Persia Drummond wrote:
> The Book of Bantorra I have been watching this one on
> crunchyroll.com.  I got interested is the series because when I heard
> about it - it was being call Armed Librarians - The Book of Bantorra.
> Had to watch an anime series about armed librarians , so far the first 8
> episodes have been very entertaining.

Yes, the whole "armed librarians" thing sucked me in, too!  The idea of
people becoming books after they die is pretty cool.  I'll try to catch
the eps on crunchyroll.com.  Thanks!

Tchula

Persia Drummond wrote:
> Hello Tchula,
> What great anime did you get to watch?  Oh, please tell.  I need to stop
> working weekends.

lol  Yes, I usually work Th, Fri, Sat, so I had to get my colleague to
work for me on Fri and Sat.  She knows I have to get my otaku fix at
least once a year!

As I mentioned in the other post, I really got hooked on The Valkyrie
Chronicles, Book of Bantorra (you might know it by its Japanese name
Tatakau Shishio), and The Sacred Blacksmith.

They were also showing D.Gray-Man up through episode 12, Soul Eater, 07
Ghost, Full Metal Alchemist, Howl's Moving Castle, Hetalia, Devil May
Cry, and a bunch of other stuff that I didn't get to see (Canaan, Full
Metal Panic 2nd Raid, Element Hunters, 11 Eyes, Needless, Last Exile).

Unfortunately, there were many problems with the audio in two of the
five video rooms.  The amps kept blowing out so we had either low sound
or no sound for most of Howl's Moving Castle and Hetalia.  I mean, I
know the subtitles are there so you can follow it, but I still like to
hear the emotion of the Japanese voice actors.  So annoying!  I hope
they fix that problem before next year's con.

I like this particular con because it's not as overwhelmingly huge as
Balticon, and they have the five video rooms--so I can almost always
find something that I want to see.  :-)

Tchula

Hey all!  I'm back from the con--scratchy-eyed, tired, and a few hundred dollars
poorer.  I just can't resist those DVD collections.  Or the J-rock CDs.  And
there might have been an awesome print of Kakashi in there, too.  :-D

Ah, it was fun!  Even though I failed (yet again) in my quest to find Hikaru no
Go or Haibane Renmei for sale, I did manage to pick up Grave of the Fireflies,
which was a really great find.

There were a few series I got interested in that I'd like to look around on the
net for:  The Valkyrie Chronicles, The Book of Bantorra, and The Sacred
Blacksmith.  Anybody on this list know these series?  Opinions welcome!

Tchula

Hey all!  Tomorrow I'm off to Crystal City for my annual anime convention.  Joy
of joys!  :-)  I checked the schedule and apparently on Saturday I will be
ensconced in one of the 5 video rooms from 8:30 AM until 8:30 PM--with no breaks
in between--watching anime.  Funny how the scheduling always works out to leave
me with no time for food...

Anyway, Lisa, if you can keep an eye out for anyone who wants to join the list
this weekend, I'd appreciate it.  I'll be away from the internet until Sunday
evening.  Thanks!

Tchula

And as for the question about how Nenyane learned the demons language, the
demons were of the first born before they chose to leave the world behind, so if
her father were  of the first born he could teach her that.

--- In MichelleWest@yahoogroups.com, Claire Rojstaczer <ambyrglow@...> wrote:
>
>
> On Nov 10, 2009, at 8:56 PM, Paula Lieberman wrote:
>
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "evalynjewell" <emira@...>
> > To: <MichelleWest@yahoogroups.com>
> > Sent: Tuesday, November 10, 2009 8:24 PM
> > Subject: [MichelleWest] Time between battles
> >
> >
> > I thought that Valedan was slightly older than that--early 20s, maybe.
> > Diora had been married and was widowed for months.   Her marriage had
> > lasted
> > long enough to produce a son by one of her wives--Diora was the first
> > wife,
> > and picked her cowives.  The cowife getting pregnant took time, then
> > nine
> > months until the birth of the child....and then the events of word of
> > the
> > massacre of the Leonnes getting to the North, and Valedan planning a
> > war,
> > Valedan competing in the big competition for best warrior, then the
> > mobilization of forces with all the excitement of the Black Ospreys
> > being
> > assigned as guard unit for Valedan, and off to the war....
> >
>
>
> Err. Diora didn't not pick her co-wives; Serra Amanita, Illara's
> mother, picked them before Diora's wedding.
>
> The battle with Allasakar at the end of Hunter's Death takes place in
> Henden 410. The first war between Essaliyan and Annagar ends in 415,
> when the hostages are sent north.
>
> Diora marries Illara in Emperal of 426. She's "halfway between four and
> five" in Scaral of 415, which makes her 15 or 16 at her wedding (I
> forget the order of the months). Illara is eight in 415, which makes
> him 19 or 20.
>
> Danello, Dierdre's son, is born in Scaral of 426. (Incidentally, I only
> just realized that Danello is also the name of Ashaf's Tor'agar. Does
> this suggest that Dierdre comes from the same village as Ashaf? Or is
> it just coincidence?)
>
>   Alesso and Sendari stage their coup in Morel of 427. At the time,
> Valedan is 17. Diora is probably 16.
>
> Crown Princes Reymar and Cormar, by the way,  are 15 and 16,
> respectively, in Morel of 427. Jewel is 32. (She joined Terafin 17
> years before that.) Mauro di'Garrardi is (give or take a year) the same
> age as Valedan. Filipo's older son Michaele is 14. Ramiro is at least
> in his mid-30s.
>
> The last time point that I can find in The Sun Sword is Corvil of 427.
> I think the book actually ends the month after that. But, still, not
> counting The Broken Crown, the entire Sun Sword series covers less than
> a year. Which is surprising, when you think about it.
>
> (Valedan has one stray memory of being 8, not 5, at the time of the
> hostage exchange, but that disagrees with every other reference made to
> both Valedan's age and the date of the war, so I'm ignoring it.)
>
> If someone does have the order of the months, I'd love a copy.
>
> Claire
>

Claire,
Thank you, Thank you for that clear, straightforward timeline of the Essalieyan
universe!!!
I always wished for something like this to keep things in time perspective.
However, I never had the time (read too lazy here) to make one. You have done us
all a great service. I printed your message out so I can keep the data handy.

Thanks Again,
Ralph

Thank you very much.  I have found this enjoyable reading, Michelle has such a
wonderful way with words, giving such depth to this work.

I did the math and this planet, does it have a name? has a yearly revolution
around their sun of 364/365 days.   I wonder if their day is the same as ours
too, would that make this planet the same size as earth?  Does size have
anything to do with speed of daily rotation???

On the map in the beginning of the books the continents don't look that big....I
wonder what else is sharing that planet???



--- In MichelleWest@yahoogroups.com, "hjbau" <hjbau@...> wrote:
>
> >
> > If someone does have the order of the months, I'd love a copy.
> >
> > Claire
> >
>
> Michelle actually gave out a copy of the months in order so here you go:
>
> The Essalieyan Calendar
> by Michelle Sagara (West) 
>
> There are thirteenth months in this calendar and they are completely regular
months, consisting of four 7 day weeks.
>
> Veral. 1st month. This month, named after Veralaan the founder, has 28 or 29
days. Historically, there are more weddings during the month of Veral than
during any other month; it's considered auspicious. Veral is the first month of
spring. Although the Hunter Lords do not realize the significance of the named
month, it is during Veral that the Sacred Hunt occurs. The first day of the
month is the Spring Equinox.
>
> Fabril. 2nd month. 28 days. Named after the first of the Maker-born to grace
the pre-salvation Empire with his artifacts and knowledge. Died a martyr to the
league of Wizards (which later became the Hand, or the Dark Hand as it was more
colloquially called), which is why he has earned a place in the folklore. The
sword of Fabril rests upon the hip of the Justice-born King -- for of the items
Fabril fashioned, only two survived -- and the rod is at the side of the
Wisdom-born King. Both items demand their due.
>
> Morel. 3rd month. 28 days. Named after the legendary (this is this world's
version of Arthur) hero who rode into the darkness of Allasakar at a time when
the Gods walked the world. The actual name rendered in Essalieyanese is
Moorelas; the Old Weston is Morrel, sometimes Moirel. Whatever his name, he rode
three times against the God; the third time, he did not return -- but the
stronghold of Allasakar was discovered and breached.
>
> Lattan. 4th month. 28 days. Beginning of the 2nd week (the 8th) is the Summer
Solstice -- and the opening ceremonies of the King's Challenge. Lattan is the
old Weston word for High Summer (Weston is the language at the base of
Essalieyanese). Originally, Lattan was a specific time -- the Summer Solstice;
it was one of two points during the year in which new and old worlds
intersected; they still intersect so now, for those who will not walk the
Oracle's path. Contemporary usage has lost all meaning of the more significant
event. [Editor's note: The Dominion's Festival of the Sun occurs at the Summer
Solstice.]
>
> Seril. 5th month. 28 days.
>
> Emperal. 6th month. 28 days. This is actually the Old Weston name of the
month; it is not clear that it was meant to refer to the King or the Emperor of
one of the Weston states, although that is clearly the tone of the word. The 10
days of The Gathering, and the coronation (if there is to be one) take place on
the 15th to the 24th of Emperal. If not, Advent is celebrated here, on the morn
of the 28th -- as the kings rise at last to the throne they were born to.
>
> Wittan. 7th month. 28 days. The beginning of the third week is the Autumnal
Equinox. There are many festivals during the month of Wittan, but most of these
are observed by followers of the Mother in Averalaan itself. Outside of
Averalaan, Wittan is probably the most celebrated month in the year -- it's the
month of the harvest., with all that that signifies. This is the second most
popular time of the year for marriages, although this is mostly in the outlying
regions. If the Kings tour (at one point it was part of ceremony), it will be at
the very beginning of Wittan, after the Advent. If this is the year of a
coronation, the Kings will tour, with their queens; that part of tradition has
not, and will not, be eradicated. Root of the word is unclear.
>
> Aeral. 8th month. 28 days. Root of this word is heavily debated. Heavily
debated (scholars do this sort of thing and enjoy it, and no one else cares one
way or the other, so as long as the scholar is sponsored they can do as the
please). The word is not Old Weston, although it takes a Weston form. The
profferred explanation that is given the widest credence is that the word comes
from the title Aeiria, which would be one of the titles given to the Queen of
the Hidden Court. Since no scholar in his right mind believes in the hidden
court, debate continues.
>
> Maran. 9th month. 28 days.
>
> Scaral. 10th month. 28 days. The beginning of the 4th week is the Winter
Solstice. This is named, as in Lattan, after the Old Weston word, scarran, which
refers to the darkest point of intersection between the old/new worlds. Again,
the conjunction occurs for those who know how to invoke its use; the line
between the old and the new breaks at this point -- but perhaps to a more
dangerous locale. [Ed.: The Dominion's Festivalof the Moon occurs at the winter
solstice.]
>
> Misteral. 11th month. 28 days.
>
> Corvil. 12th month. 28 days.
>
> Henden. 13th month. 28 days. The origins of this month are argued vociferously
among members of the Order of Knowledge. One side says that it is the modernized
version of Horenden, Old Weston for Hand -- the symbol of the League of Wizards;
the other side claims that it is actually a southern term, meaning "the thing
that is hidden but on the verge of stepping out." During this month, the more
ceremonial among the Essalieyanese (which does not include most merchants) begin
the Averalaan version of Lent. In the first week, they do not partake in any of
the more traditional forms of entertainment; in the second, they do not wear
certain colours, in the third, they do not eat certain foods. Then, there is one
day of respite (the Mothersday) before they launch into the Six Dark Days.
>

>
> If someone does have the order of the months, I'd love a copy.
>
> Claire
>

Michelle actually gave out a copy of the months in order so here you go:

The Essalieyan Calendar
by Michelle Sagara (West) 

There are thirteenth months in this calendar and they are completely regular
months, consisting of four 7 day weeks.

Veral. 1st month. This month, named after Veralaan the founder, has 28 or 29
days. Historically, there are more weddings during the month of Veral than
during any other month; it's considered auspicious. Veral is the first month of
spring. Although the Hunter Lords do not realize the significance of the named
month, it is during Veral that the Sacred Hunt occurs. The first day of the
month is the Spring Equinox.

Fabril. 2nd month. 28 days. Named after the first of the Maker-born to grace the
pre-salvation Empire with his artifacts and knowledge. Died a martyr to the
league of Wizards (which later became the Hand, or the Dark Hand as it was more
colloquially called), which is why he has earned a place in the folklore. The
sword of Fabril rests upon the hip of the Justice-born King -- for of the items
Fabril fashioned, only two survived -- and the rod is at the side of the
Wisdom-born King. Both items demand their due.

Morel. 3rd month. 28 days. Named after the legendary (this is this world's
version of Arthur) hero who rode into the darkness of Allasakar at a time when
the Gods walked the world. The actual name rendered in Essalieyanese is
Moorelas; the Old Weston is Morrel, sometimes Moirel. Whatever his name, he rode
three times against the God; the third time, he did not return -- but the
stronghold of Allasakar was discovered and breached.

Lattan. 4th month. 28 days. Beginning of the 2nd week (the 8th) is the Summer
Solstice -- and the opening ceremonies of the King's Challenge. Lattan is the
old Weston word for High Summer (Weston is the language at the base of
Essalieyanese). Originally, Lattan was a specific time -- the Summer Solstice;
it was one of two points during the year in which new and old worlds
intersected; they still intersect so now, for those who will not walk the
Oracle's path. Contemporary usage has lost all meaning of the more significant
event. [Editor's note: The Dominion's Festival of the Sun occurs at the Summer
Solstice.]

Seril. 5th month. 28 days.

Emperal. 6th month. 28 days. This is actually the Old Weston name of the month;
it is not clear that it was meant to refer to the King or the Emperor of one of
the Weston states, although that is clearly the tone of the word. The 10 days of
The Gathering, and the coronation (if there is to be one) take place on the 15th
to the 24th of Emperal. If not, Advent is celebrated here, on the morn of the
28th -- as the kings rise at last to the throne they were born to.

Wittan. 7th month. 28 days. The beginning of the third week is the Autumnal
Equinox. There are many festivals during the month of Wittan, but most of these
are observed by followers of the Mother in Averalaan itself. Outside of
Averalaan, Wittan is probably the most celebrated month in the year -- it's the
month of the harvest., with all that that signifies. This is the second most
popular time of the year for marriages, although this is mostly in the outlying
regions. If the Kings tour (at one point it was part of ceremony), it will be at
the very beginning of Wittan, after the Advent. If this is the year of a
coronation, the Kings will tour, with their queens; that part of tradition has
not, and will not, be eradicated. Root of the word is unclear.

Aeral. 8th month. 28 days. Root of this word is heavily debated. Heavily debated
(scholars do this sort of thing and enjoy it, and no one else cares one way or
the other, so as long as the scholar is sponsored they can do as the please).
The word is not Old Weston, although it takes a Weston form. The profferred
explanation that is given the widest credence is that the word comes from the
title Aeiria, which would be one of the titles given to the Queen of the Hidden
Court. Since no scholar in his right mind believes in the hidden court, debate
continues.

Maran. 9th month. 28 days.

Scaral. 10th month. 28 days. The beginning of the 4th week is the Winter
Solstice. This is named, as in Lattan, after the Old Weston word, scarran, which
refers to the darkest point of intersection between the old/new worlds. Again,
the conjunction occurs for those who know how to invoke its use; the line
between the old and the new breaks at this point -- but perhaps to a more
dangerous locale. [Ed.: The Dominion's Festivalof the Moon occurs at the winter
solstice.]

Misteral. 11th month. 28 days.

Corvil. 12th month. 28 days.

Henden. 13th month. 28 days. The origins of this month are argued vociferously
among members of the Order of Knowledge. One side says that it is the modernized
version of Horenden, Old Weston for Hand -- the symbol of the League of Wizards;
the other side claims that it is actually a southern term, meaning "the thing
that is hidden but on the verge of stepping out." During this month, the more
ceremonial among the Essalieyanese (which does not include most merchants) begin
the Averalaan version of Lent. In the first week, they do not partake in any of
the more traditional forms of entertainment; in the second, they do not wear
certain colours, in the third, they do not eat certain foods. Then, there is one
day of respite (the Mothersday) before they launch into the Six Dark Days.

On Nov 10, 2009, at 8:56 PM, Paula Lieberman wrote:

> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "evalynjewell" <emira@...>
> To: <MichelleWest@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, November 10, 2009 8:24 PM
> Subject: [MichelleWest] Time between battles
>
>
> I thought that Valedan was slightly older than that--early 20s, maybe.
> Diora had been married and was widowed for months.   Her marriage had
> lasted
> long enough to produce a son by one of her wives--Diora was the first
> wife,
> and picked her cowives.  The cowife getting pregnant took time, then
> nine
> months until the birth of the child....and then the events of word of
> the
> massacre of the Leonnes getting to the North, and Valedan planning a
> war,
> Valedan competing in the big competition for best warrior, then the
> mobilization of forces with all the excitement of the Black Ospreys
> being
> assigned as guard unit for Valedan, and off to the war....
>


Err. Diora didn't not pick her co-wives; Serra Amanita, Illara's
mother, picked them before Diora's wedding.

The battle with Allasakar at the end of Hunter's Death takes place in
Henden 410. The first war between Essaliyan and Annagar ends in 415,
when the hostages are sent north.

Diora marries Illara in Emperal of 426. She's "halfway between four and
five" in Scaral of 415, which makes her 15 or 16 at her wedding (I
forget the order of the months). Illara is eight in 415, which makes
him 19 or 20.

Danello, Dierdre's son, is born in Scaral of 426. (Incidentally, I only
just realized that Danello is also the name of Ashaf's Tor'agar. Does
this suggest that Dierdre comes from the same village as Ashaf? Or is
it just coincidence?)

   Alesso and Sendari stage their coup in Morel of 427. At the time,
Valedan is 17. Diora is probably 16.

Crown Princes Reymar and Cormar, by the way,  are 15 and 16,
respectively, in Morel of 427. Jewel is 32. (She joined Terafin 17
years before that.) Mauro di'Garrardi is (give or take a year) the same
age as Valedan. Filipo's older son Michaele is 14. Ramiro is at least
in his mid-30s.

The last time point that I can find in The Sun Sword is Corvil of 427.
I think the book actually ends the month after that. But, still, not
counting The Broken Crown, the entire Sun Sword series covers less than
a year. Which is surprising, when you think about it.

(Valedan has one stray memory of being 8, not 5, at the time of the
hostage exchange, but that disagrees with every other reference made to
both Valedan's age and the date of the war, so I'm ignoring it.)

If someone does have the order of the months, I'd love a copy.

Claire

----- Original Message -----
From: "gpherder" <gpherder@...>
To: <MichelleWest@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 10, 2009 9:48 PM
Subject: [MichelleWest] Re: Time between battles


> -- In MichelleWest@yahoogroups.com, "Paula Lieberman" <paal@...> wrote:
>> Diora had been married and was widowed for months.   Her marriage had
>> lasted
>> long enough to produce a son by one of her wives--Diora was the first
>> wife,
>
> Actually, the wife was already pregnant when she came to the harem.
>
>> and picked her cowives.  The cowife getting pregnant took time, then nine
>
> Diora picked none of her wives in her first marriage - she came, as it
> says in the book, to a harem half built.  There's a fairly long passage
> where the introductions to her new wives was written about.
>
> However, it's likely the marriage lasted at least a year - she certainly
> was there long enough to watch the Festival of the Sun with her wives and
> husband, and her husband, wives, etc. were killed right before the next
> festival of the sun.
>
>> Some of them are already old, such as Meralonne and the woman leading the
>
> Meralonne only occasionally seems "old" - for the most part, he's as old
> as he wants to be - or so it seems.

The sections where e.g. kialli call him "APhaniel" and talked of the days
when the kialli were alive and the and the Firstborn freely walk human
lands, and where Kallandras stared directly at him challenging him with
"-who taught [the maker of the rings which Evayne took from the dead hand of
the maker of them] how to make the rings?"  indicate the Meralonne
is -ancient-....

Also - regarding the timing of the "last battle" - Evayne once told Kallandras
that she felt so comfortable with him, since he was the only one she saw at the
"end" - so it occurs certainly before Kallandras dies.

-- In MichelleWest@yahoogroups.com, "Paula Lieberman" <paal@...> wrote:
> Diora had been married and was widowed for months.   Her marriage had lasted
> long enough to produce a son by one of her wives--Diora was the first wife,

Actually, the wife was already pregnant when she came to the harem.

> and picked her cowives.  The cowife getting pregnant took time, then nine

Diora picked none of her wives in her first marriage - she came, as it says in
the book, to a harem half built.  There's a fairly long passage where the
introductions to her new wives was written about.

However, it's likely the marriage lasted at least a year - she certainly was
there long enough to watch the Festival of the Sun with her wives and husband,
and her husband, wives, etc. were killed right before the next festival of the
sun.

> Some of them are already old, such as Meralonne and the woman leading the

Meralonne only occasionally seems "old" - for the most part, he's as old as he
wants to be - or so it seems.

----- Original Message -----
From: "evalynjewell" <emira@...>
To: <MichelleWest@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 10, 2009 8:24 PM
Subject: [MichelleWest] Time between battles


> If I remember correctly there was about 15 years between the battle at the
> end of Hunter's Oath and the big battle in the Sunsword Series.  Jewell
> went from being a teen, 15 or so, to a mature women in her early thirties.
>
> The House Name series is Jewels early days and then the House takeover.  I
> have been thinking that at the end of Sunsword there were a lot of
> beginnings.  Jewel and the House, Valedan and the Dominion, Voyani's,
> Adam?, and the Cities of Man.  Stephen and the Bredani.   All except Jewel
> are teens.  It seems they need time to mature and grow into their power.

I thought that Valedan was slightly older than that--early 20s, maybe.
Diora had been married and was widowed for months.   Her marriage had lasted
long enough to produce a son by one of her wives--Diora was the first wife,
and picked her cowives.  The cowife getting pregnant took time, then nine
months until the birth of the child....and then the events of word of the
massacre of the Leonnes getting to the North, and Valedan planning a war,
Valedan competing in the big competition for best warrior, then the
mobilization of forces with all the excitement of the Black Ospreys being
assigned as guard unit for Valedan, and off to the war....

> Some of the other players, Jewel and Margret, will be mature and confident
> in their roles.  However some of the older folks from Essalieyan will be
> old, too old to battle?
>
Some of them are already old, such as Meralonne and the woman leading the
mages.  Then there is Serra Teresa, heading to become a bard though she's
got two decades on Diora, there are the mage-warriors trained by Meralonne,
the Twin Kings' heirs are growing up, there is the boy who is Teos'
surprising son....

> Also, Allasakar was vanquished but not defeated.  He seems to need time to
> recoup and devise ways to battle on.
>
> Are there clues in the books I have missed?

If I remember correctly there was about 15 years between the battle at the end
of Hunter's Oath and the big battle in the Sunsword Series.  Jewell went from
being a teen, 15 or so, to a mature women in her early thirties.

The House Name series is Jewels early days and then the House takeover.  I have
been thinking that at the end of Sunsword there were a lot of beginnings.  Jewel
and the House, Valedan and the Dominion, Voyani's, Adam?, and the Cities of Man.
Stephen and the Bredani.   All except Jewel are teens.  It seems they need time
to mature and grow into their power.

Some of the other players, Jewel and Margret, will be mature and confident in
their roles.  However some of the older folks from Essalieyan will be old, too
old to battle?

Also, Allasakar was vanquished but not defeated.  He seems to need time to
recoup and devise ways to battle on.

Are there clues in the books I have missed?

--- In MichelleWest@yahoogroups.com, "evalynjewell" <emira@...> wrote:
>
> Ok, so the goal is not for Stephen and Nanyene to become approved Hunters, it
for them to become skilled for use by the Gods above.  So thus we know in the
final battle there will be a hunt, maybe, similar to Gilliams and Stephens but
this one will obviously have the need for fancy swordwork.  It is amazing how
many clues Michelle gives if you are able to piece them together thoughtful
(with lots and lots of help)Eva
>

That is my take on the situation. Stephen and Nenyane are needed to fight the
demons and the Dark Lord. The Breodani still intend to hold their annual Hunts
in honor of Breodan, even though he has "ascended" to the Heavens. Having it
spin out this way, Stephen and Nenyane would not be required to attend those
Hunts to represent Maubreche, since Robart would be there as Lord.
I can imagine Stephen, Nenyane and their pack, standing in the forefront of a
battlefield challenging Allasakar and his hordes.
This is the glory of Michelle's writing!! She provides us facts and data that
our brains can create wonderful tapestries out of. Even if were are completely,
the pleasure and diversion that her writings provide are fantastic. How she can
think, plan, plot out and finally write it for us to enjoy is next to
miraculous!
Forget Christmas, come on February 2nd!!!!

Ralph

Ok, so the goal is not for Stephen and Nanyene to become approved Hunters, it
for them to become skilled for use by the Gods above.  So thus we know in the
final battle there will be a hunt, maybe, similar to Gilliams and Stephens but
this one will obviously have the need for fancy swordwork.  It is amazing how
many clues Michelle gives if you are able to piece them together thoughtful
(with lots and lots of help)Eva

--- In MichelleWest@yahoogroups.com, "RalphW" <ralphw2548@...> wrote:
>
>
>
> --- In MichelleWest@yahoogroups.com, "evalynjewell" <emira@> wrote:
> >
> > After reading "Huntbrother" this weekend, I realized when Lord Corwin was
talking about conducting the "Hunter/Hunbrother" ceremony without the king's
approval I had gotten this ceremony confused with the "First Hunt" ceremony.  I
realized that Margret's vision showed them hunting with Gilliam, so it was
obviously a done deal so I wondered how it came about, having gotten the
ceremonies confused.
> >
> > Then, last night I read the beginning of "Hunter's Oath," and realized that
this was a simple ceremony that took place on the Hunter's Lord's property at
their own alter.  The ceremony required 2 hunters lords to speak for the young
hunters and a priest to give the Hunter Gods blessing, thus legitmacy.  Gilliam
and Stephen had two of the most important Hunter Lords, in fact, Master Hunters,
and the King's own priest presiding over their ceremony.
> >
> > Stephen and Nanyene would have Gilliam and Corwin's brother as the two
Hunter Lords, but who do you think they got for the priest, because in Margret's
vision they are hunting with their pack. ??
>
> >
> > Eva
> >
>
>
>
> My take on that is that, Lord Corwin would have cared less if no priest
attended (consecrated?) that initial ceremony held at the Maubreche estate. He,
his brother and Gilliam being there would suffice for him to start Stephen and
Nenyane on the road for training (the three hunts, Boar,Bear and Stag). I
thought his concern would be if the King in his role of "Master of the Game" 
would recognize Stephen  and Nenyane at the ceremony at the palace.
> That is the ceremony that truly would anoint them as Hunter and Huntbrother.
> IMHO!
>
> Ralph
>

I forgot to say why Lord Corwin would eschew the involvement of the priests.
Stephen of Maubreche IS the son of the Hunter God Breodan. In their theory of
religiosity, who would stand higher than Stephen? Stephen's oath would be
unchallenged by anyone, priest or lay. The problem, as I see it, is with the
Master of the Game. Only the king can grant Stephen the title of Hunter Lord.
My suspicion is that Stephen and Nenyane would be trained to hunt. They would be
allowed their own pack to hunt with. However, Robart, Stephen's younger brother,
would be the one to be granted the title Hunter Lord. Robart would then be heir
to Maubreche. Stephen, Nenyane and their pack would be free to battle against
the return of Allasakar.
IMHO, again ;)

Ralph

--- In MichelleWest@yahoogroups.com, "evalynjewell" <emira@...> wrote:
>
> After reading "Huntbrother" this weekend, I realized when Lord Corwin was
talking about conducting the "Hunter/Hunbrother" ceremony without the king's
approval I had gotten this ceremony confused with the "First Hunt" ceremony.  I
realized that Margret's vision showed them hunting with Gilliam, so it was
obviously a done deal so I wondered how it came about, having gotten the
ceremonies confused.
>
> Then, last night I read the beginning of "Hunter's Oath," and realized that
this was a simple ceremony that took place on the Hunter's Lord's property at
their own alter.  The ceremony required 2 hunters lords to speak for the young
hunters and a priest to give the Hunter Gods blessing, thus legitmacy.  Gilliam
and Stephen had two of the most important Hunter Lords, in fact, Master Hunters,
and the King's own priest presiding over their ceremony.
>
> Stephen and Nanyene would have Gilliam and Corwin's brother as the two Hunter
Lords, but who do you think they got for the priest, because in Margret's vision
they are hunting with their pack. ??

>
> Eva
>



My take on that is that, Lord Corwin would have cared less if no priest attended
(consecrated?) that initial ceremony held at the Maubreche estate. He, his
brother and Gilliam being there would suffice for him to start Stephen and
Nenyane on the road for training (the three hunts, Boar,Bear and Stag). I
thought his concern would be if the King in his role of "Master of the Game" 
would recognize Stephen  and Nenyane at the ceremony at the palace.
That is the ceremony that truly would anoint them as Hunter and Huntbrother.
IMHO!

Ralph

After reading "Huntbrother" this weekend, I realized when Lord Corwin was
talking about conducting the "Hunter/Hunbrother" ceremony without the king's
approval I had gotten this ceremony confused with the "First Hunt" ceremony.  I
realized that Margret's vision showed them hunting with Gilliam, so it was
obviously a done deal so I wondered how it came about, having gotten the
ceremonies confused.

Then, last night I read the beginning of "Hunter's Oath," and realized that this
was a simple ceremony that took place on the Hunter's Lord's property at their
own alter.  The ceremony required 2 hunters lords to speak for the young hunters
and a priest to give the Hunter Gods blessing, thus legitmacy.  Gilliam and
Stephen had two of the most important Hunter Lords, in fact, Master Hunters, and
the King's own priest presiding over their ceremony.

Stephen and Nanyene would have Gilliam and Corwin's brother as the two Hunter
Lords, but who do you think they got for the priest, because in Margret's vision
they are hunting with their pack. ??

Eva

Nevermind, I just found the answer to this, skimming through Memory of Stone.
Apparently Fabril made them with Summer power to stand against the Barons, but
they need to be imbued with Winter to stand against the Darkness. So, it must
have been before.

Aaron

--- In MichelleWest@yahoogroups.com, "ajmill1978" <ajmill1978@...> wrote:
>
> And I've always been under the impression that the rod and the sword were
'drained' during the battle in Vexusa in Hunter's Death and needed to be
reimbued for the End of Days.
>
> I mean, Fabril created these pieces...only to need additional work later, when
time is running out? Why not just create them right the first time?
>
> Aaron
>
> --- In MichelleWest@yahoogroups.com, Tchula Ripton <tchula@> wrote:
> >
> > rickayelm_69 wrote:
> > >> The events of Memory of Stone take place right after Hunter's Death,
right?
> > >>
> > > No, she reforges the artifacts to enable the kings to use them against the
> > > demons. The kings use them in hunters death, so I would think that the
story
> > > takes place during the same scarran that is in Hunters death, or possibly
the
> > > one just prior to that.
> >
> > Yeah, I could've used a timeline for that story.  I wasn't sure exactly
> > when it took place either.  But I guess it would've had to have been
> > before the Kings and the army entered the tomb of Moorelas to fight the
> > demons.
> >
> > Tchula
> >
>

Nenyane is described, though not by name, in Sea of Sorrows during Margaret's
vision. She seems to be of an age with Stephen of Maubreche, who was 8 years old
when she arrived with Evayne.

Even if the events of Memory of Stone took place just before Hunter's Death,
that would put Cessaly at about 17 or so. Plenty old enough to have a child.
Plus, time works oddly on the old roads (according to Calliastra).

The only folks with silver eyes we've seen so far have been Arianni, Meralonne,
and the Gardener (and potentially other Firstborn that I've forgotten). In the
past, I could just never figure out where an Arianni child would have come from.
However, at the end of Memory of Stone, Meralonne implies that Cessaly will
survive, since the Arianni are proof against her type of madness.

I must have missed this discussion.

Aaron

--- In MichelleWest@yahoogroups.com, "evalynjewell" <emira@...> wrote:
>
>
> Thank you for this answer because it caused me to dig out Memory of Stone and
reread it...what a touching story.
>
> However, as quoted below Nenyane is speaking or screaming a the Demon in an
unknown or uncommon language which I infer the Demon understands however it does
not expect her to know... I know the Kiriel can speak demon but I think Sidure
Mellifus understands or can read it but it is forbidden speak, so if Cessaly is
Nenyane's mother she would have learned demon speak from who???
>
> I was a part of last year's Nenyane discuss and read the ones that have taken
place in the past, I just am not satisfied...is she alluded to in other text? 
She is old, her hair is silver not through color but by age and she is not
normally a child, and she is a part of the "we" group that encompasses the gods
and Evayne.  Her eyes I believe are silver and so I am mystified.
>
>
>
>
> --- In MichelleWest@yahoogroups.com, "rickayelm_69" <rickayelm_69@> wrote:
>
> >
> > > 4. (HB. 304)  Nenyane screamed at the Demon in a language that Cynthia did
not understand.  The demon froze an instant and then turn to stare at her, 
incredulous.
> > > Who is Nenyane?
> > >
> > There is a whole topic about Nenyane that was posted last year, but I always
thought that she was the child of one of the firstborn and the female artisan
that was exiled to the winter woods in the short story Memories of stone.
>

And I've always been under the impression that the rod and the sword were
'drained' during the battle in Vexusa in Hunter's Death and needed to be
reimbued for the End of Days.

I mean, Fabril created these pieces...only to need additional work later, when
time is running out? Why not just create them right the first time?

Aaron

--- In MichelleWest@yahoogroups.com, Tchula Ripton <tchula@...> wrote:
>
> rickayelm_69 wrote:
> >> The events of Memory of Stone take place right after Hunter's Death, right?
> >>
> > No, she reforges the artifacts to enable the kings to use them against the
> > demons. The kings use them in hunters death, so I would think that the story
> > takes place during the same scarran that is in Hunters death, or possibly
the
> > one just prior to that.
>
> Yeah, I could've used a timeline for that story.  I wasn't sure exactly
> when it took place either.  But I guess it would've had to have been
> before the Kings and the army entered the tomb of Moorelas to fight the
> demons.
>
> Tchula
>

Thank you for this answer because it caused me to dig out Memory of Stone and
reread it...what a touching story.

However, as quoted below Nenyane is speaking or screaming a the Demon in an
unknown or uncommon language which I infer the Demon understands however it does
not expect her to know... I know the Kiriel can speak demon but I think Sidure
Mellifus understands or can read it but it is forbidden speak, so if Cessaly is
Nenyane's mother she would have learned demon speak from who???

I was a part of last year's Nenyane discuss and read the ones that have taken
place in the past, I just am not satisfied...is she alluded to in other text? 
She is old, her hair is silver not through color but by age and she is not
normally a child, and she is a part of the "we" group that encompasses the gods
and Evayne.  Her eyes I believe are silver and so I am mystified.




--- In MichelleWest@yahoogroups.com, "rickayelm_69" <rickayelm_69@...> wrote:

>
> > 4. (HB. 304)  Nenyane screamed at the Demon in a language that Cynthia did
not understand.  The demon froze an instant and then turn to stare at her, 
incredulous.
> > Who is Nenyane?
> >
> There is a whole topic about Nenyane that was posted last year, but I always
thought that she was the child of one of the firstborn and the female artisan
that was exiled to the winter woods in the short story Memories of stone.

rickayelm_69 wrote:
>> The events of Memory of Stone take place right after Hunter's Death, right?
>>
> No, she reforges the artifacts to enable the kings to use them against the
> demons. The kings use them in hunters death, so I would think that the story
> takes place during the same scarran that is in Hunters death, or possibly the
> one just prior to that.

Yeah, I could've used a timeline for that story.  I wasn't sure exactly
when it took place either.  But I guess it would've had to have been
before the Kings and the army entered the tomb of Moorelas to fight the
demons.

Tchula

--- In MichelleWest@yahoogroups.com, "ajmill1978" <ajmill1978@...> wrote:
>
>
>
> --- In MichelleWest@yahoogroups.com, "rickayelm_69" <rickayelm_69@> wrote:
> >
>
> > There is a whole topic about Nenyane that was posted last year, but I always
thought that she was the child of one of the firstborn and the female artisan
that was exiled to the winter woods in the short story Memories of stone.
> >
>
>
> I'd not seen this before, but it makes great sense! But Cessaly wasn't exiled,
was she? I thought she slipped into the Winter paths on Scarran so she could
"reimbue/recraft" the rod and the sword of the Kings. The Winter Queen claimed
her because of this...transgression.
>
My mistake, she is given a choice she can leave or the reforged artifacts can
leave. She chooses to stay.

> The events of Memory of Stone take place right after Hunter's Death, right?
>
No, she reforges the artifacts to enable the kings to use them against the
demons. The kings use them in hunters death, so I would think that the story
takes place during the same scarran that is in Hunters death, or possibly the
one just prior to that.
> Aaron
>

--- In MichelleWest@yahoogroups.com, "ajmill1978" <ajmill1978@...> wrote:
>
>
>
> --- In MichelleWest@yahoogroups.com, "rickayelm_69" <rickayelm_69@> wrote:
> >
>
> > There is a whole topic about Nenyane that was posted last year, but I always
thought that she was the child of one of the firstborn and the female artisan
that was exiled to the winter woods in the short story Memories of stone.
> >
>
>
> I'd not seen this before, but it makes great sense! But Cessaly wasn't exiled,
was she? I thought she slipped into the Winter paths on Scarran so she could
"reimbue/recraft" the rod and the sword of the Kings. The Winter Queen claimed
her because of this...transgression.
>
> The events of Memory of Stone take place right after Hunter's Death, right?
>
> Aaron
>

   I had never heard that theory of the origin of Nenyane either. It sent me
racing to my hoard of books to re-read that short story.
Cessaly walked the Winter Road in her bare feet. Therefore, the Winter Queen
claimed her. Guildmaster Guilafas was given the choice of taking Cessaly or the
restored Rod and Sword to the real world. Cessaly gave Guilafas the artifacts
and pushed him off of the Winter Road. That act fated Cessaly to remain forever
with the Winter Queen. Could she have born a child with a Firstborn? She was old
enough, possibly 16 or 17. There is nothing else in the story to guide me. Maybe
she had a child with one of the Arianni? That could possibly account for
Nenyane. Again, there is no information in the story to provide guidance.
The time line appears to be just before the assault on the Dark Cathedral under
Averalaan. That was why the restored Rod and Sword had to be returned so
desparately.
But Cessaly being the mother of Nenyane is an interesting theory. I would
appreciate any other data to lend support to it.


Ralph

--- In MichelleWest@yahoogroups.com, "rickayelm_69" <rickayelm_69@...> wrote:
>

> There is a whole topic about Nenyane that was posted last year, but I always
thought that she was the child of one of the firstborn and the female artisan
that was exiled to the winter woods in the short story Memories of stone.
>


I'd not seen this before, but it makes great sense! But Cessaly wasn't exiled,
was she? I thought she slipped into the Winter paths on Scarran so she could
"reimbue/recraft" the rod and the sword of the Kings. The Winter Queen claimed
her because of this...transgression.

The events of Memory of Stone take place right after Hunter's Death, right?

Aaron

--- In MichelleWest@yahoogroups.com, "evalynjewell" <emira@...> wrote:
>
> Today I started creating a chart on some of the younger power players in the
"Sunsword" storyline and it generated some questions... they are a bit random...
>
>
> 1.  How long to the Essalieyan Kings live?  How long will Prince Reymar and
Prince Cormar be waiting in the wings
> How old are they?
>
The godborn live shorter lives because their divine blood burns their mortal
bodies out. So since they have bean around for quite a while I would say that
their heirs will inherit soon.

> 2.  HB.275)   The god Breodan speaking to Lady Cynthia about Stephen… "We have
waited for the time…when your son is able to make himself heard across the wild
of the mortal plane."
> Wow, what's that mean, across the wild of the mortal plane???
>
Breodan was waiting until Stephan was old enough and strong enough to contact
him in the heavens without relying on the aid of the magical maze in the heart
of Maurbrecht.

> 3.a.  (HB.304)   The Master Gardner says , "I am Caralonne." …The
creature…shrieked in fury.  "Caralonne?" it spat.  "But you are dead!"
> 3.b.  (HB.269)   Lord Maubreche, Cynthia's father comes to
> get her after the birth of little Stephen, "The Gardner is older than the
Kingdom," he added quietly,  "And he swore his oath to the Hunter when Maubreche
was a man and not a great family.  He has labored for centuries upon this work."
> So who is Caralonne?  A hero of old?
>
I believe that he is one of the firstborn.

> 4. (HB. 304)  Nenyane screamed at the Demon in a language that Cynthia did not
understand.  The demon froze an instant and then turn to stare at her, 
incredulous.
> Who is Nenyane?
>
There is a whole topic about Nenyane that was posted last year, but I always
thought that she was the child of one of the firstborn and the female artisan
that was exiled to the winter woods in the short story Memories of stone.
> As you can probably tell I was reading a bit of Huntbrother.
>