Has anyone done any dyeing using grapes? And if so, how is it done?
I seem to have an abundance of grapes this year and wonder if this would
work well.


Sonja

-----Original Message-----
From: SCA-Garb@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SCA-Garb@yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of otsisto
Sent: Friday, September 01, 2006 12:47 AM
To: SCA-Garb@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [SCA-Garb] The color purple Re: Dumb question

Probably is was the artists balancing of color in the picture then grape
stain.

-----Original Message-----
I notice that the peasant's robe appears to be the same colour as the
harvest, presumably of grapes.....could this simply be the staining of
some
more expected dun colour of linen in his/her robe?

Adhaniá



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

--- In SCA-Garb@yahoogroups.com, "caelia_the_bold" <caelia_the_bold@...> wrote:
>
> Hi there! I'm trying to update and beautify some of my first scraped-
> together garb and I'm trying to figure out whether tied-on sleeves are
> period for early 15th-century England/Wales.
>
> Thanks in advance!
>
> Caelia

It depends on how they're detachable and how early we're talking about in the
1400s, but
the Simplicity-style ones where it's a bodice and tied-on sleeves with painfully
obvious
ties won't be period for anything I know of. I found some noble portraits from
the mid-to-
late 1400s that looked detachable to me, though. Thing is, you won't be able to
tell they're
tied on or buckled or whatever, for the most part; the fasteners would be
hidden. And the
portraits I found were of the Tudor royal family -- and one clearly looks like
the sleeves
were attached. So I wouldn't say it was common till later in the 1400s.

Here's the caveat. Wales was regarded as kind of a "poorer sister" to England.
At least
earlier in its history, Wales wore what destitute people in England wouldn't
even *consider*
wearing. In that light, detachable sleeves might not have been used for quite a
while more
there and it would have lagged a bit behind England in fashion. Good luck! Isn't
it fun
updating your garb wardrobe? :)

Vangelista

A book that I have just started using (sold on it because he gives a method for
doing your own
measurements without a helper!) is "How To Make Sewing Patterns" by Don McCunn.
He also has a
newsgroup that works with the book.

<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/How-to-Make-Sewing-Patterns/>

The book and reviews can be found at <http://tinyurl.com/r5wpz>

Hope this helps,
Fionnseach

Lente wrote:
> Okay I am looking to get a modern clothing pattern drafting book, I know there
are several out there; that's my dilemna right now so anyone know which is best
and why? I am looking to get a book for drafting patterns to fit me, not some
idealized shape if that helps. I also want to be able to draft patterns for some
clothing that a 1956 Vogue sewing book I have is set up for sewing with. Right
now the one I really want to figure out is the shirtwaist dress that has a built
in gusset in the body pieces, it intrigues me to no end.


--
Keep away from people who try to belittle your ambitions. Small people
always do that, but the really great make you feel that you, too, can
become great.

-Mark Twain

--- In SCA-Garb@yahoogroups.com, "peachyfaun" <peachyfaun@...> wrote:
>
> What can I say? You have saved me from an embarrasing and costly
> mistake, Thank you.
> Tiffany for now

Aw hey, it's not *that* bad. It wouldn't be the end of the world. At events I've
seen way
worse than that (and have *worn* way worse and so I imagine has everybody else
at one
point in their lives). If anybody turned their noses up at you for wearing such
a gown,
phooey on them! But if you're of middling-or-better sewing ability and can get
better
patterns, that's probably better. This one really is pretty out there in terms
of fantasy-ness
and if you care about authenticity, this one won't make you happy. I prefer
authentic
myself, especially if I'm going to devote that kind of time to sewing something.

But the sleeves really are cute if you want to do them on a more authentic
bodice and
skirt. I've gotten Big 3 patterns before just for one or two aspects that were
done well.

Vangelista

There is a good book out that helps with the understanding of how
drafting a pattern works to take a 2 dimensional piece of fabric to fit
a 3 dimensional body - How To Make Sewing Patterns by Donald McCunn. It
includes a method for taking your own measurements without the aid of a
helper - which is what sold me on the book. He covers the basics very
thoroughly and then goes on to demonstrate how you can design your own
clothes. He also covers some methods for moving darts - armscye, bust,
waist, etc. to either get rid of them completely or just to change the
location.

Not affiliated with him, just glad I found the book.

Your servant,
Fionnseach

--
Keep away from people who try to belittle your ambitions. Small people
always do that, but the really great make you feel that you, too, can
become great.

-Mark Twain


--
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.11.7/436 - Release Date: 9/1/2006

I took on an ever so rare commision for a desperate fellow SCAdian and LJer
and the results can be seen here: http://jaie.livejournal.com/1269789.html
The body of the gamorah (sp?) is dark blue linen and the lining is white
linen on the bodice. I have three shimmies to get done as well and she sent
some peacock purple slubbed silk for my own use that is already made into
another gamorah (someone please correct my spelling on this and give me some
links on this garment please??) that I'll post later today.


Bice

de gustibus non est disputandum

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

From what I can see on Amazon (they show samples of the contents pages
and index) this loks like an excellent book.

Rashid

--- In SCA-Garb@yahoogroups.com, Judith Taylor <judith@...> wrote:
>
> A book that I have just started using (sold on it because he gives a
method for doing your own
> measurements without a helper!) is "How To Make Sewing Patterns" by
Don McCunn. He also has a

unclrashid wrote:
*snip*


> Full circle cloaks are for the most part inauthentic and we don't
> have much evidence of them ever being used, except for in the 16th
> century when men wore very short (hip length) full circle cloaks.
> and they wore them draped under one arm and over the other shoulder.
> There are some sculptures of the 15th century which show very full
> cloaks which may be full circle cloaks, but that's hard to prove from
> a photo of a statue.
>
> According to extant garments, half circle cloaks (with or without
> shaped shoulders) seem to have been common in Europe from about 1100
> to 1500.  They usually did not have attached hoods, as separate hoods
> were common and sometimes worn without the cloak.
>
> I have patterns and cutting layouts for cloaks and hoods at this site:
>
> http://www.feoragdubh.eastkingdom.org/GarbWorkshops.php
>
> Rashid


I will agree that the majority of surviving medieval cloaks were
half-circles, but what about the pelicon?  This is one of my all-time
favorite garments.  Scroll down the page to Lady de Northwode:

http://www.whitewinds.co.uk/acatalog/index.html?http%3A//www.whitewinds.co.uk/ac\
atalog/N_to_P.html&CatalogBody

It is a flat garment with a funky buttoned hood. The original garment is
lined with miniver in a vair pattern (squirrel skins and their lighter
bellies), which would be a very thin fur.

Mary Houston has a cutting diagram for the pelicon in "Medieval Costume
in England and France, 13th, 14th and 15th Century." This is an
inexpensive Dover paperback and though it was originally printed in the
mid 1930s, Houston's re-drawings do not suffer from the problems in
Norris-- e.g., her drawings look like real medieval art sources and not
Mary Pickford or Douglas Fairbanks in fancy dress.

ciorstan

You can manipulate fine wire as you do threads for lace making. Look up some
lace making pages and grab a pattern to practice.

Here is a non-sca article about metal lace creation:
http://www.lapidaryjournal.com/feature/nov00str.cfm


----- Original Message -----
From: "C" <chris.johnson@...>
To: <SCA-Garb@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, September 02, 2006 11:56 PM
Subject: [SCA-Garb] Circlet help Please!!!!


> Hi all! I am brand new at costuming, wire working, and any kind of
> jewelry making in general! I am very determined to create something
> beautiful though! :)I was wondering if anyone is able/willing to
> tell me in as much detail as possible how to make a circlet such as
> the one pictured here: http://www.toddalanstudios.com/circlet-
> one.htm or here: http://www.toddalanstudios.com/baronial-crown.htm I
> am guessing the baronial crown is harder so maybe the first one will
> do. I want to make something like that but with more jewels within
> the wire work itself similar to the jewel on the front but occuring
> more often throughout the piece. Any info anyone can give me would
> be great. Supplies etc, pattern techniques, some sort of tutorial
> start to finish ........ anything! The second thing I want to do is
> attach a pair of side cauls to the circlet so cauls and circlet
> would be one piece. Or in such a way that the cauls can easily be
> attached and detached from the circlet which would be even better. I
> would want to work jewels into the lattice work on the side cauls as
> well. The effect I am going for is the one found here:
> http://www.kats-hats.co.uk/ This artist has somehow used wire and
> covered it in cloth for her cirlet and then did the same with the
> side cauls and then glued gems on them all. I want to do the cirlet
> and side cauls all with wire and gems if possible! Anyone have any
> ideas? Perhaps it's too ambitious for me? I have searched everywhere
> for crown making, tiara making tips etc.... This site has some good
> ones, but nothing for the brand new costumer such as: how to draw a
> lace pattern like the circlet in the first picture and then follow
> it etc... I'd love some help. Thanks to all!!!! :)
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Helpful email addresses:
>  Subscribe:    SCA-Garb-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
>  Unsubscribe:  SCA-Garb-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
> Main group web page:
>  http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SCA-Garb
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>

Sorry, forgot to add this link too:
http://medievalbeads.com/docs/items/gallery-pearl-filet.html

----- Original Message -----
From: "Chiara Francesca" <chiara@...>
To: <SCA-Garb@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, September 03, 2006 3:51 PM
Subject: Re: [SCA-Garb] Circlet help Please!!!!


> You can manipulate fine wire as you do threads for lace making. Look up
> some lace making pages and grab a pattern to practice.
>
> Here is a non-sca article about metal lace creation:
> http://www.lapidaryjournal.com/feature/nov00str.cfm
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "C" <chris.johnson@...>
> To: <SCA-Garb@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Saturday, September 02, 2006 11:56 PM
> Subject: [SCA-Garb] Circlet help Please!!!!
>
>
>> Hi all! I am brand new at costuming, wire working, and any kind of
>> jewelry making in general! I am very determined to create something
>> beautiful though! :)I was wondering if anyone is able/willing to
>> tell me in as much detail as possible how to make a circlet such as
>> the one pictured here: http://www.toddalanstudios.com/circlet-
>> one.htm or here: http://www.toddalanstudios.com/baronial-crown.htm I
>> am guessing the baronial crown is harder so maybe the first one will
>> do. I want to make something like that but with more jewels within
>> the wire work itself similar to the jewel on the front but occuring
>> more often throughout the piece. Any info anyone can give me would
>> be great. Supplies etc, pattern techniques, some sort of tutorial
>> start to finish ........ anything! The second thing I want to do is
>> attach a pair of side cauls to the circlet so cauls and circlet
>> would be one piece. Or in such a way that the cauls can easily be
>> attached and detached from the circlet which would be even better. I
>> would want to work jewels into the lattice work on the side cauls as
>> well. The effect I am going for is the one found here:
>> http://www.kats-hats.co.uk/ This artist has somehow used wire and
>> covered it in cloth for her cirlet and then did the same with the
>> side cauls and then glued gems on them all. I want to do the cirlet
>> and side cauls all with wire and gems if possible! Anyone have any
>> ideas? Perhaps it's too ambitious for me? I have searched everywhere
>> for crown making, tiara making tips etc.... This site has some good
>> ones, but nothing for the brand new costumer such as: how to draw a
>> lace pattern like the circlet in the first picture and then follow
>> it etc... I'd love some help. Thanks to all!!!! :)
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Helpful email addresses:
>>  Subscribe:    SCA-Garb-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
>>  Unsubscribe:  SCA-Garb-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>>
>> Main group web page:
>>  http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SCA-Garb
>>
>> Yahoo! Groups Links
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>

It may look like bare white cheeks but he is wearing underwear. :)

A
Remember to snip the excess.

-----Original Message-----
  I got curious and went to see the picture, I clicked on the "magnified view
" of the grape pickers and saw the "purple Peasant" ...but what "cracked "
me up was the little fellow off to the right in the blue tunic, bending over
and  "mooning" the viewer.
  take a peak, see Moonie the magnificent!
Melody

Uh no. You can bleach linen just by sticking it in the sun.
A

-----Original Message-----

Didn't French peasants dye their linen shirts blue because they couldn't
bleach the linen to make it white?

_________________________________________________________________
Find a baby-sitter FAST with MSN Search! http://search.msn.ie/





Helpful email addresses:
   Subscribe:    SCA-Garb-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
   Unsubscribe:  SCA-Garb-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

Main group web page:
   http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SCA-Garb

Yahoo! Groups Links

I'm on their mailing list, I just keep forgetting to bring the coupon. :P

-----Original Message-----
Speaking of Jo Ann's I just got their flyer in the
mail...This coming week is their big labor day sale.
(this Saturday through next Saturday). Lots of fabric
on sale. Oh and if you aren't on their mailing list,
you might want to consider it. I get a 40% off coupon
every month good on one regular priced cut of fabric
and when there are special sales like this coming
week, I also get a 50% off coupon. Definately helps
save cash on garb making. Just thought I'd let you all
know because it always helps to save some money.
~Isabel

Well I have seen an apron dyed (actually I was told it fell in the vat and
they didn't know until they emptied it) it was a pale purple, not a very
strong color.
A

-----Original Message-----
Has anyone done any dyeing using grapes? And if so, how is it done?
I seem to have an abundance of grapes this year and wonder if this would
work well.


Sonja

-----Original Message-----

Hi all! I am brand new at costuming, wire working, and any kind of jewelry
making in general! I am very determined to create something beautiful
though! :)I was wondering if anyone is able/willing to
tell me in as much detail as possible how to make a circlet such as the one
pictured here: http://www.toddalanstudios.com/circlet-
one.htm or here: http://www.toddalanstudios.com/baronial-crown.htm I
am guessing the baronial crown is harder so maybe the first one will do.

A: These are crowns, not circlets. You need to check with your Kingdom's
laws on circlets and crowns.
If the crown or circlet is for you and you are not of a rank that allows you
to wear it, you will run into problems (basically being requested not to
wear it until you have achieved that rank). If it is for another person,
again, check your kingdom's laws on whether the person is allowed to wear
it.
Also, in checking with your Kingdom's law you will beable to find out if
there are restrictions to jewels within a crown or circlet.

  The second thing I want to do is attach a pair of side cauls to the circlet
so cauls and circlet would be one piece. Or in such a way that the cauls can
easily be attached and detached from the circlet which would be even better.

A: ?
http://www.virtue.to/articles/easy_cauls.html

A: you might be interested in this site for over all costuming and
accessories.
http://moas.atlantia.sca.org/topics/clot.htm

I believe the spelling that you're looking for is "gamurra."

This website has several pics at the top from period portraiture:
http://www.angelfire.com/zine/kiarapanther/garb/gamurra.html. The style is
last quarter of the 15th century. If I'm reading aright, it appears to
center around Florence at this time.

Margaret N.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Thanks. I knew the era, and knew some documentation, just couldn't narrow
down the correct spelling and it was driving me crazy.
B~
  de gustibus non est disputandum
-------Original Message-------
I believe the spelling that you're looking for is "gamurra."

This website has several pics at the top from period portraiture:
http://www.angelfire.com/zine/kiarapanther/garb/gamurra.html. The style is
last quarter of the 15th century. If I'm reading aright, it appears to
center around Florence at this time.

Margaret N.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I did try that and it got worse :o(

there are a couple of other things I should have done but didn't in
the rush to get every one dressed.

So, some other time I will get some nicer ones, hair and all.

cheers

Deb
(Oonagh)

--- In SCA-Garb@yahoogroups.com, "unclrashid" <unclrashid@...> wrote:
>
> Very lovely!!  And the photos aren't bad.  If you adjusted the
> lighting using photoshop, they'd be great.
>
> Rashid
>
>
> --- In SCA-Garb@yahoogroups.com, "Oonagh ONeill" <oonaghme@> wrote:
> >
> > Greetings all.
> >
> > I have finished and worn my new blue jerkin.  Oh and loaded a web
> > page on it http://www.geocities.com/oonaghsown/bluejerkin.htm
> > a diary http://www.geocities.com/oonaghsown/blue_jerkin.htm
> > documentation http://au.geocities.com/curvess2000/jerkins.htm
> > and something about my hair style
> > http://www.geocities.com/oonaghsown/hairstyle.htm
> >
> > I will get some better photos at some point.
> >
> > Enjoy
> >
> > Cheers
> >
> > Deb
> > (Oonagh)
> >
> > Oonaghs Own - Venetian patrician womens dress and accessories of
the
> > mid to late sixteenth century.
> > http://www.geocities.com/oonaghsown/
> >
>

Quoting Melody Watts <piratelass@...>:

>  I got curious and went to see the picture, I clicked on the
> "magnified view " of the grape pickers and saw the "purple Peasant"
> ...but what "cracked " me up was the little fellow off to the right
> in the blue tunic, bending over and  "mooning" the viewer.
>  take a peak, see Moonie the magnificent!

::snrk::

Look at February!
http://www.christusrex.org/www2/berry/f2v.html

jerusha
-----
Susan Farmer
sfarmer@...
University of Tennessee
Department of Ecology and Evolutionary Biology
http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/Trillium/

Melody Watts wrote:
>  I got curious and went to see the picture, I clicked on the "magnified view "
of the grape pickers and saw the "purple Peasant" ...but what "cracked " me up
was the little fellow off to the right in the blue tunic, bending over and 
"mooning" the viewer.
>  take a peak, see Moonie the magnificent!

Or maybe he's just not wearing braies - he has his hosen rolled down, I see.

Sinech.

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
An Fhirinne in aghaidh an tSaoil - The Truth Against the World



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

otsisto wrote:
> >From the German Ren list's files
>
> Goller ""Collar"" shoulder length cape, often richly decorated , also used to
describe the English style partlet" Kathy Barich
> Gugel/Kogel/Kugel  Hood Kathy Barich
Thanks!  :-)

Sinech.

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
An Fhirinne in aghaidh an tSaoil - The Truth Against the World

Not all hosen went over the knee and up the thigh. I have noticed that from
a few manuscripts of lower class men and hunters wearing the short hosen.
A

-----Original Message-----
Or maybe he's just not wearing braies - he has his hosen rolled down, I see.

Sinech.

otsisto wrote:
> Not all hosen went over the knee and up the thigh. I have noticed that from a
few manuscripts of lower class men and hunters wearing the short hosen.
True, but his looked rolled down to me, though I no longer have the url to
double check.

Sinech.


* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
An Fhirinne in aghaidh an tSaoil - The Truth Against the World

http://www.christusrex.org/www2/berry/DB-f9v.jpg

The left one look slouchy enough to be a long on but on the right it looks
like a shorty.
A

-----Original Message-----
True, but his looked rolled down to me, though I no longer have the url to
double check.

Sinech.

Good point.  That's not what people usually mean when they
say "cloak".  But if they want to be warm and authentic, it is a good
way to go!

Rashid


--- In SCA-Garb@yahoogroups.com, Ciorstan <ciorstan@...> wrote:

> I will agree that the majority of surviving medieval cloaks were
> half-circles, but what about the pelicon?  This is one of my all-
time
> favorite garments.  Scroll down the page to Lady de Northwode:
>
> http://www.whitewinds.co.uk/acatalog/index.html?http%
3A//www.whitewinds.co.uk/acatalog/N_to_P.html&CatalogBody
>
> It is a flat garment with a funky buttoned hood. The original
garment is
> lined with miniver in a vair pattern (squirrel skins and their
lighter
> bellies), which would be a very thin fur.
>
> Mary Houston has a cutting diagram for the pelicon in "Medieval
Costume
> in England and France, 13th, 14th and 15th Century." This is an
> inexpensive Dover paperback and though it was originally printed in
the
> mid 1930s, Houston's re-drawings do not suffer from the problems in
> Norris-- e.g., her drawings look like real medieval art sources and
not
> Mary Pickford or Douglas Fairbanks in fancy dress.
>
> ciorstan
>

I've never actually tested this process. I suspect it would bleach a
bit of a stain out of white linen, but I rather doubt you could go from
natural linen color to white in a reasonable amount of time and without
weakening the fabric.

Rashid

--- In SCA-Garb@yahoogroups.com, "otsisto" <otsisto@...> wrote:
>
> Uh no. You can bleach linen just by sticking it in the sun.
> A
>
> -----Original Message-----
>
> Didn't French peasants dye their linen shirts blue because they
couldn't
> bleach the linen to make it white?

Yes you would look great. I pick this one up for the times when I need to
have garb for the time frame this is for, but I don't want to do the
research, fittings, etc. to get the style correct. Other thought cause this
was brought up back a bit is if you decide to use silk dupioni for your
fabric-interline it. the style if fitted so you can have stress on seams so
the interline layer (basically treating 2 fabrics layered to together as
one) is there to take the stress off the dupioni.

Kathws

Sent: Friday, September 01, 2006 11:30 PM
Subject: [SCA-Garb] Re: Appropriate-ness of dress


--- In SCA-Garb@yahoogroups.com, Adhaniá <skyspinner@...> wrote:
>
> I almost hesitate to ask, but what is the lack of authenticity in
this
> pattern?

It's not that bad.  Lacing should be changed from criss-cross to
spiral lacing.  I ccan't tell if there is a side seam, but if the
side panel is just one panel rather than a front side and a seperate
back side, that would be a little off.

There is enough evidence for princess seams that it's not worth
fussing over unless you decide you really like this period and want
to get heavy-duty authentic.

The pic with the dress pinned to the belt is just wrong, and it
should have an entire underderess rather than an underskirt if you
are going to do that, but it would be equally authentic to wear it
with just a chemise.

If you really want to tweak it towards higher authenticity, reduce
the width of the flare at the hem on the center front and back panels
and add center gores.  It would probably use less fabric due to being
able to lay out the pices more efficiently if you do that.  (but I
wouldn't do that for a first garb, inserting center gores into a slit
is something you should save for later when you really, really love
this period of dress.)

And last, but not least, if you make this dress just as shown in the
pattern pic (skip the belt made of trim) you'll look better than many
people who have been in the SCA for years.

Rashid

Now I know where a friend got inspiration for her pelicon/cloak. Mary
Houston's books are all pretty good, definitely steps above Norris that I
can tell from a perusal through a friend's Norris. Her drawings are way
better, this one of lady Northwode is the 3rd or 4th image I've found on the
internet and have found all the drawings to be pretty much spot on to the
images. Facial expressions are about the only area that it gets iffy I've
noticed and facial expressions are hard to figure out.

Kathws

Sent: Sunday, September 03, 2006 2:44 PM
Subject: Re: [SCA-Garb] Re: Is the circle cloak period?
> I will agree that the majority of surviving medieval cloaks were
> half-circles, but what about the pelicon?  This is one of my all-time
> favorite garments.  Scroll down the page to Lady de Northwode:
>
>
http://www.whitewinds.co.uk/acatalog/index.html?http%3A//www.whitewinds.co.uk/ac\
atalog/N_to_P.html&CatalogBody
>
> It is a flat garment with a funky buttoned hood. The original garment is
> lined with miniver in a vair pattern (squirrel skins and their lighter
> bellies), which would be a very thin fur.
>
> Mary Houston has a cutting diagram for the pelicon in "Medieval Costume
> in England and France, 13th, 14th and 15th Century." This is an
> inexpensive Dover paperback and though it was originally printed in the
> mid 1930s, Houston's re-drawings do not suffer from the problems in
> Norris-- e.g., her drawings look like real medieval art sources and not
> Mary Pickford or Douglas Fairbanks in fancy dress.
>
> ciorstan

Sophie wrote:
> How do you fasten the wrap or case into the hair? I've tried wrapping
> and 'tubing' my hair, and find that after just a little while it
> scrunches down or slips right off.

A couple of approaches to ribboning hair are discussed in The Bliaut
Files <http://bliautlady.50megs.com/hairhow.htm>.

Ribbons and braid cases are both discussed in "Upbraid Yourself and
Others" <http://www.virtue.to/articles/braiding.html>.


Coblaith Mhuimhneach
Barony of Bryn Gwlad
Kingdom of Ansteorra
<mailto:Coblaith@...>

To my (uneducated) eye, it looks as if there are two layers of the "skirt"
portions of the clothing at Mary's left knee. The draping and folds around the
shoulders suggests to me a short (waist-length?) rectangular or semi-circular
cloak fastened on the left shoulder, or else moved around temporarily from being
worn fastened in the center.

I am envisioning a short-sleeved linen tunic with a sleeveless wool or linen
tunic over it, both with long front openings, and the cloak to cover arms and
front openings.

Since Hildesheim is in Germany, I am wondering if maybe sleeveless clothing was
used there more than in England?


Joy Goodin(a newbie who is thinking about joining the SCA, and is researching
garb)
aejicogu@...

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