Dear All,
I send my letter to Corina in case sb has a problem reaching our web
site.

-------- Original Message --------
Subject: [Fwd: PostPsychologyLab-Library]
Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 21:12:23 +0300
From: Yuri Bessarab <yuri@...>
Organization: NDI
To: ccrane@...

Dear Corina,
I had the same problem, it showed a mistake page but on this page I
clicked on address and it brought me to our front page. You could try to
use just this: http://victorian.fortunecity.com/brutalist/278/
Yuri.

-------- Original Message --------
Subject: PostPsychologyLab-Library
Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 21:01:01 +0300
From: Yuri Bessarab <yuri@...>
Organization: NDI/Kyiv
To: Yuri Bessarab <yuri@...>


http://victorian.fortunecity.com/brutalist/278/philosophy/philosophy.html

ps
couldn't have done it w/out u


Yuri Bessarab wrote:

> From: Yuri Bessarab <yuri@...>
>
> Dear Claudia,
> My name is Yuri Bessarab and I live in Ukraine. We have and continue
> building learning communities for some time already and very glad to
> hear about what you are doing. Since 1990 there were a lot of activities
> in this direction in Ukraine and Russia the epicenter of which was Dr.
> Valery Kourinski.
> In 1994 his book "Autodidactics" (loved by all of us and sometimes we
> call it a
> "Bible for Learning") was published. We monthly invite him to give
> presentations on
> topics of learning. Only last year in Kiev, Ukraine, we organized about
> 90
> presentations, TV\Radio interviews, seminars and trainings at which he
> was  the main
> speaker. In addition to mentioned we prepare for publishing his
> extremely valuable
> book "Self-Lerning Meditations" (a tiny part of it is available in
> English on our
> Website at:
> http://victorian.fortunecity.com/brutalist/278/philosophy/selfteachingm.html)
> and which is a "legato of thoughts" which has no end. Our plans include
> opening faculties of "Autodidactics and PostPsychology" in universities
> of Ukraine and Russia starting a regular TV\Radio program, making
> software for autodidacts, etc. We will be happy to contribute to your
> project.
> Sincerely,
> Yuri.
>
> > ----------
> > >From: "Claudia L'Amoreaux" <cl@...>
> > >To: CCL-LLCs@onelist.com
> >
> > > Appendix 2
> > > The Creating Learning Communities Online Resource Center and Network
> > >
> > > The Creating Learning Communities Online Resource Center is the web
> > > companion to the Creating Learning Communities book. The book's original
> > > chapters are presented in expanded, hyperlinked versions so people can
> > > delve more deeply into ideas presented. New chapters will be continually
> > > added, keeping the book up-to-date. An index of cooperative community
> > > learning centers includes a brief description of each center with contact
> > > information and
> > > links to their website (if they have one).
> > >
> > > Visitors to the online resource center can participate in the CLC Network
> > > by joining the "LearningCommunities" discussion list. Started in February,
> > > 1999, the discussion list has recently branched into two
> > > lists--"LearningCommunities" and "CCL-LLCs." The "LearningCommunities"
list
> > > hosts discussion about the future of society, with an emphasis on making
> > > the necessary transition from an androcentric to an ecocentric worldview,
and
> > > from what author Riane Eisler calls a "dominator society" to a
"partnership
> > > society." The members of A Coalition for Self-Learning have called this
new
> > > paradigm, Gaian, and put it forward as the basis for future life-long
> > > learning systems, grounded in evolutionary cultural change. The concepts
> > > and philosophy of creating learning communities are explored here in
depth,
> > > as are the practical concerns and issues. The "CCL-LLCs" list is for A
> > > Coalition for Self Learning business. Both lists are open to anyone.
> > > Discussions are archived and accessible through the online resource
center.
> > >
> > > Individuals and groups wanting to start learning centers in their
> > > communities will find ongoing support and working models for inspiration.
> > > As the resource center grows, we plan to add photos, progress reports, and
> > > interviews,
> > > especially with young people involved in these learning centers. Hot
> > > discussion threads from the list will be featured as well. The online
> > > resource center also serves as A Coalition for Self Learning's media hub
for
> > > coordinating efforts to let more people know about this powerful model for
> > > cultural transformation.
> > >
> > > The Creating Learning Communities Online Resource Center is currently
> > > hosted by network member Ib Bang on his website in Denmark. The CLC
network
> > > discussion lists are moderated by Bill Ellis and Michael Reber. Both lists
are
> > > hosted on One List.
> > >
> > > > Cooperative Community Life-Long Learning Centers (CCL-LLCs) are emerging
> > > from the rapidly growing homeschooling and autodidact movements.  They are
> > > the foundation for a radically different society.  What are your thoughts?
> > >
> >
> > > Community email addresses:
> >   Post message: LearningCommunities@onelist.com
> >   Subscribe:    LearningCommunities-subscribe@onelist.com
> >   Unsubscribe:  LearningCommunities-unsubscribe@onelist.com
> >   List owner:   LearningCommunities-owner@onelist.com
> >
> > Shortcut URL to this page:
> >   http://www.onelist.com/community/LearningCommunities
>
> > Community email addresses:
>   Post message: LearningCommunities@onelist.com
>   Subscribe:    LearningCommunities-subscribe@onelist.com
>   Unsubscribe:  LearningCommunities-unsubscribe@onelist.com
>   List owner:   LearningCommunities-owner@onelist.com
>
> Shortcut URL to this page:
>   http://www.onelist.com/community/LearningCommunities

Dear Yuri,
I am very glad to hear from you. I have had a chance to read some of Valery's
articles. I can see there are some very interesting ideas there. I especially
liked
the one about time. Like Ann, I would like to hear more of your work there in
Ukraine.
Please tell more about your autodidactics and post psychology club. If you can,
share
some of the things you do in your workshops, and who attends.

I look forward to dialoguing with you about self learning.
Best
Claudia

Yuri Bessarab wrote:

> From: Yuri Bessarab <yuri@...>
>
> Dear Claudia,
> My name is Yuri Bessarab and I live in Ukraine. We have and continue
> building learning communities for some time already and very glad to
> hear about what you are doing. Since 1990 there were a lot of activities
> in this direction in Ukraine and Russia the epicenter of which was Dr.
> Valery Kourinski.
> In 1994 his book "Autodidactics" (loved by all of us and sometimes we
> call it a
> "Bible for Learning") was published. We monthly invite him to give
> presentations on
> topics of learning. Only last year in Kiev, Ukraine, we organized about
> 90
> presentations, TV\Radio interviews, seminars and trainings at which he
> was  the main
> speaker. In addition to mentioned we prepare for publishing his
> extremely valuable
> book "Self-Lerning Meditations" (a tiny part of it is available in
> English on our
> Website at:
> http://victorian.fortunecity.com/brutalist/278/philosophy/selfteachingm.html)
> and which is a "legato of thoughts" which has no end. Our plans include
> opening faculties of "Autodidactics and PostPsychology" in universities
> of Ukraine and Russia starting a regular TV\Radio program, making
> software for autodidacts, etc. We will be happy to contribute to your
> project.
> Sincerely,
> Yuri.
>
> > ----------
> > >From: "Claudia L'Amoreaux" <cl@...>
> > >To: CCL-LLCs@onelist.com
> >
> > > Appendix 2
> > > The Creating Learning Communities Online Resource Center and Network
> > >
> > > The Creating Learning Communities Online Resource Center is the web
> > > companion to the Creating Learning Communities book. The book's original
> > > chapters are presented in expanded, hyperlinked versions so people can
> > > delve more deeply into ideas presented. New chapters will be continually
> > > added, keeping the book up-to-date. An index of cooperative community
> > > learning centers includes a brief description of each center with contact
> > > information and
> > > links to their website (if they have one).
> > >
> > > Visitors to the online resource center can participate in the CLC Network
> > > by joining the "LearningCommunities" discussion list. Started in February,
> > > 1999, the discussion list has recently branched into two
> > > lists--"LearningCommunities" and "CCL-LLCs." The "LearningCommunities"
list
> > > hosts discussion about the future of society, with an emphasis on making
> > > the necessary transition from an androcentric to an ecocentric worldview,
and
> > > from what author Riane Eisler calls a "dominator society" to a
"partnership
> > > society." The members of A Coalition for Self-Learning have called this
new
> > > paradigm, Gaian, and put it forward as the basis for future life-long
> > > learning systems, grounded in evolutionary cultural change. The concepts
> > > and philosophy of creating learning communities are explored here in
depth,
> > > as are the practical concerns and issues. The "CCL-LLCs" list is for A
> > > Coalition for Self Learning business. Both lists are open to anyone.
> > > Discussions are archived and accessible through the online resource
center.
> > >
> > > Individuals and groups wanting to start learning centers in their
> > > communities will find ongoing support and working models for inspiration.
> > > As the resource center grows, we plan to add photos, progress reports, and
> > > interviews,
> > > especially with young people involved in these learning centers. Hot
> > > discussion threads from the list will be featured as well. The online
> > > resource center also serves as A Coalition for Self Learning's media hub
for
> > > coordinating efforts to let more people know about this powerful model for
> > > cultural transformation.
> > >
> > > The Creating Learning Communities Online Resource Center is currently
> > > hosted by network member Ib Bang on his website in Denmark. The CLC
network
> > > discussion lists are moderated by Bill Ellis and Michael Reber. Both lists
are
> > > hosted on One List.
> > >
> > > > Cooperative Community Life-Long Learning Centers (CCL-LLCs) are emerging
> > > from the rapidly growing homeschooling and autodidact movements.  They are
> > > the foundation for a radically different society.  What are your thoughts?
> > >
> >
> > > Community email addresses:
> >   Post message: LearningCommunities@onelist.com
> >   Subscribe:    LearningCommunities-subscribe@onelist.com
> >   Unsubscribe:  LearningCommunities-unsubscribe@onelist.com
> >   List owner:   LearningCommunities-owner@onelist.com
> >
> > Shortcut URL to this page:
> >   http://www.onelist.com/community/LearningCommunities
>
> > Community email addresses:
>   Post message: LearningCommunities@onelist.com
>   Subscribe:    LearningCommunities-subscribe@onelist.com
>   Unsubscribe:  LearningCommunities-unsubscribe@onelist.com
>   List owner:   LearningCommunities-owner@onelist.com
>
> Shortcut URL to this page:
>   http://www.onelist.com/community/LearningCommunities

----------
From: Alexander & Kathia Laszlo <Syntony.Quest@...>
To: Syntony Quest <Syntony.Quest@...>
Subject: Call for Papers
Date: Wed, Oct 27, 1999, 8:37 PM


Dear Friends and Colleagues:

We cordially invite you to join us at the 44th annual meeting
of the International Society for the Systems Sciences (ISSS).
Specifically, we hope you will consider contributing a paper
for presentation in the ELC (Evolutionary Learning Community)
Special Integration Group (SIG) that it is our pleasure to
co-chair.

Please visit the webpage dedicated to ELC SIG 2000.  That
page presents the following information about the ELC SIG:
1.  Title and organizational affiliation
2.  A brief statement of goals, purposes, and history
3.  The Co-Chairs plus their contact information
4.  The official Call for Papers
5.  A brief statement regarding topics, format, and focus
6.  Abstracts from the previous (43rd) ISSS annual meeting
7.  A selected paper from the 43rd ISSS meeting which lays
     the groundwork for Evolutionary Learning Community inquiry
8.  The Website URL of the sponsoring organization (Syntony Quest)
For all this information, and to find out how to participate
with the contribution of a paper for the 44th meeting of the ISSS,
point your browser to the following URL -
::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
              http://isss.org/sigs/sig29elc.htm
::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
Please note the following dates and deadlines for participation:
•  Abstracts: 1 December 1999
-> notification of acceptance: 31 December 1999
•  Full paper plus pre-registration: 1 April 2000
•  Revised final paper: 30 April 2000
Note: Abstracts and papers are to be submitted both to the SIG
       Co-Chairs and to ISSS Program Coordinator, Jennifer Wilby
       (see website URLs below for further infromation).

The ISSS Conference is scheduled to take place from 16-21 July
2000 at Ryerson Polytechnic University in Downtown Toronto,
Canada.  This will be a very special meeting created in
conjunction with some 20 other organizations to create a
World Congress of the Systems Sciences.  For more information
about the World Congress/ISSS 2000 event, including further
details on how to register and where to send things, please
point your browser to the following URLs -
--
World Congress/ISSS 2000 announcement
http://www.isss.org/2000meet/2000anno.htm
--
ISSS Homepage
http://www.isss.org/
--

Of course, if there is anything we can help clarify for you
with respect to the above, please do get in touch with us.
All of our contact information follows immediately after our
"signature," below.

Best wishes, and in anticipation of an engaging conference,
- Alexander & Kathia Laszlo
   Co-Chairs, ISSS ELC SIG
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Alexander Laszlo, Ph.D.               Kathia C. Laszlo, M.Ed.
President             > Syntony Quest <          Executive VP
1761 Vallejo Street, Suite 302, San Francisco, CA  94123-5029
Phone/Fax: ++415/346.1547   ><   eMail: Syntony.Quest@...
Website URL: http://home.earthlink.net/~aklaszlo/syntonyquest
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Dear Corina,
try these links:
http://victorian.fortunecity.com/brutalist/278/
http://victorian.fortunecity.com/brutalist/278/philosophy/philosophy.html

Yaroslav

Corina Crane wrote:

> From: "Corina Crane" <ccrane@...>
>
> Yuri wrote:
>
> >>In Kiev and  Moscow. Chapter 1 (Rus.) and "Thesis to Autodidactics" (Eng.)
are
> available on our web site at:
> http://victorian.fortunecity.com/brutalist/278/philosophy.html>>
>
> I tried this link but it came up with an error - not found on server.  Could
you please resend the URL?
>
> Thank you,
>
> Corina
>
> ______________________________________________________________________
> Get Visto.com!  Private groups, event calendars, email, and much more.
> Visto.com. Life on the Dot.
> Check it out @ http://www.visto.com/info
>
> > Community email addresses:
>   Post message: LearningCommunities@onelist.com
>   Subscribe:    LearningCommunities-subscribe@onelist.com
>   Unsubscribe:  LearningCommunities-unsubscribe@onelist.com
>   List owner:   LearningCommunities-owner@onelist.com
>
> Shortcut URL to this page:
>   http://www.onelist.com/community/LearningCommunities

Yuri wrote:

>>In Kiev and  Moscow. Chapter 1 (Rus.) and "Thesis to Autodidactics" (Eng.) are
available on our web site at:
http://victorian.fortunecity.com/brutalist/278/philosophy.html>>

I tried this link but it came up with an error - not found on server.  Could you
please resend the URL?

Thank you,

Corina


______________________________________________________________________
Get Visto.com!  Private groups, event calendars, email, and much more.
Visto.com. Life on the Dot.
Check it out @ http://www.visto.com/info

Dear Ann,
thanks aplenty for your letter! For better understanding I define a 'learning
community' as a group of people united around a philosophy of learning (in our
case it's Autodidactics & PostPsychology) which becomes both modus operandi and
modus vivendi, is based on certain ideas, has a goal and provides tools for
reaching it.  After searching through for sth close to our philosophy in
Border's, Creamer's, Crown and other bookstores in Washington D.C. last February
I realized that Dr. Kourinsky has found the laws and built the comprehensive
philosophy of learning for at least the next century. And you know Ann, once a
law is opened - nobody can close it.

Ann Lahrson Fisher wrote:

> From: Ann Lahrson Fisher <ann@...>
>
> Dear Yuri,
>
> >
> > Dear Bill and all,
> > In my letter to Claudia I tried to explain that we have already learning
> > communities in Ukraine and Russia. We are already doing it practically,
> > have a splendid theory since 1990 which works perfect [..]. [snip]
>
> ALF:
> I am glad to hear of your successes!  I would be interested in learning more
> of the details of how learning communities work in Ukraine and Russia, if
> you could take time to write about that.

I told in my previous mail about our past activities and plans for future. The
present is enlightened by those things we are delightedly doing individually and
as a group. We invited Dr. Kourinski to come from Moscow and give us three
presentation on Nov. 2-4, 1999 in "Benefice" Theater in Kiev on "Theory and
Practice of Friendliness" and we know he's coming. Ukrainian Children Art
Academy invited him too and we are jealous they got more of his time. In the
beginning of October he gave a presentation to a big  audience in Slavic Studies
University of Ukraine.
After presentations are over we learn them, discuss them in our discussion
groups, transcribe and put them on our web site, but more importantly - we apply
the knowledge in our everyday life. We are reaching other people, civic groups
and even political parties. A week ago our representative spoke at the
conference at Ministry of Culture and we expect some progress there too. The
core of our learning community in Kiev consists of 45 individuals of different
age and various professions. In addition to Autodidactics & PostPsychology all
of us learn philosophy, languages, music, cultures, art and literatures, etc. We
have very nice cooperation with such learning communities in Russia though they
are our main competitors for time of Dr.Kourinsky. We organize everything on our
own.

>
>
> There are many other successful learning communities all over the world.
> Despite these successes, the predominant model of schooling, at least in the
> US, does not properly address how people actually learn.  Sadly, the
> knowledge that you and I have is disregarded by the majority!

Dear Ann, in our case it's because we are often calm as a church mouse.

>
>
> The point of this book, written by 30+ different authors,  is to communicate
> as widely as we can, the enormous diversity of educational approaches found
> in successful learning communities.
>
> YB:
>
> > I scanned Border's Bookstore recently and there is hardly any book which
> > is as valuable for those who want to learn as "Autodidactics" by V.A.
> > Kourinsky. What I just said doesn't make us hooded to all Really
> > Valuable Ideas or books. It makes us even more open. But will we
> > continue playing  ostrich game?
>
> ALF:
> But isn't that the just point we try to address by writing this Learning
> Communities book?  We are trying to get our ostrich heads out of the sand
> and create one more book that might make a difference.  I want to see rows
> and rows of books in bookstores and libraries, and thousands of Internet
> URLs, that discuss the simple truths of how people learn.  There should be
> many books with very different approaches to meet the diverse needs of
> individuals.
>
> I wonder if I misunderstood your meaning.

Sorry if I set my great expectations from LearningCommunities too high i.e. to
propose profound philosophies of learning which are applicable and breathtaking
at the same time. Hopefully I will be forgiven for I've just joined this
discussion group.

I would be very sad if what is said by me about Autodidactics & PostPsychology
is taken not seriously and simplistically. That would be the biggest
misunderstanding. It's a quite thorough philosophy of learning.

>
>
> Do you know where one could purchase a copy of Kourinsky's book?

In Kiev and  Moscow. Chapter 1 (Rus.) and "Thesis to Autodidactics" (Eng.) are
available on our web site at:
http://victorian.fortunecity.com/brutalist/278/philosophy.html


>
>
> Sincerely,
> Ann Lahrson Fisher
> ann@...
> http://www.nettlepatch.net/homeschool

Thank you again,
Yuri.

>
>
> > Community email addresses:
>   Post message: LearningCommunities@onelist.com
>   Subscribe:    LearningCommunities-subscribe@onelist.com
>   Unsubscribe:  LearningCommunities-unsubscribe@onelist.com
>   List owner:   LearningCommunities-owner@onelist.com
>
> Shortcut URL to this page:
>   http://www.onelist.com/community/LearningCommunities

Ann, I've read of Purdy in the Christian Science Monitor some time ago.
He is proof positive that homeschooling works.  I hope to hear more from him
and have invited hims to join Learning Communities.
Bill
Attached is the Washington Post clip.

----------
>From: Ann Lahrson Fisher <ann@...>
> This may be of interest to some...
>

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Dr. Thein,
We would love to have a short description of your "green house" for our
Sectin III. "Models and Resources.'  (Name, Address, Contact Information,
Mission Statement, and 25 to 250 word description of how it came together
and how it works.)
And don't stay silent.  This movement needs you.
Bill Ellis

----------
> From: "Dr. Khin Ni Ni Thein" <nin@...>
> I have been a quiet reader of the list. Thanks to Bill for his welcoming
> note to me.
>
> Bill said:
>> John, thanks for the Corn and Community parable.
>> I applies to the CCL-LLCs project in which I am now involved.
>
> Me too, I applied it in my current work, i.e. 'Creating a learning
> environment' for the Burmese peoples. Our current situation is that we
> cannot probably create 'learning communities' in practice at this stage.
> So, I am paving my way, millimeter by millimeter, in order to
> 'create the learning communities in Burma', by creating 'a green house
> atmosphere = learning environment', here and now.
>
>> If we can promote the concept of "Creating Learning Communities" we will
>> all benefit not just those writing the book.
>> Our book, "Creating Learning Communities" is the ideas of many written
>> by a few for the benefit of all.
>
> I do agree with that. Moreover, what I'd like to express is this. We,
> Burmese people, have already benefitted from the list and we are most
> grateful for it. I will again submerged in the postings and be quiet for
> some time again. In the mean time, will be seriously learning and
> applying.
>
> With metta and respect,
> NiNi
>
> Dr. Khin Ni Ni Thein (Ms.)
> WRTC

I apologize for not sending my edited version for approval to the whole
group.  Time had actual expired for the Decker Award so I rushed it a
little.  We are still awaiting your final version.  Attached is a PC version
of what I mailed.
Bill


> From: "Claudia L'Amoreaux" <cl@...>
>
> Hi Bill.
> I'd like to suggest that  if any of us are going to edit someone's writing,
send it back first to them before sending off somewhere.
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Dear Yuri,

> From: Yuri Bessarab <yuri@...>
>
> Dear Bill and all,
> In my letter to Claudia I tried to explain that we have already learning
> communities in Ukraine and Russia. We are already doing it practically,
> have a splendid theory since 1990 which works perfect [..]. [snip]

ALF:
I am glad to hear of your successes!  I would be interested in learning more
of the details of how learning communities work in Ukraine and Russia, if
you could take time to write about that.

There are many other successful learning communities all over the world.
Despite these successes, the predominant model of schooling, at least in the
US, does not properly address how people actually learn.  Sadly, the
knowledge that you and I have is disregarded by the majority!

The point of this book, written by 30+ different authors,  is to communicate
as widely as we can, the enormous diversity of educational approaches found
in successful learning communities.

YB:

> I scanned Border's Bookstore recently and there is hardly any book which
> is as valuable for those who want to learn as "Autodidactics" by V.A.
> Kourinsky. What I just said doesn't make us hooded to all Really
> Valuable Ideas or books. It makes us even more open. But will we
> continue playing  ostrich game?

ALF:
But isn't that the just point we try to address by writing this Learning
Communities book?  We are trying to get our ostrich heads out of the sand
and create one more book that might make a difference.  I want to see rows
and rows of books in bookstores and libraries, and thousands of Internet
URLs, that discuss the simple truths of how people learn.  There should be
many books with very different approaches to meet the diverse needs of
individuals.

I wonder if I misunderstood your meaning.

Do you know where one could purchase a copy of Kourinsky's book?

Sincerely,
Ann Lahrson Fisher
ann@...
http://www.nettlepatch.net/homeschool

This may be of interest to some...

Interesting young man.

Blessings,
Joanne


      For Common Things - Irony, Trust, and Commitment in America Today by
Jedediah Purdy is a new book out ($75,000 advance) by a young (24yo) man who
was HSed until 13.   After graduating from high school, he spent a year
traveling in eastern Europe and working as a carpenter in W VA before
attending Harvard.  (He describes public high school in W VA as purgatory
from which he escaped as a senior by attending a private school.)  He is now
in his 2nd year at Yale Law School.

http://search.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/WPlate/1999-10/24/103l-102499-idx.html
  <A
HREF="http://search.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/WPlate/1999-10/24/103l-102499-id
x.html">The Adventures of Anti-Irony Boy</A>
>From a Washington Post article, on Sunday, October 24th, on the front page of
the Style section: "The Adventures of Anti-Irony Boy" by Katherine Marsh --
"Jed Purdy's precocious tome decrying the callousness of our times sent the
media elite into high howl. Is it really such a sin to want to save the world
from Seinfeld?"

Quoted from the article:
Why, Purdy asks in his book, can't we all just start believing in, and
working for the common good again?  "The truth," he writes, "is that the
possibility of a decent life is partly an achievement of political and public
institutions, and that ignoring these is the surest way to hasten their
decline."

Also:
Though Purdy's book is clearly about much more --  his main point is an
impassioned plea for renewed commitment to, and belief in, grass-roots
politics as a way to improve the world, "a way of thinking and doing, that
has more promise of goodness than the one we are now following" ...

And some more:
Irony which Purdy defines as, "refusal to believe in the depths of
relationships, the sincerity of motivation, or the truth of speech --
especially earnest speech...

Yet more:
"One of the things about being romantic by nature," he explains, "is that you
want to be able to commit yourself in an intimate way.  I hoped on some level
that the book would be a way to connect with the people who read it."  In
"For Common Things," Purdy refers to the project of the book as "one young
man's letter of love for the world's possibilities," ...

Greetings
I was not certain to which list to announce having posted material in to
Files of Learning Communities. I have cut and edited my previous submission
down to 2,600. A working draft of that, as well as a jpeg file is there for
the group's feedback and input.
Someone please set me straight if there appears to be the need.

A previous posting by Silvia Austerlic has peaked my interest. I am
interested  in your mindbook Silvia, wondering if there might be the
possibility of strategic collaborations.

Bernie Slepkov
Founder: DreamTEAMS International - HEALING FRAGMENTED COMMUNITIES
bernies@...
http://www.mergetel.com/dreamteams

Dear Bill and all,
In my letter to Claudia I tried to explain that we have already learning
communities in Ukraine and Russia. We are already doing it practically,
have a splendid theory since 1990 which works perfect and happy to share
both with you and I am surprised there were no reaction. - Everybody's
busy trying to get into the book... Maybe we could try to see how the
book works first?
I scanned Border's Bookstore recently and there is hardly any book which
is as valuable for those who want to learn as "Autodidactics" by V.A.
Kourinsky. What I just said doesn't make us hooded to all Really
Valuable Ideas or books. It makes us even more open. But will we
continue playing  ostrich game?
Sincerely,
Yuri.

John, thanks for the Corn and Community parable.
I applies to the CCL-LLCs project in which I am now involved.
If we can promote the concept of "Creating Learning Communities" we will all
benefit not just those writing the book.
Our book, "Creating Learning Communities" is the ideas of many written by a
few for the benefit of all.
You can read the on-line version on:
--------------------------------------------
<http://www.futureworld.dk/ccl-llc/book.htm>
----------------------------------------------
Best regards
Bill Ellis

----------
>From: John Steiner <steiner_king@...>
>Subject: Growing corn and community
>Date: Tue, Oct 26, 1999, 6:38 AM
>

>> Thanks to Ken Druck for the following and John Vasconcellos for passing it
>> along.
>>
>> James Bender, in his book "How to Talk Well" (New York: McGraw-Hill Book
>> Company, Inc. 1994) relates the story of a farmer who grew award-winning
>> corn. Each year he entered his corn in the state fair where it won a blue
>> ribbon. One year a newspaper reporter interviewed him and learned something
>> interesting about how he grew it.
>>
>> The reporter discovered that the farmer shared his seed corn with his
>> neighbors. "How can you afford to share your best seed corn with your
>> neighbors when they are entering corn in competition with yours each year?"
>> the reporter asked. "Why sir," said the farmer, "didn't you know? The wind
>> picks up pollen from the ripening corn and swirls it from field to field. If
>> my neighbors grow inferior corn, cross-pollination will steadily degrade the
>> quality of my corn. If I am to grow good corn, I must help my neighbors grow
>> good corn."
>>
>> He is very much aware of the connectedness of life. His corn cannot improve
>> unless his neighbor's corn also improves.  So it is in other dimensions.
>> Those who choose to live well must help others to live well, for the value of
>> a life is measured by the lives it touches.  The welfare of each is bound up
>> with the welfare of all.
>>
>> The lesson for each of us is this: if we are to grow good corn, we must help
>> our neighbors grow good corn.
>

Hello:

I just uploaded to the files of this listserv a paper that we
wrote on Evolutionary Systems Design (ESD). If our work is about
creating the conditions for the emergence of Evolutionary Learning
Community, ESD is the *process* that we suggest for such a work. This
paper presents where we (AK) are coming from and our assumptions.
I think it is relevant to the areas of inquiry of this community.
I am including in this message the abstract.

Kathia

P.S. This paper will be published in World Futures in a special
issue in honor of Bela H. Banathy.

----

ABSTRACT

This paper presents the genesis of Evolutionary Systems Design (ESD)
as a praxis that draws on General Evolution Theory and Social
Systems Design methodology, in addition to Critical Systems Theory,
to engage in life-long learning and human development in partnership
with Earth.  The contributions of Bela H. Banathy to the creation of
ESD are portrayed as bridging evolutionary consciousness and evolutionary
action.  Following a brief description of the inspiration and mentorship
provided by Bela in this regard, the roots of ESD are traced back to
General Evolution Theory.  It is described how notions of evolutionary
stewardship grew out of encounters with Bela and his work at the International
Systems Institute, and were given operational viability through the
methodology
of Social Systems Design he developed.  The fundamental tenets of ESD are
presented and discussed by way of a four stage evolutionary learning
framework.
Finally, the vehicle of Evolutionary Learning Community through which ESD
operates is shown to embody the potential for individuals and groups to
think, live, and act in harmony with the dynamics of which they are a part
as a means to guide the conscious creation of sustainability.


KEYWORDS:  General Evolution Theory, Social Systems Design, Evolutionary
Systems Design, Evolutionary Learning Community, syntony, sustainability,
life-long learning.


--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Alexander Laszlo, Ph.D.             Kathia C. Laszlo, M.Ed.
                        Syntony Quest
   1761 Vallejo Street, Suite 302, San Francisco, CA 94123
  Phone/Fax: (415) 346-1547 // eMail: Syntony.Quest@...
    http://home.earthlink.net/~aklaszlo/syntonyquest/
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

----- Original Message -----
From: Bill Ellis <tranet@...>
To: <LearningCommunities@onelist.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 26, 1999 6:01 PM
Subject: Re: [LearningCommunities] Cooperative Learning Appendix I


> From: "Bill Ellis" <tranet@...>
>
> BE:
> Bernies, a copy of by EFSS Lecture, "Flapping Butterfly Wings," is on its
> way.
> I don't think we are far apart in our views, but will add a couple of
> comments to your comments.
>
> BS:
> > I think
> > that you K&A, are inadvertently "social engineers" and if not, the
flapping
> > of your butterfly wings are certain to cause a hurricane somewhere. ...
> > My main point being, that this network, with or with out your
involvement
> > K&A, will affect changes in education.... It really is hard to
> > know what the long-term affects may have in the conventional and or
> > grassroots education, but it will make an impact.
> BE:
> This is a definitional difference. To me social engingeers along with most
> futurists, planners, and designers, believe that with enough tools they
can
> predict and create the future.  I hold that no one can accurately predict
or
> plan from current knowledge.  We cannot design the future, but we can
design
> FOR it.  Be prepared, like we prepare for hurricanes, earthquakes, floods
> and Y2K.  If we construct the right houses, dams, food supplies, health
> systems etc we will be prepared for the long term effects of the flapping
> butterfly wings.  Preparation does affect the future, it does not make the
> future.


VK
All that is very well said, Bill, but, as to me, is not that correct as it
sounds.
Time to be is influenced by the way we live in the previous phase. The
history, of course, is a mysterious "system","constellation of events and
their sensorial consequencies"  of which we always are aware only partly.
Nevertheless our doing have more actual force, causes much more effect of
both negative and positive character.
The future, thanks Goodness, the cultural construction of it is dependable
on us with you, on our choise of internal activity, on our inside and
outward bahaviour. Thus, analogy with preparation to earthquake,
notwithstanding its sympathetic appearance is not valid as a "key phrase" to
activate constantly and continuasly elevated, inspired and in a best sense
romantic work of education.

>
> BS:
> > These butterfly wing flapping have everything to do with (the science
of)
> > complexity and chaos. Dee Hock of the Chaordic Alliance is quoted as
saying
> > that "[a]t the edge of chaos, on a very narrow band, lives a kind of
sublime
> > order." Thinking that I have a sense of that, I have a motto I use in my
> > line of work. Perhaps, in many ways I am a "social engineer" of sorts -
a
> > futurist with a type of approach that seeks to control and predict. For
me,
> > you, this network or community is living the motto of "Harnessing Chaos
and
> > Directing Change."




VK
I'm barging again but...
This is, I beg athor of the above words pardon, ment in an obsolete
interpteretative style  at least of a  notion 'chaos'. Chaos is, now,  not a
catastrophe but an ingridient of a normal reality, that educational
included.
By the way, there is a very lovely "butterfly of strange attractor" which is
not going to fly off from the creative area of humankind. And moreover,  its
presense is necessary to invent whatsoever I  (or any body else) would like
to do...

'> BE:
> Agaoib a definitial difference.  HARNESSING CHAOS is an oxymoron in my
> definition of harnessing.  Chaos cannot be contolled by definition.
VK
That is (see above) just a question. Using something we in some sense are
controlling it.

  But on
> the order side of the border between chaos and order there is a flexibilty
> that is not available in either rigid order. or random chaos.
> I would prefer the motto "Recognizeing Chaos and Preparing for Change."

VK
Chaos is a condition in the ontological task of human. mAnd in every task at
large, too. Every problem, even the slightest, starts with chaotic state of
mind.
Then how one may to claim non-omnipresence of chaos (in the above meaning of
word) in everyday life and educative process? Naturally, teacher must
recognize Chaos as everybody recognizes his own feet in order to walk across
the street.

[skip]

VK
The very hint on holodynamics make me confused (therefore I skiped the
corresponding part of quoted message :^)).  That is, in my view, once
more example of oversimplifyed approaches.
The philosophy of contemporary teaching/learning (that, by the way, this  is
considerably the same, as it seems to me) has to be grounded on the ancient
dialectical principles and in such way face with honour the future.

Regards.

Valery A. Kourinsky

Hi Bill.
I'd like to suggest that in the future, if any of us are going to edit someone's
writing, send it back first to them before sending off somewhere like BBC. It
would
feel a bit more collaborative.
I am aware you were probably feeling time pressure.
But I would have had a few corrections. (I was an editor for years for a
California
publisher. My editing skills would probably be a good "partnership" with your
dyslexia.) And I would have made a few suggestions. Then the writing would be
more
of a true partnership. You take in what I write and have a few things to add, I
take in what you have written and have a few suggested changes, etc. Then we
arrive
together at something we are both satisfied with.

Can you send it to me in the body of email? Your file was a bit garbled. I'll
make
a few minor spelling corrections in case you plan to send it anywhere else. And
I'll add a sentence ot two about the difference between linear and web. I would
like to work on this sentence especially: "Individual linear learning, in
addition
teaching with publisdhed books, will be suplemented by networks of information
available thnrough the internet." It is far more than a supplement to linear
learning. I think it is actually the other way around. In the future, published
books and the occasional linear learning will supplement networked learning.
I'll
see what I can do to communicate it.

Best.
Claudia

Bill Ellis wrote:

> Yes, Claudia, I did send Appendis I and II along to BBC and also to the
> Decker Foundatin where I've been nominated for a Decker Award (What ever
> that is).  I edited your presentation slightly (see attachment).  But await
> your final version before adding to the book.
>
> ----------
> >From: "Claudia L'Amoreaux" <cl@...>
> >To: LearningCommunities@onelist.com
> >Subject: Re: [LearningCommunities] Re: Cooperative Learning Appendix 2
> >Date: Mon, Oct 25, 1999, 2:00 PM
> >
>
> > From: "Claudia L'Amoreaux" <cl@...>
> >
> > Hi Bill.
> > This version of Appendix 2 was written for you to pass on to the BBC in
> response to
> > one of your earlier mails.
>
>                               Name: Appendix II 10/26/99
>    Appendix II 10/26/99       Type: unspecified type
(application/octet-stream)
>                           Encoding: base64

Yes, Claudia, I did send Appendis I and II along to BBC and also to the
Decker Foundatin where I've been nominated for a Decker Award (What ever
that is).  I edited your presentation slightly (see attachment).  But await
your final version before adding to the book.

----------
>From: "Claudia L'Amoreaux" <cl@...>
>To: LearningCommunities@onelist.com
>Subject: Re: [LearningCommunities] Re: Cooperative Learning Appendix 2
>Date: Mon, Oct 25, 1999, 2:00 PM
>

> From: "Claudia L'Amoreaux" <cl@...>
>
> Hi Bill.
> This version of Appendix 2 was written for you to pass on to the BBC in
response to
> one of your earlier mails.

BE:
Bernies, a copy of by EFSS Lecture, "Flapping Butterfly Wings," is on its
way.
I don't think we are far apart in our views, but will add a couple of
comments to your comments.

BS:
> I think
> that you K&A, are inadvertently "social engineers" and if not, the flapping
> of your butterfly wings are certain to cause a hurricane somewhere. ...
> My main point being, that this network, with or with out your involvement
> K&A, will affect changes in education.... It really is hard to
> know what the long-term affects may have in the conventional and or
> grassroots education, but it will make an impact.
BE:
This is a definitional difference. To me social engingeers along with most
futurists, planners, and designers, believe that with enough tools they can
predict and create the future.  I hold that no one can accurately predict or
plan from current knowledge.  We cannot design the future, but we can design
FOR it.  Be prepared, like we prepare for hurricanes, earthquakes, floods
and Y2K.  If we construct the right houses, dams, food supplies, health
systems etc we will be prepared for the long term effects of the flapping
butterfly wings.  Preparation does affect the future, it does not make the
future.

BS:
> These butterfly wing flapping have everything to do with (the science of)
> complexity and chaos. Dee Hock of the Chaordic Alliance is quoted as saying
> that "[a]t the edge of chaos, on a very narrow band, lives a kind of sublime
> order." Thinking that I have a sense of that, I have a motto I use in my
> line of work. Perhaps, in many ways I am a "social engineer" of sorts - a
> futurist with a type of approach that seeks to control and predict. For me,
> you, this network or community is living the motto of "Harnessing Chaos and
> Directing Change."
BE:
Agaoib a definitial difference.  HARNESSING CHAOS is an oxymoron in my
definition of harnessing.  Chaos cannot be contolled by definition.  But on
the order side of the border between chaos and order there is a flexibilty
that is not available in either rigid order. or random chaos.
I would prefer the motto "Recognizeing Chaos and Preparing for Change."
Our thoughts are much the same although our words are different.

BS:
> You (in the spontaneous collective sense of the word) are obviously
> frustrated with education systems not living up to their goals of having
> taught us, and now our children, to hit the ground running after graduation.
BE:
It is, in my view,  much deeper than that.  Not only is LEARNING very
diffent than TEACHING.  But the concpet of GRADUATION is very differnt than
LIFE-LONG.
We don't hit the ground running after being educated.  Our whole life sould
be (and is) a continuum of learning and doing, as well as learning by doing.
We are always at the edge of chaos preparing for unknown opportunities.

BS:
> With regards to comments made about the term "holistic", which does have a
> tendency of pushing a few buttons for certain groups, I prefer to use the
> term "wholistic."
BE:
This issue is not one of just seeing the whole system, or the unity of the
universe.  I'm not sure either word captures the idea of
systems-within-systems, or holons within holons. As Ken Wliber defines the
universe "it is holons all the way up."  "Holonistic" does capture this
thought, but I've never heard the word before.
Bill

Dear Claudia,
My name is Yuri Bessarab and I live in Ukraine. We have and continue
building learning communities for some time already and very glad to
hear about what you are doing. Since 1990 there were a lot of activities
in this direction in Ukraine and Russia the epicenter of which was Dr.
Valery Kourinski.
In 1994 his book "Autodidactics" (loved by all of us and sometimes we
call it a
"Bible for Learning") was published. We monthly invite him to give
presentations on
topics of learning. Only last year in Kiev, Ukraine, we organized about
90
presentations, TV\Radio interviews, seminars and trainings at which he
was  the main
speaker. In addition to mentioned we prepare for publishing his
extremely valuable
book "Self-Lerning Meditations" (a tiny part of it is available in
English on our
Website at:
http://victorian.fortunecity.com/brutalist/278/philosophy/selfteachingm.html)
and which is a "legato of thoughts" which has no end. Our plans include
opening faculties of "Autodidactics and PostPsychology" in universities
of Ukraine and Russia starting a regular TV\Radio program, making
software for autodidacts, etc. We will be happy to contribute to your
project.
Sincerely,
Yuri.


> ----------
> >From: "Claudia L'Amoreaux" <cl@...>
> >To: CCL-LLCs@onelist.com
>
> > Appendix 2
> > The Creating Learning Communities Online Resource Center and Network
> >
> > The Creating Learning Communities Online Resource Center is the web
> > companion to the Creating Learning Communities book. The book's original
> > chapters are presented in expanded, hyperlinked versions so people can
> > delve more deeply into ideas presented. New chapters will be continually
> > added, keeping the book up-to-date. An index of cooperative community
> > learning centers includes a brief description of each center with contact
> > information and
> > links to their website (if they have one).
> >
> > Visitors to the online resource center can participate in the CLC Network
> > by joining the "LearningCommunities" discussion list. Started in February,
> > 1999, the discussion list has recently branched into two
> > lists--"LearningCommunities" and "CCL-LLCs." The "LearningCommunities" list
> > hosts discussion about the future of society, with an emphasis on making
> > the necessary transition from an androcentric to an ecocentric worldview,
and
> > from what author Riane Eisler calls a "dominator society" to a "partnership
> > society." The members of A Coalition for Self-Learning have called this new
> > paradigm, Gaian, and put it forward as the basis for future life-long
> > learning systems, grounded in evolutionary cultural change. The concepts
> > and philosophy of creating learning communities are explored here in depth,
> > as are the practical concerns and issues. The "CCL-LLCs" list is for A
> > Coalition for Self Learning business. Both lists are open to anyone.
> > Discussions are archived and accessible through the online resource center.
> >
> > Individuals and groups wanting to start learning centers in their
> > communities will find ongoing support and working models for inspiration.
> > As the resource center grows, we plan to add photos, progress reports, and
> > interviews,
> > especially with young people involved in these learning centers. Hot
> > discussion threads from the list will be featured as well. The online
> > resource center also serves as A Coalition for Self Learning's media hub for
> > coordinating efforts to let more people know about this powerful model for
> > cultural transformation.
> >
> > The Creating Learning Communities Online Resource Center is currently
> > hosted by network member Ib Bang on his website in Denmark. The CLC network
> > discussion lists are moderated by Bill Ellis and Michael Reber. Both lists
are
> > hosted on One List.
> >
> > > Cooperative Community Life-Long Learning Centers (CCL-LLCs) are emerging
> > from the rapidly growing homeschooling and autodidact movements.  They are
> > the foundation for a radically different society.  What are your thoughts?
> >
>
> > Community email addresses:
>   Post message: LearningCommunities@onelist.com
>   Subscribe:    LearningCommunities-subscribe@onelist.com
>   Unsubscribe:  LearningCommunities-unsubscribe@onelist.com
>   List owner:   LearningCommunities-owner@onelist.com
>
> Shortcut URL to this page:
>   http://www.onelist.com/community/LearningCommunities

Bill, unless my mind has gone, and I did attach a document to you, below is
the attachment that you have not been able to access. It is called a Vcard.
Anyone having an address book in one of the email programs, for the most
part, can have relevant contact information added to their address book at
the given command.
Bernie Slepkov
   Founder/The Impassionator
   DreamTEAMS International
                      <bernies@...>
                      HTML Mail
   64B North Street
   St, Catharines
   Ontario
   L2R 2S6
   Canada
                      Work: 905 684-7479
                      Fax: 905 684-0681
                      Netscape Conference Address
                      Netscape Conference DLS Server
   http://www.mergetel.com/dreamteams

   Additional Information:
   Last Name
           Slepkov
   First Name
           Bernie
   Version
           2.1

I have some points I wish to get across to a wider audience. Some points may
be in misdirected defence of Kathia & Alexander's and your response. I think
that you K&A, are inadvertently "social engineers" and if not, the flapping
of your butterfly wings are certain to cause a hurricane somewhere. (Bill,
please do forward me a copy of "Flapping Butterfly Wings" via snail mail.)
My main point being, that this network, with or with out your involvement
K&A, will affect changes in education. Maybe not in mainstream education,
perhaps mainstream education will adapt some of it. It really is hard to
know what the long-term affects may have in the conventional and or
grassroots education, but it will make an impact.

K&A, if I direct your attention to the file I added today to
http://LearningCommunities@onelist.com - a musing of some 3 years back that
marks the beginning of my involvement in stimulating social & economic
reforms in our societies.

These butterfly wing flapping have everything to do with (the science of)
complexity and chaos. Dee Hock of the Chaordic Alliance is quoted as saying
that "[a]t the edge of chaos, on a very narrow band, lives a kind of sublime
order." Thinking that I have a sense of that, I have a motto I use in my
line of work. Perhaps, in many ways I am a "social engineer" of sorts - a
futurist with a type of approach that seeks to control and predict. For me,
you, this network or community is living the motto of "Harnessing Chaos and
Directing Change."

You (in the spontaneous collective sense of the word) are obviously
frustrated with education systems not living up to their goals of having
taught us, and now our children, to hit the ground running after graduation.
Very few of our youth know what to do, or where to turn in contributing to
the greater society. After years of high level education, studies, reports,
ad-infinitum, our world stands on the brink of social and economic
collapse...So, here we are, brought from across great distances in the blink
of an eye, to make efforts to affect change in our societies, for our
children's future sake. Again, to get more directly to my point, we are
harnessing the chaos of our discontent to direct change that we feel holds
the promise of something better for everyone. In that, you, as much as I,
wish to control the future, to direct it in hopefully positive directions.

With regards to comments made about the term "holistic", which does have a
tendency of pushing a few buttons for certain groups, I prefer to use the
term "wholistic." For me, it encompasses the term holistic - generally
meaning a natural type of healing, but embracing a much bigger picture. This
plays well with the trends that many of us are now part of. We are gaining a
greater sense of the bigger picture, a picture in which we as wo/mankind are
evolving to a higher plane of enrichment. This is of course bound to have a
healing affect on our spirit and soul. Though perhaps poorly articulated by
me here - I usually like to take considerable to compose my messages - all
of this I'm sure is well articulated in a new book co-authored by John
Naisbitt and his daughter entitled "High Tech/High Touch." John Naisbitt is
the co-author of the famed MegaTrends and MegaTrends 2000.

Enough from me for now. Again, as always, I hope this has added some value
to what you are doing.

Bernie Slepkov

-----Original Message-----
From: Bill Ellis [mailto:tranet@...]
Sent: October 25, 1999 8:45 AM
To: LearningCommunities@onelist.com
Subject: [LearningCommunities] FW: Cooperative Learning Appendix I


From: "Bill Ellis" <tranet@...>


From: "Bill Ellis" <tranet@...>

Kathi and Alexander.  Souls after my own soul.
My response to your wonderful comments could go on and on.
But I'll try to only mention a couple of points.
And hope that you'll continue to discuss how we get the points across to a
wider audience.

----------

> From: Kathia and Alexander Laszlo <aklaszlo@...>
K&A:
...
> How can we communicate to others the emergent and self-organizing
> nature of our work -- which has nothing to do with "social engineering"
> type of approaches that seek to control and predict? However, we need to
> communicate that we are not leaving it to chance... we are actively trying
> to facilitate educational and social change. "We cannot direct the wind,
> but we can adjust the sails" is the proverb that I use to explain my quest
> to dance with the creative evolutionary processes. Our work is about
creating
> the conditions for new forms of education to emerge -- it is like
gardening.
BE:
That's it.
This is the wall between professional futurisits, social engineers, planners
and the mainstream, and those recognizing general evolution.  "We can't
direct the wind but we can adjust the sails" is a great proverb.  I have
often put it that we can build the cells but we can't determine how they
will self-organize, we can only prepare.  Homeschooling is a great example
of self-organiztion, and "creating learning communities" a great experiment
in adjsting the sails.
K&A:
> The way this is expressed could be even more powerful if put in terms of
> both a transition from dominator to partnership AND from homocentric to
Gaian
> paradigms.
BE:
The transition from homcentric thinking is, in my mind, part of the Gaian
Paradigm, as is partnership.  It does have to be said more clearly.

K&A:
> (BTW, Riane is working on a new book "Tomorrow's Children:
> Partnership education for the 21st century." She shared with me key
chapters
> and, although I am convinced that partnership is the way to go, I am
>
disappointed that she is still seeing "schooling" as the future of
education. > I think  that she would be very happy to learn that her
partnership model is   >  being  used in the development of community-based
life-long learning         > approaches.)
BE:
I've been trying to find Riane Eisler's address to fill her in with our work
and invite her input.  I've heard about her book but not seen it yet.  And
I'd like to have her write a cover comment for "Creating Learning
Communities."  I think we are on the same path.
Very few people (and no foundations) seem to be able to think outside the
"education" box.  IMHO breaking through is our major task.

K&A:
> Holistic or systemic cultural change?
> Holistic  is a term that I personally don't like.
BE:
I think of holistice as holonistic -- systems within systems.  Perhaps this
needs to be clarified as you suggest.  And we need to rcognize that the new
Gaian connectedness is in both space and time -- "to the seventh gneration."
>
K&A:
> I like the way Sally Goerner (1994, Chaos and the Evolving Ecological
> Universe, Gordon & Breach) puts it. She says that the new understanding of
> general evolutionary processes:
> "has dramatic implications for human beings because, like the Copernican
> revolution, it creates a radical change of perspective....  It denies
> classical science's image of a sterile mechanical universe of
directionless
> colliding particles and accidental life.  The Copernican revolution
> showed that we were not at the center of the universe.  The nonlinear
> revolution shows that we are embedded in a deep, creative, and directed
> process that is the physical universe.  We are part of something much
larger,
> more coherent and more miraculous than just ourselves"  (p. 21).
BE:
Couldn't say it better.
I tried in my 1998 E.F.Schumacher lectuter, "Flapping Butterfly Wings" but
it didn't come through well. (If anyone would like a copy I can snail mail
it)

>>BE:
>> All of the homeschoolers,
>> autodidacts, futurists and others involved in this listserv are playing
one
>> role or another in transforming the basic building block of the learning
>> system.
K&@
> "Building block" doesn't communicates the flexible, creative, unfolding
> nature of the foundations for the co-creation of new learning systems.
> It is a more mechanistic and sterile metaphor. However, maybe you want
> to use terms that communicate to others. (For example, The Council for
> Global Education, focusing on developing a new educational model, also
> talks of building blocks. IMHO, I think that we need to look for new
> ways of communicating if we really want systemic transformation.)
BE:
Point well made.  But I can't think of a better way to build the bridge
between homeschoolers and the progressive movements. Any help?


> All the best,
>
> Kathia

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YES, Silvia, homeschooling is a "strategic client."  That's what it is to
me, an example of "leaderless, unplanned, undesigned, spontainous
self-organization."  An example of chaos, complexity and gaian theories
applied to the socialsphere.
In our new web page <LearningCommunities@onelist.com> we have a "Files" list
where you can put relevant files, like "Mindbook", that you would like
discussed by the coalition.  If they seem relevant to the whole group they
might be added to the on-line version book "Creating Learning Communities."
Your coul join the group by clicking on"

           <LearningCommunities-subscribe@onelist.com>

You can read the book as it now exists on:

--------------------------------------------
<http://www.futureworld.dk/ccl-llc/book.htm>
----------------------------------------------
Bill

----------
>From: Silvia Austerlic <silvia@...>

> Hola Bill,
>
> It was not until today (that I saw the heading "Home schooling's high-tech
> wave" on the first page of the San Jose Mercury News), that I realized what
> you told me many times about homeschooling; i.e. (10 Dec 1998):
>
>>Silvia,
>>Your exploration (of a New Information System for Children) should lead
>> you to the potential of homeschooling (...).
>>This is an opportunity for people interested in learning of all ages.
>>It matches Y2K as an opportunity to affect cultural transition.
>>It could be the opening for bringing society, economic and politics back
>> to >the community.
>
> As you may know, I currently live in santa Cruz CA, where I am a full-time
> international student at a community college, where I also work part-time.
> During my free time (which is not much), beside the virtual activity in
> which I am already engaged (which is ok), I am trying to make some local
> connections with grassroots organizations/technology & business people, to
> start putting some of my ideas to work i.e. mindbook (which is not so easy!).
> As you may imagine, besides using my imagination to envision where my
> info-design work is leading me, I need to work on the personal conditions
> that enable me to be in USA (i.e. be a full-time student in good standing,
> having a 'real-world' job with which I can at least pay the rent etcetera).
>
> What I am trying to say is that what I thought today, is that
> *homeschooling* might be for me what a designer would call "a strategic
> client;" that is, that I might be able to develop i.e. design contents,
> visualization tools, global activities, local projects where to put in
> practice the design contents, tutoring services, workshops where to
> introduce whatever I want to introduce etcetera... so I could become a
> "provider" of homeschooling services.
>
> Whadaya think??? In case that what I am saying makes sense to you, which do
> you think that should be my first step/s?
> I'd very much appreciate your feedback in this issue, which I know is of
> your concern too.
>
> Looking forward for more sharing,
> Silvia
>

From: "Bill Ellis" <tranet@...>

Kathi and Alexander.  Souls after my own soul.
My response to your wonderful comments could go on and on.
But I'll try to only mention a couple of points.
And hope that you'll continue to discuss how we get the points across to a
wider audience.

----------

> From: Kathia and Alexander Laszlo <aklaszlo@...>
K&A:
...
> How can we communicate to others the emergent and self-organizing
> nature of our work -- which has nothing to do with "social engineering"
> type of approaches that seek to control and predict? However, we need to
> communicate that we are not leaving it to chance... we are actively trying
> to facilitate educational and social change. "We cannot direct the wind,
> but we can adjust the sails" is the proverb that I use to explain my quest
> to dance with the creative evolutionary processes. Our work is about creating
> the conditions for new forms of education to emerge -- it is like gardening.
BE:
That's it.
This is the wall between professional futurisits, social engineers, planners
and the mainstream, and those recognizing general evolution.  "We can't
direct the wind but we can adjust the sails" is a great proverb.  I have
often put it that we can build the cells but we can't determine how they
will self-organize, we can only prepare.  Homeschooling is a great example
of self-organiztion, and "creating learning communities" a great experiment
in adjsting the sails.
K&A:
> The way this is expressed could be even more powerful if put in terms of
> both a transition from dominator to partnership AND from homocentric to Gaian
> paradigms.
BE:
The transition from homcentric thinking is, in my mind, part of the Gaian
Paradigm, as is partnership.  It does have to be said more clearly.

K&A:
> (BTW, Riane is working on a new book "Tomorrow's Children:
> Partnership education for the 21st century." She shared with me key chapters
> and, although I am convinced that partnership is the way to go, I am         >
disappointed that she is still seeing "schooling" as the future of
education. > I think  that she would be very happy to learn that her
partnership model is   >  being  used in the development of community-based
life-long learning         > approaches.)
BE:
I've been trying to find Riane Eisler's address to fill her in with our work
and invite her input.  I've heard about her book but not seen it yet.  And
I'd like to have her write a cover comment for "Creating Learning
Communities."  I think we are on the same path.
Very few people (and no foundations) seem to be able to think outside the
"education" box.  IMHO breaking through is our major task.

K&A:
> Holistic or systemic cultural change?
> Holistic  is a term that I personally don't like.
BE:
I think of holistice as holonistic -- systems within systems.  Perhaps this
needs to be clarified as you suggest.  And we need to rcognize that the new
Gaian connectedness is in both space and time -- "to the seventh gneration."
>
K&A:
> I like the way Sally Goerner (1994, Chaos and the Evolving Ecological
> Universe, Gordon & Breach) puts it. She says that the new understanding of
> general evolutionary processes:
> "has dramatic implications for human beings because, like the Copernican
> revolution, it creates a radical change of perspective....  It denies
> classical science's image of a sterile mechanical universe of directionless
> colliding particles and accidental life.  The Copernican revolution
> showed that we were not at the center of the universe.  The nonlinear
> revolution shows that we are embedded in a deep, creative, and directed
> process that is the physical universe.  We are part of something much larger,
> more coherent and more miraculous than just ourselves"  (p. 21).
BE:
Couldn't say it better.
I tried in my 1998 E.F.Schumacher lectuter, "Flapping Butterfly Wings" but
it didn't come through well. (If anyone would like a copy I can snail mail
it)

>>BE:
>> All of the homeschoolers,
>> autodidacts, futurists and others involved in this listserv are playing one
>> role or another in transforming the basic building block of the learning
>> system.
K&@
> "Building block" doesn't communicates the flexible, creative, unfolding
> nature of the foundations for the co-creation of new learning systems.
> It is a more mechanistic and sterile metaphor. However, maybe you want
> to use terms that communicate to others. (For example, The Council for
> Global Education, focusing on developing a new educational model, also
> talks of building blocks. IMHO, I think that we need to look for new
> ways of communicating if we really want systemic transformation.)
BE:
Point well made.  But I can't think of a better way to build the bridge
between homeschoolers and the progressive movements. Any help?


> All the best,
>
> Kathia

Hi Bill.
This version of Appendix 2 was written for you to pass on to the BBC in response
to
one of your earlier mails. I thought it needed to be short, like your Appendix
1,
and was to be, basically, a description of the website and network. I was
planning
to do something different for the book itself --going into more depth. I
appreciate
your comments and insights and definitely agree.
Have you read my chapter 9? I do go into some of the cyberspace issues,
especially
the role of online learning communities and how they interconnect with local
learning centers (see the Think Globally, Act Locally section in particular). I
also
touch on the role of network guides or as you call them here, mentors.
For the appendix for the book, I can develop this more.

Best.
Claudia

Bill Ellis wrote:

> From: "Bill Ellis" <tranet@...>
>
> BE:
> Claudia, Appendix II is a good presnetation of the next phase.
> I copy it to "Learning Communities" because it raises, in my mind at least,
> some conceptual topics imporant to the overall picture of where we might go.
>
> I have only one concrete suggestion as to the strategy of the piece.
> That is, that since this will be in the book and is to be the kick-off of a
> more extensive project and read by many people who don't know us, the
> appendix should have the full URLs and e-mails of the book and listservs to
> to invite and make it easy for others to join us.
>
> I'm not sure if there is a way to work another paragraph into the Appendix
> but in exploring HAVEN, Ib's internet rendition of the book, and in lurking
> on your and other discussions of cyberspace, it seems to me that there is a
> deep fundamental change happening to our society that should be recognized
> and explored in our next phase.  This is the meeting of new concepts of
> experiential learning and electronic capabilities.
> Cyberspace gives us the facility to experience much more than we experience
> in our daily lives and in our communities, and certainly a world beyond the
> experiences of school.  History, Anthropology, Science, Psychology and all
> other areas of knowledge can become real through cyberspace.  It would seem
> to me that the next phase of this project might emphasize learning
> experiences through cybersace.
> Another aspect of learning in cyberspace that overturns our age old concept
> of learning is networking.  That is, the ability of each individual's
> learning experiences to flow naturally through the cyber network. There are
> many parallel paths for learning via computer that are not available in
> published books. Learning is not from A to B to C for every student, it can
> flow through many paths according the the drives, needs, and motivations of
> the indviual.  To be sure, this can be a dangerous way to learn since too
> many of us jump to quickly into areas for which we are not intellectually
> prepared.  The need for mentors, or mentoring build in to the system raises
> many question we might explore.
>
> I don't urge that all this be included in Appendic II, they are ideas that
> came to my mind as I read it.
> What do other think?
> ----------
> >From: "Claudia L'Amoreaux" <cl@...>
> >To: CCL-LLCs@onelist.com
>
> > Appendix 2
> > The Creating Learning Communities Online Resource Center and Network
> >
> > The Creating Learning Communities Online Resource Center is the web
> > companion to the Creating Learning Communities book. The book's original
> > chapters are presented in expanded, hyperlinked versions so people can
> > delve more deeply into ideas presented. New chapters will be continually
> > added, keeping the book up-to-date. An index of cooperative community
> > learning centers includes a brief description of each center with contact
> > information and
> > links to their website (if they have one).
> >
> > Visitors to the online resource center can participate in the CLC Network
> > by joining the "LearningCommunities" discussion list. Started in February,
> > 1999, the discussion list has recently branched into two
> > lists--"LearningCommunities" and "CCL-LLCs." The "LearningCommunities" list
> > hosts discussion about the future of society, with an emphasis on making
> > the necessary transition from an androcentric to an ecocentric worldview,
and
> > from what author Riane Eisler calls a "dominator society" to a "partnership
> > society." The members of A Coalition for Self-Learning have called this new
> > paradigm, Gaian, and put it forward as the basis for future life-long
> > learning systems, grounded in evolutionary cultural change. The concepts
> > and philosophy of creating learning communities are explored here in depth,
> > as are the practical concerns and issues. The "CCL-LLCs" list is for A
> > Coalition for Self Learning business. Both lists are open to anyone.
> > Discussions are archived and accessible through the online resource center.
> >
> > Individuals and groups wanting to start learning centers in their
> > communities will find ongoing support and working models for inspiration.
> > As the resource center grows, we plan to add photos, progress reports, and
> > interviews,
> > especially with young people involved in these learning centers. Hot
> > discussion threads from the list will be featured as well. The online
> > resource center also serves as A Coalition for Self Learning's media hub for
> > coordinating efforts to let more people know about this powerful model for
> > cultural transformation.
> >
> > The Creating Learning Communities Online Resource Center is currently
> > hosted by network member Ib Bang on his website in Denmark. The CLC network
> > discussion lists are moderated by Bill Ellis and Michael Reber. Both lists
are
> > hosted on One List.
> >
> > > Cooperative Community Life-Long Learning Centers (CCL-LLCs) are emerging
> > from the rapidly growing homeschooling and autodidact movements.  They are
> > the foundation for a radically different society.  What are your thoughts?
> >
>
> > Community email addresses:
>   Post message: LearningCommunities@onelist.com
>   Subscribe:    LearningCommunities-subscribe@onelist.com
>   Unsubscribe:  LearningCommunities-unsubscribe@onelist.com
>   List owner:   LearningCommunities-owner@onelist.com
>
> Shortcut URL to this page:
>   http://www.onelist.com/community/LearningCommunities

Bill
Thank for your response. My first thoughts are to give Ron free reign to cut
and edit what best suits your needs and of course supports your directions.
In the meanwhile, I now have some time on my hands to rework it. The
question is just what is your publication deadline. I will throw a copy of
it into the 'Files', or at least try to.
Can you either supply me with Ron's e-mail address or forward this on to him
so he can e-mail me?
I've included myself in this email so as to see just what the attachment is
you are trying to access. I can send a quick, normal email with it out to
you to relieve your frustrations.
Thanks again
Bernie Slepkov
DreamTEAMS International

-----Original Message-----
From: Bill Ellis [mailto:tranet@...]
Sent: October 24, 1999 9:05 PM
To: bernies@...
Cc: LearningCommunities@onelist.com
Subject: [LearningCommunities] Re: Is it too late to contribute


From: "Bill Ellis" <tranet@...>

Bernie,
It is probably to late to get anything of 5000 words in the book.  Ron is
now editing it and will have trouble getting in all that the CCL-LLCs
coalition agreed to.
I suggest you put your paper up on "Files" on
<LearningCommunities@onelist.com>  That will give all membera of the
coalition a chance to read and comment on it. If space becomes available
it could be in the printed book. The limit to our chapters is 2500 words of
positive information on the future of learning. If not used for the book it
still could be accepted for the future on-line expanded version.

All members of LearningCommunities are invited to put their really relevant
essays on the futre of learning and the future of society on the
LearningCommunities "Files."

(I still can't translate your attachment.  Try RTF or text.)

Bill

----------
>From: Bernie Slepkov <bernies@...>

> I would like to contribute to the book, if it's not too late. As I
> mentioned earlier - exactly to who, I'm not certain - my work began with
> a number of musings over major institutions of our society. Our
> past-to-present education system was a major issue for me.
> I have a composition of some 5,000 words I am interested in submiting.
> It could possibly be broken down into a number of chapters.
>
> My question at this point is, into whose hands (email) shall I put it,
> as it is for assessment. Let's start there. I wait your response.
>
> Bill, in the digest a couple of days ago, you mentioned not being able
> to access an attachment. The only attachment that there might have been
> included in anything I sent out, would be my contact card with address
> information. If you would like, I can supply you with that in another
> email, or you can go to http://www.mergetel.com/dreamteams/contact.html
>
> With Love, Respect and Admiration
> Bernie Slepkov
> Founder: DreamTEAMS International - HEALING FRAGMENTED COMMUNITIES
> bernies@...
> http://www.mergetel.com/dreamteams

Community email addresses:
   Post message: LearningCommunities@onelist.com
   Subscribe:    LearningCommunities-subscribe@onelist.com
   Unsubscribe:  LearningCommunities-unsubscribe@onelist.com
   List owner:   LearningCommunities-owner@onelist.com

Shortcut URL to this page:
   http://www.onelist.com/community/LearningCommunities

BE:
Claudia, Appendix II is a good presnetation of the next phase.
I copy it to "Learning Communities" because it raises, in my mind at least,
some conceptual topics imporant to the overall picture of where we might go.

I have only one concrete suggestion as to the strategy of the piece.
That is, that since this will be in the book and is to be the kick-off of a
more extensive project and read by many people who don't know us, the
appendix should have the full URLs and e-mails of the book and listservs to
to invite and make it easy for others to join us.

I'm not sure if there is a way to work another paragraph into the Appendix
but in exploring HAVEN, Ib's internet rendition of the book, and in lurking
on your and other discussions of cyberspace, it seems to me that there is a
deep fundamental change happening to our society that should be recognized
and explored in our next phase.  This is the meeting of new concepts of
experiential learning and electronic capabilities.
Cyberspace gives us the facility to experience much more than we experience
in our daily lives and in our communities, and certainly a world beyond the
experiences of school.  History, Anthropology, Science, Psychology and all
other areas of knowledge can become real through cyberspace.  It would seem
to me that the next phase of this project might emphasize learning
experiences through cybersace.
Another aspect of learning in cyberspace that overturns our age old concept
of learning is networking.  That is, the ability of each individual's
learning experiences to flow naturally through the cyber network. There are
many parallel paths for learning via computer that are not available in
published books. Learning is not from A to B to C for every student, it can
flow through many paths according the the drives, needs, and motivations of
the indviual.  To be sure, this can be a dangerous way to learn since too
many of us jump to quickly into areas for which we are not intellectually
prepared.  The need for mentors, or mentoring build in to the system raises
many question we might explore.

I don't urge that all this be included in Appendic II, they are ideas that
came to my mind as I read it.
What do other think?
----------
>From: "Claudia L'Amoreaux" <cl@...>
>To: CCL-LLCs@onelist.com

> Appendix 2
> The Creating Learning Communities Online Resource Center and Network
>
> The Creating Learning Communities Online Resource Center is the web
> companion to the Creating Learning Communities book. The book's original
> chapters are presented in expanded, hyperlinked versions so people can
> delve more deeply into ideas presented. New chapters will be continually
> added, keeping the book up-to-date. An index of cooperative community
> learning centers includes a brief description of each center with contact
> information and
> links to their website (if they have one).
>
> Visitors to the online resource center can participate in the CLC Network
> by joining the "LearningCommunities" discussion list. Started in February,
> 1999, the discussion list has recently branched into two
> lists--"LearningCommunities" and "CCL-LLCs." The "LearningCommunities" list
> hosts discussion about the future of society, with an emphasis on making
> the necessary transition from an androcentric to an ecocentric worldview, and
> from what author Riane Eisler calls a "dominator society" to a "partnership
> society." The members of A Coalition for Self-Learning have called this new
> paradigm, Gaian, and put it forward as the basis for future life-long
> learning systems, grounded in evolutionary cultural change. The concepts
> and philosophy of creating learning communities are explored here in depth,
> as are the practical concerns and issues. The "CCL-LLCs" list is for A
> Coalition for Self Learning business. Both lists are open to anyone.
> Discussions are archived and accessible through the online resource center.
>
> Individuals and groups wanting to start learning centers in their
> communities will find ongoing support and working models for inspiration.
> As the resource center grows, we plan to add photos, progress reports, and
> interviews,
> especially with young people involved in these learning centers. Hot
> discussion threads from the list will be featured as well. The online
> resource center also serves as A Coalition for Self Learning's media hub for
> coordinating efforts to let more people know about this powerful model for
> cultural transformation.
>
> The Creating Learning Communities Online Resource Center is currently
> hosted by network member Ib Bang on his website in Denmark. The CLC network
> discussion lists are moderated by Bill Ellis and Michael Reber. Both lists are
> hosted on One List.
>
> > Cooperative Community Life-Long Learning Centers (CCL-LLCs) are emerging
> from the rapidly growing homeschooling and autodidact movements.  They are
> the foundation for a radically different society.  What are your thoughts?
>

Dear all,
There is no slightest while for a delay...
I suggest that the educationists have to begin energically and with all
their possible intellectual and societal might to take their stand in
opposition to dehumanizing forces of primitive pragmatics. They must give
practical teachers a clear and elaborate theory to use it for transformation
of  learning process into phenomen, totally attractive for both sides of
friendly vis-a-vis of generations, for teachers and pupils, which are to be
to a considerable degree  the same doers -- the ones and the others have to
learn and therefore to teach themselves.
The most dangerous lacune in educational philosophy is the lack of
theoretical
basis for implementation of  priority of beauty's  experience whichever
curricula (systematic or open ones) are proposed in wonderfully organized
and technologically well-provided for learning newest versions of
homelearning and boldly dreaming  and challenging Learning Community.

Learning has a mystery of unevitable correspondence with time when it
occurs.
The more we are aware about core of the imperatives of time and new
generations that, in actuality, generate it through their behavioral accents
and content of life, the more resilient and pedagogically precise
opportunities we may find to save even if the most valuable sections of
world cultural richness, classic heritage, in one word -- all, what is a
base to evolution of Homo Globalis as I call it...

These lines are conceived as a touch-string, a kind of a "nucleator'' in
hope to
stimulate faster forming of nuclea of magic  crystal -- that of collective
thinking about our common future.

Valery A. Kourinsky
from
National Academy for Social an Intellectual Technologies (Russia)

Bernie,
It is probably to late to get anything of 5000 words in the book.  Ron is
now editing it and will have trouble getting in all that the CCL-LLCs
coalition agreed to.
I suggest you put your paper up on "Files" on
<LearningCommunities@onelist.com>  That will give all membera of the
coalition a chance to read and comment on it. If space becomes available
it could be in the printed book. The limit to our chapters is 2500 words of
positive information on the future of learning. If not used for the book it
still could be accepted for the future on-line expanded version.

All members of LearningCommunities are invited to put their really relevant
essays on the futre of learning and the future of society on the
LearningCommunities "Files."

(I still can't translate your attachment.  Try RTF or text.)

Bill

----------
>From: Bernie Slepkov <bernies@...>

> I would like to contribute to the book, if it's not too late. As I
> mentioned earlier - exactly to who, I'm not certain - my work began with
> a number of musings over major institutions of our society. Our
> past-to-present education system was a major issue for me.
> I have a composition of some 5,000 words I am interested in submiting.
> It could possibly be broken down into a number of chapters.
>
> My question at this point is, into whose hands (email) shall I put it,
> as it is for assessment. Let's start there. I wait your response.
>
> Bill, in the digest a couple of days ago, you mentioned not being able
> to access an attachment. The only attachment that there might have been
> included in anything I sent out, would be my contact card with address
> information. If you would like, I can supply you with that in another
> email, or you can go to http://www.mergetel.com/dreamteams/contact.html
>
> With Love, Respect and Admiration
> Bernie Slepkov
> Founder: DreamTEAMS International - HEALING FRAGMENTED COMMUNITIES
> bernies@...
> http://www.mergetel.com/dreamteams

Until the end of the month I will copy any messages meant for
<LearningCommunities@...> to <CCL-LLCs@onelist.com>.
Bill
-------------------------------------------------------------


On our web page:
        http://www.onelist.com/community/LearningCommunities

you will find in the left hand column "FILES."  That is a place to which you
can transfer files you would like to offer for discussion.  An announcment
of the file will be made on the listserv.  But you may wish to open the
discussion with a short 25 to 100 word abstract of the topic you want to
prersent.

You will also find "LINKS."  Here you can put your webpage and any other
websites that are relevant to Learning Communities so that other members may
contact them directly if/when relevant topics need clarification.

And als the left column has "INVITE."  If you know other people who would
like to join the disucssion of the concepts of "LearningCommunities" put
their e-mail addresses in the infite box, push the "send invite" button at
the bottoem and "confirm" when it appears and they will be invited to join.

This is a joint project feel free to suggest the moderator make any changes
that will help.  And if you'd like to be one of the moderators we need you.

----------------------------------------------------------

     THE PEOPLE ARE NOT THE PROBLEMS. THEY ARE THE SOLUTIONS.
         IF THE PEOPLE LEAD, THE LEADERS WILL FOLLOW.

Bill Ellis
TRANET
POBox 567, 5 Lake St.
Rangeley, ME 04970 USA

   http://www.nonviolence.org/tranet
or
  http://www.onelist.com/community/LearningCommunities

--------------------------------------------------