As to the e-mail referencing Delisle and his apparent acceptance but, lack of
citation to Dabrowski's work, I can add that Delisle sits on Roeper's Board
and that Anna Marie Roeper's definition of giftedness is, in part, premised
on Dabrowski's work.

Cindi Lardner
Roeper Parent

I am compelled to write because I believe that making a distinction
between will and third factor is important.  I believe it is a mistake to
dismiss Third Factor as a mere redundancy of a term we think we know the
meaning of.  I think the Will might be a good place to start, to BEGIN to
conceptualize the idea of Third Factor, however.  It is a temptation to call
these two ideas similar, but we must be very careful about calling them the
same.

         One of the biggest difficulties with TPD will always be the issue of
language.  I believe that Dabrowski struggled mightily in choosing the words
he did to describe his vision--but in the end, they are linear and
sequential denotations that attempt to convey evanescent truths about
phenomenological experience.  It is unfortunate that many of his words and
ideas are somewhat similar to concepts we are familiar with.  We think we
know what he means, and we stop there.  I think this is a big mistake.

         Dabrowski must be understood first as an intuitive whole, before we
can attempt to analyze the intricate pieces of his work.  It is only then
that we can begin to grasp the depth and complexity of his theories.  It is
only then that we can actually begin the arduous process of verification and
elaboration, of personal, academic and clinical application that this rich
theory deserves.

______________________________________________________

Hi,
For those of you who maybe new to Listservers here are two hints.   1)
If you want everyone to see your response use the reply button.  If you
only want one person to see your response send a new message.
Embarassments can be frequent on listservers.

2) To avoid long messages in replying because it includes what was
originally sent, you can turn off the quotation of original message.  Go
to Edit, then preferences, then  mail, and then messages.  At that
location you will see where you can turn the quotation off.
Frank

--
R. Frank Falk, Ph.D.
Professor
Department of Sociology
University of Akron
Akron, OH 44325-1905

Phone: (330) 972-6890
Fax:   (330) 972-5377

1). Several people have been outraged that I started this group without
asking first. I am sorry that I have offended some people. I was not
sure how to create the list any other way at first. I am learning this
technology as I go. If you want to be deleted, please send me a direct
(private) e-mail at btillier@... and I will delete you. If
you hit "reply" and ask to be deleted, everyone sees your message -
unnecessary traffic. Thanks, Bill.
2). You can see all of the previous messages that have been posted by
going to
http://www.egroups.com/group/dabrowskidiscussiongroup/

Kathy Kardaras writes:
Regarding Dabrowski and the third factor, the more I read of, about,
and by
KD, the more similarirites I find between his theory and that of Adler.
For
instance, the notion of three important factors in human development
corresponds to Adler's three tasks of development. The first factor of
nature, or genetic development corresponds to Adler's first task of
involvement in a useful and purposeful life endeavor, as befitting and
within the natural proclivity of the person.  The second task of Adler
is
that of meaningful relationship, somewhat better corresponding to
Dabrowski's second factor, that of social interaction. The third task
of
Adler is the achievement of intimacy, of complete trust and surrender
or
sublimation of the self to the Ideal. While this analogy is certainly
simplistic and far too easily drawn in this small space, it is
something I
have examined more carefully since the last Dabrowski Symposium,
wherein I
was accused of not understanding Dabrowski. These men were
contemporaries,
and one cannot dismiss the zeitgeist within which similar and related
ideas
would certainly have emerged. Even the notion of "inferiority" and
"superiority", though used with somewhat different connotations, are
found
in both theories. I wonder whether anyone else may have studied both
theories and found such similarities. If so, has anyone found that the
approach to therapeutic intervention is similar, and/or, whether the
approach is equally successful?

As you are probably aware, the Adlerian intervention approach utilizes
an
extensive exploration of Lifestyle- those CHOICES ("will", as Frank
refers
to the 3rd Factor) that the individual makes throughout his childood
and
therafter that lead the person to behaving in a unique and highly
individualized way. The therapist helps the individual to become aware
of
the impact of those choices in the creation of the Lifestyle, and
examines
the factors, such as birth order, family constellation, etc., (1st and
2nd
factors) that similarly have influenced those choices. With that
awareness,
the individual is then encouraged to examine the mistaken
beliefs/behaviors/interpretations (apperceptions), or "choices" that
are
least useful, and those that lead the individual away from a feeling of
"superiority". Superiority can be equated with perceived approximation
to
the conceptualized "Ideal".

I integrate this exploration in my own practice with gifted children
and
families, as well as with individuals at mid-life seeking personal
development opportunities. I find that when we explore the above in the
context of the Overexcitabilities as a factor in interactions,
particularly
social choices involving "movement toward" or "movement away from"
others
(not Adler, as you will recognize, but useful anyway), it is very
powerful.

I'd love to hear how others might be using the Theory, integrating it
with
other theories, etc.

Please feel free to forward this to the group if you wish.

Thanks,
Kathy Kardaras

On Thu, 17 Feb 2000, Bill Tillier wrote:

> Hi everyone. I hope you don't mind, I have created a Dabrowski list
> serve and have used everyone's e-mail addresses to start it. If you
> post a message, everyone on the list will see it on their e-mail and if
> they want can post back to you privately or to the whole list. If you
> do not want to get these posts, please let me know and I'll delete your
> name. It should prove interesting if we can generate some discussion.
> Thank you Bill, Tillier.
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> To Post a message, send it to:   dabrowskidiscussiongroup@eGroups.com
> To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to:
dabrowskidiscussiongroup-unsubscribe@eGroups.com
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Get your money connected @ OnMoney.com - the first Web site that lets you
> see, consolidate, and manage all of your finances all in one place.
> http://click.egroups.com/1/1636/0/_/404973/_/950851724/
>
> -- Check out your group's private Chat room
> -- http://www.egroups.com/ChatPage?listName=dabrowskidiscussiongroup&m=1
>
>

On Thu, 17 Feb 2000, Bill Tillier wrote:

> Hi,
>
> An open forum to discuss the Theory of Positive Disintegration by Kazimierz
Dabrowski
>
> Cheers,
>
> Bill Tillier
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> To Post a message, send it to:   dabrowskidiscussiongroup@eGroups.com
> To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to:
dabrowskidiscussiongroup-unsubscribe@eGroups.com
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
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> http://click.egroups.com/1/1470/0/_/404973/_/950851724/
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> eGroups.com Home: http://www.egroups.com/group/dabrowskidiscussiongroup/
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>

I enjoyed reading these bits and pieces and would not mind particpating in
such a forum if sporadic access were to be viewed as a safe harbor to opine
on a timely topic, to ask for assistance with an issue, or to perhaps get a
pat on the back now and then etc...

Cindi Lardner

As a neophite Dabrowski fan (hopefully not fanatic) I recently purchased a book
written by Parker Palmer, (His latest I think) entitled, "Let Your Life Speak,
Listening for the Voice of Vocation", Jossey Bass, 2000. Although not a word of
Dabrowski is spoken in literal terms, figuratively speaking, my humble opinion
would suggest that Dabrowski had his hand in this. Very powerful and suitable
for many.
If after you read it, and I am wrong in my assessment, I am willing to be
educated differently.
Laura Shuler
Grad. Student/University of Calgary

To Whom,
   If anyone out there has an old zip drive they don't need anymore I really need
such. Being
occupied with my Sr. year of scholasticity at UMC, making the "Recognizing,
Nurturing, and
Respecting the Potential that is Giftedness" interactive symposium ..... who's
website is:
.........  http://tiger.coe.missouri.edu.~ecp/gifted/       ........... a
reality, and all
the health, financial, and stratigic issues that accompany the trek for
aquizition of the
"union card" one receives upon graduation, .... I've only been able to save all
the wonderful
pages of informative, and thought provoking messages from you Bill and I
appreciate this,
though most of it goes straight into storage on my hard drive which is running
out of places
to stuff stuff.
   I would like to continue on the list, it is valuable to me, but I can afford
room for no
additional information within the forseeable future.

Sincerely,
Richard Aiken

Only the heart defies ignorance.

ditto.
I cannot have all these emails.
Perhaps they can be on a bulletin board instead
so we can get them as needed.
Please delete my email address.
-----Original Message-----
From: ASMahoney@... <ASMahoney@...>
To: dabrowskidiscussiongroup@egroups.com
<dabrowskidiscussiongroup@egroups.com>
Date: Friday, February 18, 2000 8:53 AM
Subject: [dabrowskidiscussiongroup] Re: Bombarded with emails


>Please remove me from this list serve if I am going to be bombarded with
>emails ...I am interested in your dabrowski update bill but not a barage of
>emails like I just received...thanks Andy mahoney
>In a message dated 2/18/00 10:29:34 AM Eastern Standard Time,
>CFELTZ@... writes:
>
><< dabrowskidiscussiongroup@egroups.com >>
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>To Post a message, send it to:   dabrowskidiscussiongroup@eGroups.com
>To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to:
dabrowskidiscussiongroup-unsubscribe@eGroups.com
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
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>Intro or 9.9% Fixed APR and no hidden fees.  Apply NOW!
>http://click.egroups.com/1/915/0/_/404973/_/950892760/
>
>-- 20 megs of disk space in your group's Document Vault
>-- http://www.egroups.com/docvault/dabrowskidiscussiongroup/?m=1
>
>
>


__________________________________________
NetZero - Defenders of the Free World
Get your FREE Internet Access and Email at
http://www.netzero.net/download/index.html

Andy wrote: "Please remove me from this list serve if I am going to be
bombarded with  emails ...I am interested in your dabrowski update bill but
not a barage of
emails like I just received...thanks Andy mahoney"

I agree completely.  I won't have the time this will take to read all these
new emails.  Please remove me from the list.
Annette Revel Sheely

Sorry, Bill, but as interested as I am in Dabrowski, I don't have time for
another list at this time...

Stephanie Tolan

Please take me off the list. I've got 5 lists to contend
with and this is a bit much for my weak mind..:)

Don



At 12:21 PM 02/18/2000 -0500, you wrote:
>Bill, this may serve a useful purpose for some, but the volume is
>overwhelming and I can't deal with it.  Please take me off the
>discussion group list. Nancy
>
>--
>* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
>* * * * * * * *
>Nancy B. Miller, Ph.D.
>Department of Sociology
>University of Akron
>Akron, OH 44325-1905
>(330) 972-7918 Office phone
>(330) 972-5377 fax
>* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
>* * * * * * * *
>
>
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>To Post a message, send it to:   dabrowskidiscussiongroup@eGroups.com
>To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to:
>dabrowskidiscussiongroup-unsubscribe@eGroups.com
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>FREE ADVICE FROM REAL PEOPLE!  Xpertsite has thousands of experts who
>are willing to answer your questions for FREE.  Go to Xpertsite today and
>put your mind to rest.
>http://click.egroups.com/1/1404/0/_/404973/_/950897350/
>
>eGroups.com Home: http://www.egroups.com/group/dabrowskidiscussiongroup/
>http://www.egroups.com - Simplifying group communications
>

Hi
I have a very simple way to view the "third factor" or the "Directing
and Disposing Center."   I call the will.
Ciao,
Frank

--
R. Frank Falk, Ph.D.
Professor
Department of Sociology
University of Akron
Akron, OH 44325-1905

Phone: (330) 972-6890
Fax:   (330) 972-5377

No problem - you should now be off. Bill.

At 12:21 PM 02/18/2000 -0500, you wrote:
>Bill, this may serve a useful purpose for some, but the volume is
>overwhelming and I can't deal with it.  Please take me off the
>discussion group list. Nancy
>
>--
>* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
>* * * * * * * *
>Nancy B. Miller, Ph.D.
>Department of Sociology
>University of Akron
>Akron, OH 44325-1905
>(330) 972-7918 Office phone
>(330) 972-5377 fax
>* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
>* * * * * * * *
>
>
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>To Post a message, send it to:   dabrowskidiscussiongroup@eGroups.com
>To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to:
dabrowskidiscussiongroup-unsubscribe@eGroups.com
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>FREE ADVICE FROM REAL PEOPLE!  Xpertsite has thousands of experts who
>are willing to answer your questions for FREE.  Go to Xpertsite today and
>put your mind to rest.
>http://click.egroups.com/1/1404/0/_/404973/_/950897350/
>
>eGroups.com Home: http://www.egroups.com/group/dabrowskidiscussiongroup/
>http://www.egroups.com - Simplifying group communications
>
>
>

_________________________

"I can't understand it. I can't even understand the people who can
understand it." Queen Juliana of the Netherlands

_________________________
Bill Tillier
5339 Silverdale Drive, NW
Calgary Alberta, Canada
T3B 3M7
e-mail: btillier@...
http://users.imag.net/~cgy.btillier
(or)http://www.imag.net/dabrowski

Bill, this may serve a useful purpose for some, but the volume is
overwhelming and I can't deal with it.  Please take me off the
discussion group list. Nancy

--
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
* * * * * * * *
Nancy B. Miller, Ph.D.
Department of Sociology
University of Akron
Akron, OH 44325-1905
(330) 972-7918 Office phone
(330) 972-5377 fax
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
* * * * * * * *

----- Original Message -----
From: Bill Tillier <btillier@...>
To: <dabrowskidiscussiongroup@egroups.com>
Sent: Friday, February 18, 2000 11:23 AM
Subject: overwhelming

> Bill

I don't know how to respond to any of these messages....they do not sound at
all personal, or personally interested

Eleanor

Hi Bill T and Veronica,

Bill. This discussion group is just what the doctor ordered. As mentioned
in a prevous e mail, I am returning to "The  Road not Taken, after
completing my Ph. D. on the theroy of PD in 1975, with Bill Hague as my
thesis supervisor and wondering about how best to get up to steam again.

I have submitted a proposal (see attachment) for the Montreal conference in
July that Veronica may find of interest. Your e mail made me realize I have
been doing psychotherapy from a TPD perspective in all my work settings of
the past 25 years, without fully realizing that I was doing so. Proposing
to do a presentation in Montreal, taking Bill up on his kind offer of
sending out past news letters, and making time to meet the people desiring
to keep alive the TPD by attending the Montreal conference, and now this
news group seems to be the place to begin a new.

Bill and Veronica and TPD family members. I sensed in reading Bill T
materials and in the news group personal disclosures that the TPD family is
a group of kindred spirits that has been missing from some of my past work
settings. More to follow as the the mosaic of the family unfolds here.

L'Chayim - A toast "To Life" accompanied by a strong zest for living each
moment fully.



Earle Bain

Tel (902) 492-2464
Fax (902) 423-6359

Please remove me from this list serve if I am going to be bombarded with
emails ...I am interested in your dabrowski update bill but not a barage of
emails like I just received...thanks Andy mahoney
In a message dated 2/18/00 10:29:34 AM Eastern Standard Time,
CFELTZ@... writes:

<< dabrowskidiscussiongroup@egroups.com >>

Bill Tillier here. A note to explain the ads on the bottom of the e-mails:
this is how this service pays for itself. If we don't want to see ads I
could cancel them but then we would have to pay for the service. I suggest
we continue on the free basis. I hope no one is offended by the ads. Bill.

_________________________

"I can't understand it. I can't even understand the people who can
understand it." Queen Juliana of the Netherlands

_________________________
Bill Tillier
5339 Silverdale Drive, NW
Calgary Alberta, Canada
T3B 3M7
e-mail: btillier@...
http://users.imag.net/~cgy.btillier
(or)http://www.imag.net/dabrowski

Direct quotes from Dabrowski's 1964 book:

The "third factor" along with the factors of heredity and environment,
determines the maturation of a man. It arises in the development of the
self, selecting and confirming or disconfirming certain dynamics of the
internal environment and certain influences of the external environment.
Its presence is evidence of a high level of personality
development.(footnote from page 8)

As more intensive development of the personality occurs, and the disposing
and directing center rises to a superior level, the third factor begins to
play a greater role in development than does heredity or social
environment. As we know, the third factor is an instrumental dynamism of
man. Besides taking a negative or affirmative position with regard to one's
own behavior, this factor takes a fundamental part in all periods of
transformation in which new values replace old ones in the process of the
complication and evolution of conscious life. The actions of choice, of
negation and affirmation, with regard to the internal and external
environment are very closely connected to the feeling of inferiority. In
emotional experience, a negative attitude is regarded as inferior and an
affirmative attitude is felt to be superior. The third factor constantly
participates in all experiences of comparison of the personality ideal with
the structure of the disposing and directing center, and with the direction
and level of conduct in everyday life. The feeling of distance of this
ideal from present activities determines the activity of the third factor
and its support or disapproval of present pursuits.(from page 48)

ALONG WITH INBORN PROPERTIES AND THE influence of environment, it is the
"third factor" that determines the direction, degree, and distance of man's
development. This dynamic evaluates and approves or disapproves of
tendencies of the interior environment and of the influences of the
external environment. It cooperates with the inner disposing and directing
center in the formation of higher levels of individuality. Because of the
third factor the individual becomes aware of what is essential and lasting
and what is inferior, temporary, and accidental both in his own structure
and conduct and in his exterior environment. He endeavors to cooperate with
those forces on which the third factor places a high value and to eliminate
those tendencies and concrete acts which the third factor devalues. (from
page 53)

[page 54] The importance of self-objectivity, self-criticism, self-control,
and objective evaluation of the social environment has long been
recognized. The conceptualization of this force as the third factor not
only emphasizes its importance but allows us to more clearly trace its
growth and development. This basic element in determining a man's
development has a place next to that of heredity and environment. Moreover,
its significance increases in the higher stages of man's development. The
appearance and growth of the third agent is to some degree dependent on
inherited abilities and on environmental experiences, but as it develops it
achieves an independence from these factors and through conscious
differentiation and self-definition takes its own position in determining
the course of development of personality.
	 The following illustration of the third factor is based on the
autobiography of a patient, W--, a student of philosophy, suffering from
symptoms of anxiety psychoneurosis:

	 I have chosen my "self" from among many "selfs," and I find that I still
must constantly make this choice. For many years, during everyday
activities, I have found myself questioning which is my "true self," the
one I think of as true or another which seems more and more strange to me?
	 In spite of these self-examinations, my "strange self" appears very strong
and may be the cause for my fear of it and my concern for what is the truth
of my internal make-

[page: 55]
up. But I persist in choosing my "true self." Often I am able to discover
that certain types of activities belong to my "true self" and other do not.
	 My immediate environment is of little help to me because (except for a few
people spiritually close to me) my environment itself is generally
strained. I have a tendency to be opinionated, yet manifest uncertain
attitudes in moral problems. These habits tend to provoke hostility about me.
	 However, when my anxieties weaken and my "true self" gets stronger, it is
easier for me to endure pressure from my "strange self" and the effects of
my external environment. I become stronger and, at the same time, more serene.

EMERGENCE OF THE THIRD FACTOR

The third agent manifests itself in its initial phase during childhood. We
may observe in a child's conduct simple and direct symptoms of his
discontent with himself and his behavior; we note that the child seeks
forgiveness for incurring displeasure. Manifestations of a child's
independence of his surroundings and a growing excitability of a mixed
type, with imaginative, psychomotor, emotional, and sensorial components,
testify to the germination of the third agent. That is, symptoms of
childish nervousness (which are forms of disintegration) express to some
extent the activities of the third agent. All that influences the beginning
of an accepting and rejecting attitude toward stimuli of the internal and
external environment, and the placing of a high value on one inner trait
and a negative value on another may be considered embryonic forms of the
third agent.

[page: 56]
	 The principal periods during which the third agent appears distinctly are
the ages of puberty and maturation. The attitude of affirmation and denial,
just beginning to bud in childhood, becomes dynamic at the age of puberty.
An increased emotional, psychomotor, imaginative, sensorial, and
intellectual excitability favors the process. A young man experiencing a
certain loosening of his internal and external environments observes both
these environments more or less closely and manifests an attitude of
"subject-object" toward his own self. He assumes a critical attitude toward
himself and his surroundings, strives to verify opinions with reality,
attempts to transmit personal moral experiences to others, and makes
demands of a moral nature both on himself and on other people. The
consciousness of his ambivalences arouses in him alternately arouses a
sense of superiority and of inferiority, a feeling of guilt and
self-discontent, and a more or less strong anticipation of the future or
retrospection over past experiences. During the period of puberty, young
people become aware of the sense of life and discover a need to develop
personal goals and to find the tools for realizing them. The emergence of
these problems and the philosophizing on them, with the participation of an
intense emotional component, are characteristic features of a strong
instinct of development and of the individual's rise to a higher
evolutionary level. In the period of puberty, therefore, the third agent is
more dynamic and conscious than it was in childhood but remains still
relatively uncertain in its service to the poorly outlined and wavering
disposing and directing center.
	 The age of puberty moves slowly into a stage of mental harmony, during
which time a more stable interior eqi-

[page: 57]
librium arises as well as a greater harmony with the environment. Gradually
a new structure forms, integrated on a different and more mature level than
the preceding one. The desire to gain a position, to become distinguished,
to possess property, and to establish a family will become the disposing
and directing center. But the more the integration of the mental structure
grows, the more the influence of the third agent weakens. The third agent
may even pass away altogether.
	 The third agent persists -indeed, it only develops- in individuals who
manifest an increased mental excitability and have at least mild forms of
psychoneuroses. In these persons the disintegration process is protracted,
moral ideals continue to play a considerable role, and the inner directing
and disposing center continues to be wavering and uncertain, ascending and
descending. They display mental lability, excessive naivete, freshness of
feeling, and what might be called the enduring of certain infantile
features of the prolongation of the period of puberty. Mental
disequilibrium, a certain inclination to normal disintegration, the absence
of the swift attainment of a stabilized psychic structure, and a strong
third factor are all signs of the ability to develop one's personality
toward the realization of one's ideal.
	 The persisting and growing force of the third agent in adults appears
simultaneously with the protraction of the period of maturation, with all
of its positive and some of its negative qualities. This extension of the
maturation period is clearly accompanied by a strong instinct of
development, great creative capacities, a tendency to reach for perfection,
and the appearance and development of self-consciousness, self-affirmation,
and self-education.

_________________________

"I can't understand it. I can't even understand the people who can
understand it." Queen Juliana of the Netherlands

_________________________
Bill Tillier
5339 Silverdale Drive, NW
Calgary Alberta, Canada
T3B 3M7
e-mail: btillier@...
http://users.imag.net/~cgy.btillier
(or)http://www.imag.net/dabrowski

No ... thank YOU Bill Tillier for getting the discussion group started.  I have
wanted to contribute to the discourse, but seem always to be lagging behind in
my reading and writing.  Greetings to everyone ... expect to hear from me again
soon.

Constance

At 08:27 PM 2/17/00 -0000, you wrote:
>Hi,
>
>An open forum to discuss the Theory of Positive Disintegration by
Kazimierz Dabrowski
>
>Cheers,
>
>Bill Tillier
>
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>To Post a message, send it to:   dabrowskidiscussiongroup@eGroups.com
>To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to:
dabrowskidiscussiongroup-unsubscribe@eGroups.com
>
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>Play Games, Have Fun, Win a Trip – at pogo.com! What’s the best game
>you have ever played? Chances are it’s at pogo.com. Visit today and
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>& earn extra entries!
>http://click.egroups.com/1/1470/0/_/404973/_/950851724/
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>http://www.egroups.com - Simplifying group communications
>
>
>

Bill,
  This is a terrific idea. More discussion generates better understanding. I
would very much like to ask you about
<<<<<The Third Factor>>> How is it involved in the levels and the
overexcitabilities?
K

Hello, I was first introduced to the work of Dabrowski and TPD in 1990. Immediately, it opened up doors of understanding for me that had been previously closed. It was as if I had finally found my identity and reason for existing.

 I have been a psychotherapist in private practice for 25 years, working with long term personality development. For six years I facilitated a Dabrowski discussion group that met every month. Among the events were a yearly conference to review the work of TPD and how the participants felt that they were doing regarding their developmental potential. To the best of my knowledge, there is no other therapist in the Boston area who uses TPD as an integral part of their work. If there were, I would like to make contact with that person or persons. If anyone is interested in the sort of work that I do, I would be happy to speak to them at any time. Additionally, I send my warmest regards to all of my friends and colleagues that I have met over the last 10 years in Dabrowski land:)

Eleanor Fisher

.

Hi everyone. I hope you don't mind, I have created a Dabrowski list
serve and have used everyone's e-mail addresses to start it. If you
post a message, everyone on the list will see it on their e-mail and if
they want can post back to you privately or to the whole list. If you
do not want to get these posts, please let me know and I'll delete your
name. It should prove interesting if we can generate some discussion.
Thank you Bill, Tillier.

Hi,

An open forum to discuss the Theory of Positive Disintegration by Kazimierz
Dabrowski

Cheers,

Bill Tillier