I recently paid a visit to 2 equator monuments in East Africa. When I
turned my GPS on (using WGS84 datum) and positioned it on real equator
it didn't show 0 lattitude. It showed that I am about 12 meters south
of equator.
Does anybody has any ideas about this?
Regards, Alex
Even the position of the equator varies slightly depending on the datum you use. Whatever authority was telling you that you were on the "real" equator (whatever that means) has possibly used a different datum from WGS84 when establishing its location. If you were relying on monuments they could easily have been placed slightly off for simply practical reasons (terrain etc.) on the basis that the average tourist wouldn't know or care anyway.
You should also be aware that 12m is (just) within the region of accuracy for commercially available GPSr units and small perturbations are not unusual. When geocaching I find that the reported location of a particular spot on the surface of the earth can vary by up to about that distance from day to day depending on tree cover (leaves, no leaves depending on season), atmospheric conditions (cloudy, sunny), sunspot activity etc all of which serve to perturb the signal slightly (making the hunt slightly more challenging). This is one reason why WAAS (a ground based, fixed base station, perturbation correction system) was added to the GPS systems in North America and there is, I believe, a similar system either in place or planned for Europe. Neither of these would have been effective in Afrrica, of course.
Cheers
Hugh
From: borderpoint@yahoogroups.com [mailto:borderpoint@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of kubana2005 Sent: August 4, 2008 8:43 AM To: borderpoint@yahoogroups.com Subject: [borderpoint] Equator
I recently paid a visit to 2 equator monuments in East Africa. When I turned my GPS on (using WGS84 datum) and positioned it on real equator it didn't show 0 lattitude. It showed that I am about 12 meters south of equator. Does anybody has any ideas about this?
Hi. I finally got around to uploading more of my photos from my trip to Scotland a couple of weeks ago. Of interest to this group are the photos I took along the A1 motorway at the England-Scotland border. I have added the photos to the BP Flickr pool, here: http://www.flickr.com/groups/44289624@N00/pool/
Enjoy! -c
Hi Hugh,
The proof that, it's the actuall equator is that there were locals
presenting water turning proces or whatever you call it. At the
actual equator water was not moving in any directing while droping
off.
By the term actual equator I mean the real prime lattitude or the
longest possible lattitude where sun drops directly in particular
days.
Regards, Alex
--- In borderpoint@yahoogroups.com, "Hugh Wallis" <hughwallis@...>
wrote:
>
> Even the position of the equator varies slightly depending on the
datum you
> use. Whatever authority was telling you that you were on the "real"
equator
> (whatever that means) has possibly used a different datum from
WGS84 when
> establishing its location. If you were relying on monuments they
could
> easily have been placed slightly off for simply practical reasons
(terrain
> etc.) on the basis that the average tourist wouldn't know or care
anyway.
>
> You should also be aware that 12m is (just) within the region of
accuracy
> for commercially available GPSr units and small perturbations are
not
> unusual. When geocaching I find that the reported location of a
particular
> spot on the surface of the earth can vary by up to about that
distance from
> day to day depending on tree cover (leaves, no leaves depending on
season),
> atmospheric conditions (cloudy, sunny), sunspot activity etc all of
which
> serve to perturb the signal slightly (making the hunt slightly more
> challenging). This is one reason why WAAS (a ground based, fixed
base
> station, perturbation correction system) was added to the GPS
systems in
> North America and there is, I believe, a similar system either in
place or
> planned for Europe. Neither of these would have been effective in
Afrrica,
> of course.
>
> Cheers
>
> Hugh
>
> _____
>
> From: borderpoint@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:borderpoint@yahoogroups.com] On
> Behalf Of kubana2005
> Sent: August 4, 2008 8:43 AM
> To: borderpoint@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [borderpoint] Equator
>
>
>
> I recently paid a visit to 2 equator monuments in East Africa. When
I
> turned my GPS on (using WGS84 datum) and positioned it on real
equator
> it didn't show 0 lattitude. It showed that I am about 12 meters
south
> of equator.
> Does anybody has any ideas about this?
>
> Regards, Alex
>
There is a wealth of material available to demonstrate that the water trick is just that - a trick. If they charged you money to see the trick, it was a scam.
(all obtained via a google search on "equator water spin") for just a small selection of these.
To determine the exact position of the equator to within 12 m accuracy using the second method you describe would require equipment with a far greater degree of precision than I would think was available on site. I think the definition on Wikipedia ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equator ) is likely more correct, but again would also require highly sophisticated equipment to determine with any degree of accuracy.
Cheers
Hugh
From: borderpoint@yahoogroups.com [mailto:borderpoint@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of kubana2005 Sent: August 5, 2008 3:48 AM To: borderpoint@yahoogroups.com Subject: [borderpoint] Re: Equator
Hi Hugh, The proof that, it's the actuall equator is that there were locals presenting water turning proces or whatever you call it. At the actual equator water was not moving in any directing while droping off. By the term actual equator I mean the real prime lattitude or the longest possible lattitude where sun drops directly in particular days.
Regards, Alex
--- In borderpoint@yahoogroups.com, "Hugh Wallis" <hughwallis@...> wrote: > > Even the position of the equator varies slightly depending on the datum you > use. Whatever authority was telling you that you were on the "real" equator > (whatever that means) has possibly used a different datum from WGS84 when > establishing its location. If you were relying on monuments they could > easily have been placed slightly off for simply practical reasons (terrain > etc.) on the basis that the average tourist wouldn't know or care anyway. > > You should also be aware that 12m is (just) within the region of accuracy > for commercially available GPSr units and small perturbations are not > unusual. When geocaching I find that the reported location of a particular > spot on the surface of the earth can vary by up to about that distance from > day to day depending on tree cover (leaves, no leaves depending on season), > atmospheric conditions (cloudy, sunny), sunspot activity etc all of which > serve to perturb the signal slightly (making the hunt slightly more > challenging). This is one reason why WAAS (a ground based, fixed base > station, perturbation correction system) was added to the GPS systems in > North America and there is, I believe, a similar system either in place or > planned for Europe. Neither of these would have been effective in Afrrica, > of course. > > Cheers > > Hugh > > _____ > > From: borderpoint@yahoogroups.com [mailto:borderpoint@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of kubana2005 > Sent: August 4, 2008 8:43 AM > To: borderpoint@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [borderpoint] Equator > > > > I recently paid a visit to 2 equator monuments in East Africa. When I > turned my GPS on (using WGS84 datum) and positioned it on real equator > it didn't show 0 lattitude. It showed that I am about 12 meters south > of equator. > Does anybody has any ideas about this? > > Regards, Alex >
I am still in slovakia, so no chance to uplaod photos, but here is an update on my successes and failures. I managed:
ATCZDE - it was a nice walk in and as we were quite late we were on our own at the tp apart from a DE forestry worker who was felling trees. ATHUSK - no problems - as Jesper described it was a drive in as long as you ignore the signs in German that say the road is for agricultural vehicles only. The boder between ATHU e.g. at the end of the road is now open - there is no gate and no national signs at all. The tp itself is a little neglected and ovegrown. ATCZSK - from the SK side nice statue and noticeboard. CZPLSK - went slightly wrong from the CZ town and ended up on the CZSK border - go into the town and first left then right and it is a drive in. I parked in a farmers drive 400m from the PL border -thanks Hugh for thr directions. I really liked this tp - well cared for new PL paths and bridge over the tp. Went down to the tp which is a concrete pyramid. PLSKUA - a long walk in from Nova Sedlica in SK as others have described. Then walked the PLSK boder ridge for 5km before retuning to SK. HUSKUA - A close attempt I am afraid the roads and fields near the tp - 2km were all flooded - I walked the dyke to the SKUA border about 2km or less to the tp but no chance of getting any closer or at least not without swimming I think the Tisa had burst its banks.
Got lots of photos of all of the above - also of ATHU border no restictions anywhere contary to reports that AT was anti schlengen. every track etc was open.
Also visited the pan european picnic site and velke semenance - 2.5 hours wait to get across so sadly no official entry into UA.
Will update more as I get back to the UK. Sad about the failure but 5 out of 6 is not bad I guess.
Barry
Get Hotmail on your mobile from Vodafone Try it Now!
At http://picasaweb.google.com/grenzen.joop . I enjoyed it a lot.
The last folder contains markers sorted by year. Anyone with pictures of markers
with other years can send them to the compiler of these photo albums, Joop
Versluis, and he will add them (with name of the source), he has told me.
Peter
The BBC was in the neighbourhood recently and filed some stories about
my home and native land.
Of particular interest to this group: the border!
Here's their report:
http://tinyurl.com/57sant
Cheers!
Doug
--
-----------------------------------------
D o u g M u r r a y
sounds+images+words
N o r t h A m e r i c a
Vancouver 1.604.728.1407
Seattle 1.206.333.0220
Read my blog [since 2003]: roadspill.org
This is my photos from my recent visit to this tripoint, we got there quite late in the evening and had the place to ourselves. It is quite isolated and peaceful - claerly well maintained and visited with paths from each country.
Barry
Find out how to make Messenger your very own TV! Try it Now!
Nice photos.
Did you visit the two other highlights in the vicinity: the previous
tripoint marker and the divided barn (not many divided houses on the
iron curtain).
Jesper
--- In borderpoint@yahoogroups.com, Barry Arnold <barry_432@...>
wrote:
>
>
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/barry_432/sets/72157606723422318/
>
> This is my photos from my recent visit to this tripoint, we got
there quite late in the evening and had the place to ourselves. It is
quite isolated and peaceful - claerly well maintained and visited
with paths from each country.
>
> Barry
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Get Hotmail on your mobile from Vodafone
> http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/107571435/direct/01/
>
No I did not manage those visits - can you send me some links so I can look at what I missed!!! To be truthful I was tight on time - visiting this TP en route from Koln to Sopron a long enough journey without the detour, this is an area I am likely to pass again so any information will be useful.
Barry
To: borderpoint@yahoogroups.com From: jesper@... Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 17:33:30 +0000 Subject: [borderpoint] Re: ATCZDE Tripoint Visit
Nice photos.
Did you visit the two other highlights in the vicinity: the previous
tripoint marker and the divided barn (not many divided houses on the
iron curtain).
The divided barn is next
to a restaurant/shop. It’s a nice area with many markers.
It’s easy to reach if you
approach the tripoint from the paid parking lot in DE (did you do that?)
Once you reach CZDE the
road splits. Right is the direction to the tp, left is to the
barn/shop/restaurant.
The old tp marker we
found in a garden of some local authority. Maybe some of my companions remember
the location.
Jesper
--
Borderbase - your online
guide to international borders and tripoints
http://www.nicolette.dk/borderbase
Fra:borderpoint@yahoogroups.com [mailto:borderpoint@yahoogroups.com] På vegne af Barry Arnold Sendt: 14. august 2008 20:59 Til:borderpoint@yahoogroups.com Emne: RE: [borderpoint] Re: ATCZDE
Tripoint Visit
Hi Jesper,
No I did not manage those visits - can you send me some links so I can look at
what I missed!!! To be truthful I was tight on time - visiting this TP en
route from Koln to Sopron a long enough journey without the detour, this is an
area I am likely to pass again so any information will be useful.
Barry
To: borderpoint@yahoogroups.com
From: jesper@nicolette.dk
Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 17:33:30 +0000
Subject: [borderpoint] Re: ATCZDE Tripoint Visit
Nice photos.
Did you visit the two other highlights in the vicinity: the previous
tripoint marker and the divided barn (not many divided houses on the
iron curtain).
Friday, 13.15 hrs central European time, 15Aug, on Hessen 3 (German
third program, Hessische Rundfunk - also available by Astra
satellite), there will be shown a 45 min. documentary about this
Tripoint and the area around it (possibly, from the TV description,
touching on the Vennbahn area).
I'll be able to make DvD copies of it available by mail in Windows
Media WMV format (playable on Windows-based computers) after Saturday
if anyone wants a copy who is willing to reimburse my costs.
Regards
Len Nadybal
Thanks for the information - we did park in the parking lot and walked up the road to the sign and then turned right onto the path we must have been very close - next time!! Does anyone know what this area was like during the cold war, I guess the TP was out of bounds.
With the old TP - was there border changes that facilitated the move?
Barry
To: borderpoint@yahoogroups.com From: jesper@... Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 21:36:21 +0200 Subject: SV: [borderpoint] Re: ATCZDE Tripoint Visit
The divided barn is next
to a restaurant/shop. It’s a nice area with many markers.
It’s easy to reach if you
approach the tripoint from the paid parking lot in DE (did you do that?)
Once you reach CZDE the
road splits. Right is the direction to the tp, left is to the
barn/shop/restaurant.
The old tp marker we
found in a garden of some local authority. Maybe some of my companions remember
the location.
Jesper
--
Borderbase - your online
guide to international borders and tripoints
http://www.nicolette.dk/borderbase
Fra: borderpoint@yahoogroups.com [mailto:borderpoint@yahoogroups.com] På vegne af Barry Arnold Sendt: 14. august 2008 20:59 Til: borderpoint@yahoogroups.com Emne: RE: [borderpoint] Re: ATCZDE
Tripoint Visit
Hi Jesper,
No I did not manage those visits - can you send me some links so I can look at
what I missed!!! To be truthful I was tight on time - visiting this TP en
route from Koln to Sopron a long enough journey without the detour, this is an
area I am likely to pass again so any information will be useful.
Barry
To: borderpoint@yahoogroups.com
From: jesper@nicolette.dk
Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 17:33:30 +0000
Subject: [borderpoint] Re: ATCZDE Tripoint Visit
Nice photos.
Did you visit the two other highlights in the vicinity: the previous
tripoint marker and the divided barn (not many divided houses on the
iron curtain).
Thank you for the information - I will definitely watch it (have satellite here in the UK)
To: borderpoint@yahoogroups.com From: lnadybal@... Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2008 03:38:26 +0000 Subject: [borderpoint] B-NL-D Tripoint TV Documentary 13:30 Central European Time, HR3, 15 Aug 08
Friday, 13.15 hrs central European time, 15Aug, on Hessen 3 (German
third program, Hessische Rundfunk - also available by Astra
satellite), there will be shown a 45 min. documentary about this
Tripoint and the area around it (possibly, from the TV description,
touching on the Vennbahn area).
I'll be able to make DvD copies of it available by mail in Windows
Media WMV format (playable on Windows-based computers) after Saturday
if anyone wants a copy who is willing to reimburse my costs.
I agree with the sentiment here - being interested in borders links to lots of other things - number plates are an obvious example, spotting a Bosnian number plate and not recognizing the BIH sticker - I spoke to the driver, a good conversation.
To: borderpoint@yahoogroups.com From: lgm@... Date: Fri, 18 Jul 2008 09:43:22 -0500 Subject: Re: [borderpoint] out of subject
I agree. This group is really about borders in the context of political geography--that is the expression of sovereignty and/or jurisdiction upon the landscape. The things that Jesper lists are all part of that.
I have met many border people personally, and read many discussions on BoundaryPoint and Borderpoint during the last years, and it’s my general impression that most people who are interested in borders have an natural interest in wide areas of border related stuff and geography as well, which include highest and westernmost point of nations, non political boundaries, foreign influence across borders, customs rules, car license plates, odd geographical features, non-recognized countries, GPS, maps and all sorts of stuff like that.
And I certainly do too.
We are lucky to have lots of people in this group with specialized hobbies.
There are also many posts I just skip, due to lack of time and interest, and sometimes I find old messages on a subject I haven’t even read.
I have created a folder in my mail system where posts from Borderpoint and other newsgroups automatically get archived, so they don’t flood my regular inbox. It works very well for me.
I have great hope that we may enjoy our fun company many years ahead.
Jesper
--
Borderbase - your online guide to international borders and tripoints
To: borderpoint@yahoogroups.com From: barry_432@... Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2008 08:03:55 +0000 Subject: RE: [borderpoint] B-NL-D Tripoint TV Documentary 13:30 Central European Time, HR3, 15 Aug 08
Thank you for the information - I will definitely watch it (have satellite here in the UK)
To: borderpoint@yahoogroups.com From: lnadybal@bhutan.org Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2008 03:38:26 +0000 Subject: [borderpoint] B-NL-D Tripoint TV Documentary 13:30 Central European Time, HR3, 15 Aug 08
Friday, 13.15 hrs central European time, 15Aug, on Hessen 3 (German third program, Hessische Rundfunk - also available by Astra satellite), there will be shown a 45 min. documentary about this Tripoint and the area around it (possibly, from the TV description, touching on the Vennbahn area).
I'll be able to make DvD copies of it available by mail in Windows Media WMV format (playable on Windows-based computers) after Saturday if anyone wants a copy who is willing to reimburse my costs.
some old info from bp1
http://article.gmane.org/gmane.culture.discuss.boundary-point/3365
--- In borderpoint@yahoogroups.com, Barry Arnold <barry_432@...>
wrote:
>
>
> Thanks for the information - we did park in the parking lot and
walked up the road to the sign and then turned right onto the path we
must have been very close - next time!! Does anyone know what this
area was like during the cold war, I guess the TP was out of bounds.
>
> With the old TP - was there border changes that facilitated the
move?
>
> Barry
>
> To: borderpoint@yahoogroups.com
> From: jesper@...
> Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 21:36:21 +0200
> Subject: SV: [borderpoint] Re: ATCZDE Tripoint Visit
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> The divided barn is next
> to a restaurant/shop. It's a nice area with many markers.
>
> It's easy to reach if you
> approach the tripoint from the paid parking lot in DE (did you do
that?)
>
> Once you reach CZDE the
> road splits. Right is the direction to the tp, left is to the
> barn/shop/restaurant.
>
>
>
> The old tp marker we
> found in a garden of some local authority. Maybe some of my
companions remember
> the location.
>
>
>
> Jesper
>
>
>
>
>
> --
>
> Borderbase - your online
> guide to international borders and tripoints
>
> http://www.nicolette.dk/borderbase
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Fra: borderpoint@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:borderpoint@yahoogroups.com] På vegne af Barry Arnold
>
> Sendt: 14. august 2008 20:59
>
> Til: borderpoint@yahoogroups.com
>
> Emne: RE: [borderpoint] Re: ATCZDE
> Tripoint Visit
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Hi Jesper,
>
>
>
> No I did not manage those visits - can you send me some links so I
can look at
> what I missed!!! To be truthful I was tight on time - visiting
this TP en
> route from Koln to Sopron a long enough journey without the detour,
this is an
> area I am likely to pass again so any information will be useful.
>
>
>
> Barry
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> To: borderpoint@yahoogroups.com
>
> From: jesper@...
>
> Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 17:33:30 +0000
>
> Subject: [borderpoint] Re: ATCZDE Tripoint Visit
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Nice photos.
>
>
>
> Did you visit the two other highlights in the vicinity: the
previous
>
> tripoint marker and the divided barn (not many divided houses on
the
>
> iron curtain).
>
>
>
> Jesper
>
>
>
> --- In borderpoint@yahoogroups.com,
> Barry Arnold <barry_432@>
>
> wrote:
>
> >
>
> >
>
> > http://www.flickr.com/photos/barry_432/sets/72157606723422318/
>
> >
>
> > This is my photos from my recent visit to this tripoint, we got
>
> there quite late in the evening and had the place to ourselves. It
is
>
> quite isolated and peaceful - claerly well maintained and visited
>
> with paths from each country.
>
> >
>
> > Barry
>
> >
>
> > __________________________________________________________
>
> > Get Hotmail on your mobile from Vodafone
>
> > http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/107571435/direct/01/
>
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Get Hotmail on your mobile from Vodafone Try it
> Now!
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Win New York holidays with Kellogg's & Live Search
> http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/107571440/direct/01/
>
I agree tht spotting license plates is another interest of mine, somewhat related to borders. Most of last week, there was a car parked on my street bearing "Jalisco" plates, (for those of you who may not be as familiar with the Americas, Jalisco is a state on the west coast of Mexico, home to the city of Guadalajara), which means that they must have enjoyed a long road trip!
Daryl
----- Original Message ---- From: Barry Arnold <barry_432@...> To: borderpoint@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, August 15, 2008 1:12:06 AM Subject: RE: [borderpoint] out of subject
I agree with the sentiment here - being interested in borders links to lots of other things - number plates are an obvious example, spotting a Bosnian number plate and not recognizing the BIH sticker - I spoke to the driver, a good conversation.
To: borderpoint@ yahoogroups. com From: lgm@wildblue. net Date: Fri, 18 Jul 2008 09:43:22 -0500 Subject: Re: [borderpoint] out of subject
I agree. This group is really about borders in the context of political geography--that is the expression of sovereignty and/or jurisdiction upon the landscape. The things that Jesper lists are all part of that.
I have met many border people personally, and read many discussions on BoundaryPoint and Borderpoint during the last years, and it¢s my general impression that most people who are interested in borders have an natural interest in wide areas of border related stuff and geography as well, which include highest and westernmost point of nations, non political boundaries, foreign influence across borders, customs rules, car license plates, odd geographical features, non-recognized countries, GPS, maps and all sorts of stuff like that.
And I certainly do too.
We are lucky to have lots of people in this group with specialized hobbies.
There are also many posts I just skip, due to lack of time and interest, and sometimes I find old messages on a subject I haven¢t even read.
I have created a folder in my mail system where posts from Borderpoint and other newsgroups automatically get archived, so they don¢t flood my regular inbox. It works very well for me.
I have great hope that we may enjoy our fun company many years ahead.
Jesper
--
Borderbase - your online guide to international borders and tripoints
The oddest license plate sitting I've had (on a working vehicle)
was a van with Guam plates driving around Vancouver, BC.
Cheers!
Daryl Brown wrote:
> I agree tht spotting license plates is another interest of mine,
> somewhat related to borders. Most of last week, there was a car
> parked on my street bearing "Jalisco" plates, (for those of you who
> may not be as familiar with the Americas, Jalisco is a state on the
> west coast of Mexico, home to the city of Guadalajara), which means
> that they must have enjoyed a long road trip!
>
> Daryl
>
> ----- Original Message ----
> From: Barry Arnold <barry_432@...>
> To: borderpoint@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Friday, August 15, 2008 1:12:06 AM
> Subject: RE: [borderpoint] out of subject
>
> I agree with the sentiment here - being interested in borders links to
> lots of other things - number plates are an obvious example, spotting
> a Bosnian number plate and not recognizing the BIH sticker - I spoke
> to the driver, a good conversation.
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> To: borderpoint@ yahoogroups. com
> From: lgm@wildblue. net
> Date: Fri, 18 Jul 2008 09:43:22 -0500
> Subject: Re: [borderpoint] out of subject
>
>
> I agree. This group is really about borders in the context of
> political geography--that is the expression of sovereignty and/or
> jurisdiction upon the landscape. The things that Jesper lists are all
> part of that.
>
> Lowell G. McManus
> Eagle Pass, Texas, USA
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> *From:* Jesper Nielsen/Borderbase <mailto:jesper@...>
> *To:* borderpoint@ yahoogroups. com
> <mailto:borderpoint@yahoogroups.com>
> *Sent:* Wednesday, July 16, 2008 1:42 PM
> *Subject:* SV: [borderpoint] out of subject
>
> I have met many border people personally, and read many
> discussions on BoundaryPoint and Borderpoint during the last
> years, and it¢s my general impression that most people who are
> interested in borders have an natural interest in wide areas of
> border related stuff and geography as well, which include highest
> and westernmost point of nations, non political boundaries,
> foreign influence across borders, customs rules, car license
> plates, odd geographical features, non-recognized countries, GPS,
> maps and all sorts of stuff like that.
>
>
>
> And I certainly do too.
>
>
>
> We are lucky to have lots of people in this group with specialized
> hobbies.
>
>
>
> There are also many posts I just skip, due to lack of time and
> interest, and sometimes I find old messages on a subject I haven¢t
> even read.
>
>
>
> I have created a folder in my mail system where posts from
> Borderpoint and other newsgroups automatically get archived, so
> they don¢t flood my regular inbox. It works very well for me.
>
>
>
> I have great hope that we may enjoy our fun company many years ahead.
>
>
>
> Jesper
>
> --
>
> Borderbase - your online guide to international borders and tripoints
>
> http://www.nicolett e.dk/borderbas
> <http://www.nicolette.dk/borderbase>e
> <http://www.nicolette.dk/borderbase>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Find out how to make Messenger your very own TV! Try it Now!
> <http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/101719648/direct/01/>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Looking for the perfect gift?* Give the gift of Flickr!*
> <http://www.flickr.com/gift/>
>
--
-----------------------------------------
D o u g M u r r a y
sounds+images+words
N o r t h A m e r i c a
Vancouver 1.604.728.1407
Seattle 1.206.333.0220
Read my blog [since 2003]: roadspill.org
Until last fall, I lived in a community in Louisiana where a US Army fort
was the main local "industry." I regularly saw license plates from the 48
contiguous states and the DC, plus Alaska, Hawaii, Puerto Rico, Guam,
American Samoa, and a variety of American Indian tribes and nations. Also
seen were plates that had been issued by the US military to its personnel
who had been stationed previously in Germany, Italy, the Azores, etc. and
had had their vehicles there.
The rarest plate that I ever saw in actual use on a vehicle was on an old
white Chevrolet belonging to a fellow student at Louisiana State University.
It had three digits and the letters USNS GTMO. The student was a civilian
resident of the U.S. Naval Station Guantanamo Bay in Cuba, where a parent
was employed.
Lowell G. McManus
Eagle Pass, Texas, USA
----- Original Message -----
From: "Doug Murray" <doug@...>
To: <borderpoint@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, August 15, 2008 8:51 AM
Subject: Re: [borderpoint] out of subject
> The oddest license plate sitting I've had (on a working vehicle)
> was a van with Guam plates driving around Vancouver, BC.
>
> Cheers!
>
>
>
> Daryl Brown wrote:
>> I agree tht spotting license plates is another interest of mine,
>> somewhat related to borders. Most of last week, there was a car
>> parked on my street bearing "Jalisco" plates, (for those of you who
>> may not be as familiar with the Americas, Jalisco is a state on the
>> west coast of Mexico, home to the city of Guadalajara), which means
>> that they must have enjoyed a long road trip!
>>
>> Daryl
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----
>> From: Barry Arnold <barry_432@...>
>> To: borderpoint@yahoogroups.com
>> Sent: Friday, August 15, 2008 1:12:06 AM
>> Subject: RE: [borderpoint] out of subject
>>
>> I agree with the sentiment here - being interested in borders links to
>> lots of other things - number plates are an obvious example, spotting
>> a Bosnian number plate and not recognizing the BIH sticker - I spoke
>> to the driver, a good conversation.
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> To: borderpoint@ yahoogroups. com
>> From: lgm@wildblue. net
>> Date: Fri, 18 Jul 2008 09:43:22 -0500
>> Subject: Re: [borderpoint] out of subject
>>
>>
>> I agree. This group is really about borders in the context of
>> political geography--that is the expression of sovereignty and/or
>> jurisdiction upon the landscape. The things that Jesper lists are all
>> part of that.
>>
>> Lowell G. McManus
>> Eagle Pass, Texas, USA
>>
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> *From:* Jesper Nielsen/Borderbase <mailto:jesper@...>
>> *To:* borderpoint@ yahoogroups. com
>> <mailto:borderpoint@yahoogroups.com>
>> *Sent:* Wednesday, July 16, 2008 1:42 PM
>> *Subject:* SV: [borderpoint] out of subject
>>
>> I have met many border people personally, and read many
>> discussions on BoundaryPoint and Borderpoint during the last
>> years, and it¢s my general impression that most people who are
>> interested in borders have an natural interest in wide areas of
>> border related stuff and geography as well, which include highest
>> and westernmost point of nations, non political boundaries,
>> foreign influence across borders, customs rules, car license
>> plates, odd geographical features, non-recognized countries, GPS,
>> maps and all sorts of stuff like that.
>>
>>
>>
>> And I certainly do too.
>>
>>
>>
>> We are lucky to have lots of people in this group with specialized
>> hobbies.
>>
>>
>>
>> There are also many posts I just skip, due to lack of time and
>> interest, and sometimes I find old messages on a subject I haven¢t
>> even read.
>>
>>
>>
>> I have created a folder in my mail system where posts from
>> Borderpoint and other newsgroups automatically get archived, so
>> they don¢t flood my regular inbox. It works very well for me.
>>
>>
>>
>> I have great hope that we may enjoy our fun company many years ahead.
>>
>>
>>
>> Jesper
>>
>> --
>>
>> Borderbase - your online guide to international borders and tripoints
>>
>> http://www.nicolett e.dk/borderbas
>> <http://www.nicolette.dk/borderbase>e
>> <http://www.nicolette.dk/borderbase>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> Find out how to make Messenger your very own TV! Try it Now!
>> <http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/101719648/direct/01/>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> Looking for the perfect gift?* Give the gift of Flickr!*
>> <http://www.flickr.com/gift/>
>>
>
> --
> -----------------------------------------
> D o u g M u r r a y
> sounds+images+words
>
> N o r t h A m e r i c a
> Vancouver 1.604.728.1407
> Seattle 1.206.333.0220
>
> Read my blog [since 2003]: roadspill.org
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
I can't resist adding to this off topic topic, too.
Here in D. C., where we have two small German bases, we occasionally
see cars with German military license plates and on occasion also NATO
plates.
The most interesting and rarest plates I recall enjoying in Europe,
when I lived in Frankfurt, were the Soviet Military Liaison Mission
plates (SMLM). There were about a dozen of them in Frankfurt, housed
in a small base about 2 hectares large that the Americans maintained
for the Russians, that was on territory the US did not give back to
Germany in 1955 when German sovereignty was restored after WW II.
The Soviets had three such bases - one in the former French sector (at
Baden-Baden) and the other in the former British sector.
These bases came about through a military pact called the
Hubner-Malannin agreement, from (if I recall right), 1948.
With these plates, the Russians could go anywhere outside of areas of
W. Germany named off-limits (usually US base areas), and no German
authorities could interfere with them. With the plates and US issued
ID cards, the Russians could drive to the US PXs in Frankfurt and
Heidelberg, and shop duty free.
It was always a strange site to see a Russian officer in a Russian car
withe these bright red and yellow plates in the parking lot of the US
PX.
LN
--- In borderpoint@yahoogroups.com, "Lowell G. McManus" <lgm@...> wrote:
>
> Until last fall, I lived in a community in Louisiana where a US Army
fort
> was the main local "industry." I regularly saw license plates from
the 48
> contiguous states and the DC, plus Alaska, Hawaii, Puerto Rico, Guam,
> American Samoa, and a variety of American Indian tribes and nations.
Also
> seen were plates that had been issued by the US military to its
personnel
> who had been stationed previously in Germany, Italy, the Azores,
etc. and
> had had their vehicles there.
>
> The rarest plate that I ever saw in actual use on a vehicle was on
an old
> white Chevrolet belonging to a fellow student at Louisiana State
University.
> It had three digits and the letters USNS GTMO. The student was a
civilian
> resident of the U.S. Naval Station Guantanamo Bay in Cuba, where a
parent
> was employed.
>
> Lowell G. McManus
> Eagle Pass, Texas, USA
>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Doug Murray" <doug@...>
> To: <borderpoint@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Friday, August 15, 2008 8:51 AM
> Subject: Re: [borderpoint] out of subject
>
>
> > The oddest license plate sitting I've had (on a working vehicle)
> > was a van with Guam plates driving around Vancouver, BC.
> >
> > Cheers!
> >
> >
> >
> > Daryl Brown wrote:
> >> I agree tht spotting license plates is another interest of mine,
> >> somewhat related to borders. Most of last week, there was a car
> >> parked on my street bearing "Jalisco" plates, (for those of you who
> >> may not be as familiar with the Americas, Jalisco is a state on the
> >> west coast of Mexico, home to the city of Guadalajara), which means
> >> that they must have enjoyed a long road trip!
> >>
> >> Daryl
> >>
> >> ----- Original Message ----
> >> From: Barry Arnold <barry_432@...>
> >> To: borderpoint@yahoogroups.com
> >> Sent: Friday, August 15, 2008 1:12:06 AM
> >> Subject: RE: [borderpoint] out of subject
> >>
> >> I agree with the sentiment here - being interested in borders
links to
> >> lots of other things - number plates are an obvious example, spotting
> >> a Bosnian number plate and not recognizing the BIH sticker - I spoke
> >> to the driver, a good conversation.
> >>
> >>
> >>
------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >> To: borderpoint@ yahoogroups. com
> >> From: lgm@wildblue. net
> >> Date: Fri, 18 Jul 2008 09:43:22 -0500
> >> Subject: Re: [borderpoint] out of subject
> >>
> >>
> >> I agree. This group is really about borders in the context of
> >> political geography--that is the expression of sovereignty and/or
> >> jurisdiction upon the landscape. The things that Jesper lists
are all
> >> part of that.
> >>
> >> Lowell G. McManus
> >> Eagle Pass, Texas, USA
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> ----- Original Message -----
> >> *From:* Jesper Nielsen/Borderbase <mailto:jesper@...>
> >> *To:* borderpoint@ yahoogroups. com
> >> <mailto:borderpoint@yahoogroups.com>
> >> *Sent:* Wednesday, July 16, 2008 1:42 PM
> >> *Subject:* SV: [borderpoint] out of subject
> >>
> >> I have met many border people personally, and read many
> >> discussions on BoundaryPoint and Borderpoint during the last
> >> years, and it¢s my general impression that most people who are
> >> interested in borders have an natural interest in wide areas of
> >> border related stuff and geography as well, which include highest
> >> and westernmost point of nations, non political boundaries,
> >> foreign influence across borders, customs rules, car license
> >> plates, odd geographical features, non-recognized countries, GPS,
> >> maps and all sorts of stuff like that.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> And I certainly do too.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> We are lucky to have lots of people in this group with
specialized
> >> hobbies.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> There are also many posts I just skip, due to lack of time and
> >> interest, and sometimes I find old messages on a subject I
haven¢t
> >> even read.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> I have created a folder in my mail system where posts from
> >> Borderpoint and other newsgroups automatically get archived, so
> >> they don¢t flood my regular inbox. It works very well for me.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> I have great hope that we may enjoy our fun company many
years ahead.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Jesper
> >>
> >> --
> >>
> >> Borderbase - your online guide to international borders and
tripoints
> >>
> >> http://www.nicolett e.dk/borderbas
> >> <http://www.nicolette.dk/borderbase>e
> >> <http://www.nicolette.dk/borderbase>
> >>
> >>
> >>
------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >> Find out how to make Messenger your very own TV! Try it Now!
> >> <http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/101719648/direct/01/>
> >>
> >>
------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >> Looking for the perfect gift?* Give the gift of Flickr!*
> >> <http://www.flickr.com/gift/>
> >>
> >
> > --
> > -----------------------------------------
> > D o u g M u r r a y
> > sounds+images+words
> >
> > N o r t h A m e r i c a
> > Vancouver 1.604.728.1407
> > Seattle 1.206.333.0220
> >
> > Read my blog [since 2003]: roadspill.org
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------------
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
>
Len,
Please tell us about the German bases in Washington. I didn't know about
those!
Lowell G. McManus
Eagle Pass, Texas, USA
----- Original Message -----
From: "L. A. Nadybal" <lnadybal@...>
To: <borderpoint@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, August 15, 2008 9:26 PM
Subject: [borderpoint] Re: out of subject
I can't resist adding to this off topic topic, too.
Here in D. C., where we have two small German bases, we occasionally
see cars with German military license plates and on occasion also NATO
plates.
I've read some interesting stories about the British Missions in the
Soviet Zone.
More on Brixmis here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BRIXMIS
On a completely unrelated but more bordery topic: The Tuli Circle:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tuli,_Zimbabwe
Cheers!
Doug
Lowell G. McManus wrote:
>
> Len,
>
> Please tell us about the German bases in Washington. I didn't know about
> those!
>
> Lowell G. McManus
> Eagle Pass, Texas, USA
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "L. A. Nadybal" <lnadybal@... <mailto:lnadybal%40bhutan.org>>
> To: <borderpoint@yahoogroups.com <mailto:borderpoint%40yahoogroups.com>>
> Sent: Friday, August 15, 2008 9:26 PM
> Subject: [borderpoint] Re: out of subject
>
> I can't resist adding to this off topic topic, too.
>
> Here in D. C., where we have two small German bases, we occasionally
> see cars with German military license plates and on occasion also NATO
> plates.
>
>
--
-----------------------------------------
D o u g M u r r a y
sounds+images+words
N o r t h A m e r i c a
Vancouver 1.604.728.1407
Seattle 1.206.333.0220
Read my blog [since 2003]: roadspill.org
These out-of-subject topics seem to be equally interesting for quite a few of us ;-)
My most interesting experiences with international number plates were:
- when I was travelling through California and the southwest of the US with a German license plate for a few weeks, I heard some quite some funny comments. The best one was "You have a strange number plate... are you from Canada?!?" You have to know that the number plate was starting with TÖL-.. ..., letters unknown in the languages spoken in North America. Other people came to me directly and told me they knew where I came from which was a surprise as well. That county in Germany had an important US army base by the time.
- I recently spotted a saloon car with a Spanish number plate. Quite a long trip!
- In Cairo, there are thousands of old cars where Egyptian number plates are simply put on top of old European ones.
> To: <borderpoint@ yahoogroups. com <mailto:borderpoint %40yahoogroups. com>> > Sent: Friday, August 15, 2008 9:26 PM > Subject: [borderpoint] Re: out of subject > > I can't resist adding to this off topic topic, too. > > Here in D. C., where we have two small German bases, we occasionally > see cars with German military license plates and on occasion also NATO > plates. > >
-- ------------ --------- --------- --------- -- D o u g M u r r a y sounds+images+ words
N o r t h A m e r i c a Vancouver 1.604.728.1407 Seattle 1.206.333.0220
I am interrested by this subject ;-) I collect some plates
Living in France, I remembered that I have seen on a french motorway a truck with a plate from Iran !
When I was in Newfoundland, I also seen an irish plate near St. John's
Tschuss
Romain
-----Message d'origine----- De : borderpoint@yahoogroups.com [mailto:borderpoint@yahoogroups.com] De la part de P von Werden Envoyé : samedi 16 août 2008 07:26 À : borderpoint@yahoogroups.com Objet : Re : [borderpoint] Re: out of subject
These out-of-subject topics seem to be equally interesting for quite a few of us ;-)
My most interesting experiences with international number plates were:
- when I was travelling through California and the southwest of the US with a German license plate for a few weeks, I heard some quite some funny comments. The best one was "You have a strange number plate... are you from Canada?!?" You have to know that the number plate was starting with TÖL-.. ..., letters unknown in the languages spoken in North America. Other people came to me directly and told me they knew where I came from which was a surprise as well. That county in Germany had an important US army base by the time.
- I recently spotted a saloon car with a Spanish number plate. Quite a long trip!
- In Cairo, there are thousands of old cars where Egyptian number plates are simply put on top of old European ones.
----- Message d'origine ---- De : Doug Murray <doug@borderfilms.com> À : borderpoint@yahoogroups.com Envoyé le : Samedi, 16 Août 2008, 7h33mn 57s Objet : Re: [borderpoint] Re: out of subject
> To: <borderpoint@ yahoogroups. com <mailto:borderpoint %40yahoogroups. com>> > Sent: Friday, August 15, 2008 9:26 PM > Subject: [borderpoint] Re: out of subject > > I can't resist adding to this off topic topic, too. > > Here in D. C., where we have two small German bases, we occasionally > see cars with German military license plates and on occasion also NATO > plates. > >
-- ------------ --------- --------- --------- -- D o u g M u r r a y sounds+images+ words
N o r t h A m e r i c a Vancouver 1.604.728.1407 Seattle 1.206.333.0220
Read my blog [since 2003]: roadspill.org
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