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Reply Message #5563 of 6044 |
Re: Trinity -- Who is God?

One could say that those called 'gods' by God Himself could also be called 'divine.'  But in either case it would merely refer to those faithful angels of God and those men whom God appointed to some task and who are in no way equal to God Himself.

More accurately, however, John, if he wanted such a meaning, could have used the NT Greek word which actually means 'divine,' which is 'theios.'  This is an adjective which is also applied to angels and men.  What we have at John 1:1c is a noun ('a god') which is also applied to angels and men.

They may be saying nearly the same thing (the Word is not God), but the more accurate rendering is "and the Word was a god."

 

 


--- In JWquestions-and_answers@yahoogroups.com, YTNJ <contact@...> wrote:
>
> I have to say neither is incorrect, both are correct ad the definition works for either use.
>
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On 03/06/2011, at 13:21, teddy_trueblood no_reply@yahoogroups.com wrote:
>
> > Scripture tells us that God's angels and certain men chosen by God were
> > sometimes called gods. This in no way makes them even remotely equal to
> > the Most High God!
> >
> > In NT Greek when a nominative count noun, such as 'theos,' is without
> > the article (as it is in John 1:1c - see link previously provided), it is
> > understood to be indefinite. Examples were given in the study provided
> > by the previous link.
> >
> > This means that John 1:1c intends "a god," just as John 4:19 intends "a
> > prophet" or John 18:37 intends "a king."
> >
> > .................................
> >
> > ...................................
> >
> > --- In JWquestions-and_answers@yahoogroups.com, YTNJ contact@
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > I guess it depends on what you see the word to represent. The concept
> > of a god or God makes it hard to work with on the grounds that Greek
> > does not differentiate between capital letters and no capital letters.
> > Effectively the term "ho theos" mean when translated correctly "the god"
> > where as the non use of the defining article and the use of the term
> > "theos" by itself means "god". What is the difference with this form if
> > translation? Also let's be bluntly honest here, Michael the Archangel is
> > the Christ. He became the Archangel Michael after he was resurrected as
> > Jesus and he returned to Heaven to sit at the right hand of Yahweh God.
> > >
> > > With this, tell me truthfully, if Yahweh is God, and Michael is and
> > angel, even though he is elevated above all other angels, is he really a
> > god in any sense? He can still do nothing that Yahweh God has not give
> > him authority to do. With that said he is still divine no matter what
> > and always has been a divine being. The first ever created divine being
> > to be exact, thats what the bible tells us.
> > >
> > > Yahweh Bless you
> > > Sean
> > >
> > >
> >
>



Fri Jun 3, 2011 5:40 am

teddy_trueblood
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Message #5563 of 6044 |
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I have to say neither is incorrect, both are correct ad the definition works for either use. Sent from my iPhone...
YTNJ
yahwehstruth Offline Send Email
Jun 3, 2011
5:29 am

One could say that those called 'gods' by God Himself could also be called 'divine.' But in either case it would merely refer to those faithful angels of God...
teddy_trueblood Offline Jun 3, 2011
5:51 am

"More accurately, however, John, if he wanted such a meaning, could have used the NT Greek word which actually means 'divine,' which is 'theios.' This is an...
moto_bl Offline Jun 3, 2011
11:09 pm

Jesus Talking here, Luke 8 22 “Jehovah himself produced me as the beginning of his way, the earliest of his achievements of long ago. 23 From time indefinite...
James Taggart
scrappyd... Offline Send Email
Jun 4, 2011
4:51 am

Scrappy. It isn't in Luke, it's in Proverbs 8. And it is the personified Wisdom speaking. Many scholars (including many of the earliest Church writers) ...
teddy_trueblood Offline Jun 4, 2011
4:58 am

Yes, sorry, Proverbs 8 It is from Jesus standpoint, and in so, It is Jesus speaking. All scripture is inspired from God….. Doesn’t matter what any man has...
James Taggart
scrappyd... Offline Send Email
Jun 4, 2011
5:35 am

Scappy you appear to be Trinitarian.   Here are my basis for assumption (I'm new here):   1) You quote Harner from a website that "attacks" the NW 2) You...
Jacob Pressures
jacobpressures Offline Send Email
Jun 8, 2011
7:24 pm

To me Jesus cannot be God because he is a holy servant to God. Acts 4:24,27,30 (NET 1996) 24 When they heard this, they raised their voices to God with one...
cort24ss Offline Send Email Jun 9, 2011
3:55 pm

"Many scholars (including many of the earliest Church writers) consider this to be the Messiah, but it does not specifically say that in Proverbs."   I have a...
Jacob Pressures
jacobpressures Offline Send Email
Jun 8, 2011
7:20 pm

Harner's study is greatly flawed. Here is an answer to it: http://examiningthetrinity.blogspot.com/2009/10/harners-qualitative-jbl-\ article_12.html ...
teddy_trueblood Offline Jun 4, 2011
5:06 am

I didn't know this. Thanks for the info. ... From: moto_bl <no_reply@yahoogroups.com> Subject: [JWquestions-and_answers] Re: Trinity -- Who is God? To:...
Jacob Pressures
jacobpressures Offline Send Email
Jun 8, 2011
7:17 pm

Teddy thanks for the information. If the Trinity doctrine was really important to John and the Trinity is what John meant at John 1:1, then we would not have...
Jacob Pressures
jacobpressures Offline Send Email
Jun 8, 2011
10:54 pm

Hello Sean:   You wrote:   "Strangely enough though the bible says that Christ Jesus was the first creation (of Yahweh God). So the trinity is in correct in...
David Wade
rozes2u Offline Send Email
Jun 2, 2011
10:43 pm

Sean:   Please disregard my last email.  There was a space in your word "incorrect" and I didn't pick up on it. Obviously not intended on your part. I...
David Wade
rozes2u Offline Send Email
Jun 2, 2011
10:46 pm

... Certainly. Bearing in mind that come aspects of the Supreme Being are probably unknowable - or at least ununderstandable - by us mere mortals, and trying...
Laurence Taylor
lozt2004 Offline Send Email
Jun 4, 2011
11:03 pm

... others as well) 204, though may are pretty well defunct. Can you tell that, or are you just going by groups you are or have been a member of also? ... ...
Laurence Taylor
lozt2004 Offline Send Email
Jun 4, 2011
11:04 pm

... Sure. ... (...) ... That link didn't work, but I found the article at the MCC site. The way I see it, we have God the Creator, as described in the first...
Laurence Taylor
lozt2004 Offline Send Email
Jun 4, 2011
11:06 pm

... But even that could be clarified. Does "these three persons are the One God" mean together or individually? Are they the One God _each_, or do they only...
Laurence Taylor
lozt2004 Offline Send Email
Jun 4, 2011
11:08 pm

How are you Lawrence, the Trinity by definition has been defined.   "But even that could be clarified. Does "these three persons are the One God" mean...
Jacob Pressures
jacobpressures Offline Send Email
Jun 8, 2011
10:56 pm

A man once said,no one can explain or understand the trinity because there is nothing there to explain,i agree .Jehovah God is the most high over the whole...
Kaylee Scott
scottkaylee91 Offline Send Email
Jun 9, 2011
6:57 pm

Aah, I believe the scriptures talk about that kind of faith. (Matthew 15:14) 14 LET them be. Blind guides is what they are. If, then, a blind man guides a...
Paul Leonard
anotherpaul2001 Offline Send Email
Jun 9, 2011
8:18 pm

In message <4DE66192.000088.07624@OWNER-PC> ... Definition 1: The Father, Son and Holy Spirit are all the same person, just appearing different at different...
Laurence Taylor
lozt2004 Offline Send Email
Jun 4, 2011
11:08 pm

In message <776542.41589.qm@...> ... God in three personalities? Eeerrrrrrr ........ rgds LAurence <>< ... It said 'Insert disk #3',...
Laurence Taylor
lozt2004 Offline Send Email
Jun 7, 2011
2:22 am

In message <285856.4569.qm@...> ... Which is exactly why I don't consider it worth getting excited about. We can't know the exact...
Laurence Taylor
lozt2004 Offline Send Email
Jun 15, 2011
12:42 am

What I can't understand, Laurence, is how anyone who believes the scriptures can deny the extreme importance of knowing exactly who the God is who demands...
teddy_trueblood Offline Jun 15, 2011
3:00 am

... Apart from the Creator of All Things, you mean? ... Define "substance" and "person". ... What exactly is meant by "God Incarnate" and "fully God"? ... Or...
Laurence Taylor
lozt2004 Offline Send Email
Jun 23, 2011
11:10 pm

Without trying to put a squeeze on you, Lawrence, with all due respect, you do seem to be evasive in your comments.  Is seeking out the Truth important to...
Jacob Pressures
jacobpressures Offline Send Email
Jun 24, 2011
4:50 pm

In message <1308934256.26919.YahooMailClassic@...> ... I was not intending to be. What are you thinking of in particular? ... To an...
Laurence Taylor
lozt2004 Offline Send Email
Jun 30, 2011
4:01 am

In message <601054.34355.qm@...> ... I've always thought of the Holy Spirit like it says in the song, the Breath of God". Or an energy...
Laurence Taylor
lozt2004 Offline Send Email
May 18, 2011
12:14 am
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