written in stone and in fact, the Red Hats
refer to themselves as a 'disorganization of women just getting together for no
other purpose than to have fun!!!'

My first Red Hat gathering will be this weekend...and I so look forward to it to
just relaxing and laughing some, enjoy dinner with the camaraderie of fun
ladies, at a local small restaurant...

So thank you for reminding me that there is more to life than trying to grapple
with the mysterious ways of the universe...

Congratulations on expecting your new Grandchild...now, that is a true
joy...grandma...admit it (teehee)

May you also have a glorious Autumn!!!

I truly appreciate your correspondence!!!

I will check out the link you have referred me to ...thank you..

Sincerely, macmille2000



   ----- Original Message -----
   From: Sharon
   To: eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com
   Sent: Monday, October 02, 2006 5:29 PM
   Subject: [eckankartruth] Re: Hi Sharon,



   Hi "Mac" -

   I just "got here" today & approved your 2nd two posts. New members
   are on automatic "moderation" but I just changed your settings so your
   posts will show up here shortly after you "send" them.

   I know it's all a big shock, but just be happy you found out now
   instead of in 10 or 20 years!

   Anyway, I just sat down here at "the beast" and I'm not "working"
   right now, so this is going to be short and hopefully tomorrow morning
   I'll be able to write a bit more. In the meantime, just keep reading
   the archives, the links, and the files - one of these days I've gotta
   get to organizing the links & files to make it faster & easier for people.

   You might want to take a little time "off", even just a day or two,
   and instead of reading eckstuff & thinking about it constantly, rent a
   really funny video or two, go for a nice walk in the woods or
   something...get away from it all & relax, and just do "normal" things!
   And, if you haven't yet gotten to it yet, check out:
   http://www.geocities.com/eckcult/masters.html - it's *so* true and
   you might find it comforting right now.

   Problem is, when you're out and "recovered", even when you've had the
   best intentions about staying around to help out others, it sort of
   gets "old" and boring and totally uninteresting, and we're all just
   happy to be "out" and enjoying life....especially me! <gg> So ET
   isn't really very active.

   So, I'll get back to this tomorrow morning - usually I'm a bit more
   chatty when I wake up...actually, *before* I wake up, while I'm
   working on it. <gg> Once I'm really awake I don't really feel like
   being at the computer, especially if it has anything to do with "the
   eck", which to me is something brown & yukky that you don't want to
   step in! And I've been out since '98, so anything & everything I can
   possibly say to you, I've already typed more times than I can
   remember, and to be honest I'm just a bit burned out doing the "broken
   record" thing. Whatever energy & motivation I have, I'd like to put
   towards the new & hopefully totally comprehensive new website where I
   hope to say everything I can possibly think of once & for all and
   never have to type anything to do with ekult again!!

   Hope everyone's having a great day, and that anyone who lives where
   it's turning Autumn is enjoying it as much as I am!!!

   And while I'm here - I'm going to have another new grandbaby,
   everyone!!!! Don't know what I'm going to do, I'm already 1,000%
   blessed & thrilled with the ones I've already got, especially my
   favorite little buddy, Codybear!!

   Hugs,

   Sharon

   --- In eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com, "macmille2000" <ccaggia@...> wrote:
   >
   > I promise you that I am not an eck infiltrator...I am a lonely seeker
   > with a very broad mind about spirituality...
   >
   > That is why I have been so very disheartened...I searched all over
   > and found documents from long-time Xeckists who wrote to the
   > present "Mahanta" and found out that Twitchell made up that
   > name...How can I pray to a made up name? I know Jesus was who He
   > was...now who is Harold Klemp, that I was so enchanted with???
   >
   > I went to this one link last night, that blew me away...
   >
   > http://www.thetruth-seeker.com/openletter.aspnt
   >
   > I sent this link to an eckankar group at beliefnet.com, asking for
   > comments last night,
   > and today, it seems like someone left the link out of my post and it
   > wasn't me!!!!
   >
   > This morning I cancelled my meeting with this eckist...because of
   > what I read on the above link. Oh...her expected response was that it
   > was the Kal forces, all other religions attack eckankar...blah blah
   > blah...blah...blah...blah...Eventually she allowed me to get a word
   > in edgewise...I told her that I was not ready to take the next step
   > yet and that what I had read on the INet had made me to upset to meet
   > her today...the conversation ended with her offering her friendship
   > anyway...I think she was a really needy women who needed me to take
   > her out to Eck meetings...she doesn't drive...that was just enought
   > to turn me off...basically I told her I would call her I would pray
   > about this issue...and I needed my space in order to decide for
   > myself.
   >
   > No I am not selfish...I am tired of doing service for others...it has
   > worn me to a frazzle...it gave me a nervous breakdown, and now I feel
   > it is my right to sit down and recieve...the truth...
   >
   > Ya know, if a religion can be made up like that...then each
   > individual on this planet can make up their own religion and laws and
   > keep it to themselves...maybe God gave us so much personal freedom to
   > realize that we are each our own church inside!!!
   >
   > Love...macmille2000
   >
   > Ps thank you for giving me the permission to post on this site...I
   > really was close to falling apart emotionally last night!!
   >
   > Today I feel free!!!
   >





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Sharon, thank you for sending me to that link...I love it!!! Sincerely "Mac"



   ----- Original Message -----
   From: Sharon
   To: eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com
   Sent: Monday, October 02, 2006 5:29 PM
   Subject: [eckankartruth] Re: Hi Sharon,



   Hi "Mac" -

   I just "got here" today & approved your 2nd two posts. New members
   are on automatic "moderation" but I just changed your settings so your
   posts will show up here shortly after you "send" them.

   I know it's all a big shock, but just be happy you found out now
   instead of in 10 or 20 years!

   Anyway, I just sat down here at "the beast" and I'm not "working"
   right now, so this is going to be short and hopefully tomorrow morning
   I'll be able to write a bit more. In the meantime, just keep reading
   the archives, the links, and the files - one of these days I've gotta
   get to organizing the links & files to make it faster & easier for people.

   You might want to take a little time "off", even just a day or two,
   and instead of reading eckstuff & thinking about it constantly, rent a
   really funny video or two, go for a nice walk in the woods or
   something...get away from it all & relax, and just do "normal" things!
   And, if you haven't yet gotten to it yet, check out:
   http://www.geocities.com/eckcult/masters.html - it's *so* true and
   you might find it comforting right now.

   Problem is, when you're out and "recovered", even when you've had the
   best intentions about staying around to help out others, it sort of
   gets "old" and boring and totally uninteresting, and we're all just
   happy to be "out" and enjoying life....especially me! <gg> So ET
   isn't really very active.

   So, I'll get back to this tomorrow morning - usually I'm a bit more
   chatty when I wake up...actually, *before* I wake up, while I'm
   working on it. <gg> Once I'm really awake I don't really feel like
   being at the computer, especially if it has anything to do with "the
   eck", which to me is something brown & yukky that you don't want to
   step in! And I've been out since '98, so anything & everything I can
   possibly say to you, I've already typed more times than I can
   remember, and to be honest I'm just a bit burned out doing the "broken
   record" thing. Whatever energy & motivation I have, I'd like to put
   towards the new & hopefully totally comprehensive new website where I
   hope to say everything I can possibly think of once & for all and
   never have to type anything to do with ekult again!!

   Hope everyone's having a great day, and that anyone who lives where
   it's turning Autumn is enjoying it as much as I am!!!

   And while I'm here - I'm going to have another new grandbaby,
   everyone!!!! Don't know what I'm going to do, I'm already 1,000%
   blessed & thrilled with the ones I've already got, especially my
   favorite little buddy, Codybear!!

   Hugs,

   Sharon

   --- In eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com, "macmille2000" <ccaggia@...> wrote:
   >
   > I promise you that I am not an eck infiltrator...I am a lonely seeker
   > with a very broad mind about spirituality...
   >
   > That is why I have been so very disheartened...I searched all over
   > and found documents from long-time Xeckists who wrote to the
   > present "Mahanta" and found out that Twitchell made up that
   > name...How can I pray to a made up name? I know Jesus was who He
   > was...now who is Harold Klemp, that I was so enchanted with???
   >
   > I went to this one link last night, that blew me away...
   >
   > http://www.thetruth-seeker.com/openletter.aspnt
   >
   > I sent this link to an eckankar group at beliefnet.com, asking for
   > comments last night,
   > and today, it seems like someone left the link out of my post and it
   > wasn't me!!!!
   >
   > This morning I cancelled my meeting with this eckist...because of
   > what I read on the above link. Oh...her expected response was that it
   > was the Kal forces, all other religions attack eckankar...blah blah
   > blah...blah...blah...blah...Eventually she allowed me to get a word
   > in edgewise...I told her that I was not ready to take the next step
   > yet and that what I had read on the INet had made me to upset to meet
   > her today...the conversation ended with her offering her friendship
   > anyway...I think she was a really needy women who needed me to take
   > her out to Eck meetings...she doesn't drive...that was just enought
   > to turn me off...basically I told her I would call her I would pray
   > about this issue...and I needed my space in order to decide for
   > myself.
   >
   > No I am not selfish...I am tired of doing service for others...it has
   > worn me to a frazzle...it gave me a nervous breakdown, and now I feel
   > it is my right to sit down and recieve...the truth...
   >
   > Ya know, if a religion can be made up like that...then each
   > individual on this planet can make up their own religion and laws and
   > keep it to themselves...maybe God gave us so much personal freedom to
   > realize that we are each our own church inside!!!
   >
   > Love...macmille2000
   >
   > Ps thank you for giving me the permission to post on this site...I
   > really was close to falling apart emotionally last night!!
   >
   > Today I feel free!!!
   >





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hi Camille -

Well, I'm glad your name showed up on your new posts!  There's
a big difference between Camille and Mac!  <gg>

I skimmed over all your posts again just now, and noticed you
referred to praying, which I thought was sort of funny!  Maybe
you didn't get to the "teachings" about prayer...it's really
black magic.  <gg>

Yep, it sounds like you fell for it hook, line, and sinker just
like I did!!

For me, it's "morning" right now, and since I said I'd write,
here I am!!  I've gotta watch that and be more careful about
promising to write.  I did that to someone privately quite
awhile back and not a day goes by that I don't *try* to, but I
just haven't.  Gonna try to, today, just to get it off "the
list".  Anyway, wouldn't you know it, I say I'm going to write
in the morning, then end up being up from 2-6 am and re-
sleeping until noon.  This is the 2nd day that's happened!!
What I like to do best is get up between 4:30 & 6 am, when it's
still dark, quiet, and peaceful - that's when I'm most
productive!

Right now I just don't have much to say about the cult.  Just
keep reading what's on the internet!   Oh...it's quite likely
that like me, you used to think that cults were little groups
of "weirdos" and various kinds of extremists, so naturally we
never suspected we were actually *in* one!!  I remember a
special Satsang years back, instead of the usual discourse, the
subject was "why eckankar's not a cult".   That was back in the
early 90's, and now it's understandable - the HI Arahata had
obviously gotten special instructions from MN after they saw
where the internet was heading, and how there were going to be
problems when members started getting *real* enlightenment!
The Arahata seemed just as surprised and slightly befuddled
about the whole thing as I was, sort of amazed that anyone
would even *think* eckankar was a cult!!   Well, there are many
different kinds of cults.  Ekult's relatively "benign".

Quite often, those nice sincere eckists who give those standard
replies about "the kal" and how the whole universe is against
ekult's "truth" and trying to destroy it haven't even bothered
to look at the evidence.  That excuse is standard in cults!!
It's just one of many cultic techniques/tactics we fell for.

Well...just keep reading!!

One thing I found myself doing, because Twitch stole from
everywhere and ended up producing such a convoluted mess of
"teachings" from so many sources, I sort of dumped *everything*
I "believed" in.  Right after I left, this involved doing a lot
of re-examining the eckbooks and *thinking* about it all,
objectively, and using critical thinking.

If you haven't gotten to them yet, I hope you'll check out the
other "ex" groups - EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous and X-Eckankar,
mostly.  There's more activity, and ESA's "Prometheus" posts a
lot of good commentary on Klemp's more recent writings, like
the rather new "eckmasters" book.  By the way, you might find
it easier to keep on top of things if you select the "daily
digest" option for getting group postings.

The thing is, Klemp *knew* the truth back when he became LEM...
he knew about the plagiarism, confirmed it through his own (or
the staff's) research, and he even knows about some plagiarism
that no one's found yet!!  The closest he's come to giving up
that Astral Library b.s. is calling the plagiarized sources
"parallel writings".   Even the "Great Compiler" moniker is
misleading baloney...Twitch did *not* uncover hidden truths in
all the dark corners of the universe or Rebizarre's hut - he
got them from his local library!!!!!

Oh...don't know if you've seen alt.religion.eckankar - it's
quite an experience altho I don't really pay attention to it
anymore.  But, I skimmed a daily digest rather recently and
very glad I did - "Tianyue" (aka Tom Leafeater, which is how
I'll always think of him!) posted more new plagiarism he'd
found in Alan Watts' work!   Geez, I carried my Watts book 24/7
for awhile back in high school in the 60's, but when I got to
eckankult years later, I still fell for that crap about
eckstuff "resonating" because I'd learned it in past lives with
"the master"!

(BTW, Leaf, if you're reading this - if you've done a paragraph
by paragraph comparison, feel free to stick it in the "files"
here and maybe send a copy to David Lane, so maybe he'll get
around to adding it to the Center for Twitchellian Plagiarism
site one of these days, along with a lot of other plagiarism
examples he doesn't have there.)

And you know, just because something's "old" and accepted as
"truth", doesn't mean it really is.

Okay...that's it for me right now!!  Hey, enjoy the "Red Hat
Society"!!  I've got a scanned copy of the original poem in the
"Photos" section here, from a card someone sent me years ago.

I feel sorry for that Eckist you were going to meet.  It's sort
of odd, though...at first, it's likely she thought that your
contact was a gift from "the master" or something, exactly what
she needed at just the right time!   Isn't a bit ironic that
since things didn't turn out as she'd hoped, she's going to
stop and *not* consider that the *real* blessing in your
calling her was perhaps an opportunity for her to wake up and
learn the truth?

You'd probably be surprised to know your story & experience
isn't unique at all.  It's not unusual for relatively new (and
even old ones!) eckists to do a bit of web-surfing at just the
right time, when they were about to get more deeply involved
and committed to it.  And when they take what they've
discovered to an HI, they'll get the same response you did!

Anyway, I'd suggest you give yourself some "down time" on the
"spirituality".  Just don't worry about it.  Physical life is
(or can/should be) just as "spiritual" as "non-physical",
without even thinking about it.

Oh, one thing I just started doing was something I've wanted to
for years - study Edgar Cayce a bit.    Twitch was quite
familiar with Cayce, of course...even stole bits & pieces from
Cayce, like claiming that he could "read" books by putting them
under his pillow.  Here's a bit of "eck history" you probably
never knew, but I think it reveals something, amazing that I
put this one on the shelf too, figured it was the kal that made
me feel a bit uneasy, but like most eckists who notice they're
starting to *think*, I stopped it by huing.  <gg>

Anyway, Twitch used to charge big $$$ for eck-vidya "readings"
until eckists broke the "Law of Silence" and started comparing
their readings.  Surprise, surprise - guess what!!  They
learned Twitch was giving the same past-life readings to
different people!  I've gotta find & post what he said...
basically, he said there were some kind of high holey spirichul
reasons for these duplicate readings that only a "master" could
understand, words to that effect.  Sort of like in the Wizard
of Oz - "Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain!!"
<gg>

Oh, this is funny!!  I just looked thru one box where I thought
I might have stuck an old seminar pamphlet which listed how
much he was charging for readings - a pamphlet that also
offered some of Brad Steiger's books for sale, not just IMSIAF.
  Well, didn't find it but I came across a little booklet I've
never looked at:  "The Eck-Vidya--The Akasa Science of
Prophecy" by Paul Twitchell, copyright 1968 by PT, my copy's
the 1972 third printing.

Darn, wish my scanner hadn't died!!  The predictions are
hilarious, I'd love to scan the whole thing!!   One of these
days maybe I'll type it up - BTW, does anyone remember 1981?  A
tidal wave was supposed to demolish Hawaii.  And "about the
year 2000" nations are supposed to unite to fight alien
invaders, "one of the greater planets like Mars".

Hey, I've gotta run!!   And I hope tomorrow I start waking up
at my favorite & usual time before the sun comes up!!  It's a
beautiful day out there!

Hugs,

Sharon







--- In eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com, Camille <ccaggia@...>
wrote:
>
>   Sharon, thank you for sending me to that link...I love it!
!! Sincerely "Mac"
>
>
>
>   ----- Original Message -----
>   From: Sharon
>   To: eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com
>   Sent: Monday, October 02, 2006 5:29 PM
>   Subject: [eckankartruth] Re: Hi Sharon,
>
>
>
>   Hi "Mac" -
>
>   I just "got here" today & approved your 2nd two posts. New
members
>   are on automatic "moderation" but I just changed your
settings so your
>   posts will show up here shortly after you "send" them.
>
>   I know it's all a big shock, but just be happy you found
out now
>   instead of in 10 or 20 years!
>
>   Anyway, I just sat down here at "the beast" and I'm not
"working"
>   right now, so this is going to be short and hopefully
tomorrow morning
>   I'll be able to write a bit more. In the meantime, just
keep reading
>   the archives, the links, and the files - one of these days
I've gotta
>   get to organizing the links & files to make it faster &
easier for people.
>
>   You might want to take a little time "off", even just a day
or two,
>   and instead of reading eckstuff & thinking about it
constantly, rent a
>   really funny video or two, go for a nice walk in the woods
or
>   something...get away from it all & relax, and just do
"normal" things!
>   And, if you haven't yet gotten to it yet, check out:
>   http://www.geocities.com/eckcult/masters.html - it's *so*
true and
>   you might find it comforting right now.
>
>   Problem is, when you're out and "recovered", even when
you've had the
>   best intentions about staying around to help out others, it
sort of
>   gets "old" and boring and totally uninteresting, and we're
all just
>   happy to be "out" and enjoying life....especially me! <gg>
So ET
>   isn't really very active.
>
>   So, I'll get back to this tomorrow morning - usually I'm a
bit more
>   chatty when I wake up...actually, *before* I wake up, while
I'm
>   working on it. <gg> Once I'm really awake I don't really
feel like
>   being at the computer, especially if it has anything to do
with "the
>   eck", which to me is something brown & yukky that you don't
want to
>   step in! And I've been out since '98, so anything &
everything I can
>   possibly say to you, I've already typed more times than I
can
>   remember, and to be honest I'm just a bit burned out doing
the "broken
>   record" thing. Whatever energy & motivation I have, I'd
like to put
>   towards the new & hopefully totally comprehensive new
website where I
>   hope to say everything I can possibly think of once & for
all and
>   never have to type anything to do with ekult again!!
>
>   Hope everyone's having a great day, and that anyone who
lives where
>   it's turning Autumn is enjoying it as much as I am!!!
>
>   And while I'm here - I'm going to have another new
grandbaby,
>   everyone!!!! Don't know what I'm going to do, I'm already
1,000%
>   blessed & thrilled with the ones I've already got,
especially my
>   favorite little buddy, Codybear!!
>
>   Hugs,
>
>   Sharon
>
>   --- In eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com, "macmille2000"
<ccaggia@> wrote:
>   >
>   > I promise you that I am not an eck infiltrator...I am a
lonely seeker
>   > with a very broad mind about spirituality...
>   >
>   > That is why I have been so very disheartened...I searched
all over
>   > and found documents from long-time Xeckists who wrote to
the
>   > present "Mahanta" and found out that Twitchell made up
that
>   > name...How can I pray to a made up name? I know Jesus was
who He
>   > was...now who is Harold Klemp, that I was so enchanted
with???
>   >
>   > I went to this one link last night, that blew me away...
>   >
>   > http://www.thetruth-seeker.com/openletter.aspnt
>   >
>   > I sent this link to an eckankar group at beliefnet.com,
asking for
>   > comments last night,
>   > and today, it seems like someone left the link out of my
post and it
>   > wasn't me!!!!
>   >
>   > This morning I cancelled my meeting with this eckist...
because of
>   > what I read on the above link. Oh...her expected response
was that it
>   > was the Kal forces, all other religions attack eckankar.
..blah blah
>   > blah...blah...blah...blah...Eventually she allowed me to
get a word
>   > in edgewise...I told her that I was not ready to take the
next step
>   > yet and that what I had read on the INet had made me to
upset to meet
>   > her today...the conversation ended with her offering her
friendship
>   > anyway...I think she was a really needy women who needed
me to take
>   > her out to Eck meetings...she doesn't drive...that was
just enought
>   > to turn me off...basically I told her I would call her I
would pray
>   > about this issue...and I needed my space in order to
decide for
>   > myself.
>   >
>   > No I am not selfish...I am tired of doing service for
others...it has
>   > worn me to a frazzle...it gave me a nervous breakdown,
and now I feel
>   > it is my right to sit down and recieve...the truth...
>   >
>   > Ya know, if a religion can be made up like that...then
each
>   > individual on this planet can make up their own religion
and laws and
>   > keep it to themselves...maybe God gave us so much
personal freedom to
>   > realize that we are each our own church inside!!!
>   >
>   > Love...macmille2000
>   >
>   > Ps thank you for giving me the permission to post on this
site...I
>   > really was close to falling apart emotionally last night
!!
>   >
>   > Today I feel free!!!
>   >
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

Hello today, Sharon and all  you 'ecknosticks', Thank you so much for your very
friendly and informative posts! Regarding your musings about praying,
Sharon,...I guess I did not really get into those teachings that much...I do
remember reading HK saying things like you do not pray for other people's
healings because that  interferes with their spirtual journey...pretty much that
petitions for were not the way to pray...that his spiritual exercises are all we
need to do...that is all I read about what Eckists do to invoke spirit...

Yeah, I fell for Eckankar really hard...I really loved listening to and reading
HK...he seemed so sincere, down to earth, and not at all forbidding...I thought
he was for real...I thought also that Jesus must have been a Living Eck
Master...

Recently I read the Sharyit-ki-sugmad...it sounded contradictory to HK 's
soothing little stories...and it really scared the heck out of me too... I
recognized all these things associated with various other religious cults, the
scare tactics,the only way, etc....that is when I began to look further about
Eckankar...the things I was reading in the Sugmad were not sitting well with me
at all.

When I googled Eckankar there were only the David Lane writings there...so I
just thought he was one of those angry, disappointed people...so I wrote him
off...When I googled in satsangs, I found lots more stuff about the Eckankar
that began to upset me...imagine if I did not think of typing in that word? I
would never have found you all! Now I see disturbing stories all over the net
...

I will check out the other things on-line that you referred me to...

Now I am glad that I have had this "Rude Eckwakening", because the next step
would have indoctrinated me and I know that it would probably have given me a
nervous breakdown at a later date...seriously!

You know, I was never attracted to any of the "Twitchwitchery" and not very
impressed by fortune-telling...he probably could have
made even more money if he became a sci-fi writer!!!  Sorta like the "Dune"
books...you know? I just love your reference to the Wizard of Oz! (LOL)

Yes, that poor Eck woman...she probably did not inquire within herself because
that would be Kal thinking. She probably think I'll be stuck to that Karmic
Wheel for an infinity...

Alan Watts, yes I remember those books..."The Crack in the Cosmic Egg" etc...I
carried that around with the rebellious "Steal This Book" by Abby Hoffman...who
later turned out to be an anti-disestablismentarian( I think that is the right
meaning???) after all his anarchist antics.

Well, I am now hungry and exhausted, so I think I will go  out and buy me some
unauthorized pizza! (LOL)

May your sleep cycle begin to go back to normal...oh, one more thing...I was
beginning to think that sleeping alot was a holy thing to do, because of the
whole dream idea of Eck...and meeting the "Mahaunta" in my dreams...

You have done a great job at 'Ecksorcizing' me this week!!! Thank you so very
much!!!

Signing off as Macmille2000



   ----- Original Message -----
   From: Sharon
   To: eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com
   Sent: Tuesday, October 03, 2006 2:58 PM
   Subject: [eckankartruth] Re: Hi Sharon,


   Hi Camille -

   Well, I'm glad your name showed up on your new posts! There's
   a big difference between Camille and Mac! <gg>

   I skimmed over all your posts again just now, and noticed you
   referred to praying, which I thought was sort of funny! Maybe
   you didn't get to the "teachings" about prayer...it's really
   black magic. <gg>

   Yep, it sounds like you fell for it hook, line, and sinker just
   like I did!!

   For me, it's "morning" right now, and since I said I'd write,
   here I am!! I've gotta watch that and be more careful about
   promising to write. I did that to someone privately quite
   awhile back and not a day goes by that I don't *try* to, but I
   just haven't. Gonna try to, today, just to get it off "the
   list". Anyway, wouldn't you know it, I say I'm going to write
   in the morning, then end up being up from 2-6 am and re-
   sleeping until noon. This is the 2nd day that's happened!!
   What I like to do best is get up between 4:30 & 6 am, when it's
   still dark, quiet, and peaceful - that's when I'm most
   productive!

   Right now I just don't have much to say about the cult. Just
   keep reading what's on the internet! Oh...it's quite likely
   that like me, you used to think that cults were little groups
   of "weirdos" and various kinds of extremists, so naturally we
   never suspected we were actually *in* one!! I remember a
   special Satsang years back, instead of the usual discourse, the
   subject was "why eckankar's not a cult". That was back in the
   early 90's, and now it's understandable - the HI Arahata had
   obviously gotten special instructions from MN after they saw
   where the internet was heading, and how there were going to be
   problems when members started getting *real* enlightenment!
   The Arahata seemed just as surprised and slightly befuddled
   about the whole thing as I was, sort of amazed that anyone
   would even *think* eckankar was a cult!! Well, there are many
   different kinds of cults. Ekult's relatively "benign".

   Quite often, those nice sincere eckists who give those standard
   replies about "the kal" and how the whole universe is against
   ekult's "truth" and trying to destroy it haven't even bothered
   to look at the evidence. That excuse is standard in cults!!
   It's just one of many cultic techniques/tactics we fell for.

   Well...just keep reading!!

   One thing I found myself doing, because Twitch stole from
   everywhere and ended up producing such a convoluted mess of
   "teachings" from so many sources, I sort of dumped *everything*
   I "believed" in. Right after I left, this involved doing a lot
   of re-examining the eckbooks and *thinking* about it all,
   objectively, and using critical thinking.

   If you haven't gotten to them yet, I hope you'll check out the
   other "ex" groups - EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous and X-Eckankar,
   mostly. There's more activity, and ESA's "Prometheus" posts a
   lot of good commentary on Klemp's more recent writings, like
   the rather new "eckmasters" book. By the way, you might find
   it easier to keep on top of things if you select the "daily
   digest" option for getting group postings.

   The thing is, Klemp *knew* the truth back when he became LEM...
   he knew about the plagiarism, confirmed it through his own (or
   the staff's) research, and he even knows about some plagiarism
   that no one's found yet!! The closest he's come to giving up
   that Astral Library b.s. is calling the plagiarized sources
   "parallel writings". Even the "Great Compiler" moniker is
   misleading baloney...Twitch did *not* uncover hidden truths in
   all the dark corners of the universe or Rebizarre's hut - he
   got them from his local library!!!!!

   Oh...don't know if you've seen alt.religion.eckankar - it's
   quite an experience altho I don't really pay attention to it
   anymore. But, I skimmed a daily digest rather recently and
   very glad I did - "Tianyue" (aka Tom Leafeater, which is how
   I'll always think of him!) posted more new plagiarism he'd
   found in Alan Watts' work! Geez, I carried my Watts book 24/7
   for awhile back in high school in the 60's, but when I got to
   eckankult years later, I still fell for that crap about
   eckstuff "resonating" because I'd learned it in past lives with
   "the master"!

   (BTW, Leaf, if you're reading this - if you've done a paragraph
   by paragraph comparison, feel free to stick it in the "files"
   here and maybe send a copy to David Lane, so maybe he'll get
   around to adding it to the Center for Twitchellian Plagiarism
   site one of these days, along with a lot of other plagiarism
   examples he doesn't have there.)

   And you know, just because something's "old" and accepted as
   "truth", doesn't mean it really is.

   Okay...that's it for me right now!! Hey, enjoy the "Red Hat
   Society"!! I've got a scanned copy of the original poem in the
   "Photos" section here, from a card someone sent me years ago.

   I feel sorry for that Eckist you were going to meet. It's sort
   of odd, though...at first, it's likely she thought that your
   contact was a gift from "the master" or something, exactly what
   she needed at just the right time! Isn't a bit ironic that
   since things didn't turn out as she'd hoped, she's going to
   stop and *not* consider that the *real* blessing in your
   calling her was perhaps an opportunity for her to wake up and
   learn the truth?

   You'd probably be surprised to know your story & experience
   isn't unique at all. It's not unusual for relatively new (and
   even old ones!) eckists to do a bit of web-surfing at just the
   right time, when they were about to get more deeply involved
   and committed to it. And when they take what they've
   discovered to an HI, they'll get the same response you did!

   Anyway, I'd suggest you give yourself some "down time" on the
   "spirituality". Just don't worry about it. Physical life is
   (or can/should be) just as "spiritual" as "non-physical",
   without even thinking about it.

   Oh, one thing I just started doing was something I've wanted to
   for years - study Edgar Cayce a bit. Twitch was quite
   familiar with Cayce, of course...even stole bits & pieces from
   Cayce, like claiming that he could "read" books by putting them
   under his pillow. Here's a bit of "eck history" you probably
   never knew, but I think it reveals something, amazing that I
   put this one on the shelf too, figured it was the kal that made
   me feel a bit uneasy, but like most eckists who notice they're
   starting to *think*, I stopped it by huing. <gg>

   Anyway, Twitch used to charge big $$$ for eck-vidya "readings"
   until eckists broke the "Law of Silence" and started comparing
   their readings. Surprise, surprise - guess what!! They
   learned Twitch was giving the same past-life readings to
   different people! I've gotta find & post what he said...
   basically, he said there were some kind of high holey spirichul
   reasons for these duplicate readings that only a "master" could
   understand, words to that effect. Sort of like in the Wizard
   of Oz - "Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain!!"
   <gg>

   Oh, this is funny!! I just looked thru one box where I thought
   I might have stuck an old seminar pamphlet which listed how
   much he was charging for readings - a pamphlet that also
   offered some of Brad Steiger's books for sale, not just IMSIAF.
   Well, didn't find it but I came across a little booklet I've
   never looked at: "The Eck-Vidya--The Akasa Science of
   Prophecy" by Paul Twitchell, copyright 1968 by PT, my copy's
   the 1972 third printing.

   Darn, wish my scanner hadn't died!! The predictions are
   hilarious, I'd love to scan the whole thing!! One of these
   days maybe I'll type it up - BTW, does anyone remember 1981? A
   tidal wave was supposed to demolish Hawaii. And "about the
   year 2000" nations are supposed to unite to fight alien
   invaders, "one of the greater planets like Mars".

   Hey, I've gotta run!! And I hope tomorrow I start waking up
   at my favorite & usual time before the sun comes up!! It's a
   beautiful day out there!

   Hugs,

   Sharon

   --- In eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com, Camille <ccaggia@...>
   wrote:
   >
   > Sharon, thank you for sending me to that link...I love it!
   !! Sincerely "Mac"
   >
   >
   >
   > ----- Original Message -----
   > From: Sharon
   > To: eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com
   > Sent: Monday, October 02, 2006 5:29 PM
   > Subject: [eckankartruth] Re: Hi Sharon,
   >
   >
   >
   > Hi "Mac" -
   >
   > I just "got here" today & approved your 2nd two posts. New
   members
   > are on automatic "moderation" but I just changed your
   settings so your
   > posts will show up here shortly after you "send" them.
   >
   > I know it's all a big shock, but just be happy you found
   out now
   > instead of in 10 or 20 years!
   >
   > Anyway, I just sat down here at "the beast" and I'm not
   "working"
   > right now, so this is going to be short and hopefully
   tomorrow morning
   > I'll be able to write a bit more. In the meantime, just
   keep reading
   > the archives, the links, and the files - one of these days
   I've gotta
   > get to organizing the links & files to make it faster &
   easier for people.
   >
   > You might want to take a little time "off", even just a day
   or two,
   > and instead of reading eckstuff & thinking about it
   constantly, rent a
   > really funny video or two, go for a nice walk in the woods
   or
   > something...get away from it all & relax, and just do
   "normal" things!
   > And, if you haven't yet gotten to it yet, check out:
   > http://www.geocities.com/eckcult/masters.html - it's *so*
   true and
   > you might find it comforting right now.
   >
   > Problem is, when you're out and "recovered", even when
   you've had the
   > best intentions about staying around to help out others, it
   sort of
   > gets "old" and boring and totally uninteresting, and we're
   all just
   > happy to be "out" and enjoying life....especially me! <gg>
   So ET
   > isn't really very active.
   >
   > So, I'll get back to this tomorrow morning - usually I'm a
   bit more
   > chatty when I wake up...actually, *before* I wake up, while
   I'm
   > working on it. <gg> Once I'm really awake I don't really
   feel like
   > being at the computer, especially if it has anything to do
   with "the
   > eck", which to me is something brown & yukky that you don't
   want to
   > step in! And I've been out since '98, so anything &
   everything I can
   > possibly say to you, I've already typed more times than I
   can
   > remember, and to be honest I'm just a bit burned out doing
   the "broken
   > record" thing. Whatever energy & motivation I have, I'd
   like to put
   > towards the new & hopefully totally comprehensive new
   website where I
   > hope to say everything I can possibly think of once & for
   all and
   > never have to type anything to do with ekult again!!
   >
   > Hope everyone's having a great day, and that anyone who
   lives where
   > it's turning Autumn is enjoying it as much as I am!!!
   >
   > And while I'm here - I'm going to have another new
   grandbaby,
   > everyone!!!! Don't know what I'm going to do, I'm already
   1,000%
   > blessed & thrilled with the ones I've already got,
   especially my
   > favorite little buddy, Codybear!!
   >
   > Hugs,
   >
   > Sharon
   >
   > --- In eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com, "macmille2000"
   <ccaggia@> wrote:
   > >
   > > I promise you that I am not an eck infiltrator...I am a
   lonely seeker
   > > with a very broad mind about spirituality...
   > >
   > > That is why I have been so very disheartened...I searched
   all over
   > > and found documents from long-time Xeckists who wrote to
   the
   > > present "Mahanta" and found out that Twitchell made up
   that
   > > name...How can I pray to a made up name? I know Jesus was
   who He
   > > was...now who is Harold Klemp, that I was so enchanted
   with???
   > >
   > > I went to this one link last night, that blew me away...
   > >
   > > http://www.thetruth-seeker.com/openletter.aspnt
   > >
   > > I sent this link to an eckankar group at beliefnet.com,
   asking for
   > > comments last night,
   > > and today, it seems like someone left the link out of my
   post and it
   > > wasn't me!!!!
   > >
   > > This morning I cancelled my meeting with this eckist...
   because of
   > > what I read on the above link. Oh...her expected response
   was that it
   > > was the Kal forces, all other religions attack eckankar.
   ..blah blah
   > > blah...blah...blah...blah...Eventually she allowed me to
   get a word
   > > in edgewise...I told her that I was not ready to take the
   next step
   > > yet and that what I had read on the INet had made me to
   upset to meet
   > > her today...the conversation ended with her offering her
   friendship
   > > anyway...I think she was a really needy women who needed
   me to take
   > > her out to Eck meetings...she doesn't drive...that was
   just enought
   > > to turn me off...basically I told her I would call her I
   would pray
   > > about this issue...and I needed my space in order to
   decide for
   > > myself.
   > >
   > > No I am not selfish...I am tired of doing service for
   others...it has
   > > worn me to a frazzle...it gave me a nervous breakdown,
   and now I feel
   > > it is my right to sit down and recieve...the truth...
   > >
   > > Ya know, if a religion can be made up like that...then
   each
   > > individual on this planet can make up their own religion
   and laws and
   > > keep it to themselves...maybe God gave us so much
   personal freedom to
   > > realize that we are each our own church inside!!!
   > >
   > > Love...macmille2000
   > >
   > > Ps thank you for giving me the permission to post on this
   site...I
   > > really was close to falling apart emotionally last night
   !!
   > >
   > > Today I feel free!!!
   > >
   >
   >
   >
   >
   >
   > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
   >





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

BTW Have you or anybody on the posts ever heard of Astara?...it is a spiritual
learning center somewhere in CA...I do not think it is a cult...however, they
claim that this women, Mrs. Chaney, channeled  the information she wrote, while
meditating. They share those channeled messages in their monthly discourses.
Very interesting  and not at all scary...very believable messages...nothing
forced...no threats about hell...or kal...though maya was talked about.

I went to one of their gatherings in NYC(it was free!)...it was beautiful...it
was unexpectedly low-key. No one was up on the pulpit declaring their powers and
pronouncing their beliefs, no drama on stage...we all just sat there and prayed
and meditated silently in our own way...it was very quiet all night and very
powerful...I do remember,  feeling the chi, spirit, life energy, prana,  just
get really intense all through my body when this woman, Ruby, Astarian 
spiritual healer, did these kind of hand gestures around my body...not on
it...during the very hushed healing session...

Many years later,  out of the blue, and with absolutely no apparent motive
behind it, Ruby the healer from Astara, wrote me a handwritten  notecard just to
let me know that she wished to send me her blessings and to congratulate me on
my continued spiritual growth...there was absolutely nothing in it about
resubscribing or donating...at all...very awesome to me...love Macmille2000



----- Original Message -----

From: Sharon

   To: eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com
   Sent: Tuesday, October 03, 2006 2:58 PM
   Subject: [eckankartruth] Re: Hi Sharon,


   Hi Camille -

   Well, I'm glad your name showed up on your new posts! There's
   a big difference between Camille and Mac! <gg>

   I skimmed over all your posts again just now, and noticed you
   referred to praying, which I thought was sort of funny! Maybe
   you didn't get to the "teachings" about prayer...it's really
   black magic. <gg>

   Yep, it sounds like you fell for it hook, line, and sinker just
   like I did!!

   For me, it's "morning" right now, and since I said I'd write,
   here I am!! I've gotta watch that and be more careful about
   promising to write. I did that to someone privately quite
   awhile back and not a day goes by that I don't *try* to, but I
   just haven't. Gonna try to, today, just to get it off "the
   list". Anyway, wouldn't you know it, I say I'm going to write
   in the morning, then end up being up from 2-6 am and re-
   sleeping until noon. This is the 2nd day that's happened!!
   What I like to do best is get up between 4:30 & 6 am, when it's
   still dark, quiet, and peaceful - that's when I'm most
   productive!

   Right now I just don't have much to say about the cult. Just
   keep reading what's on the internet! Oh...it's quite likely
   that like me, you used to think that cults were little groups
   of "weirdos" and various kinds of extremists, so naturally we
   never suspected we were actually *in* one!! I remember a
   special Satsang years back, instead of the usual discourse, the
   subject was "why eckankar's not a cult". That was back in the
   early 90's, and now it's understandable - the HI Arahata had
   obviously gotten special instructions from MN after they saw
   where the internet was heading, and how there were going to be
   problems when members started getting *real* enlightenment!
   The Arahata seemed just as surprised and slightly befuddled
   about the whole thing as I was, sort of amazed that anyone
   would even *think* eckankar was a cult!! Well, there are many
   different kinds of cults. Ekult's relatively "benign".

   Quite often, those nice sincere eckists who give those standard
   replies about "the kal" and how the whole universe is against
   ekult's "truth" and trying to destroy it haven't even bothered
   to look at the evidence. That excuse is standard in cults!!
   It's just one of many cultic techniques/tactics we fell for.

   Well...just keep reading!!

   One thing I found myself doing, because Twitch stole from
   everywhere and ended up producing such a convoluted mess of
   "teachings" from so many sources, I sort of dumped *everything*
   I "believed" in. Right after I left, this involved doing a lot
   of re-examining the eckbooks and *thinking* about it all,
   objectively, and using critical thinking.

   If you haven't gotten to them yet, I hope you'll check out the
   other "ex" groups - EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous and X-Eckankar,
   mostly. There's more activity, and ESA's "Prometheus" posts a
   lot of good commentary on Klemp's more recent writings, like
   the rather new "eckmasters" book. By the way, you might find
   it easier to keep on top of things if you select the "daily
   digest" option for getting group postings.

   The thing is, Klemp *knew* the truth back when he became LEM...
   he knew about the plagiarism, confirmed it through his own (or
   the staff's) research, and he even knows about some plagiarism
   that no one's found yet!! The closest he's come to giving up
   that Astral Library b.s. is calling the plagiarized sources
   "parallel writings". Even the "Great Compiler" moniker is
   misleading baloney...Twitch did *not* uncover hidden truths in
   all the dark corners of the universe or Rebizarre's hut - he
   got them from his local library!!!!!

   Oh...don't know if you've seen alt.religion.eckankar - it's
   quite an experience altho I don't really pay attention to it
   anymore. But, I skimmed a daily digest rather recently and
   very glad I did - "Tianyue" (aka Tom Leafeater, which is how
   I'll always think of him!) posted more new plagiarism he'd
   found in Alan Watts' work! Geez, I carried my Watts book 24/7
   for awhile back in high school in the 60's, but when I got to
   eckankult years later, I still fell for that crap about
   eckstuff "resonating" because I'd learned it in past lives with
   "the master"!

   (BTW, Leaf, if you're reading this - if you've done a paragraph
   by paragraph comparison, feel free to stick it in the "files"
   here and maybe send a copy to David Lane, so maybe he'll get
   around to adding it to the Center for Twitchellian Plagiarism
   site one of these days, along with a lot of other plagiarism
   examples he doesn't have there.)

   And you know, just because something's "old" and accepted as
   "truth", doesn't mean it really is.

   Okay...that's it for me right now!! Hey, enjoy the "Red Hat
   Society"!! I've got a scanned copy of the original poem in the
   "Photos" section here, from a card someone sent me years ago.

   I feel sorry for that Eckist you were going to meet. It's sort
   of odd, though...at first, it's likely she thought that your
   contact was a gift from "the master" or something, exactly what
   she needed at just the right time! Isn't a bit ironic that
   since things didn't turn out as she'd hoped, she's going to
   stop and *not* consider that the *real* blessing in your
   calling her was perhaps an opportunity for her to wake up and
   learn the truth?

   You'd probably be surprised to know your story & experience
   isn't unique at all. It's not unusual for relatively new (and
   even old ones!) eckists to do a bit of web-surfing at just the
   right time, when they were about to get more deeply involved
   and committed to it. And when they take what they've
   discovered to an HI, they'll get the same response you did!

   Anyway, I'd suggest you give yourself some "down time" on the
   "spirituality". Just don't worry about it. Physical life is
   (or can/should be) just as "spiritual" as "non-physical",
   without even thinking about it.

   Oh, one thing I just started doing was something I've wanted to
   for years - study Edgar Cayce a bit. Twitch was quite
   familiar with Cayce, of course...even stole bits & pieces from
   Cayce, like claiming that he could "read" books by putting them
   under his pillow. Here's a bit of "eck history" you probably
   never knew, but I think it reveals something, amazing that I
   put this one on the shelf too, figured it was the kal that made
   me feel a bit uneasy, but like most eckists who notice they're
   starting to *think*, I stopped it by huing. <gg>

   Anyway, Twitch used to charge big $$$ for eck-vidya "readings"
   until eckists broke the "Law of Silence" and started comparing
   their readings. Surprise, surprise - guess what!! They
   learned Twitch was giving the same past-life readings to
   different people! I've gotta find & post what he said...
   basically, he said there were some kind of high holey spirichul
   reasons for these duplicate readings that only a "master" could
   understand, words to that effect. Sort of like in the Wizard
   of Oz - "Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain!!"
   <gg>

   Oh, this is funny!! I just looked thru one box where I thought
   I might have stuck an old seminar pamphlet which listed how
   much he was charging for readings - a pamphlet that also
   offered some of Brad Steiger's books for sale, not just IMSIAF.
   Well, didn't find it but I came across a little booklet I've
   never looked at: "The Eck-Vidya--The Akasa Science of
   Prophecy" by Paul Twitchell, copyright 1968 by PT, my copy's
   the 1972 third printing.

   Darn, wish my scanner hadn't died!! The predictions are
   hilarious, I'd love to scan the whole thing!! One of these
   days maybe I'll type it up - BTW, does anyone remember 1981? A
   tidal wave was supposed to demolish Hawaii. And "about the
   year 2000" nations are supposed to unite to fight alien
   invaders, "one of the greater planets like Mars".

   Hey, I've gotta run!! And I hope tomorrow I start waking up
   at my favorite & usual time before the sun comes up!! It's a
   beautiful day out there!

   Hugs,

   Sharon

   --- In eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com, Camille <ccaggia@...>
   wrote:
   >
   > Sharon, thank you for sending me to that link...I love it!
   !! Sincerely "Mac"
   >
   >
   >
   > ----- Original Message -----
   > From: Sharon
   > To: eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com
   > Sent: Monday, October 02, 2006 5:29 PM
   > Subject: [eckankartruth] Re: Hi Sharon,
   >
   >
   >
   > Hi "Mac" -
   >
   > I just "got here" today & approved your 2nd two posts. New
   members
   > are on automatic "moderation" but I just changed your
   settings so your
   > posts will show up here shortly after you "send" them.
   >
   > I know it's all a big shock, but just be happy you found
   out now
   > instead of in 10 or 20 years!
   >
   > Anyway, I just sat down here at "the beast" and I'm not
   "working"
   > right now, so this is going to be short and hopefully
   tomorrow morning
   > I'll be able to write a bit more. In the meantime, just
   keep reading
   > the archives, the links, and the files - one of these days
   I've gotta
   > get to organizing the links & files to make it faster &
   easier for people.
   >
   > You might want to take a little time "off", even just a day
   or two,
   > and instead of reading eckstuff & thinking about it
   constantly, rent a
   > really funny video or two, go for a nice walk in the woods
   or
   > something...get away from it all & relax, and just do
   "normal" things!
   > And, if you haven't yet gotten to it yet, check out:
   > http://www.geocities.com/eckcult/masters.html - it's *so*
   true and
   > you might find it comforting right now.
   >
   > Problem is, when you're out and "recovered", even when
   you've had the
   > best intentions about staying around to help out others, it
   sort of
   > gets "old" and boring and totally uninteresting, and we're
   all just
   > happy to be "out" and enjoying life....especially me! <gg>
   So ET
   > isn't really very active.
   >
   > So, I'll get back to this tomorrow morning - usually I'm a
   bit more
   > chatty when I wake up...actually, *before* I wake up, while
   I'm
   > working on it. <gg> Once I'm really awake I don't really
   feel like
   > being at the computer, especially if it has anything to do
   with "the
   > eck", which to me is something brown & yukky that you don't
   want to
   > step in! And I've been out since '98, so anything &
   everything I can
   > possibly say to you, I've already typed more times than I
   can
   > remember, and to be honest I'm just a bit burned out doing
   the "broken
   > record" thing. Whatever energy & motivation I have, I'd
   like to put
   > towards the new & hopefully totally comprehensive new
   website where I
   > hope to say everything I can possibly think of once & for
   all and
   > never have to type anything to do with ekult again!!
   >
   > Hope everyone's having a great day, and that anyone who
   lives where
   > it's turning Autumn is enjoying it as much as I am!!!
   >
   > And while I'm here - I'm going to have another new
   grandbaby,
   > everyone!!!! Don't know what I'm going to do, I'm already
   1,000%
   > blessed & thrilled with the ones I've already got,
   especially my
   > favorite little buddy, Codybear!!
   >
   > Hugs,
   >
   > Sharon
   >
   > --- In eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com, "macmille2000"
   <ccaggia@> wrote:
   > >
   > > I promise you that I am not an eck infiltrator...I am a
   lonely seeker
   > > with a very broad mind about spirituality...
   > >
   > > That is why I have been so very disheartened...I searched
   all over
   > > and found documents from long-time Xeckists who wrote to
   the
   > > present "Mahanta" and found out that Twitchell made up
   that
   > > name...How can I pray to a made up name? I know Jesus was
   who He
   > > was...now who is Harold Klemp, that I was so enchanted
   with???
   > >
   > > I went to this one link last night, that blew me away...
   > >
   > > http://www.thetruth-seeker.com/openletter.aspnt
   > >
   > > I sent this link to an eckankar group at beliefnet.com,
   asking for
   > > comments last night,
   > > and today, it seems like someone left the link out of my
   post and it
   > > wasn't me!!!!
   > >
   > > This morning I cancelled my meeting with this eckist...
   because of
   > > what I read on the above link. Oh...her expected response
   was that it
   > > was the Kal forces, all other religions attack eckankar.
   ..blah blah
   > > blah...blah...blah...blah...Eventually she allowed me to
   get a word
   > > in edgewise...I told her that I was not ready to take the
   next step
   > > yet and that what I had read on the INet had made me to
   upset to meet
   > > her today...the conversation ended with her offering her
   friendship
   > > anyway...I think she was a really needy women who needed
   me to take
   > > her out to Eck meetings...she doesn't drive...that was
   just enought
   > > to turn me off...basically I told her I would call her I
   would pray
   > > about this issue...and I needed my space in order to
   decide for
   > > myself.
   > >
   > > No I am not selfish...I am tired of doing service for
   others...it has
   > > worn me to a frazzle...it gave me a nervous breakdown,
   and now I feel
   > > it is my right to sit down and recieve...the truth...
   > >
   > > Ya know, if a religion can be made up like that...then
   each
   > > individual on this planet can make up their own religion
   and laws and
   > > keep it to themselves...maybe God gave us so much
   personal freedom to
   > > realize that we are each our own church inside!!!
   > >
   > > Love...macmille2000
   > >
   > > Ps thank you for giving me the permission to post on this
   site...I
   > > really was close to falling apart emotionally last night
   !!
   > >
   > > Today I feel free!!!
   > >
   >
   >
   >
   >
   >
   > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
   >





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hi Sharon,
Your post was so interesting and informative...I need to respond to that in full
a little later...however I thought this was appropo to share....passages from
the Higher Awareness site:
Seek union over separation

"Beliefs separate. Loving thoughts unite."

-- Paul Ferrini

Our ego focuses on how we are different from the rest of the world. Our soul
lives when we experience how we are the same.

Any time you separate yourself from other people or from situations, you know
your personality is in control. At such times, shift your perspective to build
connection and you will move into soul.

As our picture of life becomes larger, more things make sense and we have a
greater playing field for life to unfold - naturally.

"As a holistic being you shatter the illusion of your separateness and reveal
your connection to everything. This empowers you in a way that the ego-driven
self could never contemplate."

-- Wayne Dyer

Love Camille





----- Original Message -----

   From: Sharon
   To: eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com
   Sent: Tuesday, October 03, 2006 2:58 PM
   Subject: [eckankartruth] Re: Hi Sharon,


   Hi Camille -

   Well, I'm glad your name showed up on your new posts! There's
   a big difference between Camille and Mac! <gg>

   I skimmed over all your posts again just now, and noticed you
   referred to praying, which I thought was sort of funny! Maybe
   you didn't get to the "teachings" about prayer...it's really
   black magic. <gg>

   Yep, it sounds like you fell for it hook, line, and sinker just
   like I did!!

   For me, it's "morning" right now, and since I said I'd write,
   here I am!! I've gotta watch that and be more careful about
   promising to write. I did that to someone privately quite
   awhile back and not a day goes by that I don't *try* to, but I
   just haven't. Gonna try to, today, just to get it off "the
   list". Anyway, wouldn't you know it, I say I'm going to write
   in the morning, then end up being up from 2-6 am and re-
   sleeping until noon. This is the 2nd day that's happened!!
   What I like to do best is get up between 4:30 & 6 am, when it's
   still dark, quiet, and peaceful - that's when I'm most
   productive!

   Right now I just don't have much to say about the cult. Just
   keep reading what's on the internet! Oh...it's quite likely
   that like me, you used to think that cults were little groups
   of "weirdos" and various kinds of extremists, so naturally we
   never suspected we were actually *in* one!! I remember a
   special Satsang years back, instead of the usual discourse, the
   subject was "why eckankar's not a cult". That was back in the
   early 90's, and now it's understandable - the HI Arahata had
   obviously gotten special instructions from MN after they saw
   where the internet was heading, and how there were going to be
   problems when members started getting *real* enlightenment!
   The Arahata seemed just as surprised and slightly befuddled
   about the whole thing as I was, sort of amazed that anyone
   would even *think* eckankar was a cult!! Well, there are many
   different kinds of cults. Ekult's relatively "benign".

   Quite often, those nice sincere eckists who give those standard
   replies about "the kal" and how the whole universe is against
   ekult's "truth" and trying to destroy it haven't even bothered
   to look at the evidence. That excuse is standard in cults!!
   It's just one of many cultic techniques/tactics we fell for.

   Well...just keep reading!!

   One thing I found myself doing, because Twitch stole from
   everywhere and ended up producing such a convoluted mess of
   "teachings" from so many sources, I sort of dumped *everything*
   I "believed" in. Right after I left, this involved doing a lot
   of re-examining the eckbooks and *thinking* about it all,
   objectively, and using critical thinking.

   If you haven't gotten to them yet, I hope you'll check out the
   other "ex" groups - EckankarSurvivorsAnonymous and X-Eckankar,
   mostly. There's more activity, and ESA's "Prometheus" posts a
   lot of good commentary on Klemp's more recent writings, like
   the rather new "eckmasters" book. By the way, you might find
   it easier to keep on top of things if you select the "daily
   digest" option for getting group postings.

   The thing is, Klemp *knew* the truth back when he became LEM...
   he knew about the plagiarism, confirmed it through his own (or
   the staff's) research, and he even knows about some plagiarism
   that no one's found yet!! The closest he's come to giving up
   that Astral Library b.s. is calling the plagiarized sources
   "parallel writings". Even the "Great Compiler" moniker is
   misleading baloney...Twitch did *not* uncover hidden truths in
   all the dark corners of the universe or Rebizarre's hut - he
   got them from his local library!!!!!

   Oh...don't know if you've seen alt.religion.eckankar - it's
   quite an experience altho I don't really pay attention to it
   anymore. But, I skimmed a daily digest rather recently and
   very glad I did - "Tianyue" (aka Tom Leafeater, which is how
   I'll always think of him!) posted more new plagiarism he'd
   found in Alan Watts' work! Geez, I carried my Watts book 24/7
   for awhile back in high school in the 60's, but when I got to
   eckankult years later, I still fell for that crap about
   eckstuff "resonating" because I'd learned it in past lives with
   "the master"!

   (BTW, Leaf, if you're reading this - if you've done a paragraph
   by paragraph comparison, feel free to stick it in the "files"
   here and maybe send a copy to David Lane, so maybe he'll get
   around to adding it to the Center for Twitchellian Plagiarism
   site one of these days, along with a lot of other plagiarism
   examples he doesn't have there.)

   And you know, just because something's "old" and accepted as
   "truth", doesn't mean it really is.

   Okay...that's it for me right now!! Hey, enjoy the "Red Hat
   Society"!! I've got a scanned copy of the original poem in the
   "Photos" section here, from a card someone sent me years ago.

   I feel sorry for that Eckist you were going to meet. It's sort
   of odd, though...at first, it's likely she thought that your
   contact was a gift from "the master" or something, exactly what
   she needed at just the right time! Isn't a bit ironic that
   since things didn't turn out as she'd hoped, she's going to
   stop and *not* consider that the *real* blessing in your
   calling her was perhaps an opportunity for her to wake up and
   learn the truth?

   You'd probably be surprised to know your story & experience
   isn't unique at all. It's not unusual for relatively new (and
   even old ones!) eckists to do a bit of web-surfing at just the
   right time, when they were about to get more deeply involved
   and committed to it. And when they take what they've
   discovered to an HI, they'll get the same response you did!

   Anyway, I'd suggest you give yourself some "down time" on the
   "spirituality". Just don't worry about it. Physical life is
   (or can/should be) just as "spiritual" as "non-physical",
   without even thinking about it.

   Oh, one thing I just started doing was something I've wanted to
   for years - study Edgar Cayce a bit. Twitch was quite
   familiar with Cayce, of course...even stole bits & pieces from
   Cayce, like claiming that he could "read" books by putting them
   under his pillow. Here's a bit of "eck history" you probably
   never knew, but I think it reveals something, amazing that I
   put this one on the shelf too, figured it was the kal that made
   me feel a bit uneasy, but like most eckists who notice they're
   starting to *think*, I stopped it by huing. <gg>

   Anyway, Twitch used to charge big $$$ for eck-vidya "readings"
   until eckists broke the "Law of Silence" and started comparing
   their readings. Surprise, surprise - guess what!! They
   learned Twitch was giving the same past-life readings to
   different people! I've gotta find & post what he said...
   basically, he said there were some kind of high holey spirichul
   reasons for these duplicate readings that only a "master" could
   understand, words to that effect. Sort of like in the Wizard
   of Oz - "Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain!!"
   <gg>

   Oh, this is funny!! I just looked thru one box where I thought
   I might have stuck an old seminar pamphlet which listed how
   much he was charging for readings - a pamphlet that also
   offered some of Brad Steiger's books for sale, not just IMSIAF.
   Well, didn't find it but I came across a little booklet I've
   never looked at: "The Eck-Vidya--The Akasa Science of
   Prophecy" by Paul Twitchell, copyright 1968 by PT, my copy's
   the 1972 third printing.

   Darn, wish my scanner hadn't died!! The predictions are
   hilarious, I'd love to scan the whole thing!! One of these
   days maybe I'll type it up - BTW, does anyone remember 1981? A
   tidal wave was supposed to demolish Hawaii. And "about the
   year 2000" nations are supposed to unite to fight alien
   invaders, "one of the greater planets like Mars".

   Hey, I've gotta run!! And I hope tomorrow I start waking up
   at my favorite & usual time before the sun comes up!! It's a
   beautiful day out there!

   Hugs,

   Sharon

   --- In eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com, Camille <ccaggia@...>
   wrote:
   >
   > Sharon, thank you for sending me to that link...I love it!
   !! Sincerely "Mac"
   >
   >
   >
   > ----- Original Message -----
   > From: Sharon
   > To: eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com
   > Sent: Monday, October 02, 2006 5:29 PM
   > Subject: [eckankartruth] Re: Hi Sharon,
   >
   >
   >
   > Hi "Mac" -
   >
   > I just "got here" today & approved your 2nd two posts. New
   members
   > are on automatic "moderation" but I just changed your
   settings so your
   > posts will show up here shortly after you "send" them.
   >
   > I know it's all a big shock, but just be happy you found
   out now
   > instead of in 10 or 20 years!
   >
   > Anyway, I just sat down here at "the beast" and I'm not
   "working"
   > right now, so this is going to be short and hopefully
   tomorrow morning
   > I'll be able to write a bit more. In the meantime, just
   keep reading
   > the archives, the links, and the files - one of these days
   I've gotta
   > get to organizing the links & files to make it faster &
   easier for people.
   >
   > You might want to take a little time "off", even just a day
   or two,
   > and instead of reading eckstuff & thinking about it
   constantly, rent a
   > really funny video or two, go for a nice walk in the woods
   or
   > something...get away from it all & relax, and just do
   "normal" things!
   > And, if you haven't yet gotten to it yet, check out:
   > http://www.geocities.com/eckcult/masters.html - it's *so*
   true and
   > you might find it comforting right now.
   >
   > Problem is, when you're out and "recovered", even when
   you've had the
   > best intentions about staying around to help out others, it
   sort of
   > gets "old" and boring and totally uninteresting, and we're
   all just
   > happy to be "out" and enjoying life....especially me! <gg>
   So ET
   > isn't really very active.
   >
   > So, I'll get back to this tomorrow morning - usually I'm a
   bit more
   > chatty when I wake up...actually, *before* I wake up, while
   I'm
   > working on it. <gg> Once I'm really awake I don't really
   feel like
   > being at the computer, especially if it has anything to do
   with "the
   > eck", which to me is something brown & yukky that you don't
   want to
   > step in! And I've been out since '98, so anything &
   everything I can
   > possibly say to you, I've already typed more times than I
   can
   > remember, and to be honest I'm just a bit burned out doing
   the "broken
   > record" thing. Whatever energy & motivation I have, I'd
   like to put
   > towards the new & hopefully totally comprehensive new
   website where I
   > hope to say everything I can possibly think of once & for
   all and
   > never have to type anything to do with ekult again!!
   >
   > Hope everyone's having a great day, and that anyone who
   lives where
   > it's turning Autumn is enjoying it as much as I am!!!
   >
   > And while I'm here - I'm going to have another new
   grandbaby,
   > everyone!!!! Don't know what I'm going to do, I'm already
   1,000%
   > blessed & thrilled with the ones I've already got,
   especially my
   > favorite little buddy, Codybear!!
   >
   > Hugs,
   >
   > Sharon
   >
   > --- In eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com, "macmille2000"
   <ccaggia@> wrote:
   > >
   > > I promise you that I am not an eck infiltrator...I am a
   lonely seeker
   > > with a very broad mind about spirituality...
   > >
   > > That is why I have been so very disheartened...I searched
   all over
   > > and found documents from long-time Xeckists who wrote to
   the
   > > present "Mahanta" and found out that Twitchell made up
   that
   > > name...How can I pray to a made up name? I know Jesus was
   who He
   > > was...now who is Harold Klemp, that I was so enchanted
   with???
   > >
   > > I went to this one link last night, that blew me away...
   > >
   > > http://www.thetruth-seeker.com/openletter.aspnt
   > >
   > > I sent this link to an eckankar group at beliefnet.com,
   asking for
   > > comments last night,
   > > and today, it seems like someone left the link out of my
   post and it
   > > wasn't me!!!!
   > >
   > > This morning I cancelled my meeting with this eckist...
   because of
   > > what I read on the above link. Oh...her expected response
   was that it
   > > was the Kal forces, all other religions attack eckankar.
   ..blah blah
   > > blah...blah...blah...blah...Eventually she allowed me to
   get a word
   > > in edgewise...I told her that I was not ready to take the
   next step
   > > yet and that what I had read on the INet had made me to
   upset to meet
   > > her today...the conversation ended with her offering her
   friendship
   > > anyway...I think she was a really needy women who needed
   me to take
   > > her out to Eck meetings...she doesn't drive...that was
   just enought
   > > to turn me off...basically I told her I would call her I
   would pray
   > > about this issue...and I needed my space in order to
   decide for
   > > myself.
   > >
   > > No I am not selfish...I am tired of doing service for
   others...it has
   > > worn me to a frazzle...it gave me a nervous breakdown,
   and now I feel
   > > it is my right to sit down and recieve...the truth...
   > >
   > > Ya know, if a religion can be made up like that...then
   each
   > > individual on this planet can make up their own religion
   and laws and
   > > keep it to themselves...maybe God gave us so much
   personal freedom to
   > > realize that we are each our own church inside!!!
   > >
   > > Love...macmille2000
   > >
   > > Ps thank you for giving me the permission to post on this
   site...I
   > > really was close to falling apart emotionally last night
   !!
   > >
   > > Today I feel free!!!
   > >
   >
   >
   >
   >
   >
   > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
   >





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hi, Everyone, I read many of the archives from this site, as well as
explored some interesting links from the site link list...



It is visually beautiful and a very profound observation of
creation...leading to the fractals...which really is a mind-blowing
discovery about the unfolding of creation...

http://www.crystalinks.com/fibongoddesses.html

I love love love it...
very unique perspective on Sacred Geometry and Creation, represented
by The Voyage of the 12 Goddesses of Fibonnacci...re: light, sound,
color, emotion, physical movement, time, things of the spirit, etc

It is great food for thought about the various aspects of
physical/emotional/spiritual facets of humanity and creation...

I hope you go there...it is worth it... it is not "heavy" but it is
full of the wonder of the relativity between things
physical, spiritual/menta//// You guys may think it is kinda frilly bu
look past the pretty pictures and think about it all in relationship
to all the other info on the site...

Sincerely MacMille2000

Can anything about cults be considered unlawful?

If one is seriously damaged by cultists, is this something that could
be brought to a court of justice?

Cults and even ancient, established, organized churches are usually
brain-washing, manipulative, can cause serious mental illness,
emotional trauma and spirtual crisis at the expense of poor, lonely,
lost, desperate, naive and vulnerable citizens...and the cults make
lots of money being so severely descructive to sincere seekers...

It is heart-breaking to me to read the stories of abuse that long-
time eckists suffered. There is a good aspect to all of this...if one
is intelligent, assertive, and has enough self-integrity to get
out...instead of losing one's self-esteem...and sense of self!

Legally, can a damaged soul have a leg to stand on in a court of law?
Cannot a good lawyer go to court and win, not just for a single vic,
not for money or recompense, but to protect those who are in a
vulnerable place from this seriously horrific abuse ???

Or is that part of the separation of church and state stuff that
allows these atrocioucities to exist...

Well, I guess if the neo-Nazis are allowed to assemble in this
country, and if the KKK are still around,  the answer is certainly a
disturbing "no"...huh?

My heart is goes out to those who have suffered in anyway
from 'heckankar'...but hey...you got out...you are free...your own
temple is free...filled with your own mind and spirit, with the
freedom to think and choose and question and seek...or not...May your
souls  remain free on your continuing quest or no-quest lives...

love Macmille2000...fortunate to have looked before I leaped...phew!

--- In eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com, "macmille2000" <ccaggia@...>
wrote:
>
> Can anything about cults be considered unlawful?

Yes, but by the time the authorities get involved, the followers are
either burned to a crisp (Waco) or dead from cyanide laced Kool Aid
(Guyana).
Remember that most people who join cults are adults and will allow
themselves to be brainwashed and programmed. You cannot prosecute
unless there are specific illegal activities going on....drugs,
guns...prostitution....like Manson's Gang.

>
> If one is seriously damaged by cultists, is this something that
could
> be brought to a court of justice?

See above.
>
> Cults and even ancient, established, organized churches are usually
> brain-washing, manipulative, can cause serious mental illness,
> emotional trauma and spirtual crisis at the expense of poor,
lonely,
> lost, desperate, naive and vulnerable citizens...and the cults make
> lots of money being so severely descructive to sincere seekers...




>
> It is heart-breaking to me to read the stories of abuse that long-
> time eckists suffered. There is a good aspect to all of this...if
one
> is intelligent, assertive, and has enough self-integrity to get
> out...instead of losing one's self-esteem...and sense of self!
>
> Legally, can a damaged soul have a leg to stand on in a court of
law?
> Cannot a good lawyer go to court and win, not just for a single
vic,
> not for money or recompense, but to protect those who are in a
> vulnerable place from this seriously horrific abuse ???
>
> Or is that part of the separation of church and state stuff that
> allows these atrocioucities to exist...
>
> Well, I guess if the neo-Nazis are allowed to assemble in this
> country, and if the KKK are still around,  the answer is certainly
a
> disturbing "no"...huh?
>
> My heart is goes out to those who have suffered in anyway
> from 'heckankar'...but hey...you got out...you are free...your own
> temple is free...filled with your own mind and spirit, with the
> freedom to think and choose and question and seek...or not...May
your
> souls  remain free on your continuing quest or no-quest lives...
>
> love Macmille2000...fortunate to have looked before I leaped...phew!
>

Unfortunately,
  There are no laws against brainwashing and programming people ito
cults unless threatened by immediate physical harm. It will always be
the choice of the person who involved themselves who will be
accountable.Even if the cultist is told they will suffer unspeakable
consequences if they leave, cannot be construed as a threat but a
tenet of the belief system.
  My suggestion to you would be to forget the whole Eckankar thing.
Forget it ever existed because it is total bullshit. Keep reading the
Internet and heed the stories of people who have defected after 20
years. People who have been disappointed by finding out that the
originator of Eckankar was a guy named Paul Twitchell, and you could
always tell he was lying..........his mouth was open.
One good test is that whatever names of Masters that Eckankar
purports to have been here since the beginning of time can NEVER be
found in any text of any body of spiritual knowledge of before 1965
whcih is when Twitchell conjured up the religion and put himself as
the Mahanta Living Eck Master.

Alf

--- In eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com, al_radzik <no_reply@...> wrote:
>
> --- In eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com, "macmille2000" <ccaggia@>
> wrote:
> >
> > Can anything about cults be considered unlawful?
>
> Yes, but by the time the authorities get involved, the followers
are
> either burned to a crisp (Waco) or dead from cyanide laced Kool Aid
> (Guyana).
> Remember that most people who join cults are adults and will allow
> themselves to be brainwashed and programmed. You cannot prosecute
> unless there are specific illegal activities going on....drugs,
> guns...prostitution....like Manson's Gang.
>
> >
> > If one is seriously damaged by cultists, is this something that
> could
> > be brought to a court of justice?
>
> See above.
> >
> > Cults and even ancient, established, organized churches are
usually
> > brain-washing, manipulative, can cause serious mental illness,
> > emotional trauma and spirtual crisis at the expense of poor,
> lonely,
> > lost, desperate, naive and vulnerable citizens...and the cults
make
> > lots of money being so severely descructive to sincere seekers...
>
>
>
>
> >
> > It is heart-breaking to me to read the stories of abuse that long-
> > time eckists suffered. There is a good aspect to all of this...if
> one
> > is intelligent, assertive, and has enough self-integrity to get
> > out...instead of losing one's self-esteem...and sense of self!
> >
> > Legally, can a damaged soul have a leg to stand on in a court of
> law?
> > Cannot a good lawyer go to court and win, not just for a single
> vic,
> > not for money or recompense, but to protect those who are in a
> > vulnerable place from this seriously horrific abuse ???
> >
> > Or is that part of the separation of church and state stuff that
> > allows these atrocioucities to exist...
> >
> > Well, I guess if the neo-Nazis are allowed to assemble in this
> > country, and if the KKK are still around,  the answer is
certainly
> a
> > disturbing "no"...huh?
> >
> > My heart is goes out to those who have suffered in anyway
> > from 'heckankar'...but hey...you got out...you are free...your
own
> > temple is free...filled with your own mind and spirit, with the
> > freedom to think and choose and question and seek...or not...May
> your
> > souls  remain free on your continuing quest or no-quest lives...
> >
> > love Macmille2000...fortunate to have looked before I
leaped...phew!
> >
>
> Unfortunately,
>  There are no laws against brainwashing and programming people ito
> cults unless threatened by immediate physical harm. It will always
be
> the choice of the person who involved themselves who will be
> accountable.Even if the cultist is told they will suffer
unspeakable
> consequences if they leave, cannot be construed as a threat but a
> tenet of the belief system.
>  My suggestion to you would be to forget the whole Eckankar thing.
> Forget it ever existed because it is total bullshit. Keep reading
the
> Internet and heed the stories of people who have defected after 20
> years. People who have been disappointed by finding out that the
> originator of Eckankar was a guy named Paul Twitchell, and you
could
> always tell he was lying..........his mouth was open.
> One good test is that whatever names of Masters that Eckankar
> purports to have been here since the beginning of time can NEVER be
> found in any text of any body of spiritual knowledge of before 1965
> whcih is when Twitchell conjured up the religion and put himself as
> the Mahanta Living Eck Master.
>
> Alf
>

Thank you so much, Alf...I kinda figure that the legal thing wouldn't
work...because America is supposed to be about personal freedom,
which is a great idea...however our conflicted gov. is becoming a
little too Big Brotherish for my comfort these days...

I am trying to wipe out the false teachings, and I continue to seek
my own personal truth...

Sincerely from Macmille2000

--- In eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com, "Sharon" <brighttigress@...>
wrote:
>
>
> From the April 1974 issue of the "Eck World News"
>
> "Oh, Fudge"
>
> Mix the following:
>
> 1 Cup ground pumpkin seeds
> 1 Cup ground sunflower seeds
> 2 Tablespoons sesame seeds
> 1/2 Cup Dry NonfatPowdered Milk
> 1/2 Cup Soya Powder
>
> Then add:
>
> 1 Cup peanut butter
> 1 Cup clover honey
> 2 Tablespoons liquid lecithin
>
> Mix well & refrigerate.
>
> ********
>
> Haven't tried it yet, but it looks *so* yummy and healthy!!  And
I'm
> thinking you can really play around with this basic recipe and use
> other healthy ingredients, like brewer's yeast and toasted wheat
germ
> - and maybe some chocolate morsels!!  <gg>
>
> Another interesting snippet I came across in the January 1973
issue:
>
> "The Mahanta Consciousness established itself on the physical plane
> through Paul and is going to remain for 200 years."
>
> This is sort of interesting because I'd often seen something about
how
> the LEM after Klemp isn't necessarily going to be the "Mahanta",
sort
> of like the way they pull out some old twitchquote about how the
LEM
> who'd follow him would only be an "interim" LEM or
something...don't
> remember exactly and don't feel like hunting up those old quotes,
but
> I'm sure others remember, maybe they could post the relevant ones
> which seem to contradict the above.  But that's "the way of THE
ECK" -
> inconsistency and untruth!!
>
> Bye Again!!
>
> Hugs,
>
> Sharon
>
Yummy-sounding recipe...It sounds like something I would like to
try...mmmmm.....especially at this time of year...

Re: "The Mahanta Consciousness established itself on the physical
plane through Paul and is going to remain for 200 years."


It really does sound like mind-manipulation! This statement is not
even a subtle proclaimation! It stinks of egotism, and arrogance.

  It is heart-breaking that all those innocent ickies ingest this kind
of food before even finding out if it is rotten!!!!!!

Love Macmille

--- In eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com, Ganesh622@... wrote:
>
> There's an author named Tom(not Harold) Robbins. He wrote a book
quite a
> while ago called "Skinny Legs and All". Here's a quote:"Religion is
nothing but
> institutionalized mysticism.The catch is,mysticism does not lend
itself to
> institutionalization.The moment we try to organize mysticism, we
destroy its
> essence. Religion, then,is mysticism in which the mystical has been
killed." I kinda
> can relate to that little description.
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
Hi Ganesh...that is a wonder share! Wow! I love the way Robbins put that
definition into words...Robbins was one of my fave authors...have to
pick-up "Skinny-legs" Unless that is the story w/ woman who had really
big thumbs???

Sincerely, Macmille2000

Hello, all of you forum savvy people...Please forgive me if I am
screwing up your message board...I am unfamiliar with this particular
posting format...and my messages may be going to the wrong places on
the board...Sharon, if you are the only one recieving these posts, I
apologize...I do not want to swarm any one member with my writings.
If I have, it has been done out of my ignorance about internet posting

If I did not reply to a members' post, again me-no-savvy, so I
apologize. It is not out of rudeness...It just that I am having a hard
time figuring out this format...

Love MacMille2000

Hello, all...the Cat photo and the message underneath are a riot!!!
That is the epitome of how I think about this stuff!!! and admittedly,
indulgent as the cat in the pic...(teehee)

LOL!!!

Love Macmille2000

--- In eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com, "Sharon" <brighttigress@...> wrote:
>.........................snip
> Oh, this is funny!! I just looked thru one box where I thought
I might have stuck an old seminar pamphlet which listed how
much he was charging for readings - a pamphlet that also
offered some of Brad Steiger's books for sale, not just IMSIAF.
Well, didn't find it but I came across a little booklet I've
never looked at: "The Eck-Vidya--The Akasa Science of
Prophecy" by Paul Twitchell, copyright 1968 by PT, my copy's
the 1972 third printing.

Darn, wish my scanner hadn't died!! The predictions are
hilarious, I'd love to scan the whole thing!! One of these
days maybe I'll type it up - BTW, does anyone remember 1981? A
tidal wave was supposed to demolish Hawaii. And "about the
year 2000" nations are supposed to unite to fight alien
invaders, "one of the greater planets like Mars".

Hey, I've gotta run!! And I hope tomorrow I start waking up
at my favorite & usual time before the sun comes up!! It's a
beautiful day out there!

Hugs,

Sharon

*****
Sharon I have a 1972 copy of THe Eck-Vidya: Ancient Science of
Prophecy. I could try scanning some pages. Are there any pages you
have in mind. Mostly I find the book to be full of scare tactics
disigned to make the reader dependent on the eck org and the eckankult
master of deception. lol Interesting that the book is now out of
print. Most of these end time prophecies are really just a
self-fulfilling prophecy based on some religious dogma or political
agenda, imo. Vote the war mongers out, imo. (Industrial War Complex)

QUESTION AUTHORITY!!!

Tygerpurr

Hi Sharon,

  I was going to throw away all of my Eck books (do not want to donate to
libraries or give to an innocent person)
If you would like, I can send my copy of the Eck Vidya to you or the person that
would like it...

It is so healing to have developed a sense of humor about the BIG LIES after
having your Rude Awakening about Eckankar!
Now that is definitely a sign of  TRUE spiritual freedom~~

Have a peaceful day today!!!

Sincerely MacMille2000/Mac/Camille


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

He was discovered selling CDs that he alleged cure cure AIDS.  When
someone discovered this on are a few years ago, Wallace said that his
website was "out of date" and took it down.  But only temporarily.
It's back.  He's again is selling his sacred sounds as a cure
for "terminal illnesses."  The price can go into several hundred
dollars for each CD.  Check the video here.

http://www.numberharmonics.com/update/pages/michael.html

Michael is or was a Higher initiate in Eckankar.

So are you suspect about his spiritual discoveries...? Maybe he really did
discover some amazing truths as a result of having to practice  listening  for
the "sound(s) of God." Many other spiritual disciplines claim that there is a
sound(s) of God... that can be heard as a result of deep meditation...or do you
really just think he is a technological snake oil salesman???

I don't think I put much credence to  the sounds of God which HK likes to
describe as bees, flutes, or pianos from different planes.

Actually, since I heard of the eckenscam...I am practicing my listening skills
to discern truth from fiction now...

Open minded and curious, yes>>>  Eckenscammers have forced me to not be so
gullible...

Love from Camille


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

--- In eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com, Camille <ccaggia@...> wrote:
>
>
> So are you suspect about his spiritual discoveries...? Maybe he
really did discover some amazing truths as a result of having to
practice  listening  for the "sound(s) of God." Many other spiritual
disciplines claim that there is a sound(s) of God... that can be
heard as a result of deep meditation...or do you really just think he
is a technological snake oil salesman???
>
> I don't think I put much credence to  the sounds of God which HK
likes to describe as bees, flutes, or pianos from different planes.
>
> Actually, since I heard of the eckenscam...I am practicing my
listening skills to discern truth from fiction now...
>
> Open minded and curious, yes>>>  Eckenscammers have forced me to
not be so gullible...
>
> Love from Camille
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

Read carefully, and watch the video.  Wallace claims that by
listening to his CDs, people with terminal illnesses are cured "all
the time."

That's a pretty bold claim, isn't it?  Who are these people getting
cured?  Why don't their names appear on the website?

Read the testimonial section.  Wallace says some guy listened to his
CD, and women immediately began asking him out.

Let the buyer beware.  Wallace is quite the storyteller.  Is he
really one of the foremost numerologists?  I googled his name with
numerology, and nothing came up.

Is what he's doing legal or ethical?  Can a CD cure terminal illness,
even if it costs hundreds of dollars?

Is Wallace selling snake oil?  Yes, I think so.  I think it's wrong
oh him to sell CDs for hundreds of dollars to a target audience of
people hoping for a cure of terminal illness.

Here's a quote from the Eck Vydya that shows just how egomaniacal and
mythomaniacal the Heckankar religion can be. LOL

Re: End of Days eckankar

Annnd, here it is!

" Those who seek the wisdom of the Shariyat-Ki-Sugmad cannot find
it except through the spiritual assistance of the living ECK Master.
It is he alone who is responsible for taking the individual into the
other worlds to study with the varied ECK Masters who teach out of the
books of the Shariyat-Ki-Sugmad. Here they learn those prophecies such
as when the world is going to come to an end through the terrible
destruction of fire and water; the drowning of the city of Los Angeles
and most of the west coast by earthquakes and the sea; the terrible
moon plague which will visit the earth and destroy much of its
population; the upheaval of the central plains of eastern Europe and
the formation of a new chain of mountains; the assassination of the
various political figures of nations of the world, and the awful
devastation of World War III.
These books also give the triumph of the yellow race and the red
tyrant who will sit upon the necks of the masses of people. They speak
of the Mahanta, the living ECK Master, who comes again to save the
world from complete destruction, and to return as many Souls to the
heavenly kingdom as possible during his reign on earth.
The prophecies of Nostradamus will be forgotten after one reads
and studies those revelations which are in the ninth book of the
Sharyat-Ki-Sugmad. ......."

THE ECK-VIDYA
Ancient Science of Prophecy
P. 116
by Paul Twitchell (CHARLATAN)



QUESTION AUTHORITY!!!

Tygerpurr ; )


--- In eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com, tygerpurr <no_reply@...> wrote:
>
> --- In eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com, "Sharon" <brighttigress@> wrote:
> >.........................snip
> > Oh, this is funny!! I just looked thru one box where I thought
> I might have stuck an old seminar pamphlet which listed how
> much he was charging for readings - a pamphlet that also
> offered some of Brad Steiger's books for sale, not just IMSIAF.
> Well, didn't find it but I came across a little booklet I've
> never looked at: "The Eck-Vidya--The Akasa Science of
> Prophecy" by Paul Twitchell, copyright 1968 by PT, my copy's
> the 1972 third printing.
>
> Darn, wish my scanner hadn't died!! The predictions are
> hilarious, I'd love to scan the whole thing!! One of these
> days maybe I'll type it up - BTW, does anyone remember 1981? A
> tidal wave was supposed to demolish Hawaii. And "about the
> year 2000" nations are supposed to unite to fight alien
> invaders, "one of the greater planets like Mars".
>
> Hey, I've gotta run!! And I hope tomorrow I start waking up
> at my favorite & usual time before the sun comes up!! It's a
> beautiful day out there!
>
> Hugs,
>
> Sharon
>
> *****
> Sharon I have a 1972 copy of THe Eck-Vidya: Ancient Science of
> Prophecy. I could try scanning some pages. Are there any pages you
> have in mind. Mostly I find the book to be full of scare tactics
> disigned to make the reader dependent on the eck org and the eckankult
> master of deception. lol Interesting that the book is now out of
> print. Most of these end time prophecies are really just a
> self-fulfilling prophecy based on some religious dogma or political
> agenda, imo. Vote the war mongers out, imo. (Industrial War Complex)
>
> QUESTION AUTHORITY!!!
>
> Tygerpurr
>

I have read your posts with interest, and I would like to share my
personal experience with Eckists. - Like you, I was never actively or
aggressively pursued.  No Eckist ever pushed me in any way.  It is my
sense that that is not the Eck way (at least in my area).  They are
more like fishermen, who wait for the right fish to bite.  They make
themselves available, knowing there will always be those who will
take the bait. It was part of my heartbreak to realize nobody twisted
my arm.  I willingly walked into a snare. - If a person is not
willing and able to suppress their own sensibility, they will never
make a good Eckist, anyway.  So it would be pointless for the group
to pursue those types.

I read an interesting letter by Diana Stanley (former Eck artist).
She says that the Eck community mirrored her own dysfunctional
family.  And honestly, I do think this may be the case for many of us.

But, Camille, you are not familiar with any Eck community, so I have
to believe that there is something BENEATH the Eck literature and
books that drew you.  I believe that was the case for me.  Perhaps
you are unfamiliar with the plethora of spiritual literature out
there which far surpasses anything you will find in the Eck writings.
Furthermore, there are many ways to grow as a human being, to grow
spiritually if you like, without involving yourself in something that
is so invasive.

I recently attended an Eck worship service after many years away from
the group (about 5 years).  I could not believe how small and
unhealthy and sad it all seemed.

zoey...

Yes,

And it all could've been different had the Eckankar leadership been
truthful and assessed what was actually of value to people in
Eckankar. What this path had to offer was some genuine penetration
into the inner planes of existence but the leadership got controlling
and mixed the transcendental with threats of becoming a toilet seat
amoeba in your next incarnation should you decide to leave Eckankar. A
very incongruent mix.

I attend lakewood Church here in Houston from time to time just to get
a front row seat on the phenomenon of the world's largest church. It
is an amazing thing to see so many people hungry for a positive
message, an uplifting experience. But you know, as interesting as Joel
Osteen is, and as much as his talks are inspiring, I don't feel like
I'm having a "spiritual experience" listening to the sermons. It seems
more like a social experience.

In contrast to that, I experienced genuine spiritual experiences at
some of the Eckankar WW seminars as there was always an "other
wordliness" about them. This was not due to anything Twitchell or
Gross were doing but the sense of something happening on multiple
levels of reality was pervasive. Twitchell unwittingly scooped up some
of the world's most potent spiritual messages and wove them into his
patchwork quilt of spirituality. So we responded to what was really
spiritual but we also reasoned that if some of it is true then surely
it all must be true. That was the painful lesson we had to learn about
blindly following so-called masters.

Chuck




> I recently attended an Eck worship service after many years away from
> the group (about 5 years).  I could not believe how small and
> unhealthy and sad it all seemed.
>
> zoey...
>

--- In eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com, dr_chan_hansen <no_reply@...>
wrote:
>
> He was discovered selling CDs that he alleged cure cure AIDS.
When
> someone discovered this on are a few years ago, Wallace said that
his
> website was "out of date" and took it down.  But only
temporarily.
> It's back.  He's again is selling his sacred sounds as a cure
> for "terminal illnesses."  The price can go into several hundred
> dollars for each CD.  Check the video here.
>
> http://www.numberharmonics.com/update/pages/michael.html
>
> Michael is or was a Higher initiate in Eckankar.
>
After listening to the sound byte at his website, it is not unlike a
3 year old kid banging on a toy piano. Knowing Michael through
a.r.e. has produced the profile of a frustrated musician; a guitar
player who cannot sing (according to Sean, one time comrade of
Michael's). Michael now has applied his Eck principles to his music
and like Twitchell, changed the sources to an historical figure,
Pythagorus in a feeble attempt at achieving good health and well
being. It is of course just one more New Age angle on trying to pry
money from your pocket into his.

Beauty, Brains, Integrity and that mother of five voice! YAYA!!!