>>> Does anyone know the name of the Byzantine church in Sarriske
Jastrebie [sic]?  Are there records available for this parish, do I
need to look elsewhere, or do I need to wait for something to become
available? <<<

Greek Catholic parish registers of births, mariages and deaths for
Šarišské Jastrabie, Slovakia, formerly Jesztreb (also called
Felsőkánya), Sáros, Hungary.

Krsty 1827-1874 Úmrtia 1827-1884 Uzavreté manželstvá 1827-1851 Úmrtia
1885-1946 Uzavreté manželstvá 1885-1932 -  FHL INTL Film [ 1794092
Items 2-3 ]

Uzavreté manželstvá 1932-1946 Cirkevné finančné záznamy 1819-1878
Uzavreté manželstvá 1862-1885 Krsty 1874-1952 -  FHL INTL Film [
1794093 Items 1-4 ]

LOCATE YOUR NEAREST FAMILY HISTORY CENTER AND ORDER FILM
You can go to the LDS web site to locate your nearest Family History
Center (FHC) and determine their hours of operation. You will need to
go there in person to order the film(s). In about a month, the film
will arrive and you can book a film reader and begin your research.

Not only the church records but also the very informative 1869
Hungarian Census film.

Jesztreb [Felso kánya] (Šaršské Jastrabie) Film 2162322 Item 1

Good luck and happy squinting.

Slovak euro exchange rate is set


Mr Pociatek says euro entry will boost Slovakian  growth

The European Union has formally invited Slovakia to join  the European single
currency and has set the rate at which korunas will be  exchanged for euros.
The official rate has been set at 30.1260 korunas to the euro.
Slovakia will adopt the euro on 1 January 2009, becoming the 16th  official
member country to do so.
The European Union's 27 finance ministers approved Slovakia's entry  despite
concerns from the European Central Bank about its inflation.
"I am delighted to be welcoming Slovakia into the eurozone," said EU
Monetary Affairs Commissioner Joaquin Almunia.
Euro entry 'beneficial'
Slovakia recently strengthened the value of the koruna by 15%, partly  in an
attempt to fight inflation.
Slovakia follows other recent euro adopters including Slovenia (from  2007),
and Cyprus and Malta in January this year.
Its use of the single currency will add one percentage point to its  economic
growth, according to Slovakian finance minister Jan Pociatek.
"Euro entry will be beneficial for our economy," he said. "It will  attract
foreign direct investment."





**************Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for
fuel-efficient used cars.     
(http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut00050000000007)


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Dobre rano Everyone!
 
Janet's comments about Turocz are right on.  It is a fascinating county in terms
of its history, not to mention beautiful.  In addition, Slovenske Pravno is
along an ancient trade route which extended from the Danube basin north into
what is now Poland.
 
RE: The "Durko" on the photo.  Could it be Jurko, which is a nickname for Juraj
(George)?
 
The LDS has microfilmed the "mixed marriage registers" from Slovenske Pravno
which is a gold mine.  In this register, 1 spouse is Catholic and 1 is
Lutheran.  People are identified by name, age, date of marriage, names and ages
of children.  Multiple years available.  They are on the same reels with the
church records.
 
The family I am looking at in the mixed marriage registers has presented a
dilemma.  In the 1860s, the family had 3 children:  Jan, Jozef, and Anna.   Only
Anna appears with her parents in the register.  Why would only 1 of the children
be listed?  The only thing I can think of is that Anna was Catholic, and the 2
sons might have been Lutherans.  (Yes, there were 3 children who lived to
adulthood -- other records verify that.)  Was it common to raise some children
in 1 religion and other children in the other?  Among Anna's own children, 2
were Lutherans, 2 were Catholic, and 1 I don't know the religion.  Does anyone
have any insight on this?
 
Margo

--- On Mon, 7/7/08, Janet Kozlay <kozlay@...> wrote:

From: Janet Kozlay <kozlay@...>
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer is happy to meet you all
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
Date: Monday, July 7, 2008, 1:34 PM






Hi Liz and Anabeth,

Rudno (Turoczrudno) is a tiny village just south of Slovenske Pravno. Its
church records will be found with those from Slovenske Pravno.

It should be very interesting to match and combine the Chicago church
records with those from Slovakia. It should make for a very large and
complex family tree. It will be a lot of work, but the results should be
spectacular.

Turócz was a very interesting county for its small size. There was a
relatively high proportion of Germans there, more than its neighboring
counties. It was also an important center for the Evangelical/ Lutheran
church as well as for Slovak nationalism. Ironically, it was also the home
of Lajos Kossuth’s family since the 13th century. Kossuth led Hungary’s
1848-49 war of independence against Austria yet never recognized the
strength and determination of Hungary’s Slovak minority to seek their own
independence from Hungary.

Turócz (Nagy Csepcsény) was the home of my husband’s ancestors, in the
1700s, before they migrated south to the Hungarian Plain. I have had
considerable difficulty tracing the family there. If either of you should
happen to look at records from the 1700s and run into names like Kozlay,
Kozlech, or Kozlik, or anything else beginning with “Kozl,” I would
appreciate hearing.

Janet

Janet

_____

From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com] On
Behalf Of Anabeth Dollins
Sent: Monday, July 07, 2008 12:33 PM
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
Subject: Re: [S-R] This newcomer is happy to meet you all

Hi, Liz --

I spent some time looking at my Trinity Slovak Lutheran Church
(Chicago) microfilms. Found a bunch of records on Kuka, Klein, and
Svec families, which I'll send you as a separate email. There are lots
and lots of Mizialkos and Zvonar family records -- I didn't copy any
of those records since there are so many.

In the records, the Klein family that you mentioned is from Rudno;
Zuzanna's last name is spelled Derer, not Direr. And another of your
Zuzannas is Fontani in the records, not Fontana.

Interesting to note that while your Klein family and the one in my
database are not the same, they're both from Rudno. Wonder whether
they're related.

Anabeth Dollins

On Sun, Jul 6, 2008 at 2:24 PM, Elizabeth Tjomsland
<e_tjomsland@ <mailto:e_tjomsland %40yahoo. com> yahoo.com> wrote:
> Hello, my name is Liz. I joined this group recently, because I thought I
> might get some pointers on my genealogy research. I'm a novice who has
been
> working from bits and pieces of information found in the paperwork of my
> parents after they passed on. All the folks from previous generations are
> gone, so there is no one left to ask. The following is what I do know at
> this point.
>
> My paternal grandfather, Juraj Kuka (1885-1961), came from Slovenske
> Pravno,Martin Turciansky Svaety. He was very certain that there was no
> change in the surname spelling.
> Parents: Juraj Kuka(1843-1905) and Suzanna Fontana(1859- 1941).
> Siblings: Jan, Jozef (m. Irena Kollar), Amelia (m. Paul Podmajersky) ,
> Suzanna (m. George Durkovic, I think).
> My grandfather married Suzanna Klein(1889-1934) . Even though the name
sounds
> Germanic, she insisted that she was Slovak. Her parents were Jozef
> Klein(1869-1934) and Suzanna Direr (1864-1942) and they supposedly had a
farm
> in Slovakia which was eventually confiscated by the Communists.
>
> My maternal grandmother, Alzbeta Zvonar,(1892- 1935) came from Brezova.
> Parents: Martin Zvonar and Katarina Mizialko (1862-1929)
> Siblings: Matej (1887-1887), Stefan (1888 - ?), Judita (1896-1902) and
> Martin (1905 - ?).
> My grandmother married Louis (Alois) Svec in Chicago. I know next to
nothing
> about him. He supposedly ran away from home at the age of 17, came to the
> U.S. and had little contact with his family. His parents were Jozef Svec
and
> Mary Rovnanski.
>
> My maternal great grandmother was Katarina Mizialko from Brezova.
> Parents: Stefan Mizialko(b.1820- ?) and Alzbeta Chvascula(b. 1822-?).
> Siblings: Stefan (1847-?), Matej, Jan, and Suzanna 1856-?)(m Samuel Nosko)
> She married Martin Zvonar in 1886, who apparently came to the U.S. on
> several occasions to work the coal mines in Pennsylvania. She immigrated
to
> the U.S. after her husband died.
>
> Everyone that immigrated settled in Chicago or surrounding area and, with
> the exception of Louis Svec and his parents, were Lutheran (Trinity Slovak
> Lutheran Church).
>
> My dad's name was George Julius, however, on the back of a photograph, I
see
> that his mother wrote his name as "Durko". Is this indicative of
something?
> Also wrote the middle name of my uncle as "Ludwig" (Louis). Is this just a
> dialect issue or ???? All the other "Georges" in his family were Juraj.
>
> I will welcome any and all comments.... .anything that might help me
untangle
> my roots.
>
> Many Thanks.....Regards, Liz
>
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


















[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Thank you very much.  Knowing that these films are available saves us valuable
time---didn't want to go searching for information which wasn't there.  I really
appreciate your assistance, and that of everyone in this group.  I read the
posts and learn from everyone.  Sorry for my spelling and lack of diacritical
marks....I'm a "beginner," particularly in the Slovak research, as that's my
husband's heritage.  I'm learning, albeit slowly.
Thank you, again.
Lisa

"I give you a new commandment: love one another. As my love has been for you, so
must your love be for each other." (Jn 13.34)

________________________________
> To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
> From: johnqadam@...
> Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2008 02:08:43 +0000
> Subject: [S-R] Re: Byzantine church of Sarisske Jastrabie
>
>
>>>> Does anyone know the name of the Byzantine church in Sarriske
> Jastrebie [sic]? Are there records available for this parish, do I
> need to look elsewhere, or do I need to wait for something to become
> available? <<<
>
> Greek Catholic parish registers of births, mariages and deaths for
> Šarišské Jastrabie, Slovakia, formerly Jesztreb (also called
> Felsőkánya), Sáros, Hungary.
>
> Krsty 1827-1874 Úmrtia 1827-1884 Uzavreté manželstvá 1827-1851 Úmrtia
> 1885-1946 Uzavreté manželstvá 1885-1932 - FHL INTL Film [ 1794092
> Items 2-3 ]
>
> Uzavreté manželstvá 1932-1946 Cirkevné finančné záznamy 1819-1878
> Uzavreté manželstvá 1862-1885 Krsty 1874-1952 - FHL INTL Film [
> 1794093 Items 1-4 ]
>
> LOCATE YOUR NEAREST FAMILY HISTORY CENTER AND ORDER FILM
> You can go to the LDS web site to locate your nearest Family History
> Center (FHC) and determine their hours of operation. You will need to
> go there in person to order the film(s). In about a month, the film
> will arrive and you can book a film reader and begin your research.
>
>
>

_________________________________________________________________
Need to know now? Get instant answers with Windows Live Messenger.
http://www.windowslive.com/messenger/connect_your_way.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_mes\
senger_072008

Hi Margo,

In much of this cultural area it was, and still is, the custom that in mixed
marriages, boys followed the religion of the father; the girls that of the
mother. Could that explain your data? Have you checked the records for both
churches?

Janet




-----Original Message-----
From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Margo Smith
Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2008 7:43 AM
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer is happy to meet you all

Dobre rano Everyone!
 
Janet's comments about Turocz are right on.  It is a fascinating county in
terms of its history, not to mention beautiful.  In addition, Slovenske
Pravno is along an ancient trade route which extended from the Danube basin
north into what is now Poland.
 
RE: The "Durko" on the photo.  Could it be Jurko, which is a nickname for
Juraj (George)?
 
The LDS has microfilmed the "mixed marriage registers" from Slovenske Pravno
which is a gold mine.  In this register, 1 spouse is Catholic and 1 is
Lutheran.  People are identified by name, age, date of marriage, names and
ages of children.  Multiple years available.  They are on the same reels
with the church records.
 
The family I am looking at in the mixed marriage registers has presented a
dilemma.  In the 1860s, the family had 3 children:  Jan, Jozef, and Anna.  
Only Anna appears with her parents in the register.  Why would only 1 of the
children be listed?  The only thing I can think of is that Anna was
Catholic, and the 2 sons might have been Lutherans.  (Yes, there were 3
children who lived to adulthood -- other records verify that.)  Was it
common to raise some children in 1 religion and other children in the
other?  Among Anna's own children, 2 were Lutherans, 2 were Catholic, and 1
I don't know the religion.  Does anyone have any insight on this?
 
Margo

--- On Mon, 7/7/08, Janet Kozlay <kozlay@...> wrote:

From: Janet Kozlay <kozlay@...>
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer is happy to meet you all
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
Date: Monday, July 7, 2008, 1:34 PM






Hi Liz and Anabeth,

Rudno (Turoczrudno) is a tiny village just south of Slovenske Pravno. Its
church records will be found with those from Slovenske Pravno.

It should be very interesting to match and combine the Chicago church
records with those from Slovakia. It should make for a very large and
complex family tree. It will be a lot of work, but the results should be
spectacular.

Turócz was a very interesting county for its small size. There was a
relatively high proportion of Germans there, more than its neighboring
counties. It was also an important center for the Evangelical/ Lutheran
church as well as for Slovak nationalism. Ironically, it was also the home
of Lajos Kossuth’s family since the 13th century. Kossuth led Hungary’s
1848-49 war of independence against Austria yet never recognized the
strength and determination of Hungary’s Slovak minority to seek their own
independence from Hungary.

Turócz (Nagy Csepcsény) was the home of my husband’s ancestors, in the
1700s, before they migrated south to the Hungarian Plain. I have had
considerable difficulty tracing the family there. If either of you should
happen to look at records from the 1700s and run into names like Kozlay,
Kozlech, or Kozlik, or anything else beginning with “Kozl,” I would
appreciate hearing.

Janet

Janet

_____

From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com]
On
Behalf Of Anabeth Dollins
Sent: Monday, July 07, 2008 12:33 PM
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
Subject: Re: [S-R] This newcomer is happy to meet you all

Hi, Liz --

I spent some time looking at my Trinity Slovak Lutheran Church
(Chicago) microfilms. Found a bunch of records on Kuka, Klein, and
Svec families, which I'll send you as a separate email. There are lots
and lots of Mizialkos and Zvonar family records -- I didn't copy any
of those records since there are so many.

In the records, the Klein family that you mentioned is from Rudno;
Zuzanna's last name is spelled Derer, not Direr. And another of your
Zuzannas is Fontani in the records, not Fontana.

Interesting to note that while your Klein family and the one in my
database are not the same, they're both from Rudno. Wonder whether
they're related.

Anabeth Dollins

On Sun, Jul 6, 2008 at 2:24 PM, Elizabeth Tjomsland
<e_tjomsland@ <mailto:e_tjomsland %40yahoo. com> yahoo.com> wrote:
> Hello, my name is Liz. I joined this group recently, because I thought I
> might get some pointers on my genealogy research. I'm a novice who has
been
> working from bits and pieces of information found in the paperwork of my
> parents after they passed on. All the folks from previous generations are
> gone, so there is no one left to ask. The following is what I do know at
> this point.
>
> My paternal grandfather, Juraj Kuka (1885-1961), came from Slovenske
> Pravno,Martin Turciansky Svaety. He was very certain that there was no
> change in the surname spelling.
> Parents: Juraj Kuka(1843-1905) and Suzanna Fontana(1859- 1941).
> Siblings: Jan, Jozef (m. Irena Kollar), Amelia (m. Paul Podmajersky) ,
> Suzanna (m. George Durkovic, I think).
> My grandfather married Suzanna Klein(1889-1934) . Even though the name
sounds
> Germanic, she insisted that she was Slovak. Her parents were Jozef
> Klein(1869-1934) and Suzanna Direr (1864-1942) and they supposedly had a
farm
> in Slovakia which was eventually confiscated by the Communists.
>
> My maternal grandmother, Alzbeta Zvonar,(1892- 1935) came from Brezova.
> Parents: Martin Zvonar and Katarina Mizialko (1862-1929)
> Siblings: Matej (1887-1887), Stefan (1888 - ?), Judita (1896-1902) and
> Martin (1905 - ?).
> My grandmother married Louis (Alois) Svec in Chicago. I know next to
nothing
> about him. He supposedly ran away from home at the age of 17, came to the
> U.S. and had little contact with his family. His parents were Jozef Svec
and
> Mary Rovnanski.
>
> My maternal great grandmother was Katarina Mizialko from Brezova.
> Parents: Stefan Mizialko(b.1820- ?) and Alzbeta Chvascula(b. 1822-?).
> Siblings: Stefan (1847-?), Matej, Jan, and Suzanna 1856-?)(m Samuel Nosko)
> She married Martin Zvonar in 1886, who apparently came to the U.S. on
> several occasions to work the coal mines in Pennsylvania. She immigrated
to
> the U.S. after her husband died.
>
> Everyone that immigrated settled in Chicago or surrounding area and, with
> the exception of Louis Svec and his parents, were Lutheran (Trinity Slovak
> Lutheran Church).
>
> My dad's name was George Julius, however, on the back of a photograph, I
see
> that his mother wrote his name as "Durko". Is this indicative of
something?
> Also wrote the middle name of my uncle as "Ludwig" (Louis). Is this just a
> dialect issue or ???? All the other "Georges" in his family were Juraj.
>
> I will welcome any and all comments.... .anything that might help me
untangle
> my roots.
>
> Many Thanks.....Regards, Liz
>
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


















[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


------------------------------------

To visit your group on the web, go to:
     http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SLOVAK-ROOTS/

To unsubscribe from this group, go to
http://www.yahoogroups.com/group/SLOVAK-ROOTS  -or- send  blank email to
SLOVAK-ROOTS-unsubscribe@...! Groups Links

Hi Maxine,
You can see my friend's work (John Yagersky) at
  http://worldconnect.rootsweb.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/igm.cgi?op=GET
<http://worldconnect.rootsweb.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/igm.cgi?op=GET&db=yagersk
y&id=I648> &db=yagersky&id=I648

Look at the descendants of Gyorgy TOLLASSY , making sure to read his notes
where you will find his notation about the various spellings of the name he
found, Gulyassy being one of them.

Happy Hunting,
Marilyn

   _____

From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of maxine
Sent: Friday, July 04, 2008 7:11 AM
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [S-R] Re: New & researching Zemplen Abauj area



Hi, can you send me your friends e-mail on her family tree? I do not have
it. thanks maxine

----- Original Message -----
From: Marilyn Hertenstein
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, July 03, 2008 9:47 PM
Subject: RE: [S-R] Re: New & researching Zemplen Abauj area

My Varsa family came from the Teplicska/Markusovce area (near Spiska Nova
Ves). The Gulyassy branch had many from Kotterbach (Rudnany), also in the
Spis area. A friend I met while researching that branch has a rather large
tree posted on the internet, which I'm sure you've found by now.

Marilyn

_____

From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
[mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of maxine
Sent: Thursday, July 03, 2008 5:33 PM
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [S-R] Re: New & researching Zemplen Abauj area

Hi, Gulyassy is the name of my great, grandmother, Suzzanna. She was born in
Jakubany, Slovakia. She married my grandfather Elias Sasala, or sometimes
Schschla. When he passed Suzzanna married a Compel from the same village. In
1924 she came to Perth Amboy, NJ with Compel. Stayed a while and went to her
dauthers in Lopez, Pa, Kathleen Sasala Decker or Deker.

Where do your family names comes from? Maxine

----- Original Message -----
From: Marilyn Hertenstein
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, July 02, 2008 11:39 PM
Subject: RE: [S-R] Re: New & researching Zemplen Abauj area

Maxine,
I see you mentioned the name Gulyassy below. Is this a surname name in your
family tree? I too have that name in my family tree. Maria Varsa married
Steve Dulacy, which through much research, we found to be an Americanization
of this Slovak name. Dulacy is also spelled Tollassy, Tolasi, Gulyassy,
Gyulassy.

Marilyn

_____

From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
[mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of maxine
Sent: Wednesday, July 02, 2008 3:32 PM
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [S-R] Re: New & researching Zemplen Abauj area

Hi Lisa. That is the SAME cemetery that my whole family is buried at. Also,
I and my family have always gone to St Johns!
My grandfather is John Salala and my grandmother is Julia Velas Sasala. They
lived on the corner of State St and Mechanic. My grandfather owned Sasala's
Tavern. Across the street was SMITHS Drug Store and 2 houses down was a
school which I attended until about 5th grade.
I still attend St Johns and have relatives living in Perth Amboy and the
area. My grandfathers children are:

Sasala
Anna Dosil married
Julia Doyle married
Mary Fedak (Picone) my mother
Helen Bukarica
John Sasala

Grandfather came from Jakubany in Slovikia.
One of the names you wrote starting with a G, could that be possibly be
Gulyassy?

My grandfather John had 1 brother, Stephen from Perth Amboy and 2 sisters
who ended up in Lopez, Pa.
The sisters are Katherine Sasala Decker and Anna Sasala Decker. 2 sisters
marrying 2 brothers.

Do you think your Mom could remember any of this people?

Also had an Aunt Julia Yadlouski.

thanks maxine sasala

----- Original Message -----
From: lisa elzeini
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2008 10:54 PM
Subject: [S-R] Re: New & researching Zemplen Abauj area

Hi! Maxine,
I was born in Perth Amboy, I moved before high school.
My Great Grandfather Mihaly Dzsupinka is burried in a cemetery on Pfieffer
Blvd and Florida Grove Road. (Hopelawn/Perth Amboy) St. John the Baptist
Orthodox Church in Perth Amboy, New Jersey is one of the oldest parishes in
the American Carpatho-Russian Orthodox Diocese. The parish was founded in
1897. 145 Broad Street , Perth Amboy, New Jersey 08861.

Lisa

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Ed,
    My grandfather, John Hornick (born 1863), left Krynica (about 35
mi. east of Falsztyn and 40 mi. east of Dursztyn) for the US in
1882. I have no idea who his parents or siblings were except that he
had half-brothers. If you think this is an avenue for us to persue,
please let me know.
John

--- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, "Frank" <frankur@...> wrote:
>
>
> --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, "big_ed321" <e_hornick@e...>
> wrote:
> >
> > Happy NEW YEAR EVERYONE
> >
> > I think I found  my Grand fathers town it is either DURSZTYN or
> > FALSZTYN
> > The towns circling them are CZORSZTYNSKIE , NIEDZICA, LAPSZE NIZNE
> > TRYBSZ and KREMPACHY
> > I found these towns on a 2004 travel road map of POLAND
> > I tried to get more detail maps from travel agenties but no luck
> > ( mountains ,churches, mines ect)
> > My grandfather is JOSEPH HORNICK (HORNIK) landed in USA in 1893
> > I have tried to Email some HORNIK  people but they do not go thru
> > I hope that everyone can help me like they have in the past?
> > Thanks ED
>
> ED,
>
> Lapse Nizne is located 200 miles south of Warzsawa, Poland.
> Krempachy is located 197 miles south of Warszawa.
> Falsztyn is located 5 miles distant from Krempachy and
> Dursztyn is located 3 miles distant from Krempachy.
>
> Your towns are located in SE Poland in former Galicia across from
the
> Slovakia border and about 11 miles distant from your Matias^ovce
(Sk)
> Szepesmátyásfalva (H) as the vrana (crow) flies.
>
>
> Hungarian    English     Polish grammatical form
> kis          little      mal~a/mal~e/mal~y
> nagy         large       wielka/wielke/wielki
> felso"       upper       górna/górne/górny
> alsó         lower       dolna/dolne/dolny
> felso"       upper       wyzna,wyzne,wyzny
> alsó         lower       nizna,nizne,nizny
>
> Hungarian    English     Slovak grammatical form
> kis          little      malá/malé/maly'
> nagy         large       vel'ká/vel'ké/vel'ky'
> felso"       upper       horná/horné/horny'
> alsó         lower       dolná/dolné/dolny'
> felso"       upper       vys^ná/vys^né/vys^ny'
> alsó         lower       niz^ná/niz^né/niz^ny'
>
> >From the late 1700s until the end of WW I, Poland did not exist as
a
> country.  It was divided among the Russian, German (Prussian), and
> Austrian Empires.  These divisions were known as Partitions.
> When Poland was restored as a country after WWI, only certain
portions
> of these partitioned areas were used to construct the present day
> Poland.
> The other portion of these areas were retained by the respective
> ruling government. There was German-Poland, Russian-Poland, and
> Austrian-Poland.
>
> German-Poland
> (20 % territory 23 % population)
>
> Prussia acquired the western regions of Poland especially
> those, which were later renamed West Prussia (formerly
> Royal Prussia) and the Province of Posen (the area around
> Poznan, called Wielkopolska, i.e. Greater Poland).
> West Prussia was known as Westpreussen (German) and Prusy
> Królewskie (Polish).
>
> This area was also referred to as Silesia and Prussian-Poland.
> Prussia took parts of Great Poland in the First Partition of Poland
in
> 1772.
> In the Second Partition in 1793, Prussia seized Danzig (Gdansk),
Thorn
> (Torun),
> and Great Poland, as well as a part of Mazovia.
> Prussia took the remainder of Mazovia, including Warsaw, in the
> Third Partition.
>
> Russian-Poland
> (62 % territory 45 % population)
>
> Russia had obtained White Russia and Latvian Lithuania to the
Dnieper
> and Dvina rivers in the First Partition of Poland.
> In the Second Partition, Russia took most of the western Ukraine,
> including Podolia and a part of Volhynia, and all of the eastern
part
> of Lithuania, also obtaining the right to move its troops into what
> remained of Poland and control its foreign policy.
> Russia acquired the rest of Lithuania and the Ukraine, the remainder
> of Volhynia, and the Duchy of Courland in the Third Partition.
> Warsaw and the surrounding area was under Prussian rule until 1815,
> when the Congress Kingdom of Poland comes into being under Russian
> rule. The former provinces of Grodno, Kalicz, Kielce, Lublin, Lodz,
> Lomza,Plock, Radom, Siedlce, and Suwalki were among those areas
> annexed
> by the Russian Government.
>
> Austrian-Poland
> (18 % territory 32 % population)
>
> By the First Partition ( 1792) of Poland, Austria had obtained
Galicia
> (consisting of  Red Russia, the city of Lemberg [Lwów], a part of
> western Podolia, and southern Little Poland).
> Austria did not take any Polish land in the Second Partition.
> During the Third Partition (1795) of Poland, Austria took the
> remainder of Little Poland and Kraków.
>
> The southern Polish territories  around Kraków  and Lwów were
> incorporated into the Austrian Empire and renamed "Galicia".
>
> Galicia was formerly a Austrian Kronland and part of Austro-
Hungarian
> Monarchy(1867-1918). Sometimes referred to as Austrian Poland.
> Other names for the area were Galicja (Polish), Galizien (German),
> Halychyna (Ukrainian) and Rus Halicka (Polish).
>
> In 1918, Galicia was annexed to Poland as "Malopolska" (Little
> Poland).
> After the 1939 partition of Poland by Germany and Russia, East
Galicia
> became part of Ukraine while West Galicia remained in Poland.
> Its former territories are now shared between southern Poland and
> western Ukraine.
>
>
> Frank K
>
>              Happy New Year
> (Slovak)     S^t'astný Nový Rok
> (Czech)      S^tastný Nový Rok
> (Polish)     Szczes'liwego Nowego Roku
> (German)     Ein Fröhes Neues Jahr
> (Hungarian)  Boldog Újévet
>

Hi!  Maxine,

   You asked if I had Gulyassy in my family.

   My great grandfather came to America as Janos Gulyas, but on his naturaliztion
papers it was Janos Gujas.  Today it is written Gulish. (also was Gulosh when my
mom was young)
   And curious thing is, I recently discovered another way it was spelled.  After
your last response I happen to re-look at the 1930 Census for Perth Amboy and
the name was written as Gulissy.  On the document he hand writing is sloppy and
I never paid full attention to it.

   I don't know much about the cemetery of St. John the Baptist Orthodox Church. 
Last year I tried to find my great grandfather DZSUPINKA's (JUPINKA) grave but
couldn't locate it.  I tried to contact the church via telephone to inquire
about records but had no luck at that either.  Maybe in the fall I will try
again.

   My family in Perth Amboy started out on Goodwin Street and also Sherman
Street.
   Later one of my Aunt Clara lived on Louis Street Hopelawn near the cemetery we
are speaking of.  Also my Uncle John lived on Howard Street Hopelawn.  I,
myself, grew up close to the Hopelawn border with Perth Amboy-- Harding Ave.

   Lisa





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hi, Do you know the village your grandfather came from?  Also, who did you speak
to at church, St Johns? maxine



   ----- Original Message -----
   From: lisa elzeini
   To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
   Sent: Wednesday, July 09, 2008 8:40 PM
   Subject: [S-R] Re: New & researching Zemplen Abauj area


   Hi! Maxine,

   You asked if I had Gulyassy in my family.

   My great grandfather came to America as Janos Gulyas, but on his naturaliztion
papers it was Janos Gujas. Today it is written Gulish. (also was Gulosh when my
mom was young)
   And curious thing is, I recently discovered another way it was spelled. After
your last response I happen to re-look at the 1930 Census for Perth Amboy and
the name was written as Gulissy. On the document he hand writing is sloppy and I
never paid full attention to it.

   I don't know much about the cemetery of St. John the Baptist Orthodox Church.
Last year I tried to find my great grandfather DZSUPINKA's (JUPINKA) grave but
couldn't locate it. I tried to contact the church via telephone to inquire about
records but had no luck at that either. Maybe in the fall I will try again.

   My family in Perth Amboy started out on Goodwin Street and also Sherman
Street.
   Later one of my Aunt Clara lived on Louis Street Hopelawn near the cemetery we
are speaking of. Also my Uncle John lived on Howard Street Hopelawn. I, myself,
grew up close to the Hopelawn border with Perth Amboy-- Harding Ave.

   Lisa




   [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Thank you for your suggestion, Janet.  Yes, I checked both Catholic and Lutheran
church records for Slovenske Pravno and found only the daughter.  It could be an
explanation.  The Lichners (father) were Lutheran.  Maybe I should look for an
adjacent Lutheran parish and check that one.  The family lived in the hamlet of
Kal'amenova, but attended church and school in Slovenske Pravno.

--- On Tue, 7/8/08, Janet Kozlay <kozlay@...> wrote:

From: Janet Kozlay <kozlay@...>
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer is happy to meet you all
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
Date: Tuesday, July 8, 2008, 9:03 AM






Hi Margo,

In much of this cultural area it was, and still is, the custom that in mixed
marriages, boys followed the religion of the father; the girls that of the
mother. Could that explain your data? Have you checked the records for both
churches?

Janet

-----Original Message-----
From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com] On
Behalf Of Margo Smith
Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2008 7:43 AM
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer is happy to meet you all

Dobre rano Everyone!
 
Janet's comments about Turocz are right on.  It is a fascinating county in
terms of its history, not to mention beautiful.  In addition, Slovenske
Pravno is along an ancient trade route which extended from the Danube basin
north into what is now Poland.
 
RE: The "Durko" on the photo.  Could it be Jurko, which is a nickname for
Juraj (George)?
 
The LDS has microfilmed the "mixed marriage registers" from Slovenske Pravno
which is a gold mine.  In this register, 1 spouse is Catholic and 1 is
Lutheran.  People are identified by name, age, date of marriage, names and
ages of children.  Multiple years available.  They are on the same reels
with the church records.
 
The family I am looking at in the mixed marriage registers has presented a
dilemma.  In the 1860s, the family had 3 children:  Jan, Jozef, and Anna.  
Only Anna appears with her parents in the register.  Why would only 1 of the
children be listed?  The only thing I can think of is that Anna was
Catholic, and the 2 sons might have been Lutherans.  (Yes, there were 3
children who lived to adulthood -- other records verify that.)  Was it
common to raise some children in 1 religion and other children in the
other?  Among Anna's own children, 2 were Lutherans, 2 were Catholic, and 1
I don't know the religion.  Does anyone have any insight on this?
 
Margo

--- On Mon, 7/7/08, Janet Kozlay <kozlay@comcast. net> wrote:

From: Janet Kozlay <kozlay@comcast. net>
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer is happy to meet you all
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
Date: Monday, July 7, 2008, 1:34 PM

Hi Liz and Anabeth,

Rudno (Turoczrudno) is a tiny village just south of Slovenske Pravno. Its
church records will be found with those from Slovenske Pravno.

It should be very interesting to match and combine the Chicago church
records with those from Slovakia. It should make for a very large and
complex family tree. It will be a lot of work, but the results should be
spectacular.

Turócz was a very interesting county for its small size. There was a
relatively high proportion of Germans there, more than its neighboring
counties. It was also an important center for the Evangelical/ Lutheran
church as well as for Slovak nationalism. Ironically, it was also the home
of Lajos Kossuth’s family since the 13th century. Kossuth led Hungary’s
1848-49 war of independence against Austria yet never recognized the
strength and determination of Hungary’s Slovak minority to seek their own
independence from Hungary.

Turócz (Nagy Csepcsény) was the home of my husband’s ancestors, in the
1700s, before they migrated south to the Hungarian Plain. I have had
considerable difficulty tracing the family there. If either of you should
happen to look at records from the 1700s and run into names like Kozlay,
Kozlech, or Kozlik, or anything else beginning with “Kozl,” I would
appreciate hearing.

Janet

Janet

_____

From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:SLOVAK- ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com]
On
Behalf Of Anabeth Dollins
Sent: Monday, July 07, 2008 12:33 PM
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
Subject: Re: [S-R] This newcomer is happy to meet you all

Hi, Liz --

I spent some time looking at my Trinity Slovak Lutheran Church
(Chicago) microfilms. Found a bunch of records on Kuka, Klein, and
Svec families, which I'll send you as a separate email. There are lots
and lots of Mizialkos and Zvonar family records -- I didn't copy any
of those records since there are so many.

In the records, the Klein family that you mentioned is from Rudno;
Zuzanna's last name is spelled Derer, not Direr. And another of your
Zuzannas is Fontani in the records, not Fontana.

Interesting to note that while your Klein family and the one in my
database are not the same, they're both from Rudno. Wonder whether
they're related.

Anabeth Dollins

On Sun, Jul 6, 2008 at 2:24 PM, Elizabeth Tjomsland
<e_tjomsland@ <mailto:e_tjomsland %40yahoo. com> yahoo.com> wrote:
> Hello, my name is Liz. I joined this group recently, because I thought I
> might get some pointers on my genealogy research. I'm a novice who has
been
> working from bits and pieces of information found in the paperwork of my
> parents after they passed on. All the folks from previous generations are
> gone, so there is no one left to ask. The following is what I do know at
> this point.
>
> My paternal grandfather, Juraj Kuka (1885-1961), came from Slovenske
> Pravno,Martin Turciansky Svaety. He was very certain that there was no
> change in the surname spelling.
> Parents: Juraj Kuka(1843-1905) and Suzanna Fontana(1859- 1941).
> Siblings: Jan, Jozef (m. Irena Kollar), Amelia (m. Paul Podmajersky) ,
> Suzanna (m. George Durkovic, I think).
> My grandfather married Suzanna Klein(1889-1934) . Even though the name
sounds
> Germanic, she insisted that she was Slovak. Her parents were Jozef
> Klein(1869-1934) and Suzanna Direr (1864-1942) and they supposedly had a
farm
> in Slovakia which was eventually confiscated by the Communists.
>
> My maternal grandmother, Alzbeta Zvonar,(1892- 1935) came from Brezova.
> Parents: Martin Zvonar and Katarina Mizialko (1862-1929)
> Siblings: Matej (1887-1887), Stefan (1888 - ?), Judita (1896-1902) and
> Martin (1905 - ?).
> My grandmother married Louis (Alois) Svec in Chicago. I know next to
nothing
> about him. He supposedly ran away from home at the age of 17, came to the
> U.S. and had little contact with his family. His parents were Jozef Svec
and
> Mary Rovnanski.
>
> My maternal great grandmother was Katarina Mizialko from Brezova.
> Parents: Stefan Mizialko(b.1820- ?) and Alzbeta Chvascula(b. 1822-?).
> Siblings: Stefan (1847-?), Matej, Jan, and Suzanna 1856-?)(m Samuel Nosko)
> She married Martin Zvonar in 1886, who apparently came to the U.S. on
> several occasions to work the coal mines in Pennsylvania. She immigrated
to
> the U.S. after her husband died.
>
> Everyone that immigrated settled in Chicago or surrounding area and, with
> the exception of Louis Svec and his parents, were Lutheran (Trinity Slovak
> Lutheran Church).
>
> My dad's name was George Julius, however, on the back of a photograph, I
see
> that his mother wrote his name as "Durko". Is this indicative of
something?
> Also wrote the middle name of my uncle as "Ludwig" (Louis). Is this just a
> dialect issue or ???? All the other "Georges" in his family were Juraj.
>
> I will welcome any and all comments.... .anything that might help me
untangle
> my roots.
>
> Many Thanks.....Regards, Liz
>
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

------------ --------- --------- ------

To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups. yahoo.com/ group/SLOVAK- ROOTS/

To unsubscribe from this group, go to
http://www.yahoogro ups.com/group/ SLOVAK-ROOTS -or- send blank email to
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Margo,

Note in the Radix Index (www.radixindex.com) how many Lichners show up in
villages in Turocz--Tot-Prona, Turocz-Szent-Marton, Zsambokret, Stubnya,
even my village of interest, Nagy-Csepcseny. Then you see them show up in
places to the south--Besztercebanya, Selmecbanya, Balassagyarmat,
Endrefalva. I have seen in my own research many, many families (both peasant
and noble) from Turocz who moved south, often to Nograd. Most of this
migration seemed to take place in the late 1700s and early 1800s. My
husband's family was a part of this pattern, going first to Nograd, then to
northern Pest, and finally ending up in Jasz-Nagykun-Szolnok.

According to the extensive diary of my husband's great-grandfather, who
visited his relatives in Turocz in 1844, the land was very poor for
agriculture, with potatoes being a main crop. This may help explain why so
many left.

It sounds like you have also visited the area. Did you get to see the castle
at Sklabina? That was a highlight of our trip.

Janet




-----Original Message-----
From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Margo Smith
Sent: Thursday, July 10, 2008 3:11 PM
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer is happy to meet you all

Thank you for your suggestion, Janet.  Yes, I checked both Catholic and
Lutheran church records for Slovenske Pravno and found only the daughter. 
It could be an explanation.  The Lichners (father) were Lutheran.  Maybe I
should look for an adjacent Lutheran parish and check that one.  The family
lived in the hamlet of Kal'amenova, but attended church and school in
Slovenske Pravno.

--- On Tue, 7/8/08, Janet Kozlay <kozlay@...> wrote:

From: Janet Kozlay <kozlay@...>
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer is happy to meet you all
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
Date: Tuesday, July 8, 2008, 9:03 AM






Hi Margo,

In much of this cultural area it was, and still is, the custom that in mixed
marriages, boys followed the religion of the father; the girls that of the
mother. Could that explain your data? Have you checked the records for both
churches?

Janet

-----Original Message-----
From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com]
On
Behalf Of Margo Smith
Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2008 7:43 AM
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer is happy to meet you all

Dobre rano Everyone!
 
Janet's comments about Turocz are right on.  It is a fascinating county in
terms of its history, not to mention beautiful.  In addition, Slovenske
Pravno is along an ancient trade route which extended from the Danube basin
north into what is now Poland.
 
RE: The "Durko" on the photo.  Could it be Jurko, which is a nickname for
Juraj (George)?
 
The LDS has microfilmed the "mixed marriage registers" from Slovenske Pravno
which is a gold mine.  In this register, 1 spouse is Catholic and 1 is
Lutheran.  People are identified by name, age, date of marriage, names and
ages of children.  Multiple years available.  They are on the same reels
with the church records.
 
The family I am looking at in the mixed marriage registers has presented a
dilemma.  In the 1860s, the family had 3 children:  Jan, Jozef, and Anna.  
Only Anna appears with her parents in the register.  Why would only 1 of the
children be listed?  The only thing I can think of is that Anna was
Catholic, and the 2 sons might have been Lutherans.  (Yes, there were 3
children who lived to adulthood -- other records verify that.)  Was it
common to raise some children in 1 religion and other children in the
other?  Among Anna's own children, 2 were Lutherans, 2 were Catholic, and 1
I don't know the religion.  Does anyone have any insight on this?
 
Margo

--- On Mon, 7/7/08, Janet Kozlay <kozlay@comcast. net> wrote:

From: Janet Kozlay <kozlay@comcast. net>
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer is happy to meet you all
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
Date: Monday, July 7, 2008, 1:34 PM

Hi Liz and Anabeth,

Rudno (Turoczrudno) is a tiny village just south of Slovenske Pravno. Its
church records will be found with those from Slovenske Pravno.

It should be very interesting to match and combine the Chicago church
records with those from Slovakia. It should make for a very large and
complex family tree. It will be a lot of work, but the results should be
spectacular.

Turócz was a very interesting county for its small size. There was a
relatively high proportion of Germans there, more than its neighboring
counties. It was also an important center for the Evangelical/ Lutheran
church as well as for Slovak nationalism. Ironically, it was also the home
of Lajos Kossuth’s family since the 13th century. Kossuth led Hungary’s
1848-49 war of independence against Austria yet never recognized the
strength and determination of Hungary’s Slovak minority to seek their own
independence from Hungary.

Turócz (Nagy Csepcsény) was the home of my husband’s ancestors, in the
1700s, before they migrated south to the Hungarian Plain. I have had
considerable difficulty tracing the family there. If either of you should
happen to look at records from the 1700s and run into names like Kozlay,
Kozlech, or Kozlik, or anything else beginning with “Kozl,” I would
appreciate hearing.

Janet

Janet

_____

From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:SLOVAK- ROOTS@ yahoogroups.
com]
On
Behalf Of Anabeth Dollins
Sent: Monday, July 07, 2008 12:33 PM
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
Subject: Re: [S-R] This newcomer is happy to meet you all

Hi, Liz --

I spent some time looking at my Trinity Slovak Lutheran Church
(Chicago) microfilms. Found a bunch of records on Kuka, Klein, and
Svec families, which I'll send you as a separate email. There are lots
and lots of Mizialkos and Zvonar family records -- I didn't copy any
of those records since there are so many.

In the records, the Klein family that you mentioned is from Rudno;
Zuzanna's last name is spelled Derer, not Direr. And another of your
Zuzannas is Fontani in the records, not Fontana.

Interesting to note that while your Klein family and the one in my
database are not the same, they're both from Rudno. Wonder whether
they're related.

Anabeth Dollins

On Sun, Jul 6, 2008 at 2:24 PM, Elizabeth Tjomsland
<e_tjomsland@ <mailto:e_tjomsland %40yahoo. com> yahoo.com> wrote:
> Hello, my name is Liz. I joined this group recently, because I thought I
> might get some pointers on my genealogy research. I'm a novice who has
been
> working from bits and pieces of information found in the paperwork of my
> parents after they passed on. All the folks from previous generations are
> gone, so there is no one left to ask. The following is what I do know at
> this point.
>
> My paternal grandfather, Juraj Kuka (1885-1961), came from Slovenske
> Pravno,Martin Turciansky Svaety. He was very certain that there was no
> change in the surname spelling.
> Parents: Juraj Kuka(1843-1905) and Suzanna Fontana(1859- 1941).
> Siblings: Jan, Jozef (m. Irena Kollar), Amelia (m. Paul Podmajersky) ,
> Suzanna (m. George Durkovic, I think).
> My grandfather married Suzanna Klein(1889-1934) . Even though the name
sounds
> Germanic, she insisted that she was Slovak. Her parents were Jozef
> Klein(1869-1934) and Suzanna Direr (1864-1942) and they supposedly had a
farm
> in Slovakia which was eventually confiscated by the Communists.
>
> My maternal grandmother, Alzbeta Zvonar,(1892- 1935) came from Brezova.
> Parents: Martin Zvonar and Katarina Mizialko (1862-1929)
> Siblings: Matej (1887-1887), Stefan (1888 - ?), Judita (1896-1902) and
> Martin (1905 - ?).
> My grandmother married Louis (Alois) Svec in Chicago. I know next to
nothing
> about him. He supposedly ran away from home at the age of 17, came to the
> U.S. and had little contact with his family. His parents were Jozef Svec
and
> Mary Rovnanski.
>
> My maternal great grandmother was Katarina Mizialko from Brezova.
> Parents: Stefan Mizialko(b.1820- ?) and Alzbeta Chvascula(b. 1822-?).
> Siblings: Stefan (1847-?), Matej, Jan, and Suzanna 1856-?)(m Samuel Nosko)
> She married Martin Zvonar in 1886, who apparently came to the U.S. on
> several occasions to work the coal mines in Pennsylvania. She immigrated
to
> the U.S. after her husband died.
>
> Everyone that immigrated settled in Chicago or surrounding area and, with
> the exception of Louis Svec and his parents, were Lutheran (Trinity Slovak
> Lutheran Church).
>
> My dad's name was George Julius, however, on the back of a photograph, I
see
> that his mother wrote his name as "Durko". Is this indicative of
something?
> Also wrote the middle name of my uncle as "Ludwig" (Louis). Is this just a
> dialect issue or ???? All the other "Georges" in his family were Juraj.
>
> I will welcome any and all comments.... .anything that might help me
untangle
> my roots.
>
> Many Thanks.....Regards, Liz
>
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

------------ --------- --------- ------

To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups. yahoo.com/ group/SLOVAK- ROOTS/

To unsubscribe from this group, go to
http://www.yahoogro ups.com/group/ SLOVAK-ROOTS -or- send blank email to
SLOVAK-ROOTS- unsubscribe@ yahoogroups. comYahoo! Groups Links


















[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


------------------------------------

To visit your group on the web, go to:
     http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SLOVAK-ROOTS/

To unsubscribe from this group, go to
http://www.yahoogroups.com/group/SLOVAK-ROOTS  -or- send  blank email to
SLOVAK-ROOTS-unsubscribe@...! Groups Links

In my recent correspondence with the Archives, I had something brought home to
me.          In Slovakia, they do things the opposite of what we do in the U.S.
        Where we put the house number first , and then the name of the street,
they put the street name first, followed by the number.
       Same with the city and zip code.       They put the zip code number first
, followed by the name of the city.
      I received a letter from them recently, that, if it hadn't been
"Registered", might not have gotten here.  As it is, it took twice as long to
arrive.
                                                  Tom

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Tom et al;

Your experience with the European method of addressing post.  The
British use the same basic system we do in the US but in every other
country where I have lived/worked in the 20+ years I spent there
addresses mail using the street name then number and preceding the
city name with the postal/zip code.

The US Postal Service is well aware of this difference in addressing
and I've had lots of mail from friends in Europe that arrived within
what one might consider normal transit time.  What probably slowed
down your correspondence from Slovakia was the fact that it was
registered.  Counterintuitively, registered mail takes quite a bit
longer than regular mail because it is not handled by automated means
and must be accounted for by number at each stop in its journey.  It
is the safest way to ensure something gets to someone but it is
definitely slower.

Paul in NW Florida

--- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, "Tom Geiss" <tomfgurka@...> wrote:
>
> In my recent correspondence with the Archives, I had something
brought home to me.          In Slovakia, they do things the opposite
of what we do in the U.S.
>        Where we put the house number first , and then the name of
the street, they put the street name first, followed by the number.
>       Same with the city and zip code.       They put the zip code
number first , followed by the name of the city.
>      I received a letter from them recently, that, if it hadn't been
"Registered", might not have gotten here.  As it is, it took twice as
long to arrive.
>                                                  Tom
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

JohnQAdam - many thanks for the great resource list.  It seems that
Furin is not that common of a name - not much on the boards.

Thanks again.

--- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, "johnqadam" <johnqadam@...>
wrote:
>
> >>> Searching for any information about a family named Furin/Boros
> from
> Kisporuba. <<<
>
> Based upon EI listings, I agree that Kis Poruba was in Lipto Megye
=
> county as per Zlatica's detailed answer on another board.
>
> BASIC RESEARCH HELP
> For basic research help, be sure to visit Bill Tarkulich's
excellent
> site at http://www.iabsi.com/gen/public/
>
> CHURCH RECORDS AT LATTER DAY SAINTS (MORMON) LDS FAMILY HISTORY
> CENTER (FHC)
> The Mormons have been microfilming historic vital records worldwide
> for decades as part of their mission. The Mormons make their
> collection available to anyone for viewing at their Family History
> Centers (FHC). The microfilms are stored in Salt Lake City. When
you
> visit a center, you can "rent" a microfilm, by paying a small fee
> (abt. $5 per film). The center will order the film on your behalf
and
> notify you when it arrives at their center. You can then use
reserve
> the microfilm readers to view these records.
>
> There's one more thing to keep in mind about the FHC. For the most
> part, the FHC volunteers will know NOTHING about research in
Slovakia
> or about the contents of the films. The volunteer may know about
> his/her own heritage, but that is about it. That's where you need
> groups like this to point you in the right direction.
>
> When searching for genealogical information, knowing the birth
> village is paramount because records are organized by village not
> nationally, so it is not possible to search on a national basis. It
> is also necessary to know the religion. To locate church records
for
> Slovakia, knowing the village/town name, go to the LDS web site:
> www.familysearch.org/Eng/Library/FHLC/frameset_fhlc.asp  The church
> records cover baptisms (krsteni), marriages (sobeseni) and deaths
> (zomreli).
>
> There is very little shown on the LDS site for Liptovska Porubka.
> Here is your next step  .  .  .
>
> LDS FICHES (set of 6) LDS #6000786
> Survey of parish registers in Slovakia up to the time of civil
> registration. Provides details of church records that are held in
> Slovak archives.  Index of villages is on fiche #6 and page
> references refer to different religions. Most of these church
records
> are available on film via your LDS Family History Center.
>
> LOCATE YOUR NEAREST FAMILY HISTORY CENTER AND ORDER FILM or FICHES
> You can go to the LDS web site to locate your nearest Family
History
> Center (FHC) and determine their hours of operation. You will need
to
> go there in person to ask if they have Fiches #6000786 on hand
and/or
> order the fiches/film(s). In about a month, the film will arrive
and
> you can book a film reader and begin your research.
>

Looking for any information about the Furin or Boros Families from
Kisporuba (Liptovsk Porubka).

Many Thanks.

Hi! Maxine,
Mihaly Dzsupinka (Jupinka) last residence was Tokaj (Tokay)  Hungary in Zemplen.
I do not know if that is where he was born.  I don't know much  about him
because he died before my mom, his granddaughter  was born.  I don't even know
his exact death date.  I just know my mom says he's burried in the cemetery that
we are talking about.  I know the time frame would have been that he died after
my Uncle Steve Jupinka was born  Jan 1913  and before 1923 which would have been
about the time my great grandmother had another child with her 2nd husband
George Orosz. 
I don't remember who I spoke to, but it was someone who was trying to access the
cemetery records, but she had trouble hearing me over the phone.  She said it
would be better to come in person which I couldn't do because I was caring for
my mom who has cancer. 
It's a long story, but I originally was searching in the wrong cemetery because
between information on mapquest and a genealogy website put me on the wrong side
of Florida Grove Road and eventually I was communicating via email with the
secretary Anna of the Ukrainian Catholic Church Assumption of the Blessed Virgin
Mary Cemetery, Florida Grove Road Hopelawn, NJ  and she told me to look for his
grave in the cemetery directly across Florida Grove Road---which belonged to St.
John the Baptist Orthodox Church.  Mapquest just labels both sides as Ukrainian
Cemetery.  It was very confusing to me.  But  maybe it was meant for me to find
Anna, because in our communications I found out she knew my mom's best friend
during the 1960-70's,  Stella Gadek, and said she was a parishoner there.
Since you know more, can you look on mapquest and tell me if St. John the
Baptist Cemetery is bounded by Pfeiffer Blvd, Florida Grove Rd, Columbus Drive
and a resevoir.  Anna said to look there.  I was on the side that was Pfeiffer
Blvd., Florida Grove Rd., Clyde Ave,  and Herbert Street.
In my youth I would walk past these cemeteries as I walked down Pfeiffer Blvd to
get to Two Guys to go shopping from my house on Harding Ave. Perth Amboy.
Lisa

Hi Lisa, the cemetery is located on Pheiffer & Florida Grove.  There are 2 for
the Orthodox church. The new one is  directly across from the old one.  good
luck maxine


   ----- Original Message -----
   From: SimplyLisa
   To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com ; SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
   Sent: Sunday, July 13, 2008 12:52 AM
   Subject: [S-R] Re: New & researching Zemplen Abauj area


   Hi! Maxine,
   Mihaly Dzsupinka (Jupinka) last residence was Tokaj (Tokay)  Hungary in
Zemplen. I do not know if that is where he was born.  I don't know much  about
him because he died before my mom, his granddaughter  was born.  I don't even
know his exact death date.  I just know my mom says he's burried in the cemetery
that we are talking about.  I know the time frame would have been that he died
after my Uncle Steve Jupinka was born  Jan 1913  and before 1923 which would
have been about the time my great grandmother had another child with her 2nd
husband George Orosz.
   I don't remember who I spoke to, but it was someone who was trying to access
the cemetery records, but she had trouble hearing me over the phone.  She said
it would be better to come in person which I couldn't do because I was caring
for my mom who has cancer.
   It's a long story, but I originally was searching in the wrong cemetery
because between information on mapquest and a genealogy website put me on the
wrong side of Florida Grove Road and eventually I was communicating via email
with the secretary Anna of the Ukrainian Catholic Church Assumption of the
Blessed Virgin Mary Cemetery, Florida Grove Road Hopelawn, NJ  and she told me
to look for his grave in the cemetery directly across Florida Grove Road---which
belonged to St. John the Baptist Orthodox Church.  Mapquest just labels both
sides as Ukrainian Cemetery.  It was very confusing to me.  But  maybe it was
meant for me to find Anna, because in our communications I found out she knew my
mom's best friend during the 1960-70's,  Stella Gadek, and said she was a
parishoner there.
   Since you know more, can you look on mapquest and tell me if St. John the
Baptist Cemetery is bounded by Pfeiffer Blvd, Florida Grove Rd, Columbus Drive
and a resevoir.  Anna said to look there.  I was on the side that was Pfeiffer
Blvd., Florida Grove Rd., Clyde Ave,  and Herbert Street.
   In my youth I would walk past these cemeteries as I walked down Pfeiffer Blvd
to get to Two Guys to go shopping from my house on Harding Ave. Perth Amboy.
   Lisa




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Janet, yes, there were a lot of Lichners in Turocz.  My husband's great aunt (an
immigrant from Kal'amenova in the 1920s) told me that her Lichners (her mother's
ancestors) had "come across the mountains after the Napoleonic Wars."  The 1715
tax list shows that there were Lichners in Turocz at that time, so it wouldn't
surprise me if Aunt Anna's chronology was off.
 
Yes, after the Turks were expelled, a bunch of folks from the north migrated
south to occupy that vacated territory.  Most branches of my husband's family
was in Turocz back into the 1600s and stayed there.  He has cousins there still.
 
Lucky you to have the diary of your husband's great-grandfather!  Have you
considered publishing it?
 
Yes, I have visited Turocz (now Turiec) 3 times between 2003-2006.   The
principal crop is cereal grain.  Increased logging in the forests of the Mala
Fatras to the west.  Everyone, or so it seems, has a garden plot where they grow
potatoes and other veggies.  I particularly liked seeing the apple trees growing
along the roadsides -- good use of space.  No, I did not get to Sklabina, but we
did visit the castles at Orava and Bojnice in adjacent counties -- and the ruins
of Zniev in Turocz.  Next trip has the ruins of the castle at Blatnica on my
itinerary because my husband has ancestors from there also.
 
I wanted to visit Zniev because my husband's grandfather had told me about
seeing them from Kal'amenova when he was growing up.  With binoculars, I
searched unsuccessfully for the ruins from the valley floor.  Then I found a map
of hiking trails which showed the location and way to the ruins.  Once I got up
there I realized that the forest had grown up and obscured the ruins in the
century between the time that the grandfather had lived in Kal'amenova and my
trip. 
 
Potatoes are a New World domesticate.  They were cultivated in Slovakia starting
in about the 1770s in response to a famine.
 
Check out Karol Rebro's book Ubarska regulacia Marie Terezie a poddanske upravy
Jozefa II Na Slovensku.  You can get it on interlibrary loan.  If my memory is
correct, there are tables which list the villages and whether they are good or
poor land.  If you remind me when I get back to IL after Aug. 12, I will look up
your villages for you.  My recollection is that Turiec was entirely in the 3
best classes of land.
 
Margo

--- On Fri, 7/11/08, Janet Kozlay <kozlay@...> wrote:

From: Janet Kozlay <kozlay@...>
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer... Lichner family
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
Date: Friday, July 11, 2008, 4:00 AM






Margo,

Note in the Radix Index (www.radixindex. com) how many Lichners show up in
villages in Turocz--Tot- Prona, Turocz-Szent- Marton, Zsambokret, Stubnya,
even my village of interest, Nagy-Csepcseny. Then you see them show up in
places to the south--Beszterceban ya, Selmecbanya, Balassagyarmat,
Endrefalva. I have seen in my own research many, many families (both peasant
and noble) from Turocz who moved south, often to Nograd. Most of this
migration seemed to take place in the late 1700s and early 1800s. My
husband's family was a part of this pattern, going first to Nograd, then to
northern Pest, and finally ending up in Jasz-Nagykun- Szolnok.

According to the extensive diary of my husband's great-grandfather, who
visited his relatives in Turocz in 1844, the land was very poor for
agriculture, with potatoes being a main crop. This may help explain why so
many left.

It sounds like you have also visited the area. Did you get to see the castle
at Sklabina? That was a highlight of our trip.

Janet

-----Original Message-----
From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com] On
Behalf Of Margo Smith
Sent: Thursday, July 10, 2008 3:11 PM
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer is happy to meet you all

Thank you for your suggestion, Janet.  Yes, I checked both Catholic and
Lutheran church records for Slovenske Pravno and found only the daughter. 
It could be an explanation.  The Lichners (father) were Lutheran.  Maybe I
should look for an adjacent Lutheran parish and check that one.  The family
lived in the hamlet of Kal'amenova, but attended church and school in
Slovenske Pravno.

--- On Tue, 7/8/08, Janet Kozlay <kozlay@comcast. net> wrote:

From: Janet Kozlay <kozlay@comcast. net>
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer is happy to meet you all
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
Date: Tuesday, July 8, 2008, 9:03 AM

Hi Margo,

In much of this cultural area it was, and still is, the custom that in mixed
marriages, boys followed the religion of the father; the girls that of the
mother. Could that explain your data? Have you checked the records for both
churches?

Janet

-----Original Message-----
From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:SLOVAK- ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com]
On
Behalf Of Margo Smith
Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2008 7:43 AM
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer is happy to meet you all

Dobre rano Everyone!
 
Janet's comments about Turocz are right on.  It is a fascinating county in
terms of its history, not to mention beautiful.  In addition, Slovenske
Pravno is along an ancient trade route which extended from the Danube basin
north into what is now Poland.
 
RE: The "Durko" on the photo.  Could it be Jurko, which is a nickname for
Juraj (George)?
 
The LDS has microfilmed the "mixed marriage registers" from Slovenske Pravno
which is a gold mine.  In this register, 1 spouse is Catholic and 1 is
Lutheran.  People are identified by name, age, date of marriage, names and
ages of children.  Multiple years available.  They are on the same reels
with the church records.
 
The family I am looking at in the mixed marriage registers has presented a
dilemma.  In the 1860s, the family had 3 children:  Jan, Jozef, and Anna.  
Only Anna appears with her parents in the register.  Why would only 1 of the
children be listed?  The only thing I can think of is that Anna was
Catholic, and the 2 sons might have been Lutherans.  (Yes, there were 3
children who lived to adulthood -- other records verify that.)  Was it
common to raise some children in 1 religion and other children in the
other?  Among Anna's own children, 2 were Lutherans, 2 were Catholic, and 1
I don't know the religion.  Does anyone have any insight on this?
 
Margo

--- On Mon, 7/7/08, Janet Kozlay <kozlay@comcast. net> wrote:

From: Janet Kozlay <kozlay@comcast. net>
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer is happy to meet you all
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
Date: Monday, July 7, 2008, 1:34 PM

Hi Liz and Anabeth,

Rudno (Turoczrudno) is a tiny village just south of Slovenske Pravno. Its
church records will be found with those from Slovenske Pravno.

It should be very interesting to match and combine the Chicago church
records with those from Slovakia. It should make for a very large and
complex family tree. It will be a lot of work, but the results should be
spectacular.

Turócz was a very interesting county for its small size. There was a
relatively high proportion of Germans there, more than its neighboring
counties. It was also an important center for the Evangelical/ Lutheran
church as well as for Slovak nationalism. Ironically, it was also the home
of Lajos Kossuth’s family since the 13th century. Kossuth led Hungary’s
1848-49 war of independence against Austria yet never recognized the
strength and determination of Hungary’s Slovak minority to seek their own
independence from Hungary.

Turócz (Nagy Csepcsény) was the home of my husband’s ancestors, in the
1700s, before they migrated south to the Hungarian Plain. I have had
considerable difficulty tracing the family there. If either of you should
happen to look at records from the 1700s and run into names like Kozlay,
Kozlech, or Kozlik, or anything else beginning with “Kozl,” I would
appreciate hearing.

Janet

Janet

_____

From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:SLOVAK- ROOTS@ yahoogroups.
com]
On
Behalf Of Anabeth Dollins
Sent: Monday, July 07, 2008 12:33 PM
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
Subject: Re: [S-R] This newcomer is happy to meet you all

Hi, Liz --

I spent some time looking at my Trinity Slovak Lutheran Church
(Chicago) microfilms. Found a bunch of records on Kuka, Klein, and
Svec families, which I'll send you as a separate email. There are lots
and lots of Mizialkos and Zvonar family records -- I didn't copy any
of those records since there are so many.

In the records, the Klein family that you mentioned is from Rudno;
Zuzanna's last name is spelled Derer, not Direr. And another of your
Zuzannas is Fontani in the records, not Fontana.

Interesting to note that while your Klein family and the one in my
database are not the same, they're both from Rudno. Wonder whether
they're related.

Anabeth Dollins

On Sun, Jul 6, 2008 at 2:24 PM, Elizabeth Tjomsland
<e_tjomsland@ <mailto:e_tjomsland %40yahoo. com> yahoo.com> wrote:
> Hello, my name is Liz. I joined this group recently, because I thought I
> might get some pointers on my genealogy research. I'm a novice who has
been
> working from bits and pieces of information found in the paperwork of my
> parents after they passed on. All the folks from previous generations are
> gone, so there is no one left to ask. The following is what I do know at
> this point.
>
> My paternal grandfather, Juraj Kuka (1885-1961), came from Slovenske
> Pravno,Martin Turciansky Svaety. He was very certain that there was no
> change in the surname spelling.
> Parents: Juraj Kuka(1843-1905) and Suzanna Fontana(1859- 1941).
> Siblings: Jan, Jozef (m. Irena Kollar), Amelia (m. Paul Podmajersky) ,
> Suzanna (m. George Durkovic, I think).
> My grandfather married Suzanna Klein(1889-1934) . Even though the name
sounds
> Germanic, she insisted that she was Slovak. Her parents were Jozef
> Klein(1869-1934) and Suzanna Direr (1864-1942) and they supposedly had a
farm
> in Slovakia which was eventually confiscated by the Communists.
>
> My maternal grandmother, Alzbeta Zvonar,(1892- 1935) came from Brezova.
> Parents: Martin Zvonar and Katarina Mizialko (1862-1929)
> Siblings: Matej (1887-1887), Stefan (1888 - ?), Judita (1896-1902) and
> Martin (1905 - ?).
> My grandmother married Louis (Alois) Svec in Chicago. I know next to
nothing
> about him. He supposedly ran away from home at the age of 17, came to the
> U.S. and had little contact with his family. His parents were Jozef Svec
and
> Mary Rovnanski.
>
> My maternal great grandmother was Katarina Mizialko from Brezova.
> Parents: Stefan Mizialko(b.1820- ?) and Alzbeta Chvascula(b. 1822-?).
> Siblings: Stefan (1847-?), Matej, Jan, and Suzanna 1856-?)(m Samuel Nosko)
> She married Martin Zvonar in 1886, who apparently came to the U.S. on
> several occasions to work the coal mines in Pennsylvania. She immigrated
to
> the U.S. after her husband died.
>
> Everyone that immigrated settled in Chicago or surrounding area and, with
> the exception of Louis Svec and his parents, were Lutheran (Trinity Slovak
> Lutheran Church).
>
> My dad's name was George Julius, however, on the back of a photograph, I
see
> that his mother wrote his name as "Durko". Is this indicative of
something?
> Also wrote the middle name of my uncle as "Ludwig" (Louis). Is this just a
> dialect issue or ???? All the other "Georges" in his family were Juraj.
>
> I will welcome any and all comments.... .anything that might help me
untangle
> my roots.
>
> Many Thanks.....Regards, Liz
>
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Dear Margo,

My husband's great-grandfather was an officer in the 1848-49 war, stationed
at Komarom when the army was finally defeated, and escaped from Hungary to
the U.S. with a group of his fellow officers. He brought with him his “big
book,“ which was not just a diary but also many memoirs, poetry, and
fiction. He continued his diary through his first few years in America.
Added to that was a huge amount of correspondence. Several years ago we had
it all translated from Hungarian. It took two years two translate nearly
1000 pages. It has been my intention to publish (on the Internet) the
translations, to which I am adding extensive annotations. I worked on it
steadily for several years, but I have been very bad at getting back to it.
I got stuck when I came to some that had been written in German for which we
did not have the translations. Well, they have now been done, so I don't
have a good excuse any more. It's just so much more fun helping others with
their research. I need to work on self-discipline and get the job done.
There is very little in English that relates to the daily life of the
well-to-do in 19th-century Hungary. It also gives insight into the
relationship between the serfs and the estate managers and other interesting
topics. (Included is some very racy stuff regarding sexual exploits, so racy
that my translator didn't want to translate it in detail, which I insisted
on. They were a very free-wheeling bunch about sex, both men and women.) It
would be terribly sad if I never finished it.

Of course I have also done a lot of work researching the family. But the
transitional period between Turocz and Nograd is very hazy, mainly because
relevant church records have been lost. Trying to make a connection is
complicated also because the family used more than one name. I think the
family was known as Kozlik and/or a form of Kozlay in Turocz, but so far I
have found almost no firm connections. I have considered hiring Vladimir
Bohinc, who says it would be an interesting project, but it would also be
very expensive research.

I certainly agree that that area of Slovakia is very beautiful. We drove up
there from Hungary, and the mountains and forests were lovely.
Great-grandfather's trip in 1844 was in mid-winter, which I can't imagine.
He had to exchange his horses in Besztercebanya (Banska Bystrica) for ones
that were familiar with mountainous terrain, and he did complain about the
cold. Whatever made him choose that season for long-distance traveling is
beyond me.

How wonderful it is that you have been able to find relatives there today.
I'm sure we will never be that fortunate. But I was surprised this year to
discover descendants of great-grandfather Kozlay's mother, and they have
worked out an extensive genealogy of the family. It was most interesting
that although Kozlay's father and grandfather both married into that family,
neither of the marriages appeared in the family tree. So I have been able to
send them significant information.

Is the book you recommended only in Slovak? I do not know the language at
all, but I am always up for learning more.

Best regards, Janet




-----Original Message-----
From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Margo Smith
Sent: Wednesday, July 16, 2008 10:52 AM
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer... Lichner family

Janet, yes, there were a lot of Lichners in Turocz.  My husband's great aunt
(an immigrant from Kal'amenova in the 1920s) told me that her Lichners (her
mother's ancestors) had "come across the mountains after the Napoleonic
Wars."  The 1715 tax list shows that there were Lichners in Turocz at that
time, so it wouldn't surprise me if Aunt Anna's chronology was off.
 
Yes, after the Turks were expelled, a bunch of folks from the north migrated
south to occupy that vacated territory.  Most branches of my husband's
family was in Turocz back into the 1600s and stayed there.  He has cousins
there still.
 
Lucky you to have the diary of your husband's great-grandfather!  Have you
considered publishing it?
 
Yes, I have visited Turocz (now Turiec) 3 times between 2003-2006.   The
principal crop is cereal grain.  Increased logging in the forests of the
Mala Fatras to the west.  Everyone, or so it seems, has a garden plot where
they grow potatoes and other veggies.  I particularly liked seeing the apple
trees growing along the roadsides -- good use of space.  No, I did not get
to Sklabina, but we did visit the castles at Orava and Bojnice in adjacent
counties -- and the ruins of Zniev in Turocz.  Next trip has the ruins of
the castle at Blatnica on my itinerary because my husband has ancestors from
there also.
 
I wanted to visit Zniev because my husband's grandfather had told me about
seeing them from Kal'amenova when he was growing up.  With binoculars, I
searched unsuccessfully for the ruins from the valley floor.  Then I found a
map of hiking trails which showed the location and way to the ruins.  Once I
got up there I realized that the forest had grown up and obscured the ruins
in the century between the time that the grandfather had lived in
Kal'amenova and my trip. 
 
Potatoes are a New World domesticate.  They were cultivated in Slovakia
starting in about the 1770s in response to a famine.
 
Check out Karol Rebro's book Ubarska regulacia Marie Terezie a poddanske
upravy Jozefa II Na Slovensku.  You can get it on interlibrary loan.  If my
memory is correct, there are tables which list the villages and whether they
are good or poor land.  If you remind me when I get back to IL after Aug.
12, I will look up your villages for you.  My recollection is that Turiec
was entirely in the 3 best classes of land.
 
Margo

--- On Fri, 7/11/08, Janet Kozlay <kozlay@...> wrote:

From: Janet Kozlay <kozlay@...>
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer... Lichner family
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
Date: Friday, July 11, 2008, 4:00 AM






Margo,

Note in the Radix Index (www.radixindex. com) how many Lichners show up in
villages in Turocz--Tot- Prona, Turocz-Szent- Marton, Zsambokret, Stubnya,
even my village of interest, Nagy-Csepcseny. Then you see them show up in
places to the south--Beszterceban ya, Selmecbanya, Balassagyarmat,
Endrefalva. I have seen in my own research many, many families (both peasant
and noble) from Turocz who moved south, often to Nograd. Most of this
migration seemed to take place in the late 1700s and early 1800s. My
husband's family was a part of this pattern, going first to Nograd, then to
northern Pest, and finally ending up in Jasz-Nagykun- Szolnok.

According to the extensive diary of my husband's great-grandfather, who
visited his relatives in Turocz in 1844, the land was very poor for
agriculture, with potatoes being a main crop. This may help explain why so
many left.

It sounds like you have also visited the area. Did you get to see the castle
at Sklabina? That was a highlight of our trip.

Janet

-----Original Message-----
From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com]
On
Behalf Of Margo Smith
Sent: Thursday, July 10, 2008 3:11 PM
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer is happy to meet you all

Thank you for your suggestion, Janet.  Yes, I checked both Catholic and
Lutheran church records for Slovenske Pravno and found only the daughter. 
It could be an explanation.  The Lichners (father) were Lutheran.  Maybe I
should look for an adjacent Lutheran parish and check that one.  The family
lived in the hamlet of Kal'amenova, but attended church and school in
Slovenske Pravno.

--- On Tue, 7/8/08, Janet Kozlay <kozlay@comcast. net> wrote:

From: Janet Kozlay <kozlay@comcast. net>
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer is happy to meet you all
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
Date: Tuesday, July 8, 2008, 9:03 AM

Hi Margo,

In much of this cultural area it was, and still is, the custom that in mixed
marriages, boys followed the religion of the father; the girls that of the
mother. Could that explain your data? Have you checked the records for both
churches?

Janet

-----Original Message-----
From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:SLOVAK- ROOTS@ yahoogroups.
com]
On
Behalf Of Margo Smith
Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2008 7:43 AM
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer is happy to meet you all

Dobre rano Everyone!
 
Janet's comments about Turocz are right on.  It is a fascinating county in
terms of its history, not to mention beautiful.  In addition, Slovenske
Pravno is along an ancient trade route which extended from the Danube basin
north into what is now Poland.
 
RE: The "Durko" on the photo.  Could it be Jurko, which is a nickname for
Juraj (George)?
 
The LDS has microfilmed the "mixed marriage registers" from Slovenske Pravno
which is a gold mine.  In this register, 1 spouse is Catholic and 1 is
Lutheran.  People are identified by name, age, date of marriage, names and
ages of children.  Multiple years available.  They are on the same reels
with the church records.
 
The family I am looking at in the mixed marriage registers has presented a
dilemma.  In the 1860s, the family had 3 children:  Jan, Jozef, and Anna.  
Only Anna appears with her parents in the register.  Why would only 1 of the
children be listed?  The only thing I can think of is that Anna was
Catholic, and the 2 sons might have been Lutherans.  (Yes, there were 3
children who lived to adulthood -- other records verify that.)  Was it
common to raise some children in 1 religion and other children in the
other?  Among Anna's own children, 2 were Lutherans, 2 were Catholic, and 1
I don't know the religion.  Does anyone have any insight on this?
 
Margo

--- On Mon, 7/7/08, Janet Kozlay <kozlay@comcast. net> wrote:

From: Janet Kozlay <kozlay@comcast. net>
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer is happy to meet you all
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
Date: Monday, July 7, 2008, 1:34 PM

Hi Liz and Anabeth,

Rudno (Turoczrudno) is a tiny village just south of Slovenske Pravno. Its
church records will be found with those from Slovenske Pravno.

It should be very interesting to match and combine the Chicago church
records with those from Slovakia. It should make for a very large and
complex family tree. It will be a lot of work, but the results should be
spectacular.

Turócz was a very interesting county for its small size. There was a
relatively high proportion of Germans there, more than its neighboring
counties. It was also an important center for the Evangelical/ Lutheran
church as well as for Slovak nationalism. Ironically, it was also the home
of Lajos Kossuth’s family since the 13th century. Kossuth led Hungary’s
1848-49 war of independence against Austria yet never recognized the
strength and determination of Hungary’s Slovak minority to seek their own
independence from Hungary.

Turócz (Nagy Csepcsény) was the home of my husband’s ancestors, in the
1700s, before they migrated south to the Hungarian Plain. I have had
considerable difficulty tracing the family there. If either of you should
happen to look at records from the 1700s and run into names like Kozlay,
Kozlech, or Kozlik, or anything else beginning with “Kozl,” I would
appreciate hearing.

Janet

Janet

_____

From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:SLOVAK- ROOTS@ yahoogroups.
com]
On
Behalf Of Anabeth Dollins
Sent: Monday, July 07, 2008 12:33 PM
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
Subject: Re: [S-R] This newcomer is happy to meet you all

Hi, Liz --

I spent some time looking at my Trinity Slovak Lutheran Church
(Chicago) microfilms. Found a bunch of records on Kuka, Klein, and
Svec families, which I'll send you as a separate email. There are lots
and lots of Mizialkos and Zvonar family records -- I didn't copy any
of those records since there are so many.

In the records, the Klein family that you mentioned is from Rudno;
Zuzanna's last name is spelled Derer, not Direr. And another of your
Zuzannas is Fontani in the records, not Fontana.

Interesting to note that while your Klein family and the one in my
database are not the same, they're both from Rudno. Wonder whether
they're related.

Anabeth Dollins

On Sun, Jul 6, 2008 at 2:24 PM, Elizabeth Tjomsland
<e_tjomsland@ <mailto:e_tjomsland %40yahoo. com> yahoo.com> wrote:
> Hello, my name is Liz. I joined this group recently, because I thought I
> might get some pointers on my genealogy research. I'm a novice who has
been
> working from bits and pieces of information found in the paperwork of my
> parents after they passed on. All the folks from previous generations are
> gone, so there is no one left to ask. The following is what I do know at
> this point.
>
> My paternal grandfather, Juraj Kuka (1885-1961), came from Slovenske
> Pravno,Martin Turciansky Svaety. He was very certain that there was no
> change in the surname spelling.
> Parents: Juraj Kuka(1843-1905) and Suzanna Fontana(1859- 1941).
> Siblings: Jan, Jozef (m. Irena Kollar), Amelia (m. Paul Podmajersky) ,
> Suzanna (m. George Durkovic, I think).
> My grandfather married Suzanna Klein(1889-1934) . Even though the name
sounds
> Germanic, she insisted that she was Slovak. Her parents were Jozef
> Klein(1869-1934) and Suzanna Direr (1864-1942) and they supposedly had a
farm
> in Slovakia which was eventually confiscated by the Communists.
>
> My maternal grandmother, Alzbeta Zvonar,(1892- 1935) came from Brezova.
> Parents: Martin Zvonar and Katarina Mizialko (1862-1929)
> Siblings: Matej (1887-1887), Stefan (1888 - ?), Judita (1896-1902) and
> Martin (1905 - ?).
> My grandmother married Louis (Alois) Svec in Chicago. I know next to
nothing
> about him. He supposedly ran away from home at the age of 17, came to the
> U.S. and had little contact with his family. His parents were Jozef Svec
and
> Mary Rovnanski.
>
> My maternal great grandmother was Katarina Mizialko from Brezova.
> Parents: Stefan Mizialko(b.1820- ?) and Alzbeta Chvascula(b. 1822-?).
> Siblings: Stefan (1847-?), Matej, Jan, and Suzanna 1856-?)(m Samuel Nosko)
> She married Martin Zvonar in 1886, who apparently came to the U.S. on
> several occasions to work the coal mines in Pennsylvania. She immigrated
to
> the U.S. after her husband died.
>
> Everyone that immigrated settled in Chicago or surrounding area and, with
> the exception of Louis Svec and his parents, were Lutheran (Trinity Slovak
> Lutheran Church).
>
> My dad's name was George Julius, however, on the back of a photograph, I
see
> that his mother wrote his name as "Durko". Is this indicative of
something?
> Also wrote the middle name of my uncle as "Ludwig" (Louis). Is this just a
> dialect issue or ???? All the other "Georges" in his family were Juraj.
>
> I will welcome any and all comments.... .anything that might help me
untangle
> my roots.
>
> Many Thanks.....Regards, Liz
>
>

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Please note that our email address has been changed



From kozlay@...



To kozlay@...



Janet and Doug Kozlay



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Janet, the "diary" you have is a valuable and precious resource!  You must keep
your focus on finishing this project.  (Sometimes, I need to be reminded about
focus also.)
 
Yes, Rebro's book is in Slovak.  And I don't read the language.  What I did was
go through the book page by page and photocopy all pages that mentioned my
villages and a few other topics I could recognize.  When a cousin visited from
SK, I cornered him and pleaded that he read (translate) for me.  He tired of
that pretty quickly, so he took my photocopies and had them translated.  Nagy
Csepcin is not one of my villages, but I did photocopy all the charts, so I'
ll look for that when I get  back to IL and let you know.  You probably should
remind me the middle of next month.
 
Are you familiar with the 1730s maps by Samuel Mikovini?  He did 2 maps of
Turocz.  There is Nagy Csepcin!  For each of the villages he draws in the
individual farmsteads -- I'm pretty certain that he does NOT have the actual #
of farmsteads per village.  E.g. Dubove was always substantially larger than a
lot of the other villages in the southern part of the valley, but is not shown
on the map as being a lot larger.  What I just noticed about N-C is that behind
the farmsteads he has drawn in what looks like an orchard.  It is the only
village with an orchard.  (Check the online tax list for 1715 for N-C.  Look at
the description after the list of taxables and see if the village description
mentions an orchard.)
 
Yes, name changes are frustrating.  A lot of my folks had aliases in the 1700s. 
You have to check every source for both the surname and the alias -- and you
have to find at least 1 record that lists both the surname and the alias in the
same record to know that the names are linked.  I'm still struggling with the
alternate spellings of the names of the godparents and marriage witnesses, e.g.
Macz, Matz, Mac are all the same person.  There are relatively few surnames
where the spelling is standardized (there is Hungarian, Slovak, and Latin).
 
Yes, my life changed forever when the Slovaks came into my life in 2003.
 
Keep focused!
 
Margo 

--- On Wed, 7/16/08, Janet Kozlay <kozlay@...> wrote:

From: Janet Kozlay <kozlay@...>
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer... Lichner family
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
Date: Wednesday, July 16, 2008, 12:24 PM






Dear Margo,

My husband's great-grandfather was an officer in the 1848-49 war, stationed
at Komarom when the army was finally defeated, and escaped from Hungary to
the U.S. with a group of his fellow officers. He brought with him his “big
book,“ which was not just a diary but also many memoirs, poetry, and
fiction. He continued his diary through his first few years in America.
Added to that was a huge amount of correspondence. Several years ago we had
it all translated from Hungarian. It took two years two translate nearly
1000 pages. It has been my intention to publish (on the Internet) the
translations, to which I am adding extensive annotations. I worked on it
steadily for several years, but I have been very bad at getting back to it.
I got stuck when I came to some that had been written in German for which we
did not have the translations. Well, they have now been done, so I don't
have a good excuse any more. It's just so much more fun helping others with
their research. I need to work on self-discipline and get the job done.
There is very little in English that relates to the daily life of the
well-to-do in 19th-century Hungary. It also gives insight into the
relationship between the serfs and the estate managers and other interesting
topics. (Included is some very racy stuff regarding sexual exploits, so racy
that my translator didn't want to translate it in detail, which I insisted
on. They were a very free-wheeling bunch about sex, both men and women.) It
would be terribly sad if I never finished it.

Of course I have also done a lot of work researching the family. But the
transitional period between Turocz and Nograd is very hazy, mainly because
relevant church records have been lost. Trying to make a connection is
complicated also because the family used more than one name. I think the
family was known as Kozlik and/or a form of Kozlay in Turocz, but so far I
have found almost no firm connections. I have considered hiring Vladimir
Bohinc, who says it would be an interesting project, but it would also be
very expensive research.

I certainly agree that that area of Slovakia is very beautiful. We drove up
there from Hungary, and the mountains and forests were lovely.
Great-grandfather' s trip in 1844 was in mid-winter, which I can't imagine.
He had to exchange his horses in Besztercebanya (Banska Bystrica) for ones
that were familiar with mountainous terrain, and he did complain about the
cold. Whatever made him choose that season for long-distance traveling is
beyond me.

How wonderful it is that you have been able to find relatives there today.
I'm sure we will never be that fortunate. But I was surprised this year to
discover descendants of great-grandfather Kozlay's mother, and they have
worked out an extensive genealogy of the family. It was most interesting
that although Kozlay's father and grandfather both married into that family,
neither of the marriages appeared in the family tree. So I have been able to
send them significant information.

Is the book you recommended only in Slovak? I do not know the language at
all, but I am always up for learning more.

Best regards, Janet


-----Original Message-----
From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com] On
Behalf Of Margo Smith
Sent: Wednesday, July 16, 2008 10:52 AM
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer... Lichner family

Janet, yes, there were a lot of Lichners in Turocz.  My husband's great aunt
(an immigrant from Kal'amenova in the 1920s) told me that her Lichners (her
mother's ancestors) had "come across the mountains after the Napoleonic
Wars."  The 1715 tax list shows that there were Lichners in Turocz at that
time, so it wouldn't surprise me if Aunt Anna's chronology was off.
 
Yes, after the Turks were expelled, a bunch of folks from the north migrated
south to occupy that vacated territory.  Most branches of my husband's
family was in Turocz back into the 1600s and stayed there.  He has cousins
there still.
 
Lucky you to have the diary of your husband's great-grandfather!  Have you
considered publishing it?
 
Yes, I have visited Turocz (now Turiec) 3 times between 2003-2006.   The
principal crop is cereal grain.  Increased logging in the forests of the
Mala Fatras to the west.  Everyone, or so it seems, has a garden plot where
they grow potatoes and other veggies.  I particularly liked seeing the apple
trees growing along the roadsides -- good use of space.  No, I did not get
to Sklabina, but we did visit the castles at Orava and Bojnice in adjacent
counties -- and the ruins of Zniev in Turocz.  Next trip has the ruins of
the castle at Blatnica on my itinerary because my husband has ancestors from
there also.
 
I wanted to visit Zniev because my husband's grandfather had told me about
seeing them from Kal'amenova when he was growing up.  With binoculars, I
searched unsuccessfully for the ruins from the valley floor.  Then I found a
map of hiking trails which showed the location and way to the ruins.  Once I
got up there I realized that the forest had grown up and obscured the ruins
in the century between the time that the grandfather had lived in
Kal'amenova and my trip. 
 
Potatoes are a New World domesticate.  They were cultivated in Slovakia
starting in about the 1770s in response to a famine.
 
Check out Karol Rebro's book Ubarska regulacia Marie Terezie a poddanske
upravy Jozefa II Na Slovensku.  You can get it on interlibrary loan.  If my
memory is correct, there are tables which list the villages and whether they
are good or poor land.  If you remind me when I get back to IL after Aug.
12, I will look up your villages for you.  My recollection is that Turiec
was entirely in the 3 best classes of land.
 
Margo

--- On Fri, 7/11/08, Janet Kozlay <kozlay@comcast. net> wrote:

From: Janet Kozlay <kozlay@comcast. net>
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer... Lichner family
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
Date: Friday, July 11, 2008, 4:00 AM

Margo,

Note in the Radix Index (www.radixindex. com) how many Lichners show up in
villages in Turocz--Tot- Prona, Turocz-Szent- Marton, Zsambokret, Stubnya,
even my village of interest, Nagy-Csepcseny. Then you see them show up in
places to the south--Beszterceban ya, Selmecbanya, Balassagyarmat,
Endrefalva. I have seen in my own research many, many families (both peasant
and noble) from Turocz who moved south, often to Nograd. Most of this
migration seemed to take place in the late 1700s and early 1800s. My
husband's family was a part of this pattern, going first to Nograd, then to
northern Pest, and finally ending up in Jasz-Nagykun- Szolnok.

According to the extensive diary of my husband's great-grandfather, who
visited his relatives in Turocz in 1844, the land was very poor for
agriculture, with potatoes being a main crop. This may help explain why so
many left.

It sounds like you have also visited the area. Did you get to see the castle
at Sklabina? That was a highlight of our trip.

Janet

-----Original Message-----
From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:SLOVAK- ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com]
On
Behalf Of Margo Smith
Sent: Thursday, July 10, 2008 3:11 PM
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer is happy to meet you all

Thank you for your suggestion, Janet.  Yes, I checked both Catholic and
Lutheran church records for Slovenske Pravno and found only the daughter. 
It could be an explanation.  The Lichners (father) were Lutheran.  Maybe I
should look for an adjacent Lutheran parish and check that one.  The family
lived in the hamlet of Kal'amenova, but attended church and school in
Slovenske Pravno.

--- On Tue, 7/8/08, Janet Kozlay <kozlay@comcast. net> wrote:

From: Janet Kozlay <kozlay@comcast. net>
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer is happy to meet you all
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
Date: Tuesday, July 8, 2008, 9:03 AM

Hi Margo,

In much of this cultural area it was, and still is, the custom that in mixed
marriages, boys followed the religion of the father; the girls that of the
mother. Could that explain your data? Have you checked the records for both
churches?

Janet

-----Original Message-----
From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:SLOVAK- ROOTS@ yahoogroups.
com]
On
Behalf Of Margo Smith
Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2008 7:43 AM
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer is happy to meet you all

Dobre rano Everyone!
 
Janet's comments about Turocz are right on.  It is a fascinating county in
terms of its history, not to mention beautiful.  In addition, Slovenske
Pravno is along an ancient trade route which extended from the Danube basin
north into what is now Poland.
 
RE: The "Durko" on the photo.  Could it be Jurko, which is a nickname for
Juraj (George)?
 
The LDS has microfilmed the "mixed marriage registers" from Slovenske Pravno
which is a gold mine.  In this register, 1 spouse is Catholic and 1 is
Lutheran.  People are identified by name, age, date of marriage, names and
ages of children.  Multiple years available.  They are on the same reels
with the church records.
 
The family I am looking at in the mixed marriage registers has presented a
dilemma.  In the 1860s, the family had 3 children:  Jan, Jozef, and Anna.  
Only Anna appears with her parents in the register.  Why would only 1 of the
children be listed?  The only thing I can think of is that Anna was
Catholic, and the 2 sons might have been Lutherans.  (Yes, there were 3
children who lived to adulthood -- other records verify that.)  Was it
common to raise some children in 1 religion and other children in the
other?  Among Anna's own children, 2 were Lutherans, 2 were Catholic, and 1
I don't know the religion.  Does anyone have any insight on this?
 
Margo

--- On Mon, 7/7/08, Janet Kozlay <kozlay@comcast. net> wrote:

From: Janet Kozlay <kozlay@comcast. net>
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer is happy to meet you all
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
Date: Monday, July 7, 2008, 1:34 PM

Hi Liz and Anabeth,

Rudno (Turoczrudno) is a tiny village just south of Slovenske Pravno. Its
church records will be found with those from Slovenske Pravno.

It should be very interesting to match and combine the Chicago church
records with those from Slovakia. It should make for a very large and
complex family tree. It will be a lot of work, but the results should be
spectacular.

Turócz was a very interesting county for its small size. There was a
relatively high proportion of Germans there, more than its neighboring
counties. It was also an important center for the Evangelical/ Lutheran
church as well as for Slovak nationalism. Ironically, it was also the home
of Lajos Kossuth’s family since the 13th century. Kossuth led Hungary’s
1848-49 war of independence against Austria yet never recognized the
strength and determination of Hungary’s Slovak minority to seek their own
independence from Hungary.

Turócz (Nagy Csepcsény) was the home of my husband’s ancestors, in the
1700s, before they migrated south to the Hungarian Plain. I have had
considerable difficulty tracing the family there. If either of you should
happen to look at records from the 1700s and run into names like Kozlay,
Kozlech, or Kozlik, or anything else beginning with “Kozl,” I would
appreciate hearing.

Janet

Janet

_____

From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:SLOVAK- ROOTS@ yahoogroups.
com]
On
Behalf Of Anabeth Dollins
Sent: Monday, July 07, 2008 12:33 PM
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
Subject: Re: [S-R] This newcomer is happy to meet you all

Hi, Liz --

I spent some time looking at my Trinity Slovak Lutheran Church
(Chicago) microfilms. Found a bunch of records on Kuka, Klein, and
Svec families, which I'll send you as a separate email. There are lots
and lots of Mizialkos and Zvonar family records -- I didn't copy any
of those records since there are so many.

In the records, the Klein family that you mentioned is from Rudno;
Zuzanna's last name is spelled Derer, not Direr. And another of your
Zuzannas is Fontani in the records, not Fontana.

Interesting to note that while your Klein family and the one in my
database are not the same, they're both from Rudno. Wonder whether
they're related.

Anabeth Dollins

On Sun, Jul 6, 2008 at 2:24 PM, Elizabeth Tjomsland
<e_tjomsland@ <mailto:e_tjomsland %40yahoo. com> yahoo.com> wrote:
> Hello, my name is Liz. I joined this group recently, because I thought I
> might get some pointers on my genealogy research. I'm a novice who has
been
> working from bits and pieces of information found in the paperwork of my
> parents after they passed on. All the folks from previous generations are
> gone, so there is no one left to ask. The following is what I do know at
> this point.
>
> My paternal grandfather, Juraj Kuka (1885-1961), came from Slovenske
> Pravno,Martin Turciansky Svaety. He was very certain that there was no
> change in the surname spelling.
> Parents: Juraj Kuka(1843-1905) and Suzanna Fontana(1859- 1941).
> Siblings: Jan, Jozef (m. Irena Kollar), Amelia (m. Paul Podmajersky) ,
> Suzanna (m. George Durkovic, I think).
> My grandfather married Suzanna Klein(1889-1934) . Even though the name
sounds
> Germanic, she insisted that she was Slovak. Her parents were Jozef
> Klein(1869-1934) and Suzanna Direr (1864-1942) and they supposedly had a
farm
> in Slovakia which was eventually confiscated by the Communists.
>
> My maternal grandmother, Alzbeta Zvonar,(1892- 1935) came from Brezova.
> Parents: Martin Zvonar and Katarina Mizialko (1862-1929)
> Siblings: Matej (1887-1887), Stefan (1888 - ?), Judita (1896-1902) and
> Martin (1905 - ?).
> My grandmother married Louis (Alois) Svec in Chicago. I know next to
nothing
> about him. He supposedly ran away from home at the age of 17, came to the
> U.S. and had little contact with his family. His parents were Jozef Svec
and
> Mary Rovnanski.
>
> My maternal great grandmother was Katarina Mizialko from Brezova.
> Parents: Stefan Mizialko(b.1820- ?) and Alzbeta Chvascula(b. 1822-?).
> Siblings: Stefan (1847-?), Matej, Jan, and Suzanna 1856-?)(m Samuel Nosko)
> She married Martin Zvonar in 1886, who apparently came to the U.S. on
> several occasions to work the coal mines in Pennsylvania. She immigrated
to
> the U.S. after her husband died.
>
> Everyone that immigrated settled in Chicago or surrounding area and, with
> the exception of Louis Svec and his parents, were Lutheran (Trinity Slovak
> Lutheran Church).
>
> My dad's name was George Julius, however, on the back of a photograph, I
see
> that his mother wrote his name as "Durko". Is this indicative of
something?
> Also wrote the middle name of my uncle as "Ludwig" (Louis). Is this just a
> dialect issue or ???? All the other "Georges" in his family were Juraj.
>
> I will welcome any and all comments.... .anything that might help me
untangle
> my roots.
>
> Many Thanks.....Regards, Liz
>
>

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Dear Margo,

I am totally unfamiliar with Samuel Mikovini's maps. This news is very
exciting. Where are the maps available? Does he include the names of the
owners of the farmsteads? That would be absolutely too good to be true, so I
am not holding my breath.

When Kozlay made his trip to Turocz in 1844 he said he was surprised to
learn that the land his family had owned in Nagy Csepcseny was still called
“Kozlayo csaska,“ meaning Kozlay property. It is this one statement that has
made me believe there might be some record of real estate transactions when
the family left for the south. There might also be court records. But that
would take someone with much better access to records than is available to
us on microfilm. Vladimir Bohinc has told me that he would have such access.


Court and official county records were very rich when looking for
information about the family in Jasz-Nagykun-Szolnok megye. Thanks to my
good friend Lajos Reich, in Budapest, we received a five-page report on what
was found there. He is a frequent contributor to both Slovak and Hungarian
message boards and forums and is an invaluable resource. Because he had a
high governmental position during the Communist era, he knows important
people all over Hungary, and he knows how to gently twist arms to get
information.

I strongly suspect that none of the family was left behind when they moved.
He did not mention meeting with anyone there from that side of the family.
In fact, all of his visiting was with relatives of his step-mother,
Zsuzsanna Ruttkay, who was also related to the Kossuths through her own
step-mother, whom he also visited. Her own mother was a Szocsovszky, but he
never mentioned that name either. Those families, of course, were all
nobles, dating way back in Turocz.

He stated very clearly, several times, that he descended from “an old noble
family." Yet I have not seen the name in listings of Turocz nobility. There
are very, very few references in any of the church records to Kozlay (and
variations) or Kozlik. Most of them appear only as witnesses, which of
course are genealogically pretty useless. Yet the “Kozlay“ entries suggest
nobility (D., N., or D.N.), while the “Kozlik“ ones do not.  There is a
single intriguing 1792 death notice in Ivancina for “Joannes Kozik, lanio
Lovinobanensis,“ age 47. Ivancina was the church for residents of Nagy
Csepcseny. The notice states that he died in the baths at Stubnya! He is
clearly related, as the Koziks lived in Lovinobana (Lonyabanya) in Nograd
megye, and they were butchers (lanio). There seems to be little reason for
this notice to appear in the Ivancina records unless he had been born there
and was perhaps visiting relatives at the time. Yet I find no firm birth
record for him. There was a Johannes, son of Michaelis Kozlik, baptized
there in 1752, but this is seven years off--unless his age at death was
misstated.

The marriage record for the father of great-grandfather Kozlay says that his
father was Samuel. The only reference I have found for Samuel (lanio) was a
death notice in Szirak (in Nograd) that said he died in 1797, age 38, and
was born in Szirak. Yet the diary says that it was his grandfather who moved
from Turocz to the “Hungarian plain“ during the reign of Maria Teresia. So
it may be an error to have said he was born in Szirak.

Were Samuel and Johannes brothers? Unfortunately, it is the early records
for Lovinobana/Lonyabanya that are missing. They likely could have answered
these many questions. But we have to work with what we have.

Have you ever run into the name Murin? There is a marriage record in
Ivancina for Anna Kozljk and Georgius Murin of Toth-Pronensis in 1741.

Those old records are so hard to read! But I have been through them many
times, and I don't think I've missed anything. There are lots of Kozols, but
I don't think they are related. There are way too many of them.

I hope this hasn't been too boring. Obviously this has been a great source
of frustration. I have tried to verify everything in the diary, and for the
most part I have been successful. But the issue of whether the family was in
fact noble and when and who made the move from Turocz to Nograd remains an
unsolved mystery. Were Kozlay and Kozlik the same? Importantly, I found two
entries for Samuel in Szirak, married to Susanna Massanyi, that used the
Kozlay name: witnesses to a baptism, Samuel Kozlay and Susanna Massanyi in
1795, and the death of Susanna Massanyi, widow of Samuel Kozele, in 1800.
These were great-grandfather Kozlay's grandparents. This matches the entry
for the death of Samuel Kozik in 1797. This seems to imply that both names
were used when they lived in Nograd! Yet the Kozlay name was not resurrected
until great-grandfather Kozlay began using it, probably in the 1840s.

Why do the Kozlay entries imply nobility and the Kozliks do not? Were they
butchers in Turocz also?

If your eyes glaze over during all this, that's all right. But it helps me
to pull my data together and organize what I have. It also helps me to
figure out what information I need to send to Vladimir if and when I decide
to hire him.

Thank you for urging me to get back to the book. If I have a legacy at all,
it will be that book. But that truly will mean cutting back severely on the
research I am doing for others, which is so much fun!

Please let me know about the maps.

Best regards,
Janet





-----Original Message-----
From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Margo Smith
Sent: Thursday, July 17, 2008 10:36 PM
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer... Lichner family

Janet, the "diary" you have is a valuable and precious resource!  You must
keep your focus on finishing this project.  (Sometimes, I need to be
reminded about focus also.)
 
Yes, Rebro's book is in Slovak.  And I don't read the language.  What I did
was go through the book page by page and photocopy all pages that mentioned
my villages and a few other topics I could recognize.  When a cousin visited
from SK, I cornered him and pleaded that he read (translate) for me.  He
tired of that pretty quickly, so he took my photocopies and had them
translated.  Nagy Csepcin is not one of my villages, but I did photocopy all
the charts, so I' ll look for that when I get  back to IL and let you know. 
You probably should remind me the middle of next month.
 
Are you familiar with the 1730s maps by Samuel Mikovini?  He did 2 maps of
Turocz.  There is Nagy Csepcin!  For each of the villages he draws in the
individual farmsteads -- I'm pretty certain that he does NOT have the actual
# of farmsteads per village.  E.g. Dubove was always substantially larger
than a lot of the other villages in the southern part of the valley, but is
not shown on the map as being a lot larger.  What I just noticed about N-C
is that behind the farmsteads he has drawn in what looks like an orchard. 
It is the only village with an orchard.  (Check the online tax list for 1715
for N-C.  Look at the description after the list of taxables and see if the
village description mentions an orchard.)
 
Yes, name changes are frustrating.  A lot of my folks had aliases in the
1700s.  You have to check every source for both the surname and the alias --
and you have to find at least 1 record that lists both the surname and the
alias in the same record to know that the names are linked.  I'm still
struggling with the alternate spellings of the names of the godparents and
marriage witnesses, e.g. Macz, Matz, Mac are all the same person.  There are
relatively few surnames where the spelling is standardized (there is
Hungarian, Slovak, and Latin).
 
Yes, my life changed forever when the Slovaks came into my life in 2003.
 
Keep focused!
 
Margo 

--- On Wed, 7/16/08, Janet Kozlay <kozlay@...> wrote:

From: Janet Kozlay <kozlay@...>
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer... Lichner family
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
Date: Wednesday, July 16, 2008, 12:24 PM






Dear Margo,

My husband's great-grandfather was an officer in the 1848-49 war, stationed
at Komarom when the army was finally defeated, and escaped from Hungary to
the U.S. with a group of his fellow officers. He brought with him his “big
book,“ which was not just a diary but also many memoirs, poetry, and
fiction. He continued his diary through his first few years in America.
Added to that was a huge amount of correspondence. Several years ago we had
it all translated from Hungarian. It took two years two translate nearly
1000 pages. It has been my intention to publish (on the Internet) the
translations, to which I am adding extensive annotations. I worked on it
steadily for several years, but I have been very bad at getting back to it.
I got stuck when I came to some that had been written in German for which we
did not have the translations. Well, they have now been done, so I don't
have a good excuse any more. It's just so much more fun helping others with
their research. I need to work on self-discipline and get the job done.
There is very little in English that relates to the daily life of the
well-to-do in 19th-century Hungary. It also gives insight into the
relationship between the serfs and the estate managers and other interesting
topics. (Included is some very racy stuff regarding sexual exploits, so racy
that my translator didn't want to translate it in detail, which I insisted
on. They were a very free-wheeling bunch about sex, both men and women.) It
would be terribly sad if I never finished it.

Of course I have also done a lot of work researching the family. But the
transitional period between Turocz and Nograd is very hazy, mainly because
relevant church records have been lost. Trying to make a connection is
complicated also because the family used more than one name. I think the
family was known as Kozlik and/or a form of Kozlay in Turocz, but so far I
have found almost no firm connections. I have considered hiring Vladimir
Bohinc, who says it would be an interesting project, but it would also be
very expensive research.

I certainly agree that that area of Slovakia is very beautiful. We drove up
there from Hungary, and the mountains and forests were lovely.
Great-grandfather' s trip in 1844 was in mid-winter, which I can't imagine.
He had to exchange his horses in Besztercebanya (Banska Bystrica) for ones
that were familiar with mountainous terrain, and he did complain about the
cold. Whatever made him choose that season for long-distance traveling is
beyond me.

How wonderful it is that you have been able to find relatives there today.
I'm sure we will never be that fortunate. But I was surprised this year to
discover descendants of great-grandfather Kozlay's mother, and they have
worked out an extensive genealogy of the family. It was most interesting
that although Kozlay's father and grandfather both married into that family,
neither of the marriages appeared in the family tree. So I have been able to
send them significant information.

Is the book you recommended only in Slovak? I do not know the language at
all, but I am always up for learning more.

Best regards, Janet


-----Original Message-----
From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com]
On
Behalf Of Margo Smith
Sent: Wednesday, July 16, 2008 10:52 AM
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer... Lichner family

Janet, yes, there were a lot of Lichners in Turocz.  My husband's great aunt
(an immigrant from Kal'amenova in the 1920s) told me that her Lichners (her
mother's ancestors) had "come across the mountains after the Napoleonic
Wars."  The 1715 tax list shows that there were Lichners in Turocz at that
time, so it wouldn't surprise me if Aunt Anna's chronology was off.
 
Yes, after the Turks were expelled, a bunch of folks from the north migrated
south to occupy that vacated territory.  Most branches of my husband's
family was in Turocz back into the 1600s and stayed there.  He has cousins
there still.
 
Lucky you to have the diary of your husband's great-grandfather!  Have you
considered publishing it?
 
Yes, I have visited Turocz (now Turiec) 3 times between 2003-2006.   The
principal crop is cereal grain.  Increased logging in the forests of the
Mala Fatras to the west.  Everyone, or so it seems, has a garden plot where
they grow potatoes and other veggies.  I particularly liked seeing the apple
trees growing along the roadsides -- good use of space.  No, I did not get
to Sklabina, but we did visit the castles at Orava and Bojnice in adjacent
counties -- and the ruins of Zniev in Turocz.  Next trip has the ruins of
the castle at Blatnica on my itinerary because my husband has ancestors from
there also.
 
I wanted to visit Zniev because my husband's grandfather had told me about
seeing them from Kal'amenova when he was growing up.  With binoculars, I
searched unsuccessfully for the ruins from the valley floor.  Then I found a
map of hiking trails which showed the location and way to the ruins.  Once I
got up there I realized that the forest had grown up and obscured the ruins
in the century between the time that the grandfather had lived in
Kal'amenova and my trip. 
 
Potatoes are a New World domesticate.  They were cultivated in Slovakia
starting in about the 1770s in response to a famine.
 
Check out Karol Rebro's book Ubarska regulacia Marie Terezie a poddanske
upravy Jozefa II Na Slovensku.  You can get it on interlibrary loan.  If my
memory is correct, there are tables which list the villages and whether they
are good or poor land.  If you remind me when I get back to IL after Aug.
12, I will look up your villages for you.  My recollection is that Turiec
was entirely in the 3 best classes of land.
 
Margo

--- On Fri, 7/11/08, Janet Kozlay <kozlay@comcast. net> wrote:

From: Janet Kozlay <kozlay@comcast. net>
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer... Lichner family
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
Date: Friday, July 11, 2008, 4:00 AM

Margo,

Note in the Radix Index (www.radixindex. com) how many Lichners show up in
villages in Turocz--Tot- Prona, Turocz-Szent- Marton, Zsambokret, Stubnya,
even my village of interest, Nagy-Csepcseny. Then you see them show up in
places to the south--Beszterceban ya, Selmecbanya, Balassagyarmat,
Endrefalva. I have seen in my own research many, many families (both peasant
and noble) from Turocz who moved south, often to Nograd. Most of this
migration seemed to take place in the late 1700s and early 1800s. My
husband's family was a part of this pattern, going first to Nograd, then to
northern Pest, and finally ending up in Jasz-Nagykun- Szolnok.

According to the extensive diary of my husband's great-grandfather, who
visited his relatives in Turocz in 1844, the land was very poor for
agriculture, with potatoes being a main crop. This may help explain why so
many left.

It sounds like you have also visited the area. Did you get to see the castle
at Sklabina? That was a highlight of our trip.

Janet

-----Original Message-----
From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:SLOVAK- ROOTS@ yahoogroups.
com]
On
Behalf Of Margo Smith
Sent: Thursday, July 10, 2008 3:11 PM
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer is happy to meet you all

Thank you for your suggestion, Janet.  Yes, I checked both Catholic and
Lutheran church records for Slovenske Pravno and found only the daughter. 
It could be an explanation.  The Lichners (father) were Lutheran.  Maybe I
should look for an adjacent Lutheran parish and check that one.  The family
lived in the hamlet of Kal'amenova, but attended church and school in
Slovenske Pravno.

--- On Tue, 7/8/08, Janet Kozlay <kozlay@comcast. net> wrote:

From: Janet Kozlay <kozlay@comcast. net>
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer is happy to meet you all
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
Date: Tuesday, July 8, 2008, 9:03 AM

Hi Margo,

In much of this cultural area it was, and still is, the custom that in mixed
marriages, boys followed the religion of the father; the girls that of the
mother. Could that explain your data? Have you checked the records for both
churches?

Janet

-----Original Message-----
From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:SLOVAK- ROOTS@ yahoogroups.
com]
On
Behalf Of Margo Smith
Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2008 7:43 AM
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer is happy to meet you all

Dobre rano Everyone!
 
Janet's comments about Turocz are right on.  It is a fascinating county in
terms of its history, not to mention beautiful.  In addition, Slovenske
Pravno is along an ancient trade route which extended from the Danube basin
north into what is now Poland.
 
RE: The "Durko" on the photo.  Could it be Jurko, which is a nickname for
Juraj (George)?
 
The LDS has microfilmed the "mixed marriage registers" from Slovenske Pravno
which is a gold mine.  In this register, 1 spouse is Catholic and 1 is
Lutheran.  People are identified by name, age, date of marriage, names and
ages of children.  Multiple years available.  They are on the same reels
with the church records.
 
The family I am looking at in the mixed marriage registers has presented a
dilemma.  In the 1860s, the family had 3 children:  Jan, Jozef, and Anna.  
Only Anna appears with her parents in the register.  Why would only 1 of the
children be listed?  The only thing I can think of is that Anna was
Catholic, and the 2 sons might have been Lutherans.  (Yes, there were 3
children who lived to adulthood -- other records verify that.)  Was it
common to raise some children in 1 religion and other children in the
other?  Among Anna's own children, 2 were Lutherans, 2 were Catholic, and 1
I don't know the religion.  Does anyone have any insight on this?
 
Margo

--- On Mon, 7/7/08, Janet Kozlay <kozlay@comcast. net> wrote:

From: Janet Kozlay <kozlay@comcast. net>
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer is happy to meet you all
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
Date: Monday, July 7, 2008, 1:34 PM

Hi Liz and Anabeth,

Rudno (Turoczrudno) is a tiny village just south of Slovenske Pravno. Its
church records will be found with those from Slovenske Pravno.

It should be very interesting to match and combine the Chicago church
records with those from Slovakia. It should make for a very large and
complex family tree. It will be a lot of work, but the results should be
spectacular.

Turócz was a very interesting county for its small size. There was a
relatively high proportion of Germans there, more than its neighboring
counties. It was also an important center for the Evangelical/ Lutheran
church as well as for Slovak nationalism. Ironically, it was also the home
of Lajos Kossuth’s family since the 13th century. Kossuth led Hungary’s
1848-49 war of independence against Austria yet never recognized the
strength and determination of Hungary’s Slovak minority to seek their own
independence from Hungary.

Turócz (Nagy Csepcsény) was the home of my husband’s ancestors, in the
1700s, before they migrated south to the Hungarian Plain. I have had
considerable difficulty tracing the family there. If either of you should
happen to look at records from the 1700s and run into names like Kozlay,
Kozlech, or Kozlik, or anything else beginning with “Kozl,” I would
appreciate hearing.

Janet

Janet

_____

From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:SLOVAK- ROOTS@ yahoogroups.
com]
On
Behalf Of Anabeth Dollins
Sent: Monday, July 07, 2008 12:33 PM
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
Subject: Re: [S-R] This newcomer is happy to meet you all

Hi, Liz --

I spent some time looking at my Trinity Slovak Lutheran Church
(Chicago) microfilms. Found a bunch of records on Kuka, Klein, and
Svec families, which I'll send you as a separate email. There are lots
and lots of Mizialkos and Zvonar family records -- I didn't copy any
of those records since there are so many.

In the records, the Klein family that you mentioned is from Rudno;
Zuzanna's last name is spelled Derer, not Direr. And another of your
Zuzannas is Fontani in the records, not Fontana.

Interesting to note that while your Klein family and the one in my
database are not the same, they're both from Rudno. Wonder whether
they're related.

Anabeth Dollins

On Sun, Jul 6, 2008 at 2:24 PM, Elizabeth Tjomsland
<e_tjomsland@ <mailto:e_tjomsland %40yahoo. com> yahoo.com> wrote:
> Hello, my name is Liz. I joined this group recently, because I thought I
> might get some pointers on my genealogy research. I'm a novice who has
been
> working from bits and pieces of information found in the paperwork of my
> parents after they passed on. All the folks from previous generations are
> gone, so there is no one left to ask. The following is what I do know at
> this point.
>
> My paternal grandfather, Juraj Kuka (1885-1961), came from Slovenske
> Pravno,Martin Turciansky Svaety. He was very certain that there was no
> change in the surname spelling.
> Parents: Juraj Kuka(1843-1905) and Suzanna Fontana(1859- 1941).
> Siblings: Jan, Jozef (m. Irena Kollar), Amelia (m. Paul Podmajersky) ,
> Suzanna (m. George Durkovic, I think).
> My grandfather married Suzanna Klein(1889-1934) . Even though the name
sounds
> Germanic, she insisted that she was Slovak. Her parents were Jozef
> Klein(1869-1934) and Suzanna Direr (1864-1942) and they supposedly had a
farm
> in Slovakia which was eventually confiscated by the Communists.
>
> My maternal grandmother, Alzbeta Zvonar,(1892- 1935) came from Brezova.
> Parents: Martin Zvonar and Katarina Mizialko (1862-1929)
> Siblings: Matej (1887-1887), Stefan (1888 - ?), Judita (1896-1902) and
> Martin (1905 - ?).
> My grandmother married Louis (Alois) Svec in Chicago. I know next to
nothing
> about him. He supposedly ran away from home at the age of 17, came to the
> U.S. and had little contact with his family. His parents were Jozef Svec
and
> Mary Rovnanski.
>
> My maternal great grandmother was Katarina Mizialko from Brezova.
> Parents: Stefan Mizialko(b.1820- ?) and Alzbeta Chvascula(b. 1822-?).
> Siblings: Stefan (1847-?), Matej, Jan, and Suzanna 1856-?)(m Samuel Nosko)
> She married Martin Zvonar in 1886, who apparently came to the U.S. on
> several occasions to work the coal mines in Pennsylvania. She immigrated
to
> the U.S. after her husband died.
>
> Everyone that immigrated settled in Chicago or surrounding area and, with
> the exception of Louis Svec and his parents, were Lutheran (Trinity Slovak
> Lutheran Church).
>
> My dad's name was George Julius, however, on the back of a photograph, I
see
> that his mother wrote his name as "Durko". Is this indicative of
something?
> Also wrote the middle name of my uncle as "Ludwig" (Louis). Is this just a
> dialect issue or ???? All the other "Georges" in his family were Juraj.
>
> I will welcome any and all comments.... .anything that might help me
untangle
> my roots.
>
> Many Thanks.....Regards, Liz
>
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

------------ --------- --------- ------

To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups. yahoo.com/ group/SLOVAK- ROOTS/

To unsubscribe from this group, go to
http://www.yahoogro ups.com/group/ SLOVAK-ROOTS -or- send blank email to
SLOVAK-ROOTS- unsubscribe@ yahoogroups. comYahoo! Groups Links

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

------------ --------- --------- ------

To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups. yahoo.com/ group/SLOVAK- ROOTS/

To unsubscribe from this group, go to
http://www.yahoogro ups.com/group/ SLOVAK-ROOTS -or- send blank email to
SLOVAK-ROOTS- unsubscribe@ yahoogroups. comYahoo! Groups Links

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

------------ --------- --------- ------

To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups. yahoo.com/ group/SLOVAK- ROOTS/

To unsubscribe from this group, go to
http://www.yahoogro ups.com/group/ SLOVAK-ROOTS -or- send blank email to
SLOVAK-ROOTS- unsubscribe@ yahoogroups. comYahoo! Groups Links


















[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


------------------------------------

To visit your group on the web, go to:
     http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SLOVAK-ROOTS/

To unsubscribe from this group, go to
http://www.yahoogroups.com/group/SLOVAK-ROOTS  -or- send  blank email to
SLOVAK-ROOTS-unsubscribe@...! Groups Links

I just found this fascinating account of steerage conditions around 1905 -- many
references to Slovaks.

http://www.gjenvick.com/Steerage/FellowshipOfTheSteerage-1-Intro.html


"Everyone capable of thanksgiving is capable of salvation and eternal joy." --
Protopresbyter Alexander Schmemann





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Dear Janet --
 
I hope you will still talk to me.  My husband is at the end of 11 generations of
sturdy serf stock.  The best I could do for him was a couple of members of
village councils, descendants of village founder, 1 miller, 1 blacksmith, 1
furrier.  Some were perpetually obligated to Revay family members.
 
Jan Purgina.  Samuel Mikovini 1700-1750:  Zivot a Dielo.  Bratislava:  Sprava
Geodezie a Kartografie na Slovensku, 1958.  Mapa 30 (entire Turiec County) and
Mapa 21 (south part of Turiec County).  Bring your magnifying glass.  No, it
does not provide the names of any property owners.  But it is soooo cool to see
that the ancestral villages existed then, and the "roads" between them. 
Actually, it seems that most of the Turiec villages existed back to around 1250.
 
Have you looked at LDS microfilm # 0632504 which are documents on the nobility
investigations of Turiec County from 1723-1784?
 
Also Janos Ilessy.  "Turocz varmegye" in Az 1754-55 evi orszagos Nemesi
Osszeiras.  Budapest, 1902 pp. 114-117  List of Turiec noble families.
 
I don't recall any Murrins, but I wasn't looking.
 
I have found that ages reported at the time of death were often wrong.
 
Witnesses are hardly "useless."  They substantiate social networks.  It was not
at all uncommon for families linked first by baptismal sponsorship later became
linked by marriage.  Example, the children of compadres later marry.  Also
sometimes when it is hard to tell if a certain child belongs to a particular
family, one can see that all of the prospective siblings have the same
godparents.
 
I have spent so much time with the parish records from Turciansky Dur, Slovenske
Pravno, and Turciansky Michal (includes Ivancina) that I feel like I could
recite them from memory!
 
The prevalence, or lack thereof, of a surname can increase or decrease quickly
in just a couple of generations depending on the luck of the draw, so to speak. 
How many sons does a couple have and do they survive to have sons of their own? 
If the family has a bunch of daughters and no sons who live to adulthood, the
surname dies out.  A couple of things made a huge impression on me:  families
had many children assuming both parents were living, but a lot of the children
died; lots of twins too.
 
Did I cover everything?
 
Margo

--- On Fri, 7/18/08, Janet Kozlay <kozlay@...> wrote:

From: Janet Kozlay <kozlay@...>
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer... Lichner family
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
Date: Friday, July 18, 2008, 4:32 PM






Dear Margo,

I am totally unfamiliar with Samuel Mikovini's maps. This news is very
exciting. Where are the maps available? Does he include the names of the
owners of the farmsteads? That would be absolutely too good to be true, so I
am not holding my breath.

When Kozlay made his trip to Turocz in 1844 he said he was surprised to
learn that the land his family had owned in Nagy Csepcseny was still called
“Kozlayo csaska,“ meaning Kozlay property. It is this one statement that has
made me believe there might be some record of real estate transactions when
the family left for the south. There might also be court records. But that
would take someone with much better access to records than is available to
us on microfilm. Vladimir Bohinc has told me that he would have such access.

Court and official county records were very rich when looking for
information about the family in Jasz-Nagykun- Szolnok megye. Thanks to my
good friend Lajos Reich, in Budapest, we received a five-page report on what
was found there. He is a frequent contributor to both Slovak and Hungarian
message boards and forums and is an invaluable resource. Because he had a
high governmental position during the Communist era, he knows important
people all over Hungary, and he knows how to gently twist arms to get
information.

I strongly suspect that none of the family was left behind when they moved.
He did not mention meeting with anyone there from that side of the family.
In fact, all of his visiting was with relatives of his step-mother,
Zsuzsanna Ruttkay, who was also related to the Kossuths through her own
step-mother, whom he also visited. Her own mother was a Szocsovszky, but he
never mentioned that name either. Those families, of course, were all
nobles, dating way back in Turocz.

He stated very clearly, several times, that he descended from “an old noble
family." Yet I have not seen the name in listings of Turocz nobility. There
are very, very few references in any of the church records to Kozlay (and
variations) or Kozlik. Most of them appear only as witnesses, which of
course are genealogically pretty useless. Yet the “Kozlay“ entries suggest
nobility (D., N., or D.N.), while the “Kozlik“ ones do not. There is a
single intriguing 1792 death notice in Ivancina for “Joannes Kozik, lanio
Lovinobanensis,“ age 47. Ivancina was the church for residents of Nagy
Csepcseny. The notice states that he died in the baths at Stubnya! He is
clearly related, as the Koziks lived in Lovinobana (Lonyabanya) in Nograd
megye, and they were butchers (lanio). There seems to be little reason for
this notice to appear in the Ivancina records unless he had been born there
and was perhaps visiting relatives at the time. Yet I find no firm birth
record for him. There was a Johannes, son of Michaelis Kozlik, baptized
there in 1752, but this is seven years off--unless his age at death was
misstated.

The marriage record for the father of great-grandfather Kozlay says that his
father was Samuel. The only reference I have found for Samuel (lanio) was a
death notice in Szirak (in Nograd) that said he died in 1797, age 38, and
was born in Szirak. Yet the diary says that it was his grandfather who moved
from Turocz to the “Hungarian plain“ during the reign of Maria Teresia. So
it may be an error to have said he was born in Szirak.

Were Samuel and Johannes brothers? Unfortunately, it is the early records
for Lovinobana/Lonyaban ya that are missing. They likely could have answered
these many questions. But we have to work with what we have.

Have you ever run into the name Murin? There is a marriage record in
Ivancina for Anna Kozljk and Georgius Murin of Toth-Pronensis in 1741.

Those old records are so hard to read! But I have been through them many
times, and I don't think I've missed anything. There are lots of Kozols, but
I don't think they are related. There are way too many of them.

I hope this hasn't been too boring. Obviously this has been a great source
of frustration. I have tried to verify everything in the diary, and for the
most part I have been successful. But the issue of whether the family was in
fact noble and when and who made the move from Turocz to Nograd remains an
unsolved mystery. Were Kozlay and Kozlik the same? Importantly, I found two
entries for Samuel in Szirak, married to Susanna Massanyi, that used the
Kozlay name: witnesses to a baptism, Samuel Kozlay and Susanna Massanyi in
1795, and the death of Susanna Massanyi, widow of Samuel Kozele, in 1800.
These were great-grandfather Kozlay's grandparents. This matches the entry
for the death of Samuel Kozik in 1797. This seems to imply that both names
were used when they lived in Nograd! Yet the Kozlay name was not resurrected
until great-grandfather Kozlay began using it, probably in the 1840s.

Why do the Kozlay entries imply nobility and the Kozliks do not? Were they
butchers in Turocz also?

If your eyes glaze over during all this, that's all right. But it helps me
to pull my data together and organize what I have. It also helps me to
figure out what information I need to send to Vladimir if and when I decide
to hire him.

Thank you for urging me to get back to the book. If I have a legacy at all,
it will be that book. But that truly will mean cutting back severely on the
research I am doing for others, which is so much fun!

Please let me know about the maps.

Best regards,
Janet

-----Original Message-----
From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com] On
Behalf Of Margo Smith
Sent: Thursday, July 17, 2008 10:36 PM
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer... Lichner family

Janet, the "diary" you have is a valuable and precious resource!  You must
keep your focus on finishing this project.  (Sometimes, I need to be
reminded about focus also.)
 
Yes, Rebro's book is in Slovak.  And I don't read the language.  What I did
was go through the book page by page and photocopy all pages that mentioned
my villages and a few other topics I could recognize.  When a cousin visited
from SK, I cornered him and pleaded that he read (translate) for me.  He
tired of that pretty quickly, so he took my photocopies and had them
translated.  Nagy Csepcin is not one of my villages, but I did photocopy all
the charts, so I' ll look for that when I get  back to IL and let you know. 
You probably should remind me the middle of next month.
 
Are you familiar with the 1730s maps by Samuel Mikovini?  He did 2 maps of
Turocz.  There is Nagy Csepcin!  For each of the villages he draws in the
individual farmsteads -- I'm pretty certain that he does NOT have the actual
# of farmsteads per village.  E.g. Dubove was always substantially larger
than a lot of the other villages in the southern part of the valley, but is
not shown on the map as being a lot larger.  What I just noticed about N-C
is that behind the farmsteads he has drawn in what looks like an orchard. 
It is the only village with an orchard.  (Check the online tax list for 1715
for N-C.  Look at the description after the list of taxables and see if the
village description mentions an orchard.)
 
Yes, name changes are frustrating.  A lot of my folks had aliases in the
1700s.  You have to check every source for both the surname and the alias --
and you have to find at least 1 record that lists both the surname and the
alias in the same record to know that the names are linked.  I'm still
struggling with the alternate spellings of the names of the godparents and
marriage witnesses, e.g. Macz, Matz, Mac are all the same person.  There are
relatively few surnames where the spelling is standardized (there is
Hungarian, Slovak, and Latin).
 
Yes, my life changed forever when the Slovaks came into my life in 2003.
 
Keep focused!
 
Margo 

--- On Wed, 7/16/08, Janet Kozlay <kozlay@comcast. net> wrote:

From: Janet Kozlay <kozlay@comcast. net>
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer... Lichner family
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
Date: Wednesday, July 16, 2008, 12:24 PM

Dear Margo,

My husband's great-grandfather was an officer in the 1848-49 war, stationed
at Komarom when the army was finally defeated, and escaped from Hungary to
the U.S. with a group of his fellow officers. He brought with him his “big
book,“ which was not just a diary but also many memoirs, poetry, and
fiction. He continued his diary through his first few years in America.
Added to that was a huge amount of correspondence. Several years ago we had
it all translated from Hungarian. It took two years two translate nearly
1000 pages. It has been my intention to publish (on the Internet) the
translations, to which I am adding extensive annotations. I worked on it
steadily for several years, but I have been very bad at getting back to it.
I got stuck when I came to some that had been written in German for which we
did not have the translations. Well, they have now been done, so I don't
have a good excuse any more. It's just so much more fun helping others with
their research. I need to work on self-discipline and get the job done.
There is very little in English that relates to the daily life of the
well-to-do in 19th-century Hungary. It also gives insight into the
relationship between the serfs and the estate managers and other interesting
topics. (Included is some very racy stuff regarding sexual exploits, so racy
that my translator didn't want to translate it in detail, which I insisted
on. They were a very free-wheeling bunch about sex, both men and women.) It
would be terribly sad if I never finished it.

Of course I have also done a lot of work researching the family. But the
transitional period between Turocz and Nograd is very hazy, mainly because
relevant church records have been lost. Trying to make a connection is
complicated also because the family used more than one name. I think the
family was known as Kozlik and/or a form of Kozlay in Turocz, but so far I
have found almost no firm connections. I have considered hiring Vladimir
Bohinc, who says it would be an interesting project, but it would also be
very expensive research.

I certainly agree that that area of Slovakia is very beautiful. We drove up
there from Hungary, and the mountains and forests were lovely.
Great-grandfather' s trip in 1844 was in mid-winter, which I can't imagine.
He had to exchange his horses in Besztercebanya (Banska Bystrica) for ones
that were familiar with mountainous terrain, and he did complain about the
cold. Whatever made him choose that season for long-distance traveling is
beyond me.

How wonderful it is that you have been able to find relatives there today.
I'm sure we will never be that fortunate. But I was surprised this year to
discover descendants of great-grandfather Kozlay's mother, and they have
worked out an extensive genealogy of the family. It was most interesting
that although Kozlay's father and grandfather both married into that family,
neither of the marriages appeared in the family tree. So I have been able to
send them significant information.

Is the book you recommended only in Slovak? I do not know the language at
all, but I am always up for learning more.

Best regards, Janet

-----Original Message-----
From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:SLOVAK- ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com]
On
Behalf Of Margo Smith
Sent: Wednesday, July 16, 2008 10:52 AM
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer... Lichner family

Janet, yes, there were a lot of Lichners in Turocz.  My husband's great aunt
(an immigrant from Kal'amenova in the 1920s) told me that her Lichners (her
mother's ancestors) had "come across the mountains after the Napoleonic
Wars."  The 1715 tax list shows that there were Lichners in Turocz at that
time, so it wouldn't surprise me if Aunt Anna's chronology was off.
 
Yes, after the Turks were expelled, a bunch of folks from the north migrated
south to occupy that vacated territory.  Most branches of my husband's
family was in Turocz back into the 1600s and stayed there.  He has cousins
there still.
 
Lucky you to have the diary of your husband's great-grandfather!  Have you
considered publishing it?
 
Yes, I have visited Turocz (now Turiec) 3 times between 2003-2006.   The
principal crop is cereal grain.  Increased logging in the forests of the
Mala Fatras to the west.  Everyone, or so it seems, has a garden plot where
they grow potatoes and other veggies.  I particularly liked seeing the apple
trees growing along the roadsides -- good use of space.  No, I did not get
to Sklabina, but we did visit the castles at Orava and Bojnice in adjacent
counties -- and the ruins of Zniev in Turocz.  Next trip has the ruins of
the castle at Blatnica on my itinerary because my husband has ancestors from
there also.
 
I wanted to visit Zniev because my husband's grandfather had told me about
seeing them from Kal'amenova when he was growing up.  With binoculars, I
searched unsuccessfully for the ruins from the valley floor.  Then I found a
map of hiking trails which showed the location and way to the ruins.  Once I
got up there I realized that the forest had grown up and obscured the ruins
in the century between the time that the grandfather had lived in
Kal'amenova and my trip. 
 
Potatoes are a New World domesticate.  They were cultivated in Slovakia
starting in about the 1770s in response to a famine.
 
Check out Karol Rebro's book Ubarska regulacia Marie Terezie a poddanske
upravy Jozefa II Na Slovensku.  You can get it on interlibrary loan.  If my
memory is correct, there are tables which list the villages and whether they
are good or poor land.  If you remind me when I get back to IL after Aug.
12, I will look up your villages for you.  My recollection is that Turiec
was entirely in the 3 best classes of land.
 
Margo

--- On Fri, 7/11/08, Janet Kozlay <kozlay@comcast. net> wrote:

From: Janet Kozlay <kozlay@comcast. net>
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer... Lichner family
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
Date: Friday, July 11, 2008, 4:00 AM

Margo,

Note in the Radix Index (www.radixindex. com) how many Lichners show up in
villages in Turocz--Tot- Prona, Turocz-Szent- Marton, Zsambokret, Stubnya,
even my village of interest, Nagy-Csepcseny. Then you see them show up in
places to the south--Beszterceban ya, Selmecbanya, Balassagyarmat,
Endrefalva. I have seen in my own research many, many families (both peasant
and noble) from Turocz who moved south, often to Nograd. Most of this
migration seemed to take place in the late 1700s and early 1800s. My
husband's family was a part of this pattern, going first to Nograd, then to
northern Pest, and finally ending up in Jasz-Nagykun- Szolnok.

According to the extensive diary of my husband's great-grandfather, who
visited his relatives in Turocz in 1844, the land was very poor for
agriculture, with potatoes being a main crop. This may help explain why so
many left.

It sounds like you have also visited the area. Did you get to see the castle
at Sklabina? That was a highlight of our trip.

Janet

-----Original Message-----
From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:SLOVAK- ROOTS@ yahoogroups.
com]
On
Behalf Of Margo Smith
Sent: Thursday, July 10, 2008 3:11 PM
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer is happy to meet you all

Thank you for your suggestion, Janet.  Yes, I checked both Catholic and
Lutheran church records for Slovenske Pravno and found only the daughter. 
It could be an explanation.  The Lichners (father) were Lutheran.  Maybe I
should look for an adjacent Lutheran parish and check that one.  The family
lived in the hamlet of Kal'amenova, but attended church and school in
Slovenske Pravno.

--- On Tue, 7/8/08, Janet Kozlay <kozlay@comcast. net> wrote:

From: Janet Kozlay <kozlay@comcast. net>
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer is happy to meet you all
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
Date: Tuesday, July 8, 2008, 9:03 AM

Hi Margo,

In much of this cultural area it was, and still is, the custom that in mixed
marriages, boys followed the religion of the father; the girls that of the
mother. Could that explain your data? Have you checked the records for both
churches?

Janet

-----Original Message-----
From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:SLOVAK- ROOTS@ yahoogroups.
com]
On
Behalf Of Margo Smith
Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2008 7:43 AM
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer is happy to meet you all

Dobre rano Everyone!
 
Janet's comments about Turocz are right on.  It is a fascinating county in
terms of its history, not to mention beautiful.  In addition, Slovenske
Pravno is along an ancient trade route which extended from the Danube basin
north into what is now Poland.
 
RE: The "Durko" on the photo.  Could it be Jurko, which is a nickname for
Juraj (George)?
 
The LDS has microfilmed the "mixed marriage registers" from Slovenske Pravno
which is a gold mine.  In this register, 1 spouse is Catholic and 1 is
Lutheran.  People are identified by name, age, date of marriage, names and
ages of children.  Multiple years available.  They are on the same reels
with the church records.
 
The family I am looking at in the mixed marriage registers has presented a
dilemma.  In the 1860s, the family had 3 children:  Jan, Jozef, and Anna.  
Only Anna appears with her parents in the register.  Why would only 1 of the
children be listed?  The only thing I can think of is that Anna was
Catholic, and the 2 sons might have been Lutherans.  (Yes, there were 3
children who lived to adulthood -- other records verify that.)  Was it
common to raise some children in 1 religion and other children in the
other?  Among Anna's own children, 2 were Lutherans, 2 were Catholic, and 1
I don't know the religion.  Does anyone have any insight on this?
 
Margo

--- On Mon, 7/7/08, Janet Kozlay <kozlay@comcast. net> wrote:

From: Janet Kozlay <kozlay@comcast. net>
Subject: RE: [S-R] This newcomer is happy to meet you all
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
Date: Monday, July 7, 2008, 1:34 PM

Hi Liz and Anabeth,

Rudno (Turoczrudno) is a tiny village just south of Slovenske Pravno. Its
church records will be found with those from Slovenske Pravno.

It should be very interesting to match and combine the Chicago church
records with those from Slovakia. It should make for a very large and
complex family tree. It will be a lot of work, but the results should be
spectacular.

Turócz was a very interesting county for its small size. There was a
relatively high proportion of Germans there, more than its neighboring
counties. It was also an important center for the Evangelical/ Lutheran
church as well as for Slovak nationalism. Ironically, it was also the home
of Lajos Kossuth’s family since the 13th century. Kossuth led Hungary’s
1848-49 war of independence against Austria yet never recognized the
strength and determination of Hungary’s Slovak minority to seek their own
independence from Hungary.

Turócz (Nagy Csepcsény) was the home of my husband’s ancestors, in the
1700s, before they migrated south to the Hungarian Plain. I have had
considerable difficulty tracing the family there. If either of you should
happen to look at records from the 1700s and run into names like Kozlay,
Kozlech, or Kozlik, or anything else beginning with “Kozl,” I would
appreciate hearing.

Janet

Janet

_____

From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:SLOVAK- ROOTS@ yahoogroups.
com]
On
Behalf Of Anabeth Dollins
Sent: Monday, July 07, 2008 12:33 PM
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
Subject: Re: [S-R] This newcomer is happy to meet you all

Hi, Liz --

I spent some time looking at my Trinity Slovak Lutheran Church
(Chicago) microfilms. Found a bunch of records on Kuka, Klein, and
Svec families, which I'll send you as a separate email. There are lots
and lots of Mizialkos and Zvonar family records -- I didn't copy any
of those records since there are so many.

In the records, the Klein family that you mentioned is from Rudno;
Zuzanna's last name is spelled Derer, not Direr. And another of your
Zuzannas is Fontani in the records, not Fontana.

Interesting to note that while your Klein family and the one in my
database are not the same, they're both from Rudno. Wonder whether
they're related.

Anabeth Dollins

On Sun, Jul 6, 2008 at 2:24 PM, Elizabeth Tjomsland
<e_tjomsland@ <mailto:e_tjomsland %40yahoo. com> yahoo.com> wrote:
> Hello, my name is Liz. I joined this group recently, because I thought I
> might get some pointers on my genealogy research. I'm a novice who has
been
> working from bits and pieces of information found in the paperwork of my
> parents after they passed on. All the folks from previous generations are
> gone, so there is no one left to ask. The following is what I do know at
> this point.
>
> My paternal grandfather, Juraj Kuka (1885-1961), came from Slovenske
> Pravno,Martin Turciansky Svaety. He was very certain that there was no
> change in the surname spelling.
> Parents: Juraj Kuka(1843-1905) and Suzanna Fontana(1859- 1941).
> Siblings: Jan, Jozef (m. Irena Kollar), Amelia (m. Paul Podmajersky) ,
> Suzanna (m. George Durkovic, I think).
> My grandfather married Suzanna Klein(1889-1934) . Even though the name
sounds
> Germanic, she insisted that she was Slovak. Her parents were Jozef
> Klein(1869-1934) and Suzanna Direr (1864-1942) and they supposedly had a
farm
> in Slovakia which was eventually confiscated by the Communists.
>
> My maternal grandmother, Alzbeta Zvonar,(1892- 1935) came from Brezova.
> Parents: Martin Zvonar and Katarina Mizialko (1862-1929)
> Siblings: Matej (1887-1887), Stefan (1888 - ?), Judita (1896-1902) and
> Martin (1905 - ?).
> My grandmother married Louis (Alois) Svec in Chicago. I know next to
nothing
> about him. He supposedly ran away from home at the age of 17, came to the
> U.S. and had little contact with his family. His parents were Jozef Svec
and
> Mary Rovnanski.
>
> My maternal great grandmother was Katarina Mizialko from Brezova.
> Parents: Stefan Mizialko(b.1820- ?) and Alzbeta Chvascula(b. 1822-?).
> Siblings: Stefan (1847-?), Matej, Jan, and Suzanna 1856-?)(m Samuel Nosko)
> She married Martin Zvonar in 1886, who apparently came to the U.S. on
> several occasions to work the coal mines in Pennsylvania. She immigrated
to
> the U.S. after her husband died.
>
> Everyone that immigrated settled in Chicago or surrounding area and, with
> the exception of Louis Svec and his parents, were Lutheran (Trinity Slovak
> Lutheran Church).
>
> My dad's name was George Julius, however, on the back of a photograph, I
see
> that his mother wrote his name as "Durko". Is this indicative of
something?
> Also wrote the middle name of my uncle as "Ludwig" (Louis). Is this just a
> dialect issue or ???? All the other "Georges" in his family were Juraj.
>
> I will welcome any and all comments.... .anything that might help me
untangle
> my roots.
>
> Many Thanks.....Regards, Liz
>
>

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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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To unsubscribe from this group, go to
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I have a 14 year old bunch of Czechoslovak Genealogy Society Magazines
along with some of Helene's Slovakia Newsletters.  They have many
interesting articles and photos.  I would like to see someone get them
who can put them to use.

I will mail them to the first person who wants to reimburse for
postage.

I have the following:
Rocenka V1, #1 Yearbook Winter 1992
Nase rodina (Summer 1993, Fall 1993, March 1994, June 1994, September
1994, December 1994, March 1995, June 1995, September 1995)

Slovakia (Fall 1994, Winter 1994, Spring 1995, Fall 1995).

Email me if you want them. D'akujem.
Dave

If anyone has the full email address for Edward Hornick (big_ed321,
partial email address <e_hornick@e...>) could you please send him a
personal message asking him to look at message #20412 here on Slovak
Roots?
Thank you, John Hornick

I see where a Hornick was trying to reach another Hornick.       There is a Joe
HORNACK, in Cleveland, Ohio, with the SLOVAK INSTITUTE there.
      Just go to google, type in  " slovak institute ",  and you will get their
phone# , E-mail address, etc.
                                                   Tom

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Thanks, I will contact him.

--- On Fri, 7/25/08, Tom Geiss <tomfgurka@...> wrote:

From: Tom Geiss <tomfgurka@...>
Subject: [S-R] RE- hORNICK
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
Date: Friday, July 25, 2008, 2:08 PM






I see where a Hornick was trying to reach another Hornick. There is a Joe
HORNACK, in Cleveland, Ohio, with the SLOVAK INSTITUTE there.
Just go to google, type in " slovak institute ", and you will get their phone# ,
E-mail address, etc.
Tom

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


















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Thanks, I will contact him.

--- On Fri, 7/25/08, Tom Geiss <tomfgurka@...> wrote:

From: Tom Geiss <tomfgurka@...>
Subject: [S-R] RE- hORNICK
To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
Date: Friday, July 25, 2008, 2:08 PM






I see where a Hornick was trying to reach another Hornick. There is a Joe
HORNACK, in Cleveland, Ohio, with the SLOVAK INSTITUTE there.
Just go to google, type in " slovak institute ", and you will get their phone# ,
E-mail address, etc.
Tom

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