We have had two of our monthly dinner meetings so far in addition to the topic-driven meetings.  Personally they are very different experiences for me, the cruxt being no moderator at the dinners.  This gives more of an opportunity for the verbally assertive to dominate the experience.  I believe it gives the more knowledgable about the spontaneous topic at hand more of an opportunity to dominate as well, though the two interact, as the more assertive tend to drive the topics.  I tend to be much less assertive outside of the moderator role, and am much less informed about the topics we have found ourselves in so far, so I tend to feel less engaged. I may start to forego the dinners myself, though I haven't heard anyone else complain.  This is not a big problem for me, as I hope the role off RRNA will be to continue to provide a variety of experiences, which of course would vary in the subsets of membership to which they appeal.

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From: "twclark2002" <twc@...>
Reply-To: cfnfellowship@yahoogroups.com
To: cfnfellowship@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [cfnfellowship] Re: where to look
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 21:40:43 -0000

--- In cfnfellowship@yahoogroups.com, "Bryan" <bryantunnell@h...>
wrote:

> So that's all I can say.

Well, you could have written a book, but I guess this will have to
do. 

Seriously Bryan, thanks for the amazing work you've done in giving
us guidance on community building.  If you develop any materials
related to your meetings (flyers, agendas, etc.) and feel like
posting them in the files section, please do so.  I'm always looking
for successful formats that keep people coming back.  Are you now
having a monthly dinner as well as a formal meeting? 

all the best,

Tom


> The group that I organize, Richmond Reason and Naturalism
Association
> (RRNA) is in current form a discussion and dinner group, and as
such
> only vaguely resembles the sort of organization described in the
aim
> of this CFN Fellowship web group.  For those who you who haven't
seen
> it in a while, that goal is:
>
> Purpose: to develop guidelines and support material enabling the
> Center for Naturalism to sponsor local Fellowships of Naturalists.
> These fellowships will function somewhat as secular equivalents of
> church, and through them we hope to demonstrate how naturalism can
be
> a source of joy and community that promotes personal,
interpersonal
> and societal well-being. Practices may be drawn from fields as
> diverse as Buddhist, traditional religious, and/or Positive
> Psychology, among others. Let's show how logic and evidence
actually
> have more "soul and spirit" than superstition!
>
> As I imagine possible growth in numbers of RRNA, my own mind is
open
> to and hopeful of the development of special interest groups
within
> this organization.  If this occurs, perhaps some of those special
> interest groups more directly will explore and draw practices from
> the sorts of fields described in this CFN Fellowship goal.  Yet
this
> outcome is conjectural, and dependent on many things I cannot even
> pretend to be able to predict.  Thus the story of the development
of
> RRNA and the organizational lessons we are learning from it seem
to
> have limited relevance.
>
> Perhaps one of the most relevant types of support I can offer
towards
> the end of CFN Fellowships is encouragement and some thoughts on
> where to look in search of others local to you who may be kindred
> naturalists and thus serve as the nucleus of a group that you
> yourself could form.  Though RRNA is a mix of naturalists who are
> fully deterministic and naturalists who hold on to some notion of
> free will, we all are very close in thinking.  I also frequent two
> other groups in town—putatively, one of humanists and one of
> freethinkers—and to some degree am familiar with personal details
of
> their membership.  Thus I have a small sample from which I can
share
> data pertinent to the question of where you might run into the
sort
> of people who might be interested in forming something like a CFN
> Fellowship.  This data comes with a caveat as is appropriate
> concerning small sample sizes.  Yet many of the places I am going
to
> suggest you might look are logical conclusions as well—and some of
> them so obvious that my thoughts are intended mostly as
encouragement
> and much less as insight.
>
> Before offering my data, I would like to emphasize to you how much
of
> a benefit you might gain if you found, wherever you looked, even
one
> other interested party.  I can tell you from experience that when
> considering forming a new group in Richmond, being able to discuss
> the possibilities face to face with just one other person was
> stimulating and encouraging.  The first meeting of what eventually
> became RRNA was between myself and one other individual. 
> Immediately, I announced to whatever audience I thought might be
> interested the formation of a new group in town, with a membership
of
> two and hopefully growing.  I cannot be certain, but I believe
that
> the existence of something tangible, however small and whimsically
> announced, grabbed the attention and pulled out of the woodwork
some
> individuals who I wouldn't have been able to recruit to sit down
with
> me alone and the group in my imagination.  We two originals had
three
> captive audiences in town with folks who were in a way ready to
> spring on something new:  the two other groups I mentioned that I
> attend and a listing of local folks on Meetup.com looking to
> associate with the Brights movement.  So I cannot sell the story
of
> RRNA as the story of something that sprang from two people in an
> otherwise apparent vacuum.  Yet as you consider my suggestions
below
> or whatever strategy you think you could follow to find a local
with
> whom to speak about CFN Fellowships,  I hope you take to heart the
> sense of stimulation and the tangible that can result even if the
> outcome of your search is one.
>
> My data is a report of the sorts of places you would run into some
of
> the current attendees of RRNA and the other similar groups in
> Richmond.
>
> I believe Tom mentions somewhere on naturalism.org Unitarian
> churches.  Our Richmond Unitarian Universalist church provided a
> ready source where we actually did find a few of our attendees--a
> humanist discussion group.  Even without such an obvious sub-
group,
> Unitarian churches, as you probably know, often are the best bet
in
> town for an atheist or agnostic seeking community.
>
> At least three of our attendees are ACLU members.  I have no idea
if
> the ACLU holds local meetings of any sort of its members, but if
it
> does, or if there is some place you think you might find
them . . . .
>
> I would love to be able to tell you that if you became active "on
the
> ground" politically you would be likely to run into naturalists no
> matter what your political inclination, but if my data is
indicative
> (and I'm guessing any of yours too), the place to keep your eyes
open
> more specifically is liberal political organizations.  I
personally
> have heard genuine and I think reasonable thinking--some of it in
> this web group--on how a naturalistic view could be compatible
with a
> leaning towards the sort of economic philosophy typically found
among
> Republicans.  And, actually, one of our RRNA attendees goes to
> Republican Party meetings, evenly matching the only one of our
> members who I know has attended a Democratic meeting recently. 
> Still, as indicated by conversation, our RRNA Republicans are in a
> clear minority within our group (we have two).  Most RRNA seem to
be
> avid anti-Republicans and clearly anti-Bush.  Thus it would be
> misleading to suggest all of my data indicates you have equal odds
of
> finding a naturalist in Republican and Democratic political
> settings.  (Disenchantment with both parties is a common sentiment
> among our members, by the way.) If you are politically active on
the
> ground with liberals, you might try grumbling out loud among them
> about "one nation under God" to see if steam starts coming out of
the
> ears of another atheist.
>
> IF my tiny set of data was to turn out representative, you would
have
> a good chance of finding naturalists among the staff of performing
> arts organizations and among the artists themselves.  Two of our
long-
> time attendees are part-time actors.  One of those also works in a
> local theater's costume shop and now brings a friend who works
there
> with her.  I have spent much of the past five years myself as an
> administrative staff member for performing arts organizations. 
That
> experience, my years as a theater major many moons ago, and my
> contrasting experience of working in other settings support what
many
> suspect, that compared with other work settings one is more likely
to
> find within the performing arts people whose thinking is openly
> outside of the mainstream.  (No stereotyping, of course.)   If you
> only are circulating among financial supporters of the arts at
> fundraisers and aren't finding these sorts of offbeat people, try
> finding your way among the artists and staff.  I'm not suggesting
you
> fake an interest in the performing arts--not that I think you
would
> do that--but if you are a supporter and you have an opportunity to
> mix regularly at cast parties or volunteer behind the scenes, even
if
> you don't find other naturalists you may have a chance to meet the
> sort of people I have met who wouldn't blink at the fact that you
are
> one.
>
> And of course there are the academic settings.  You would find
some
> of our members there.  Two in a biology department.  One is
retired
> from an economics department.  One teaches computer science and
used
> to teach philosophy.  A veteran member of the local Richmond Area
> Free Thinkers, which I also attend, is a professor and researcher
of
> physics.  Although one of our biology department members laments
the
> apparently illogical fact that so many of his peers are
> supernaturalists, the other biologist maintains that the walls
facing
> the elevator doors where he works would be an excellent place for
an
> RRNA poster.
>
> Two of our attendees are computer programmers, and another two may
> not be programmers but make their living in computer technology. 
I
> once heard casually from someone who you would think knows these
> things that some high tech companies consider how gay-friendly a
> locale is when considering where to locate.  If that's true, I
> presume it is to accommodate an appreciable gay or perhaps
socially
> liberal staff.  Is it worthwhile to consider that as a hint one
would
> find a higher than usual incidence of progressive belief systems
in
> the computer fields, too?  I don't know, but if RRNA starts
hanging
> posters, I'd love to be able to hang one in an internet cafe, or
in a
> coffee shop across the street from a large business in computer
> technology.  Some towns have computer special interest groups
(such
> as Mac users) that meet in person, as well.
>
> Speaking of businesses, I imagine either of our biologists--one a
> biological statistician, one a cellular biologist--easily could
have
> found work with a biotech firm.  I'd take the coffee shop across
the
> street from one of those, too.
>
> Finally, you could find me at the monthly philosophy discussion
> events held at one of our local cafés, and you probably already
know
> of CFN's activity with such events.  (Richmond's event is called
> Socrates Café.)  Occasionally I hear strangers say something at
those
> gatherings that makes me think she or he may be "one of us."
>
> Everyone else I can think of works at places that I'm confident
would
> yield no insight to hear about, which in part suggests you might
find
> us anywhere.  One of our members spent years of his life as an
> atheistic church organist. 
>
> So that's all I can say.  Except maybe that the other day one of
our
> members, who works with a large organization, was in the parking
lot
> outside her workplace and spotted a Darwin fish on the car of a
> couple who just happened to be getting in or out of it at the
time. 
> She started a conversation with them, mentioned RRNA and they
seemed
> interested. This makes me wonder if the gutsy move of leaving a
brief
> note and e-mail address on the windshields of some of those Darwin-
> mobiles might pay off.  I'd keep in mind, however, the
> appropriateness of doing so in a work setting.
>
> Thank you for taking the time to read this lengthy entry, or at
least
> skipping to the bottom to see how it ends.  If you have some ideas
> yourself of good bets for locating other naturalists, I'd be glad
to
> hear them for possible advertisement.
>
> Regards,
> Bryan T.

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