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#46 From: "Mara List" <maralist@...>
Date: Wed Oct 20, 1999 5:08 pm
Subject: Re: Hi dear friend!
maralist@...
Send Email Send Email
 
>dear mara
>
>thank you for linking the name of oue school in the web site.
>
>public relations
>The Hope Flowers School
>
Hello to you!

I'm not sure now that I'm writting to Hussein, but anyway I'd like to know
your name.
I'm Mara List from Hadera Democratic school, I'm the computer teacher and I
took this mission to open a site for the Democratic-Schools community.
Your contribution in the forum is quite important, so please tell Hussein he
is "welcome" to participate.
I want to inform you about a 4 days riding travel protest our school and a
democratic
school from the north (Maayanot - yarden) are taking part in.
This parade  is going to be a protest against "violence of any kind " and we
are going to be well accompanied with the communication.
It'll  be our pleasure if your school could send one or more delegates .
Please contact me for additional information.
Mara : 066374242 afternoon, 066325038 daily time

for a fruitful relationship
Mara List

#45 From: amalzh <amalzh@...>
Date: Thu Mar 5, 1998 11:44 pm
Subject: Re: POLL: Wich name you prefer for the new site?
amalzh@...
Send Email Send Email
 
please drop me of your list

The Hope Flowers School

maralist@... wrote:

> Every member poll is important!
> Be democratic.
> Mara
> :)
> ----
>
> Please select one of the following:
>
>    o IDEN  (democratic education net)
>    o IDEC site
>    o THE FREE EDUCATION SPACE
>
> by going to the following Web form:
>
>    http://www.egroups.com/vote?id=939682273211
>
> Thank you!
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> eGroups.com home: http://www.egroups.com/group/democratic-education
> http://www.egroups.com - Simplifying group communications

#44 From: amalzh <amalzh@...>
Date: Thu Mar 5, 1998 10:21 pm
Subject: Re: test
amalzh@...
Send Email Send Email
 
Please drop me of your list

The hope flowers school


Derry Hannam wrote:

> -----Original Message-----
> From: maralist@... <maralist@...>
> To: democratic-education@eGroups.com <democratic-education@eGroups.com>
> Date: 13 October 1999 00:44
> Subject: [democratic-education] test
>
> ùìåí åáøëåú ìëåìí!
> îä ùìåîëí?
> îøä
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Post your message freely.
> Please be our guest!
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Post your message freely.
> Please be our guest!

#43 From: JerryAERO@...
Date: Tue Oct 19, 1999 10:36 pm
Subject: Re: FIRST ISSUE FOR THE BACKYARD FORUM
JerryAERO@...
Send Email Send Email
 
In a message dated 10/19/99 3:21:22 PM, you wrote:

<<So tell me how you feel about and if you can remember a similar case in
your school/community that we can compare.

>>

Dear Mara:
I think we need more information. For example, in Israel is is possible and
legal to be a conscientious objector? Why is it the orthodoz Jews do not have
to serve?

Jerry

#42 From: "Jesse Stewart Mumm" <jessemumm@...>
Date: Tue Oct 19, 1999 5:51 pm
Subject: Re: FIRST ISSUE FOR THE BACKYARD FORUM
jessemumm@...
Send Email Send Email
 
Dear Mara,

Regarding the issue of students dealing with compulsory military service, i dont
believe democratic schools can be neutral and remain honest.  At Dr. Pedro
Albizu Campos High School, many choices we make regarding our mostly Puerto
Rican teenage population revolve around finding ways to keep them out of the
very real dangers they face in the inner city of Chicago.  How can we then
afford to ignore an even greater threat to their life and well-being?

Our situations are of course different.  The US government does not now have a
draft, so no one is forced into service by law, as is the case in Israel. 
Complicating this is the fact that the US government is the colonizer of Puerto
Rico, and has taken about 13% of the best land of the island for military use. 
Puerto Ricans were in fact made citizens of the US in 1917 almost solely for the
reason that the US wanted their young men to fight in World War I.  Due to
racism and economic exploitation, more Puerto Ricans end up in the military, and
a greater proportion end up dying.

What do we do?  One thing we do here is to make sure we are providing a very
complete set of other options for each student, so they do not feel the military
is their only choice.  When a student does decide to join the Army, we review
with them the history of US military actions both with Puerto Rican and the
world in general.  We try to make sure they understand the nature and the terms
of their enlistment.  Quite honestly, we tell them its not only a waste of time,
but a dangerous one based on deliberate injustice.  And for those who join
anyway, we support them as people, and remain in contact in the case that they
return to the community and want to become reconnected.  Of course, theres more
to this whole subject on the "moral" end, but i dont know what questions you
have.

Good luck, and let me know what people decide.

jesse

On Tue, 19 Oct 1999 17:17:44   Mara List wrote:
>I'd like to open the backyard issues with a new phenomenon-taking place in my
school.
>
>Our school, as you may know or not know, Democratic as much as it is, declares
to be under
>
>the laws of the Israeli state.
>
>That's sounds ok, but the problem began putting limits about issues and laws
that find breaches.
>
>One of these issues is the law of "Obligatory serving the country in the Army"
for three-year (boys) and two-year (girls).
>
>We are witnessing in the last two years, students that graduate our school and
evader by intention
>
>the service in the army.
>
>You can release yourself very easily by proving a psychical problem, that's
something that can be improvised with no big talent, and there are advisors on
"how to", to be find easily too.
>
>Part of this group of students come back to school for another year, and stay
as students from the quorum, and some of them volunteer or are partly paid to
teach and contribute the community.
>
>In the last staff meeting this issue breaks into the discussion and divides the
staff in many positions
>
>, partly ideological and partly hardly emotion.
>
>The main argument discuss was if "we" are supporting and legalizing an unmoral
new stream flow in our community, and if we encourage its flow.
>
>Of course the "moral" and "unmoral" term in this issue is an endless discuss
too.
>
>It is very hard for us, I think, to take an objective view in this, when our
children are still getting killed in the frontiers, and almost all of them burn
three precious years of life giving them to the state, for "defense and survive"
(another blurred border).
>
>But.in the other hand it is a very brave decision that needs a very high
self-confidence to be taken,
>
>because it is very hard to have equal opportunities as a citizen in Israel for
someone who didn't served the army. It is really being "outsider".
>
>I'd like to open this discussion in our group and try to focus in the point if
"we", as teachers and staff in Democratic and free systems of education, are
giving a fertile ground to these issues to happen.
>
>So tell me how you feel about and if you can remember a similar case in your
school/community that we can compare.
>
>
>Ardent waiting for your answers.
>
>Mara
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>


What are you N2?  Choose from 150 free e-mail addresses.
http://www.n2mail.com

#41 From: "Mara List" <maralist@...>
Date: Tue Oct 19, 1999 3:17 pm
Subject: FIRST ISSUE FOR THE BACKYARD FORUM
maralist@...
Send Email Send Email
 

I’d like to open the backyard issues with a new phenomenon-taking place in my school.

Our school, as you may know or not know, Democratic as much as it is, declares to be under

the laws of the Israeli state.

That’s sounds ok, but the problem began putting limits about issues and laws that find breaches.

One of these issues is the law of "Obligatory serving the country in the Army" for three-year (boys) and two-year (girls).

We are witnessing in the last two years, students that graduate our school and evader by intention

the service in the army.

You can release yourself very easily by proving a psychical problem, that’s something that can be improvised with no big talent, and there are advisors on “how to”, to be find easily too.

Part of this group of students come back to school for another year, and stay as students from the quorum, and some of them volunteer or are partly paid to teach and contribute the community.

In the last staff meeting this issue breaks into the discussion and divides the staff in many positions

, partly ideological and partly hardly emotion.

The main argument discuss was if “we” are supporting and legalizing an unmoral new stream flow in our community, and if we encourage its flow.

Of course the “moral” and “unmoral” term in this issue is an endless discuss too.

It is very hard for us, I think, to take an objective view in this, when our children are still getting killed in the frontiers, and almost all of them burn three precious years of life giving them to the state, for “defense and survive” (another blurred border).

But…in the other hand it is a very brave decision that needs a very high self-confidence to be taken,

because it is very hard to have equal opportunities as a citizen in Israel for someone who didn’t served the army. It is really being “outsider”.

I’d like to open this discussion in our group and try to focus in the point if “we”, as teachers and staff in Democratic and free systems of education, are giving a fertile ground to these issues to happen.

So tell me how you feel about and if you can remember a similar case in your school/community that we can compare.

Ardent waiting for your answers…

Mara

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 


#40 From: andrewol@...
Date: Tue Oct 19, 1999 3:30 pm
Subject: Re: POLL: Wich name you prefer for the new site?
andrewol@...
Send Email Send Email
 
ãÉÔÉÒÏ×ÁÎÉÅ maralist@...:

> Every member poll is important!
> Be democratic.
> Mara
> :)
> ----
>
> Please select one of the following:
>
>    o IDEN  (democratic education net)
>
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! We  prefer this!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

#39 From: Ian Warder <Ian@...>
Date: Tue Oct 19, 1999 10:52 am
Subject: Re: That's okay
Ian@...
Send Email Send Email
 
Right on Leonard, and very nicely put!!!
best wishes
Ian

In message <7u5ih7$uoqu@eGroups.com>, liam@... writes
>Mara,
>
>Well it's true you didn't give us a lot of choice about the name, but
>you worked on putting the web together and I personally suffered no
>sense of exclusion while picking one of the three possibilities. I also
>had the feeling that if I had wanted to write you with another
>suggestion it would have been considered ... there are more important
>issues both in my life and probably yours at the moment so I was quite
>happy to give you that little bit of authority.I'm sure if there is a
>huge groundswell for a name change that it could be dealt with in the
>future.I like it when people take gentle initiative with non fatal
>issues.If there's trust there's no sense of power play, and always the
>understanding that someone's forward actions could be cheerfully
>corrected by the group should they go astray.
>
>Leonard Turton
>
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>Get the most popular downloads on the Web. Theyre new!
>Theyre hot! Theyre FREE! Utilities, drivers, games.
>Its all here. http://clickhere.egroups.com/click/1158
>
>Post your message freely.
>Please be our guest!
>
>

--
Ian Warder

#38 From: "Mara List" <maralist@...>
Date: Mon Oct 18, 1999 4:50 pm
Subject: who didn't yet... please register the forum to participate in the poll and more features!
maralist@...
Send Email Send Email
 
You must open the message you recieved with subject :

Please Verify to Complete Your eGroups.com Registration

from : eGroups.com Registration

and follow instructions.

If there are any kind of problems please write me.

 

friendly

Mara


#37 From: "Mara List" <maralist@...>
Date: Mon Oct 18, 1999 4:32 pm
Subject: new "democratic" poll
maralist@...
Send Email Send Email
 
Please enter the forum and give your "anonymus" voice   :
   http://www.egroups.com/vote?id=940263067585
Complaints and remarks will be welcome  this time.
(try me)
:-)
 
Mara

#36 From: maralist@...
Date: Mon Oct 18, 1999 4:11 pm
Subject: POLL: The backyard door
maralist@...
Send Email Send Email
 
Are you agree of openning  a close forum for the Idecers group, where we'll
speak about
"those" issues that we aren't so glad/sure/have_possitive_feelings  about, but
you think we should talk in a private
way.
----

Please select one or more of the following:

    o yes ! open it , i would love to participate
    o no way!all this bullshit
    o yes! open it ,but I won't participate
    o nothing to speak about, Democratic education &#34;is&#34; perfect,
&#34;no&#34; problems about it.
    o not an interesting issue
    o yes! open it, but to all the web participators
    o yes, but i don't agree  with the name


by going to the following Web form:

    http://www.egroups.com/vote?id=940263067585

Thank you!

#35 From: andrewol@...
Date: Mon Oct 18, 1999 3:09 pm
Subject: Re:
andrewol@...
Send Email Send Email
 
>
> No votes have been received yet!
  I Think!!!!!
Andrew
>

#33 From: "Sergey Gratchev" <rbtraid@...>
Date: Sun Oct 17, 1999 7:26 pm
Subject: ...
rbtraid@...
Send Email Send Email
 
#32 From: JerryAERO@...
Date: Sun Oct 17, 1999 2:06 am
Subject: Re: From Laura Stine: Difference between IDEC and dem-ed
JerryAERO@...
Send Email Send Email
 
In a message dated 10/15/99 11:43:10 PM, you wrote:

<<Dear Laura.
There are no real differences between the idec@... group list and
the forum, the same people, with the same intentions.
My propose by opening this forum was to archive  our correspondence,
and be able to reply in a more arranged way our messages.
You can post a message to idec@... or straight to the forum in the
site: www.homestead.com/democratic/idecnet.html.(please bookmark it)
There is a new active rubric "question of the month" specially for the
kids.
If you could encourage the children in your school to post their answers,
i'll also post some of my school's  kids .
And about my energies, well thank you, I love them too even thought they
'cause me trouble from time to time.
:-)
Mara
>>

Dear Mara:
Could you explain in which way our posts on your new listserve would be
archived. We arranged for our aerolist posts to be archived, and right aaay
it got us in trouble, as somone accidentally posted something to the list he
didn't want seen by the general public (as you did the other day). We then
arrange to have our archive be a private one (in the sense that it isn't
publicized) and with the possibility of our webmaster deleting objectionable
or problem posts. Because of that situation I decided not to archive the
posts to this (idec) list, although I save most of them myself if someone
needs to look something up.

It seems as if there are some features on your new list that could be fun,
like the chat feature. Could you explain how that might work?

Jerry

#31 From: maralist <maralist@...>
Date: Fri Oct 15, 1999 12:40 am
Subject: Re: From Laura Stine: Difference between IDEC and dem-ed
maralist@...
Send Email Send Email
 
 
From: Laura Stine <lstine@...>

All,
Could someone please help me understand the difference between the idec
listserve discussions and the new democratic-education listserve? It
seems Mara that you are trying to expand the possibilities for the
network of democratic schools. But, is it intended to replace
idec@...? I'm a little humbled by all this Internet world. At the
same time, I'm absolutely fascinated by the wonderful opportunities for
connection with each other from all parts of the world. I apologize if
the explanation about all this has already gone past and I missed it,
but I'm still confused.
Laura
P.S. I love your energy Mara and appreciate your efforts to draw us
together.

Laura Stine
Blue Mountain School
Cottage Grove, Oregon USA

Dear Laura.
There are no real differences between the idec@... group list and
the forum, the same people, with the same intentions.
My propose by opening this forum was to archive  our correspondence,
and be able to reply in a more arranged way our messages.
You can post a message to idec@... or straight to the forum in the site: www.homestead.com/democratic/idecnet.html.(please bookmark it)
There is a new active rubric "question of the month" specially for the kids.
If you could encourage the children in your school to post their answers,
i'll also post some of my school's  kids .
And about my energies, well thank you, I love them too even thought they
'cause me trouble from time to time.
:-)
Mara

*   I'll put an instruction link in the main page.


#30 From: JerryAERO@...
Date: Fri Oct 15, 1999 6:16 pm
Subject: From Laura Stine: Difference between IDEC and dem-ed
JerryAERO@...
Send Email Send Email
 
From: Laura Stine <lstine@...>

All,
Could someone please help me understand the difference between the idec
listserve discussions and the new democratic-education listserve? It
seems Mara that you are trying to expand the possibilities for the
network of democratic schools. But, is it intended to replace
idec@...? I'm a little humbled by all this Internet world. At the
same time, I'm absolutely fascinated by the wonderful opportunities for
connection with each other from all parts of the world. I apologize if
the explanation about all this has already gone past and I missed it,
but I'm still confused.
Laura
P.S. I love your energy Mara and appreciate your efforts to draw us
together.

Laura Stine
Blue Mountain School
Cottage Grove, Oregon USA

#29 From: "Mara List" <maralist@...>
Date: Fri Oct 15, 1999 7:34 am
Subject: continuing my apologies...
maralist@...
Send Email Send Email
 

I do want people to know that I love my school, specially the staff I work with (even thought sometimes I can be very critical with and about them, and that's thanks to the school "principles" about democracy), and most of all I love the children, there is were my criticism returns back to me.

I admire Jesse for his work and his contribution for the community, and I know he is a very high talented, loved, special teacher and person.

SO...if they’re any doubts, I took them back now.

And cursing? Sorry English gentlemen, it’s in our blood, I think this has something to do with the weather here, you won’t believe it, but it’s still hot :-)

All this took me to the Idea of opening a "back-black-door" forum in our site, where we can discuss all those "unpleasant Issues" we, as "Democratic schools”, immerse our legs from time to time.

I also could close it to members only, if it is wished.

So please send me your ideas for the name of the forum, what you think about, and I'll open a poll.

Sincerely

ML

 

#25 From: liam@...
Date: Thu Oct 14, 1999 10:38 pm
Subject: That's okay
liam@...
Send Email Send Email
 
Mara,

Well it's true you didn't give us a lot of choice about the name, but
you worked on putting the web together and I personally suffered no
sense of exclusion while picking one of the three possibilities. I also
had the feeling that if I had wanted to write you with another
suggestion it would have been considered ... there are more important
issues both in my life and probably yours at the moment so I was quite
happy to give you that little bit of authority.I'm sure if there is a
huge groundswell for a name change that it could be dealt with in the
future.I like it when people take gentle initiative with non fatal
issues.If there's trust there's no sense of power play, and always the
understanding that someone's forward actions could be cheerfully
corrected by the group should they go astray.

Leonard Turton

#24 From: "Jesse Stewart Mumm" <jessemumm@...>
Date: Thu Oct 14, 1999 7:54 pm
Subject: Re: some words about IDEN site...
jessemumm@...
Send Email Send Email
 
Mara,

If your idea of democracy means voting for 3 choices that you yourself make up,
which arent very different anyway, you have indeed learned TOO MUCH from the
united states.  Thats why i trust consensus so much more.

Of course, our practice of democracy includes the idea that people who dont
INVOLVE themselves, forfeit the right to decide.  Given that, i have to be self
critical.  i WILL be in this.

jesse
--

On Tue, 12 Oct 1999 01:50:48   Mara List wrote:
>Hello you dears!
>
>Sorry about the delay for my explanantions  about our new site.
>Its name is : I(nternational)D(emocratic)E(ducation)N(et).
>Any rejections or other ideas about the name are acceptable.
>The url is : http://www.homestead.com/democratic/idecnet.html until i'll find a
host server who can give us an normal address.
>Almost all the options are yet inactive and under construction, and yes, it
takes a lot of my time and money in web connection doing this , I feel I got
involved an never-ending adventure. (hope not to break down soon)
>
>Anyway the options that "ARE" avaible now are:
>1> Idec rubric  , i'll intend to put information about the next Idec and the
pasts Idecs.(so whoever have such an information please email to me).
>There is already a description about what is IDEC posted by David Grible.
>
>2> Articles:
>     You'll see there already articles that i had and an article that Jakob
sent to me.
>     Whoever wants me to publish here an article or send me a link, please do.
>     I don't decide what article should be published, but we can (as a gruop)
decide to take an article off the site. (by vote).
>
>3> The forum :
>   * This rubrik is some complex but very good.
>     I already subscribe each of you  (all members of Idec list) in the forum.
>     You enter by clicking in the member option, and entering to new users.
>     You have to give a password (i recomend you an easy one so you'll remember
it).
>      You can email me your password so i'll keep it in any case.
>      Each letter that is posted to idec@... is published in this forum,
so it can be kept.
>     If there are some unrelevant messages i'll take them off.
>     You can reply to the forum messages very easly.
>
>   * A poll rubrik, where we can vote democratly for any issue.
>     there is already an issue i put there for test ( the site name, please
vote).
>     Any member can post a poll to the group.
>
>  * A chat room, (maybe we meet by accident in a same hour?)
>  * A talk room (very good), it need from you to get inside this rubrik and
have a microphone + speaker avaible, and maybe
>    we'll talk from America to Japan?!?  :)
>  * a calendar were we can mark impotant dates (like birthdays , conferences
,trips  ..etc...etc..)
>  * a database were i intend to put schools and members addresses + info.  (so
if each of you can post me your details to be
>     published here).
>  *there are more options to be explain ,but for other time.
>
>4> An emergency-responde rubrik for schools in trouble to communicate to Jesse
and Jim (we vote for them in Sumerhill to take
>     this job).
>5> Kids section, still inactive and wait to all of us initiative.
>     Whoever have an idea for "the question of the moth" is wellcome to send to
me .
>
>REMEMBER : OUR SITE WILL BE INTERESTING DEPENDING IN ALL OF US.(and the stuff
you'll send to me)
>
>Wellcome to work, and bless you all with love.
>
>yours
>Mara
>
>p.s there will be some junk-mail for some days reaching you 'cause my tests.
>      sorry about it.
>
>
>
>
>
>


What are you N2?  Choose from 150 free e-mail addresses.
http://www.n2mail.com

#23 From: "eGroups.com Poll Results" <maralist@...>
Date: Wed Oct 13, 1999 7:27 pm
Subject: Voting Results: Wich name you prefer for the new site?
maralist@...
Send Email Send Email
 
IDEN  (international democratic education net)
		 markangela@...
		 maralist@...
		 liam@...
		 pryors_place@...

#18 From: JWollbold@...
Date: Tue Oct 12, 1999 3:41 pm
Subject: Re: Subscription Notification for democratic-education@egroups.com
JWollbold@...
Send Email Send Email
 
#15 From: "Mara List" <maralist@...>
Date: Tue Oct 12, 1999 7:21 am
Subject: any-body who have some good lines and pictures
maralist@...
Send Email Send Email
 

from the past Idecs' please them send to me...

Any relevant stuff to our site is well expected and wellcome!!!

I'll put them into our site.
my email : Maralist@...
my address : Mara List
                    Brandeis forest, 38245 Hadera
                    Israel
                    phone : 97266225261, 97266325038
                    fax : 97266344146

#13 From: "Mara List" <maralist@...>
Date: Mon Oct 11, 1999 11:50 pm
Subject: some words about IDEN site...
maralist@...
Send Email Send Email
 
Hello you dears!
 
Sorry about the delay for my explanantions  about our new site.
Its name is : I(nternational)D(emocratic)E(ducation)N(et).
Any rejections or other ideas about the name are acceptable.
The url is : http://www.homestead.com/democratic/idecnet.html until i'll find a host server who can give us an normal address.
Almost all the options are yet inactive and under construction, and yes, it takes a lot of my time and money in web connection doing this , I feel I got involved an never-ending adventure. (hope not to break down soon)
 
Anyway the options that "ARE" avaible now are:
1> Idec rubric  , i'll intend to put information about the next Idec and the pasts Idecs.(so whoever have such an information please email to me).
There is already a description about what is IDEC posted by David Grible.
 
2> Articles:
     You'll see there already articles that i had and an article that Jakob sent to me.
     Whoever wants me to publish here an article or send me a link, please do.
     I don't decide what article should be published, but we can (as a gruop) decide to take an article off the site. (by vote).
 
3> The forum :
   * This rubrik is some complex but very good.
     I already subscribe each of you  (all members of Idec list) in the forum.
     You enter by clicking in the member option, and entering to new users.
     You have to give a password (i recomend you an easy one so you'll remember it).
      You can email me your password so i'll keep it in any case.
      Each letter that is posted to idec@... is published in this forum, so it can be kept.
     If there are some unrelevant messages i'll take them off.
     You can reply to the forum messages very easly.
    
   * A poll rubrik, where we can vote democratly for any issue.
     there is already an issue i put there for test ( the site name, please vote).
     Any member can post a poll to the group.
 
  * A chat room, (maybe we meet by accident in a same hour?)
  * A talk room (very good), it need from you to get inside this rubrik and have a microphone + speaker avaible, and maybe
    we'll talk from America to Japan?!?  :)
  * a calendar were we can mark impotant dates (like birthdays , conferences ,trips  ..etc...etc..)
  * a database were i intend to put schools and members addresses + info.  (so if each of you can post me your details to be
     published here).
  *there are more options to be explain ,but for other time.
 
4> An emergency-responde rubrik for schools in trouble to communicate to Jesse and Jim (we vote for them in Sumerhill to take
     this job).
5> Kids section, still inactive and wait to all of us initiative.
     Whoever have an idea for "the question of the moth" is wellcome to send to me .
 
REMEMBER : OUR SITE WILL BE INTERESTING DEPENDING IN ALL OF US.(and the stuff you'll send to me)
 
Wellcome to work, and bless you all with love.
 
yours
 
p.s there will be some junk-mail for some days reaching you 'cause my tests.
      sorry about it.
 
 
 
 
 

#9 From: maralist@...
Date: Mon Oct 11, 1999 10:51 pm
Subject: POLL: Wich name you prefer for the new site?
maralist@...
Send Email Send Email
 
Every member poll is important!
Be democratic.
Mara
:)
----

Please select one of the following:

    o IDEN  (democratic education net)
    o IDEC site
    o THE FREE EDUCATION SPACE


by going to the following Web form:

    http://www.egroups.com/vote?id=939682273211

Thank you!

#8 From: ken jacobson <kenj@...>
Date: Mon Oct 11, 1999 7:28 pm
Subject: Re: Subscription Notification for democratic-education@egroups.com
kenj@...
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eGroups.com Manager wrote:
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> ------------------
> Welcome to the Idecers forum!
> please enter url : http://www.egroups.com/group/democratic-education/
> and start the dialogue
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> Mara
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Hi Mora, you are to be complimented for your energy in setting up the
site. I visited it but was unable to figure out how I post a
message...perhaps you could clarify to all via email.

     What I wanted to post on the site was a reinforcement of Mark
pryor's thaughts: Summerhill (and all Democratic schools) is (are)
utopias. As such they may in the long run survive only historically as
economic conditions lead to their abandonment; or, if their philosophy
resonates with enough people, they may prove to be a future paradigm.
Either way they have the right to exist without government interference.
I don't think anyone would dispute that it is ethnocentric to favor one
philosophy over another. So far no charges of criminal infractions have
been brought against Summerhill, thus justifying government
interference.  Civil infractions are the social constructions of a
particular political group which happens to temporarily have the power
to try and enforce them. Just as I think we should all rail against any
religious group which has the temerity to argue that its philosophy is
the only and correct one; so we must rail against any political entity
which has the temerity to suggest the its philosophy for socializing
children is the only correct one. The British government is
sophisticated enough to understand this arguement...I am sure that it
does not want to act in a colonial maner with respect to education. For
this reason, I an convinced that once it thinks through the problem it
will come to celebrate Summerhill as a national (International)
intellectual treasure to be revered and preserved in the same manner as
any national treasure.

  Please post this on your site and forward to whomever you think will
find it reliivant to the debate. Sincerely Ken Jacobson.

#7 From: JerryAERO@...
Date: Mon Oct 11, 1999 12:53 am
Subject: Re: film.
JerryAERO@...
Send Email Send Email
 
In a message dated 10/10/99 8:54:59 PM, you wrote:

<<Would you then try to film it?
Theyself will film it (with our  help)
immediately.
  Have they written any of the
>script yet?

No, they have not... They played some scenes only. It will be the first
attempt!
Film-School (MOSCOW)! Do you listen to us!
You see - we need some advise!
Andrew, KLUCH
>>

I'm not sure MIFS is on the listserve now. I remember a while back that their
e mail address was bad. Maybe it has been corrected. Their phone number is
7075 939 8485. Will it be written in Russian? Do you have a camera?

Jerry

#6 From: "Mark Pryor" <pryors_place@...>
Date: Mon Oct 11, 1999 4:17 am
Subject: Dear Mr. Blunkett
pryors_place@...
Send Email Send Email
 
October 10, 1999
 
The Rt. Hon. David Blunkett
Secretary of State for Education
dfee.ministers@...

Dear Mr. Blunkett,
 
I have not received a reply to my letter dated 13, July 1999. I hope you have not become displacent regarding Summerhill School.
  • Why have you not responded to my letter?
  • Is it of good faith on your part to close further discussion regarding the future of Summerhill?
  • Sir, what will happen if the education act of 1996 fails?
  • What I mean by that is, do you have an alternate plan?
  • What will you use as a model?
  • What are you using as a model?
  • How have I failed to show you that statements made in the press by many education department members, under your control, are in line with Summerhill School’s ethos?
  • How is one small school going to affect your whole nation?
  • Why have you ignored the questionnaires of past students of Summerhill?
  • Why have you ignored the questionnaires from parents of current students of Summerhill?
 
To let you know that we of the world community are still discussing way’s to help you understand that Summerhill is still a valuable education research school and having been suggested from a Ph.D. in education, I have enclosed a resent correspondence.
 
Sincerely,
 
Mark Pryor
27182 La Fuente
Mission Viejo, CA 92692-3432
pryors_place_earthlink.net
 
 
 
K,
It seems to me to be a basic and simple question. Does Summerhill produce
well-educated, happy, productive citizens? The answer can be found by some
not-so-basic research, involving (unfortunately) at least a substantial
portion of Summerhill's graduates. Objectively -- are they more or less
productive, on a variety of scales, than their peers who were schooled
elsewhere? i.e., do they make more money, do they demand higher respect among
those with similar callings, do they have a lower criminal population,
divorce rate, suicide rate? Et cetera. Subjectively -- do they report
themselves to be happy with their lives, their educations, and their
preparation for entry into society?
There are plenty of standard tests available to assess these points. If one
wants to go deeper into the subject, one should also assess the backgrounds
of Summerhill alums and crossmatch them with a sample population with similar
pre-school experiences, socioeconomic status, etc., but that means getting
somebody interested in doing a doctorate, and funding some grad students --
at least it would in the U.S. However, a simple survey with perhaps 50
questions would be ammunition for the present controversy, I would think.
Once this information were available, perhaps both sides of the issue could
be persuaded to look at who chooses to send their children to an alternative
institution, and why, and factor in what happens to those folks with similar
profiles for whom a Summerhill was not an option. Perhaps someone should
point out to Parliament that there are different learning styles, and the
person who feels uncomfortable (and therefore cannot perform to his/her own
potential) in one setting will do fantasticly in another. There are those
who genuinely need a large university, and others who do best with an
apprenticeship.
 
Pardon me, please, if this is all old hash. As I say, I came late to the
discussion.
 
Mary
 
Dear Mary,
 
Your suggestions are what most rational people would expect. They are
logical and make sense. Summerhill did send questionnaires out to alumni and
parents of current students. As noted in the OFSTED report parents back the
school 100 percent
( <http://www.shill.demon.co.uk/hmi/Report.htm#Report> ). The alumni
questionnaires which show a cross section of PhD's, college professors,
world renown actors, musicians, record producers, painters, computer
programmers, IT administrators, inventors, journalist in all mediums,
carpenters, house parents, engineers (the list goes on) seem to have had
little if any bearing on the fact that Summerhill does provide and has
always provided a sound educational base for its' pupils. Furthermore,
Summerhill's population has always been international. What I mean by that
is, students come from all over the world. And, the school is among the most
democratic educational institutes in the world as well as being the oldest
democratic free school. Allowing the children more latitude in living their
lives under the banner of "Freedom not license" then most countries do their
citizens.
Now, having said that in brief, please be aware that the ministers of
education in Britain have been sounding "Buzz" words and statements like
"lifelong learning", "teach how to learn", "citizenship", "tolerance",
"democracy in learning", "raising skill levels"
(See for articles http://pipe.ccta.gov.uk/coi/coipress.nsf/?Open ) which
seem to align with the ethos of Summerhill. The choice of words would also
lead one to believe that the ministers have some understanding of current
findings in brain behavior and multiple intelligence. (See
http://www.thomasarmstrong.com ). The reality appears to be a "back to
basics" campaign that forces the children in schools to achieve set levels
of comprehension and understanding in subjects that are checked via testing at
yearly intervals. At first this may seem a reasonable position for a
government to take. However, taking a closer look at the reason for this
"back to basics" campaign we find the government and it's ministers felt
that the education process was failing to provide techniques (skills) that
they deemed necessary to compete in the world technology market. Sighting
that many skills of times past are waning or have become obsolete. Of course
this brings up the issue of unemployment and the size of the work force but
let's set that aside for the moment. What I'm trying to say here is if a
system led you to ruin as times changed then don't return back to that same
system and expect it to raise you above the need of the current time.
Meaning: they are campaigning the same education system development in the
last revolution (displacing people and jobs) that is not equipped for nor had
foresight of the current "techno" revolution. It's like a dog returning to
it's own vomit. Their fear of the future work force, or lack thereof, is
understandable but they themselves having been steeped in the old system
have little understanding of alternative education systems and are relying
on their past for the answer instead of creating there future. Mary, they
don't even see that and they are going to stay with what makes them feel
safe. This fear has caused them to set into motion a sweeping law (the
Education act of 1996). This law is their "center" and they use it blindly
with disregard for the destruction that it is creating. So, I think it must
be a law that shall give strength to Summerhill and schools like it. It is
in the court system that we will find ourselves. The letters do little and
they can always "spin" the truth as fare as the public goes.
Well I've gone on probably too much. Forgive my lack of writing style and
incorrect spelling. I would rather make a fool of myself then not share.
 
Love,
 
Mark Pryor

#5 From: "Andrew V Pantuew" <kluch@...>
Date: Sun Oct 10, 1999 8:53 pm
Subject: film.
kluch@...
Send Email Send Email
 
Would you then try to film it?
Theyself will film it (with our  help)
immediately.
  Have they written any of the
>script yet?

No, they have not... They played some scenes only. It will be the first attempt!
Film-School (MOSCOW)! Do you listen to us!
You see - we need some advise!
Andrew, KLUCH


Get your FREE Email at http://mailcity.lycos.com
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#4 From: maralist@...
Date: Sun Oct 10, 1999 11:38 am
Subject: tickets to tokyo
maralist@...
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Does anybody knows what is the cheappest way to reach to Tokyo ?
Maybe its possible to arrange a group from London so we can get a
reduction
(less price) for buying tickets to a group?

Mara and Zahava

#1 From: "Mara List" <maralist@...>
Date: Sat Oct 9, 1999 3:20 pm
Subject: Welcome to the democratic-education eGroup
maralist@...
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DEMOCRATIC EDUCATION is based on the notion that learning democratic and humanistic values are the main goals in the field of education. This approach regards human dignity and liberty as the fundamentals of human society. The democratic education deems applying the principals of democracy and of human rights the essential basis for achieving its goal.

Group Manager: democratic-education-owner@egroups.com

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