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A Friend Asked How It Is That I Am Not a Full Preterist   Message List  
Reply Message #27543 of 31386 |

A friend asked how I could get so many things right and not be a full preterist.  This is my answer.

Most people came to full preterism because they saw that the two comings proposed by partial preterism is BS. They figured, if partial preterism is wrong, then full preterism must be right. They did not know there was something inbetween. It is Daniel 7 that has kept me from full preterism for the last quarter century. Daniel 7:7-11 shows thrones put in place (i.e., the beginning of the millennium, Rev. 20:4) at the AD 70 defeat of the little horn (cf. the court seated in Daniel 7:23-27).
 
Volume II (of The Antichrist and the Second Coming) is where I really go into detail on the millennium; it should be out in 4 or so months. Here is just a little bit on this issue.
 
The sequence of Revelation 19:11-20:4 parallels that of Daniel 7:21-22.
 
I was watching and the same horn was making war against the saints, and prevailing against them, until the Ancient of Days came, and a judgment was made in favor of the saints of the Most High, and the time came for the saints to possess the kingdom.
 Daniel 7:21-22
 
Daniel 7 clearly shows that it is right after the AD 70 coming of God to defeat of the Antichrist (the little horn) that the saints possess the kingdom. This parallels Revelation 19:11-20:4. It is right after the AD 70 coming of the Word of God to defeat the Antichrist (the individual beast) that the saints possess the kingdom (as the millennium begins; Rev. 19:11-20:4; cf. Dan. 7:7-11).

Notice how Daniel 7 shows God's people having gone through the great tribulation just prior to possessing the kingdom (i.e., the little horn prevailing against the saints in verse 21; cf. v. 25). It is the same in Revelation 20:4; one of the groups that come alive at the beginning of the millennium consists of those who had been killed for not taking the mark of the beast (i.e., they had gone through the great tribulation, Rev. 13:5-18).
 
And I saw thrones, and they sat on them, and judgment was committed to them. Then I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for their witness to Jesus and for the word of God, who had not worshipped the beast or his image, and had not received his mark on their foreheads or on their hands. And they lived and reigned with Christ for a thousand years
 Revelation 20:4
 
This speaks of an AD 70 beginning of the millennium, not AD 30. To say this speaks of an AD 30 spiritual coming to life of believers makes no sense whatsoever (but the full preterist paradigm is on the line, so that is the interpretation that has to be offered). These are the souls of dead people (cf. Rev. 6:9-11) killed in the great tribulation for not taking the mark of the beast (Rev. 13:5-18; cf. Rev. 7:9-17) who are joining in the resurrection at AD 70.
 
What I am saying violates the full preterist creed of all fulfilled by AD 70 and thus has to be rejected by full preterists (if they want to stay full prets that is). For this reason I do not bring it up that much (arguing against a group's paradigm is usually a waste of time). But I do go into detail on these things in volume II. The two sections most germane to Rev. 20:4 are Daniel 7 and Rev. 13. Most discussions I see on the millennium do not go into much, if any, depth on these sections.



Wed Sep 14, 2011 7:45 pm

mckenzdw
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Message #27543 of 31386 |
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A friend asked how I could get so many things right and not be a full preterist. This is my answer. Most people came to full preterism because they saw that...
mckenzdw Offline Send Email Sep 14, 2011
7:45 pm

Hi Duncan, I am not sure what the contention you have is. Is it that you think the resurrection must be to live upon the earth again for this dominion to be...
Robin
mograce2u Offline Send Email
Sep 15, 2011
3:16 pm

Hi Duncan, Your friend asks good questions. :) To me, the best arguments against full preterism are this Rev. 20 argument and Isaiah 65. I focus on clear...
Jan Logsdon
janmlogsdon Offline Send Email
Sep 15, 2011
9:25 pm

Just wanted to weigh in on the subject. There is NOTHING wrong (at all) with Dave responding to Sam, Talbot, and the like. If they are attempting to refute...
Healinglvs@...
healingleave... Offline Send Email
Sep 15, 2011
9:42 pm

As I told Dorothy, I miss the funny response posts to the Talbotites. They are just so negative and lying, and I'm not sure we should be associated with that....
Jan Logsdon
janmlogsdon Offline Send Email
Sep 15, 2011
9:57 pm

They are, but Dave (in my opinion) has always done a good job of answering them graciously and accurately. I personally have enjoyed everything he has posted...
Healinglvs@...
healingleave... Offline Send Email
Sep 15, 2011
10:17 pm

Yes, definitely. I have said the same....
Jan Logsdon
janmlogsdon Offline Send Email
Sep 15, 2011
10:23 pm

Hi Mike, I totally agree and the comments I made that day confirm it. There were some things I didn't say that I would like to weigh in on also. Back in...
Dorothy
justgracethr... Offline Send Email
Sep 15, 2011
11:38 pm

... Where does Daniel 7 allude to a 2,000+-year period ("the millennium") that follows the defeat of the little horn and that ends in the destruction of Satan...
David Green
jer2329 Offline Send Email
Sep 16, 2011
8:06 pm

Major Premise: Partial Preterists who claim to hold to the "time texts" should hold that they are already in the "city" of Revelation 22. Revelation 22 1Then...
Michael Bennett
steel_saint Offline Send Email
Sep 16, 2011
8:28 pm

Hi Mike, First, it needs to be understood that there are two different groups of preterists who see AD 70 as the beginning of the millennium. One says that...
mckenzdw Offline Send Email Sep 17, 2011
7:15 pm

Michael, In my opinion your "Major Premise" is seriously flawed, and of course this major flaw falsifies the balance of your statements and conclusions! To be...
Lloyd Dale
barldranch@... Send Email
Sep 17, 2011
7:00 pm

... Where in the Aramaic text of Dan 7 are we told that 'the saints' possess the kingdom "right after" the end of the little horn? Regards Th.S....
thomas_sach Offline Send Email Sep 17, 2011
9:03 pm

To all, If there are some single FP's out there, or you know of some, please send them to a FB page I just created:...
Healinglvs@...
healingleave... Offline Send Email
Sep 17, 2011
9:33 pm

Mike, The video from David Curtis on our union in Christ was excellent - thanks for posting the link. Robin...
Robin
mograce2u Offline Send Email
Sep 18, 2011
2:35 am

Hi Mike, I see you set up a site for single preterists to meet. When I saw it, I thought I would pass on a few things that I've been studying and some ...
Dorothy
justgracethr... Offline Send Email
Sep 18, 2011
2:27 pm

Thank you Mike....
Jan Logsdon
janmlogsdon Offline Send Email
Sep 19, 2011
12:58 pm
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