Skip to search.
TailwindForum · Tailwind Forum

Group Information

  • Members: 1138
  • Category: Planes
  • Founded: Aug 24, 2001
  • Language: English
? Already a member? Sign in to Yahoo!

Yahoo! Groups Tips

Did you know...
Hear how Yahoo! Groups has changed the lives of others. Take me there.

Messages

  Messages Help
Advanced
O&O / W-10   Message List  
Reply Message #49191 of 51269 |
Re: [TailwindForum] Re: O&O / W-10

True, but if the outside surface is sealed, how will the moisture get in there?

Also, not all epoxies are brittle. Depends on the chemistry of the resin and the catalyst/resin mix.

Without a substrate (fiberglas, carbon fiber, etc) no resin I know of will add any appreciable strength to the structure.

I can assure you, if and when I construct another wooden wing, it will again have a suitable epoxy coating applied to seal against moisture. Most likely West Systems with slow hardener. On both sides, like my existing Tailwind's wing. It works for boats - good enough for me... after all, boats float, at least for a while :-)

Yes, the resin adds some weight, but IMHO I wouldn't say a LOT of weight (unless you just plop on gobs of the stuff and do not spread it with a squeegee or brush). I remember Jim C. saying that multiple coats of West squeegeed on were lighter than filler when filling up the FG deck cloth, prepping for primer/paint.

I believe him.

DAL


On Feb 14, 2012, at 1:07 PM, Richard wrote:



A couple of detail points about epoxy treatments:

The phrase "epoxy saturation" is extremely misleading.
Epoxy doesn't "saturate" into wood more than a few hundredths of an inch.
For the most part it's a surface treatment, leaving the core of the panel quite 
unprotected from moisture.


Epoxy, by itself, is heavy, stiff, and brittle.  It adds no real strength to the structure,
but does add a lot of weight. 
Being brittle, any flex can cause small cracks that 
will allow moisture to enter the structure.

It's the glass that does all the work here.  It adds weight, but also a lot of strength.
It holds the epoxy i place and keeps the finish from being so delicate that it will
crack when flexed.


Having said that, please don't think that an unsupported (except by ribs)  fiberglass 
skin is a direct replacement for plywood.  Fiberglass structures get strong enough 
to carry a load long before they get stiff enough not to distort under that load.

Richard



Tue Feb 14, 2012 8:04 pm

dlampher
Offline Offline
Send Email Send Email

Message #49191 of 51269 |
Expand Messages Author Sort by Date

I will continue to support the Drawings accomplished on Steve Wittman's O&O. There is at this point an accurate dimensional computer 3D drawing of the Fuselage...
Randall Bray
twind38 Offline Send Email
Jan 18, 2012
1:24 am

If a 4130 fuselage is assembled from the firewall back 2 bays only to the rear wing spar station w/ initially 3 tack welds spaced evenly around each tube. Then...
Randall Bray
twind38 Offline Send Email
Feb 9, 2012
2:58 am

Randall, I believe if one jigs and braces it correctly, one could achieve a perfect fit. Zero tolerance. One could build a bulkhead such as you would build a...
alex frizzell
carrxw10... Offline Send Email
Feb 9, 2012
3:15 am

Alex you have changed my mindset. I believe you are right. I will re-look at what I am planning from your direction with a jig / exact fit as a goal. Thank you...
Randall Bray
twind38 Offline Send Email
Feb 9, 2012
1:44 pm

The form of building a tubular forward section of the fuselage and a bolt on tail section has been being used for decades. The Mooney Mites, AT-6's,Weatherly...
John Haedtler
jhaedtler Offline Send Email
Feb 9, 2012
3:49 pm

On the subject of jigs and accuracy.  "This is a job for Superman",  (er,  Jim Clement).   Construction of Tubular Steel Fuselages, Elzea's Aircraft...
Marc Bourget
bourget_m Offline Send Email
Feb 9, 2012
3:18 pm

Alex F will you share you're tel number with me (email: braymail@...) or please call me at 910 452 7101. Thank you, Randall Bray EAA34747 Athens...
Randall Bray
twind38 Offline Send Email
Feb 10, 2012
6:04 pm

What are the Pros & Cons, please, of using square or round tube'g around the door openings. Thank you for you're constructive comments. Randall Bray EAA34747...
Randall Bray
twind38 Offline Send Email
Feb 14, 2012
11:54 am

If I made another fuselage, I would definitely go with square tubing for the door opening. It will give you an easier surface to seal off air leakage/drafts...
David & Elaine Lamphere
dlampher Offline Send Email
Feb 14, 2012
12:47 pm

Randall, I also would go with the square tubing for the door opening on the fuselage for the same reasons mentioned by Dave. I did my door frames in square ...
alex frizzell
carrxw10... Offline Send Email
Feb 14, 2012
3:11 pm

A couple of detail points about epoxy treatments: The phrase "epoxy saturation" is extremely misleading. Epoxy doesn't "saturate" into wood more than a few...
Richard
cavelamb Offline Send Email
Feb 14, 2012
6:07 pm

Wood - God's composite. Wonderful stuff! Sent from my iPhone...
Keith Nurcombe
keith.nurcombe Offline Send Email
Feb 14, 2012
6:09 pm

True, but if the outside surface is sealed, how will the moisture get in there? Also, not all epoxies are brittle. Depends on the chemistry of the resin and...
David & Elaine Lamphere
dlampher Offline Send Email
Feb 14, 2012
8:04 pm

Dave for what it's worth, the Tailwind wing is not sealed, it has a multitude of drain holes at the trailing edge. I do agree that coating every thing with...
downing.j@...
w109885 Offline Send Email
Feb 14, 2012
8:17 pm

John, I hate to drag this discussion on more, but my wing is coated on the inside as well as the outside. So the wood is coated (dare I say sealed?). Yep,...
David & Elaine Lamphere
dlampher Offline Send Email
Feb 14, 2012
10:46 pm

This discussion reminds me of the fact that "impregnated wood" construction is not a new process- the Russian Lavochkin aircraft used it with good effect...
Dave
ddaland Offline Send Email
Feb 15, 2012
3:26 am

Dave, I have thought about the drain holes in the wings and am thinking that those holes are put there to vent each cavity rather than to drain moisture ...
alex frizzell
carrxw10... Offline Send Email
Feb 15, 2012
3:28 am

Some plastic planes have had their sealed control surfaces explode at altitude. Vents do lots of good things. From: TailwindForum@yahoogroups.com...
Cy Galley
cygalley Offline Send Email
Feb 15, 2012
4:13 am

Boyles law, as I recall from school, or "Why I don't eat cabbage before flying up to Leadville" (personal experience)...
Dave
ddaland Offline Send Email
Feb 15, 2012
4:22 am

Dave, I have the wing covered in plywood and now filling the staple holes getting ready to put on the fiberglass. If I had waited two days to staple on the...
downing.j@...
w109885 Offline Send Email
Feb 15, 2012
3:29 am
Advanced

Copyright © 2010 Yahoo! Inc. All rights reserved.
Privacy Policy - Terms of Service - Guidelines NEW - Help