... Brad, I suspect that the answer to your important last question is that the contents of the Gospels were not, as a rule, an issue for them. It would be...
3110
David Inglis
djino1
Apr 6, 2011 4:41 pm
Stephen Carlson wrote: Can we get at this problem without begging the question? Of course, the idea of a Q makes it easier to believe that other written, lost...
3111
David Mealand
D.Mealand@...
Apr 6, 2011 5:42 pm
Hm. I found quite a few refs to the Gospels in the margins of Kirsopp Lake's Loeb edition of the "Apostolic Fathers" just looking at the Didache, and Hermas,...
3112
Jeff Peterson
jepetersonphd
Apr 6, 2011 5:56 pm
Brad, Seems to me you've got a hold of the wrong end of the methodological question; if Ignatius, Polycarp, or another AF had undertaken to write a Gospel or...
3113
Brad McAdon
brad@...
Apr 6, 2011 6:08 pm
Thanks for this, David. Yes, Andrew Gregory and Chrisotpher Tuckett's two volumes (The Reception of the NT in the AFs and Trajectories through the NT in the...
3114
Brad McAdon
brad@...
Apr 6, 2011 6:37 pm
Thanks for this, Jeff. I offered the list in response to the question as to whether other sources concerning the life of Jesus existed in the first century. I...
3115
Chuck Jones
chuckjonez
Apr 6, 2011 6:49 pm
Bob, Thanks for the follow up. Â I did read the irony in the note backwards. Â I hang around the group and usually only read. Â I've been amazed at the...
3116
Chuck Jones
chuckjonez
Apr 6, 2011 7:02 pm
David, I think Lk's insertion of "the Holy Spirit" throughout his gospel is an excellent example of words and brief phrases that are sondergut. Â Likewise Mt's...
3117
Chuck Jones
chuckjonez
Apr 6, 2011 7:22 pm
Bob, My brief post built on a longer conversation. Â Mark G. had listed three arguments in favor of Lk's dependence on Mt in chs 1-2. Â The first was that we...
3118
Chuck Jones
chuckjonez
Apr 6, 2011 7:25 pm
Mark, Somehow I got Bob's post before yours. Â I just noticed he was quoting you. Â Sorry for the third person response! Chuck Rev. Chuck Jones Atlanta,...
3119
Jeff Peterson
jepetersonphd
Apr 6, 2011 7:28 pm
Brad, *Argumentum e silentio *always requires careful discrimination. An analogy: If you look over my personal archive of sermon manuscripts (covering about 20...
3120
Jeff Peterson
jepetersonphd
Apr 6, 2011 7:33 pm
Etymologically, the term refers to "monopoly goods," what one person is selling that no one else offers. Used metaphorically in Gospels scholarship, I think...
3121
Chuck Jones
chuckjonez
Apr 6, 2011 7:40 pm
Jeff, You are a bright enough and creative enough person to realize that Lk could have changed the appearance of the star with an angel (Mt's story has angels...
3122
Chuck Jones
chuckjonez
Apr 6, 2011 7:49 pm
Jeff, I just reread your post, and, wow. You write that "Luke objects" to the word majoi and to the star, and "is happier" sending angels to shepherds. And...
3123
Brad McAdon
brad@...
Apr 6, 2011 7:53 pm
Thanks for this, Jeff. I think it is a false analogy at several levels. Let me ask you this: Using Ignatius as an example, if Ignatius alludes to or cites a...
3124
Jeff Peterson
jepetersonphd
Apr 6, 2011 8:05 pm
Chuck, Actually I think angels-for-star is part of what Luke does in reconceiving the birth narrative. Shepherds-for-*magoi* does at least three things for ...
3125
Chuck Jones
chuckjonez
Apr 6, 2011 8:08 pm
David, I agree with your statement below re. "many" sources. If this is true, then most of the synopticists' sources are no longer in existence. If *this*...
3126
Jeff Peterson
jepetersonphd
Apr 6, 2011 8:14 pm
... I'd be interested to see those detailed. ... Smyrn. 1.1f includes Matthaean redaction of Mark, which I'd call strong evidence that Ignatius knew Matthew....
3127
Chuck Jones
chuckjonez
Apr 6, 2011 8:22 pm
Jeff, Majoi turned shepherds addresses 12 verses of Lk's 120 verse Birth narrative. Separately why would Lk solve the Bethlehem-Nazareth relationship in a way...
3128
Jeff Peterson
jepetersonphd
Apr 6, 2011 8:35 pm
Chuck, If avoiding "irreconcilable differences" with his predecessor were foremost among Luke's concerns, he wouldn't reorder the temptation narrative that he ...
3129
Matson, Mark (Academic)
markmatsona
Apr 6, 2011 8:42 pm
... I am not sure that polloi necessarily suggests more than two.. But I have often thought that Luke did know three "narratives" in existence: Mark, Matthew...
3130
Graham E Budd
grahbudd
Apr 6, 2011 8:48 pm
Who was it - Hengel? - who did some sort of calculation based on known missing early Christian literature and came up with a figure of some 85% being missing? ...
3131
David Inglis
djino1
Apr 6, 2011 8:59 pm
The only thing that early reference to "a passage or narrative unit or say even a handful of passages or narrative units" of, say, Matthew is evidence of is...
3132
Brad McAdon
brad@...
Apr 6, 2011 9:10 pm
Jeff, Thanks for this, Jeff. ... We know that you have a copy of the Bible that includes a book attributed to Matthew. We do not know that this is the case...
3133
Stephen Carlson
scarlson_min...
Apr 6, 2011 9:14 pm
... Or change the last words on the cross, or have the woman anoint the feet instead of the head, or etc.. The irony for me, with regard to Chuck's argument,...
3134
Stephen Carlson
scarlson_min...
Apr 6, 2011 9:22 pm
... Good point, though I don't know if we can really press the "many" to mean more than two necessarily. But according to Luke, "many have undertaken to ...
3135
Ken Olson
kaolson101
Apr 6, 2011 9:46 pm
... be from Matthew have, as Foster puts it, "far fewer points of contact," which suggests that the text of what became Matthew that Ignatius (or the au of...
3136
Brad McAdon
brad@...
Apr 6, 2011 9:56 pm
Thanks for this, Ken. ... What I meant to say was, essentially, what David Inglis articulated much better in his most recent post--that we can only say that au...
3137
Chuck Jones
chuckjonez
Apr 7, 2011 1:53 am
The sadness for me, Stephen, is that it seems I've never been able to communicate why the birth narratives create a special problem. Â I've raised the issue a...
3138
Chuck Jones
chuckjonez
Apr 7, 2011 1:58 am
The below sentence makes me feel a lot better, I must say. If it were part of my 8 year old son's reading homework, we'd be correcting it. Chuck ... I don't...
