[fbis translated text]

Milan: Il Nuovo (Internet Version-WWW) in Italian 0805 GMT 05 Dec 03
[Report by Gianni Cipriani: "'I Will Be a Martyr' -- This Is How the
Islamists in Handcuffs Speak"]



Here is the text of intercepted conversations from the inquiry into
the recruitment of future Islamic terrorists in Italy. It paints a
worrying picture of a little known phenomenon with deep roots.



In the context of the investigation in Milan into the Ansar al-Islam
transnational terrorist organization, what has emerged is a "fresco"
of the world of radical Islamism full of secret projects but also a
propensity for subversion that is completely different from the one
that we were accustomed to seeing here in Italy in connection with
our own form of domestic political terrorism.



Thus over and above the more strictly investigative aspect, a
thorough read through some of the documents or wiretaps conducted in
the course of the investigation can be revealing in terms of the
group's plans but also, and above all, in terms of its political,
religious, and social implications. We can gain a clear idea of the
prestige and program of Emir Krikar, the acknowledged leader of Ansar
al-Islam, a group that is in turn linked to al-Tawid whose leader is
Emir Abu Musab al-Zarkawi, still a leading member of Al-Qa'ida.



"The money is there, we need to get educated: War needs to be
studied" -- Wiretaps dated 15 June



The documents contain an extremely interesting conversation that took
place between Nasr Usama Mustafa, also known as Abu Umar, and an Arab
from Germany. The magistracy claims that the following dialogue
allowed it to discover "a new transnational subversive structure
whose outposts concern also our own country, and consisting of
ideologically and militarily trained members split into cells and
operationally subject to the decision-making component of al-Tawid in
the conduct of terrorist attacks."



This conversation is especially interesting if we consider that
Egyptian Imam Abu Umar was subsequently kidnapped, or in any event he
has disappeared from Milan.



"In loco" conversation intercepted on 15 June 2002, from 2215 [2015
GMT] and 53 seconds on, inside the offices of the Islamic Community
in Italy located in via Quaranta 54, Milan. Line 2, number 13,596.



Persons present: Abu Umar: Nasr Usama Mustafa Hasan Man: unknown (of
unspecified nationality) from Germany



Transcript number 13,596 begins with an exchange of compliments on
the conference that the guest has held.



[Abu Umar] Congratulations, you encouraged the youngsters.



[Man] And that is not the end of it. There are so many things to
change in order to eliminate God's enemies, the policy of Israel and
those who pursue it.



[Abu Umar] That is our hope...



[Man] On 16 of last month there was a confidential meeting with the
shaykhs in Poland; the final decision was to completely change the
Hizb al-Tahrir front and to build a new organization that concerns
itself with the national territory and with the international
territory but we need highly trained people at every level.



[Abu Umar] It takes time.



[Man] We have time; we are moving very gradually. There are people
already on the inside.



[Abu Umar] What do you mean?



[Man] Now Shaykh Adel and Shaykh Abd al-Wahab have set up various
groups in which there are various brothers who have come back from
Chechnya.



[Abu Umar] How about Shaykh Adlen?



[Man] He moved before I came here. I met him in 1987. But let us now
return to our topic. Our project needs intelligent and highly
educated people. Where the Jihad part is concerned, there is Abu
Serrah who is planning to set up a battalion of 25 to 26 units but
the plan needs to be thoroughly prepared.



[Abu Umar] As long as the Devil does not work his way into it.



[Man] The first thing that I will tell you is that we are aware that
we are under surveillance. We know that half the brothers are in
jail, including those who have been accused of gathering funds. I
repeat, the plan must be studied in detail because the thread begins
in Saudi Arabia; the person taking care of this plan is Abu Salman
(or Abu Suleyman) who is of the same blood as Emir Abdullah (1) so
there is no need for any comment. [Man ends]



At that point both men laugh.



[Man] But the mosques have too high a profile; they must be left
alone. We need new structures; we are seeking from seven to nine
buildings. We recently bought a four-story building.



[Abu Umar] Are we not concerning ourselves with the mosques?



[Man] Yes, we are concerning ourselves with them. We are also
concerning ourselves with financing them, but money has to generate
money because the aim is also to form an Islamic army with the name
of Force 9 (source translator's note: the term used is Kawa )



[Abu Umar] How are things going in Germany?



[Man] I cannot complain. There are 10 of us; we are taking an
interest in Belgium, Spain, The Netherlands, Turkey and Egypt, Italy
and France, but the nerve center is still London... Shaykh Adlen has
given a great deal of money; as I told you this plan has no need of
any further comments or words.



[Abu Umar] I hope that this will cause our youth to shine.



[Man] That is our objective; each of us has a task, for instance if
one has 10 operatives available, he becomes their leader and then it
is up to him to decide whether to organize them into smaller groups
or to keep them like that. The important thing is to use one's
intelligence.



[Abu Umar] Even if they are foreigners (source translator's note: not
Arabs)?



[Man] That is not important. We need also foreigners; we have
Albanians, Swiss, British... It is enough that they be of a high
cultural level. In Germany we have interpreters and interpreters that
translate books; we have also in telecommunications [as published],
also in Austria; the important thing is that their faith in Islam be
sincere.



[Abu Umar] We have never had any problems with them; on the contrary,
we have noticed that they are very enthusiastic and they participate.



[Man] Besides, neither you nor I are the ones who decide whether to
take them or not; those who make the decision are the people with
Hizb al-Tawid.



[Abu Umar] I am very enthusiastic about this plan.



[Man] Never worry about money, because Saudi Arabia's money is your
money; the important thing is not to rush ahead, because it is all
new; there are old things too, but the training is completely new.
The man who wanted to set up the plan is close to Emir Abdullah and
we are grateful to Emir Abdullah. Get prepared.



[Abu Umar] I am ready.



[Man] We are also awaiting the shaykh from Iraq (2)...



[Abu Umar] (interrupting the man) Is he not the one from Algeria?



[Man] The one who used to be in London.



[Abu Umar] I have heard that there are various problems with Shaykh
Wahab (phonetic).



[Man] I do not believe so.



[Abu Umar] I have just heard it said.



[Man] Beware of the Internet, it is frightening. These are the
initial indications from Shaykh Adlen; we must ignore the Internet.
If you communicate via the Internet use a different language... The
main point is that each group protects the next group without
mutually destroying each other, and each group must be distant from
the next. Chechnya takes care of training the youngsters, while
another group takes care of information. And yet another takes care
of the air that we breathe. There is only one condition. One or two
people from the group take part in every meeting, where they discuss
their situation and they listen to the others. The important thing is
that these people be of the same rank as the others... and they must
all be aware of everything. We are all one and one is God.



[Abu Umar] We fight for the word of freedom, even via paper.



[Man] Yes, this too is part of our plans. There is a certain amount
of information that I cannot provide now until we see each other
next, God willing...



[Man] [as published] There is need of merchants, of professors, of
engineers, of medics, of trainers, but on one point... There is money
for this cause but money needs to bring in more money, as I told you
earlier I am not the one making the decisions. Those who err pay in
the name of the Sharia and there are tests to pass. I take care of my
city in Germany. The other guy takes care of his city in Algeria.
Each city has its pupils. And he (the Ka'id ) is the one who chooses
them. The responsibility is totally his; if a person errs, then the
Ka'id answers for that. But dear Abu Umar, it is not quantity but
quality; even if they number only 10, that is sufficient. Because you
can study them, you can understand them psychologically. You do like
at school: There is kindergarten, there is elementary school, high
school, and college. At each stage there is an exam. But the most
important things are security, prudence, intelligence, order, and
communications, which must be conducted via other people (messengers)
or else one speaks in a different language (with predefined
terminology -- Il Nuovo editor's note), so it is necessary to
carefully study that point because each group refers to its own
region ( Dahira ); I will give you a small example: Italy is part of
Austria, Germany is part of The Netherlands, The Netherlands is part
of London. This is only an example, though; for this, too, lessons
are required because prudence is the thing that saves you. Take for
instance the case of Ismail who has been in The Netherlands since
1979 and no one knows who he is... I repeat, the organization must be
unimpeachable where confidentiality is concerned...



[Abu Umar] What do I busy myself with?



[Man] You sell, you buy, you print, you record, after which the
person involved will come to you and speak with you personally; it is
sufficient for things not to get mixed up with one another, and it is
sufficient to avoid easy arrests; we know perfectly well that I, you,
and the others are all under surveillance. I know that I am being
followed by the police but I take them for a ride; the important
thing is to find a way of getting a message to someone else. Dear Abu
Umar, technology is needed to fight God's enemies.



[Abu Umar] That is true.



[Man] That is why the shaykhs insist on having highly educated people.



[Abu Umar] Yes, yes.



[Man] It is necessary to have a great deal of intelligence. If Shaykh
Abu Khalil, Shaykh Abu Qatada, and Shaykh Aden the Syrian are under
surveillance, there are other people who run the group in their
stead, who handle the situation; second, one needs to be careful of
the way he speaks, one must not just throw words about carelessly,
one must control his tongue; our groups are spread from Algeria
throughout the world. For instance a person can manage the group
perfectly well from Poland, like Shaykh Abd al-Aziz; he has a group
called the Katilea group, its organization is stunning, it is a
perfect organization, communication is possible even via a book.



[Abu Umar] What, has he written a book?



[Man] Even more. He, in books, they are books, but they are full of
dollars. [sentence as published]



[Abu Umar] He sends dollars via books?



[Man] Yes, and other things too.



[Abu Umar] How? Through the mail?



[Man] Yes, also through the mail.



[Abu Umar] With such ease?



[Man] Yes, because it is not Europe. Europe is now under surveillance
by air and by land, but in Poland, in Bulgaria, and in countries that
are not members of the European Community it is all easy. First, they
are corrupt, you can buy them with dollars. I take the substance from
there and I place it here and there; they are countries that are less
monitored, there are not too many eyes; but the country from which
all kinds of things depart is Austria. Three I meet with all the
shaykhs and all our brothers are there... At this juncture that has
become the country of international communications. It has become the
country of contacts; as I told you before, all the contacts arrive
from Austria or from Poland. The most convenient country is Austria,
and all the other neighboring countries. If you are on the wanted
list, you have two options. Either you hide there (in Austria) or in
the mountains. Above all the mosque of Sahafi (or Sahawi), the old
mosque, has been a very hot mosque for a long time, very hot; they
are very united especially after the event that occurred recently.



[Abu Umar] There is only one God and Muhammad is his Prophet.



[Man] I will send you the full explanation with a brother; I simply
commend to you the union and Hizb al-Tawa.



[Abu Umar] All I need are the indications.



[Man] God willing, they will reach you. It is a matter of days
because right now the shaykhs are traveling in Algeria, in Morocco,
and in Bosnia; with calm and patience; you must never rush; the
people are with you too; each line has its own task. The youngsters
and the jihad ...



[Abu Umar] Tell me, is Abu Othman still active?



[Man] Abu Othman is certainly a member of our party; all the former
combatants in Chechnya have a group of their own at this juncture.



[Abu Umar] Well, I met Abu Othman in the period between 1986 and 1987.



[Man] He spent a long time in Austria, then he transferred to Saudi
Arabia; he has written several communiques in support of Emir
Abdullah.



[Abu Umar] May God bless him... So Austria has become a great power.



[Man] Yes, everything circulates there... There is a great deal of
money circulating... one has but to learn and to study, and to
organize things that may be of interest to us. Studying the streets,
because the war needs to be studied...



(1) Usama Bin Ladin



(2) Probably a reference to Faraj Ahmad Najmudin, alias Mullah Krikar



"I want to be a martyr, I live for the jihad"



Two members of the organization, apprehended by the police, speak
with each other while locked away in a security cell in Milan's
police headquarters.



The thing that transpires from their conversation, apart from the
agreements on how to elude the investigation, is the two men's
fanaticism and their unequivocal opinion of the suicide bombers and
of the "positiveness" of being a martyr.



Interlocutors:

Mera'i = Al-Ayashi Radi

Mohammad the Somali = Ciise Maxamed Cabdullah



[Mohammad] What a situation!



[Mera'i] God sees them. You stay calm.



[Mohammad] I am calm, but there is so much confusion inside me.



[Mera'i] I repeat, everything is in God's hands. Now we are here.
Even if they take us to San Vittore [Milan central penitentiary]...



[Mohammad] What is San Vittore?



[Mera'i] It is a jail, but there we will find the best brothers...
the kind of brothers that never leave you in the lurch (3).



[Mohammad] At this juncture let us pray to God. Where are we here?



[Mera'i] This is the DIGOS [Italian Division for General
Investigations and Special Operations] waiting room.



[Mohammad] Ah, what is their name?



[Mera'i] DIGOS. After the security services ( mukhabarat ), they are
next.



[Mohammad] If I had had a little more time I would not be here today,
I would be in Paris.



[Mera'i] Do not make me feel guilty.



[Mohammad] No, no, it is fate. There have been problems ever since I
arrived in Italy. I am not putting the blame on you. We are
combatants.



[Mera'i] Good, good; for the better.



[Mohammad] Have they put anything in our food?



[Mera'i] We do not eat the candy of the enemies of God because they
are sons of dogs.



[Mohammad] Tell me honestly, have you been here before?



[Mera'i] Never at the DIGOS, but at the Foreigners Office, yes.



[Mohammad] We do not know each other.



[Mera'i] You do not even need to say it. They have already asked me
if I knew you and I answered that I met you at the mosque.



[Mohammad] Fine, let us stick to that version, because they have
nothing on me. When they asked me how come I was here, I answered
that I came to look for my cousin, a member of the family whom I have
been desperately seeking high and low. But quite honestly here in
your place there is something wrong. I am astonished by the business
of the bag; how could they know that it was there; how could they
have brought me the bag? Why are they asking me where the training
camps in Syria are? I am speechless.



[Mera'i] You know, they try to get you to speak; they try to make you
believe that they know everything, but they know nothing. I have very
many brothers in jail who have been sentenced to serve from five to
15 years, in Italy, in Bosnia, in the whole world.



[Mohammad] So there is a link. So you are under surveillance.



[Mera'i] Listen, brother, if I had been discovered I certainly would
not be here. I would already be serving my sentence (source
translator's note: in jail). You have to know that spies sometimes
come to the mosque; a few spies come; these guys want to know who a
person is and where he comes from when they see new movement... They
try to gather information and then they go tell them.



[Mohammad] I will tell you that I saw them from the very first day,
even when we were arrested and they put me into the car and pointed a
pistol at me. They told me that they will conduct inquiries
concerning me and that they will ask the Americans too. I told them
that they are enemies of God, to take their hands off me; after that,
they asked me what my true nationality was.



[Mera'i] Take them for a ride; tell them that you are Egyptian. Let
us thank God that they did not find our passports. I have few things
at home; I have only money, but the others are hidden, but... I have
only a few euros at home...



[Mohammad] They do not frighten me; one must always have faith in God.



[Mera'i] I have been reciting the Koran all night.



[Mohammad] So have I.



[Mera'i] They are just waiting for a word, for us to say that we are
mujahidin , and they will be happy; since they have nothing, let us
take them for a ride...



[Mohammad] The Moroccan passports?



[Mera'i] Nothing; when they took us, I had nothing on me; I had given
everything to Brahim.



[Mohammad] He is the sharpest one of the people that you introduced
me to.



[Mera'i] He is sharp and generous, tranquil and kind; he knows how to
behave in these situations.



[Mohammad] How about the Moroccan passport that they prepared for you
and that they gave you when we sat down?



[Mera'i] Brahim has it; he knows what to do. I am not so stupid as to
keep it on me; when we get out of here, you disappear at once and I
will do the same. If you need support, Brahim knows where the money
is hidden too. I have never had anything on me. If you want to take
the passports, take them; he knows all my hideouts and he knows all
my moves; sometimes even we, too, forget where we have hidden things;
he is [silent as] a tomb.



[Mohammad] First let us get out of here, and then I will try to get
to Romania, too, because I have support there. I am sorry to put the
question to you again, but are you sure that this is the first time
that you have been brought here? Are you not under surveillance?
(Mera'i was asked this same question on several occasions -- Il Nuovo
editor's note)



[Mera'i] I realize when I am under surveillance. I know most of them,
and then there are the youngsters who watch me in the mosque and who
inform me.



[Mohammad] I have doubts about the damned telephones; if that is the
way it is, then it is a big problem because the others are waiting
for me; Abderrazak, Abu Zaied, Abd al-Karim, these guys are on most
of the secret services' wanted lists, especially Abu Zaied who is
wanted by the French.



[Mera'i] I do not think so. Because I do not use the telephone very
much; I constantly change my phone card; and the phone calls that we
made together, we made them from outside.



[Mohammad] I hope that that is true, that they do not have any phone
calls, because if that were the case it would be a problem for the
brothers; but I think that you are under surveillance (in the sense
that he is known, quite apart from the telephones -- Il Nuovo
editor's note)



[Mera'i] That may be true. Who is not under surveillance? All they
have to do is to see you once and they watch your moves.



[Mohammad] No, brother. No I remember well Quaranta Quaranta [Forty
Forty]; I recall a guy who told me that it was better to go to
Afghanistan or to Iran than to go to via Quaranta; this place is the
most dangerous place after London, because it is known worldwide for
the training of terrorists and for logistical and financial support;
it is well-known for being in the firing line. The whole world knows
Quaranta Quaranta.



[Mera'i] Where are you coming from? From the United Kingdom. So? Be
calm; they have nothing. They asked me about Lotfi (4), about Hamad
(6), about Mullah Fouad, about Amin; most of them are in jail or else
they are dead. In my view their target is Mullah Fouad (7).



[Mohammad] I am not worried for myself, I am worried for the others,
for the brothers over there who are waiting for me. I will not set
foot in London again because at this juncture I am on the files.



[Mera'i] Is Abu Zaied Farouk the Algerian?



[Mohammad] No, absolutely not; I know him as an Egyptian from Zamalek
(a locality in Egypt -- Il Nuovo editor's note)



[Mera'i] Do you know brother Abd al-Karim?



[Mohammad] Yes! He has left. [Mohammad ends]



There follows a brief pause, then:



[Mera'i] The enemies of God, sons of dogs; stupid questions. Have you
been to Iran? Yes, so what? What is the problem with my having been
to Iran? Have you been to Syria? Stupid questions.



[Mohammad] They told me that I am Sudanese.



[Mera'i] You tell them yes, no, perhaps, I have forgotten; take them
for a ride. These people here, the Americans' servants, they are
slaves.



[Mohammad] Yes, yes.



[Mera'i] But they are terrified of us; sooner or later, maybe
tomorrow morning, they will have news, because both the Americans and
the Israelis, they pay sooner or later; maybe tomorrow morning, who
knows? When they kill, it is all right, and if we tell them that we
are going to Iran or to Syria they ask us what we are going to do
there. Now they have gotten Iraq involved as well, the American and
Israeli dogs, may God curse them, also their allies including the
Italian Government; whatever they ask them for, they are totally
amenable; the Americans walk them around on a lead. Because they are
servants, because the power... but what power... if they ask me
whether I went to fight in Afghanistan I will tell them that I did.
So what? Is there some problem? They are armed and they are afraid of
us.



[Mohammad] Whatever the Americans ask, they... not just them, but
also any other country, they serve them.



[Mera'i] Very soon they will be getting news, a splendid thing to
behold... and they pay because they are dogs, they are like dogs,
they are sons of dogs, they are cursed, they are the enemies of God;
the others in front and them behind on a lead. They have no worth;
they are dogs. They are devils. The American power does not frighten
me. Are you afraid of them? Whatever questions they ask you, do not
answer. Or else tell them that you do not know. Tell them that it is
the Koran that answers.



[Mohammad] The enemy of God came to touch my Koran.



[Mera'i] And did you let him?



[Mohammad] No.



[Mera'i] Tell him to go away and not to touch it even with his finger.



[Mohammad] He told me that he wanted to check it and I told him that
I would open it, page by page; he made me open it three times.



[Mera'i] Enemies of God. They will undoubtedly ask you about the
people who were in Afghanistan; they want the head (the leader -- Il
Nuovo editor's note). They like life; I want to be a martyr, I live
for the jihad . There is nothing in this life; life is afterward;
above all, brother, the indescribable feeling is that of dying a
martyr. God, help me to be your martyr. [Mera'i ends]



They recite verses from the Koran.



[Mohammad] These people, why are they not ashamed? Whatever they ask
of them, they are at their disposal.



[Mera'i] The Americans are masters for them. Believe me, even if they
were to ask me something about the Americans I would answer them that
you both belong to the same race. Enemies. They are the masters and
you are the dogs. You go wherever they tell you to go. Devils. They
are afraid of the Americans; we are not afraid of the Americans.
[Mera'i ends]



There follows more chat in the course of which the two men insult the
Americans and their allies, then recite verses from the Koran and the
anthem of the jihad , then:



[Mera'i] Do you know the anthem of the jihad against the Americans.



[Mohammad Yes!



[Mera'i] By Shaykh Abu Faysal. Come on, let us recite it together.
[Mera'i ends]



The two men recite the anthem.



[Mera'i] We have freedom and we go to paradise, but they will have
only woes. Come on, brother, paradise is ours. We have not lost the
day. We have learned so many things.



[Mohammad] But when they arrest people, do they usually put two of
them together?



[Mera'i] No!



[Mohammad] So how come they put us together?



[Mera'i] They conducted a roundup and everything is undoubtedly full.



[Mohammad] Bizarre.



[Mera'i] Oh, brother, there is nothing; we are waiting for the
Foreigners Office; they conduct a check and then you leave. They have
not found anything; they have found 1,500 euros (8) that were at home
and the wrist watch, and that is all. There is nothing. What do you
think that they can do to you? Because if it were something big, they
would have evidence; we would not be together...



[Mohammad] I am anxious to know what is going on. You tell me that
they usually put them separately?



[Mera'i] I have only been taken by the Foreigners Office; there is no
problem.



[Mohammad] Well! We shall see. If there had been a main street, they
would not have caught me; I would have escaped.



[Mera'i] Unfortunately what happened happened...



[Mera'i] [as published] They are armed and they are afraid of us.
[Mera'i ends]



At this juncture Mera'i begins to recite the anthem of the jihad .



[Mera'i] I have brothers who are in jail. My brother who is in jail
has learned by heart fully 60 sure (verses) from the Koran.



[Mohammad] I repeat, I regret not having escaped. Because there were
no escape routes, no side streets, and besides, I do not know the
street well. When they pointed a pistol at me, did they have orders
to shoot me?



[Mera'i] It is possible.



[Mohammad] But if I had had escape routes, they could even have shot
at me but they would not have gotten me.



[Mera'i] It is a stupid solution because if you escape you worsen
your situation. It is better if they have nothing.



[Mohammad] If it had not been a main street, I would have escaped...
[Mohammad ends]



(3) The reference is to the people arrested in the course of
Operation Al-Muhajirun, personally known to Mera'i;



(4) Lagha Lotfi, currently under detention in Guantanamo;



(5) Adel Ben Mabrouk, currently under detention in Guantanamo;



(6) Bouyahia Hammadi, arrested in the ROS [Special Operations Group --
carabinieri special branch] investigation code-named "Bazar."



(7) Mullah Fouad, in other words Muhammad Majid who was mentioned in
the report dated 31 March;



(8) sure enough, the sum of 1,500 euros in cash was confiscated in
his home; you may recall that 600 euros were supposed to be delivered
to Ciise Maxamed, but also 10 bank bills in Iraqi currency which
confirms the foreigner's interest in that country.


"Sarò un martire" così parlano gli islamici in manette

http://www.ilnuovo.it/nuovo/foglia/0,1007,193082,00.html