Greetings;

Originally, I had wanted to just simply ignore this post, but as it is my
nature, I simply _CANNOT_ let anyone get away with such poor and illogical
scholarship like how Mr. Dunkin here tries to pass off. But let us see what he
claims.

PATRIOT TIM:
[[ For many months, I have been scoffing at the Muslim claims to having
found Allah in the Bible. However, I noticed something very
interesting while reading last night, and it indicates that Allah, in
fact, IS found in the Old Testament. ]]

But then Mr. Dunkin goes off by the tangent by expounding that "RIMMON" is
somehow related to the moon-god nonsense he parrots from Morey. First off, Mr.
Dunkin, no one by any stretch of imagination will claim that "ALLAH" has a
common root word with "RIMMON". The root of ALLAH is ALEPH-LAMD-HA, the same
root as for ELOHIM, which is ALEPH-LAMED-HEH. I have never failed to
consistently point this out, as can be seen on my webpage:

http://www.bismikaallahuma.org/Polemics/moongod.htm

The word ELOHIM do exist in the Hebrew translation of the Qur'an, as can be seen
here:

http://www.bismikaallahuma.org/God/h-basmalah.htm

That should silence the noise there. Now we move on into the heart of the
matter, and as expounded by Mr. Dunkin:

[[ The verse in question is II Kings 5:18, and the words were spoken by
Naaman the Syrian general who had just been healed of his leprosy by
Elisha the prophet [....] We see Naaman saying that, because of his position of
importance to the king of Syria, he would be required to enter and bow to
Rimmon in
that deity's temple in Damascus.

Thus, we see that RIMMON is found in the Bible. ]]

And then he proceeds off to quote from this very hilarious source:

PATRIOT TIM:
[[ "It is interesting to find that Rammanu, who was RIMMON of Assyria,
Brahman of India, and RAHMAN OF ISLAM, was also known in Babylon as
IL-HALLABU." (S.H. Langdon, The Mythology of All Races, Vol. 5, p.
39, the Archaeological Institute of America) ]]

I have my own doubts with this citation by Mr. Dunkin from this source, because
I have seen this cited before by Mr. Dunkin's idol Morey, and I am not inclined
to believe that Morey had cited this correctly. But of course, that would be
considered _poisoning the well_. So let us move on to Mr. Dunkin's next claim:

PATRIOT TIM:
[[ Rahman, as indicated to us in the Qu'ran, Surah 17:110, is another
name for Allah. Hence, we see that there is a definite connexion,
linguistic and otherwise, between the Rimmon who was worshipped all
throughout Syria, Paddan-Aram, Assyria, and the rest of the northern
Fertile Crescent, and Rahman, or Allah. ]]

Okay, I think I had enough of this shoddy scholarship, and now its the time to
blast Mr. Dunkin to kingdom come. The reality is that one does not need the
source(s) that Mr. Dunkin dutifully parrots from Morey, as both _The New
Strong's Exhaustive Concordance of the Bible_ and _The Brown-Driver-Briggs
Hebrew-English Lexicon_ are good enough authorities on the etymology, and I own
BOTH books.

I searched for RIMMON in Strong's and this is what I found:

4. A Syrian god (7417)

Looks like Morey's citation(?) is already wrong there. How could it say that
RIMMON is "Assyrian" now, eh?

Next, by the Strong number given I cross-checked with B-D-B Lexicon, and this is
what I found on p. 942:

RIMMON n. pr. dei; as Rammanu, god of wind, rain and storm; thunder; storm

Already by this is enough to refute Mr. Dunkin. But let us take a look of the
meaning of RAHMAN, as in Hans Wehr's Arabic-English Dictionary (edited by J. M.
Cowan) on p. 332:

ar-rahman - the Merciful (i.e. God)

The root of RAHMAN is the word RAHMA, and so on the very same page, we find that
the word RAHMA means:

pity, compassion; human understanding, sympathy, kindness; mercy

Any relation with the "Assyrian" RIMMON of Syria? I certainly do not see any!

To hammer in the final nail on the coffin, let us summarise the whole matter:

1) RIMMON is a *SYRIAN god* and the name itself is a *NOUN*, and has nothing in
common with RAHMAN, which is an *ATTRIBUTE* of God, as any Muslim schoolchild
would know. RAHMAN is *not* a noun.

2) RIMMON means "thunder". RAHMAN comes from the word RAHMA, which means "pity,
compassion, etc." Certainly no one in their right mind can see *ANY* correlation
there!

3) RIMMON is the Syrian "god of wind, rain and storm". By no stretch of
imagination can this be applied to ALLAH, the God of Abraham (P), Moses (P),
Jesus (P) and Muhammad (P)!

4) _NOWHERE_ in Strong's or in the B-D-B Lexicon do we find any correlation of
RIMMON with the Arabic word RAHMAN or RAHMA

Conclusion: Mr. Dunkin is foaming at the mouth with his constant NONSENSE and
SHODDY SCHOLARSHIP. We suggest that Mr. Dunkin stick to his current daytime
occupation, which has to be that of some frustrating poorly-paid Sunday school
teaching job, instead of trying to pass off himself as some sort of
etymologist-cum-archeologist and parroting verbatim from his idol, Morey Ha
Kelev Ben Kelev.

Regards.

MENJ
menj@...
http://www.bismikaallahuma.org

-----Original Message-----
From: patriot_tim [mailto:timdunkin@...]
Sent: Wednesday, July 10, 2002 11:56 AM
To: bibleandquran@yahoogroups.com
Subject: {Bible And Quran} Allah IS in the Bible, after all!


Greetings,

For many months, I have been scoffing at the Muslim claims to having
found Allah in the Bible. However, I noticed something very
interesting while reading last night, and it indicates that Allah, in
fact, IS found in the Old Testament.

The verse in question is II Kings 5:18, and the words were spoken by
Naaman the Syrian general who had just been healed of his leprosy by
Elisha the prophet. Naaman has stated that the God of Israel is the
only God, but is seeking pardon from the Lord by Elisha in the
following:

"In this thing the Lord pardon thy servant, that when my master [the
king of Syria - Tim] goeth into the house of RIMMON to worship there,
and he leaneth on my hand, and I bow myself in the house of RIMMON:
when I bow down myself in the house of RIMMON, the Lord pardon thy
servant for this thing."

We see Naaman saying that, because of his position of importance to
the king of Syria, he would be required to enter and bow to Rimmon in
that deity's temple in Damascus.

Thus, we see that RIMMON is found in the Bible.

"It is interesting to find that Rammanu, who was RIMMON of Assyria,
Brahman of India, and RAHMAN OF ISLAM, was also known in Babylon as
IL-HALLABU." (S.H. Langdon, The Mythology of All Races, Vol. 5, p.
39, the Archaeological Institute of America)

Rahman, as indicated to us in the Qu'ran, Surah 17:110, is another
name for Allah. Hence, we see that there is a definite connexion,
linguistic and otherwise, between the Rimmon who was worshipped all
throughout Syria, Paddan-Aram, Assyria, and the rest of the northern
Fertile Crescent, and Rahman, or Allah.

Rimmon, as seen above, is connected with the Babylonian Il-hallabu,
which has been shown elsewhere to be a root term containing the IL
particle from which al-ILah, Allah, comes from. This, of course,
leads us right back to Sin, the moon god, with that title "al-
ilah"....Allah.

I guess the Muslims were right all along.

Tim




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