Been quietly following this thread.  My observation is that if it's not your
beliefs, then it's a myth.

I don't call other people's beliefs that; this is just my personal observation. 
(I also don't let it twist my knickers in a wad either)

Kimberly


--- In HeathenHomestead@yahoogroups.com, "PatrickD" <pduffy7@...> wrote:
>
> But, no one does except those who like to play games. That's the point. It's
also why I don't call it Christian/Hinu/Buddhist/etc Mythology. If I want my
Beleifs to be Respected, I have to do the same for Others. Agree NO.Fight
against, YES. Respect that which Utgarders themselves Beleive, YES. I'm too old
to play "Tweaking the Mundanes" by a few decades....
> Truth,
> Pat

Fey,
You can also work under an umbrella church such as Universal Life
church<http://www.themonastery.org/?destination=main>
.--Jeremy

On Fri, Nov 20, 2009 at 12:06 PM, Fey Raine <feyraine@...> wrote:

>
>
> I'm about to embark on the tax exempt church paperwork for our Kindred.
>
> Anyone who has done this with any words of advice on how to tame this
> beast?
>
> Also, I'm wondering how long the process took to get approval so I can have
> a realistic time frame...
>
> Thanks
> Fey Raine
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

But, no one does except those who like to play games. That's the point. It's
also why I don't call it Christian/Hinu/Buddhist/etc Mythology. If I want my
Beleifs to be Respected, I have to do the same for Others. Agree NO.Fight
against, YES. Respect that which Utgarders themselves Beleive, YES. I'm too old
to play "Tweaking the Mundanes" by a few decades....
Truth,
Pat
--- In HeathenHomestead@yahoogroups.com, S <drakaran@...> wrote:
>
> Well, I'd rather someone said Heathen mythology (or mythos), than I
> would Heathen dogma. hehehehe

Probably would be easier to get nonprofit status (or you might try that
if you can't get designated as a church).

S

Fey Raine wrote:
>
>
> I'm about to embark on the tax exempt church paperwork for our Kindred.
>
> Anyone who has done this with any words of advice on how to tame this
> beast?
>
> Also, I'm wondering how long the process took to get approval so I can
> have a realistic time frame...
>
> Thanks
> Fey Raine
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
> _

Well, I'd rather someone said Heathen mythology (or mythos), than I
would Heathen dogma. hehehehe

S

Pat Duffy wrote:
>
>
> It doesn't matter what scholars do with their Word Games. "Myth" and
> "Story"
> have been used at least in the Western World for more than a millennia to
> separate "true" material from made ups stuff by Ignorant Foreigners and
> Country Folk. When someone calls my Beliefs "Myths, I Know EXACTLY
> what they
> mean. Esp. since I call theirs the same and they get Pissed. BTW,
> Neopagans
> oft do the same thing. After all, the Regin arte "Just Aspects of their
> Goddess and God";>..
>
> Cheers,
>
> Pat
>

I looked into it for our kindred.  did find out if you have less then $5,000.00
in contributions or assets you do not have to file.
Ilsa

--- On Fri, 11/20/09, Fey Raine <feyraine@...> wrote:


From: Fey Raine <feyraine@...>
Subject: [HeathenHomestead] 501(c)3 status paper work ?s
To: "HeathenHomestead@yahoogroups.com" <HeathenHomestead@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Friday, November 20, 2009, 1:06 PM


 



I'm about to embark on the tax exempt church paperwork for our Kindred.

Anyone who has done this with any words of advice on how to tame this beast?

Also, I'm wondering how long the process took to get approval so I can have a
realistic time frame...

Thanks
Fey Raine

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]











[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

It doesn't matter what scholars do with their Word Games. "Myth" and "Story"
have been used at least in the Western World for more than a millennia to
separate "true" material  from made ups stuff by Ignorant Foreigners and
Country Folk. When someone calls my Beliefs "Myths, I Know EXACTLY what they
mean.  Esp. since I call theirs the same and they get Pissed. BTW, Neopagans
oft do the same thing. After all, the Regin arte "Just Aspects of their
Goddess and God";>..

Cheers,

Pat





From: HeathenHomestead@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:HeathenHomestead@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Gregkaye
Sent: Tuesday, November 10, 2009 4:58 AM
To: HeathenHomestead@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [HeathenHomestead] The right to hold a belief that isn't
systematically classified as a myth





Hi, I have a hunch that this may not be the most appropriate post to put up
on this board and yet, as I have posted it on the boards of a number of
religious groups, I thought it might be of interest here as well.

I am not in any way saying that various views should not be criticised. I'm
just saying that judgement should not be enforced before the relevant
threads of information have been considered. Anyway - here goes:

The word 'myth' carries meanings associated either with fictitious
narratives usually involving supernatural persons, actions, or events, with
untrue or popular tales or rumours or with fictitious or imaginary people or
objects.
(see: THE OXFORD ENGLISH DICTIONARY, 2001)






[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I'm about to embark on the tax exempt church paperwork for our Kindred.

Anyone who has done this with any words of advice on how to tame this beast?

Also, I'm wondering how long the process took to get approval so I can have a
realistic time frame...

Thanks
Fey Raine







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

It's been two weeks without a computer. Didn't miss it as much as i thought. The
biggest has been since I got mine back from the shop. About half of my lists
don't work and many of the sites I frequent now require more software. Pttttp!.
Yahoogroups even closed my acct for lack of traffic. I got it back but I still
can't get anything through except from the site. Most annoying...
Other than this, things are pretty stable. Most Tender plants are in the
greenhouse and Winter veggies are Germinating well. Discovered a Blood Orange on
one of the container Citrus(those that can't handle our Winters even with
Protection). Hopefully, I'll have myself a Yule present!
Cheers,
Pat

I recently updated my solar system with a new 120 watt panel, power controller,
batteries, and small wind turbine. Total system is 470 watts plus 125 watt wind
turbine.

With the extra panel I am now completely charging two Trojan t105s and two MD80
batteries in 3 hours of sunshine.

In winter about three hours of good sunshine is all I can expect and that will
give me reserve power for 4 days or even longer if I conserve power.

In summer I could easily add 4 more batteries but I designed my system to handle
winter needs because I am rarely home to use power in the summer.

At today's prices you could get a system like mine for:

four 120 watt panels at $300 =  $1200

4 deep cycle batteries at $170 = $680

Mppt power controller            $130

1000 watt inverter               $150

Total cost                      $2160

And that does not include the 30% fed tax rebate or any state rebate.

Price of system $2160 price of freedom from a lifetime of utility bills-
priceless!

If you are looking for solar panels or other alternative energy equipment please
contact me off-line and I can direct you to the best prices from reputable
dealers. I do not sell equipment but I know where to get good stuff cheap!

LaMar
www.simplesolarhomesteading.com

This is the guys plans that inspired me to design a solar porch:

http://www.builditsolar.com/Experimental/ShurcliffPart1/PolySpace.htm

Only I simplified it to make the porch usable all year, doesn't require any air
pump and built for a lot less money.

The porch on my cabin faces south. In summer it provides a cool place to hang
out and cools the breeze that enters the house and shades windows from sun.

In winter the sun is much lower in the sky and that porch is converted to a
solarium to catch the heat for the house.

One layer of plastic goes outside the house and one layer goes inside to create
a dead air space that acts as insulation to hold the heat in.

I use an old storm door attached to 2x4s that fits perfectly on the porch and
goes up in a few minutes.

When the sun shines in winter the porch will get into mid 70-80 degrees and I
just open the front door and let the heat in to warm the house.

The porch also acts as an airlock to prevent cold winds from entering the cabin
and that saves heat.

The porch gets very cozy on winter days and thats where I hang out to get some
sun without cold breezes blowing down my neck and I work on projects on the
porch.

I can put the solar porch up in 2 hours and take it down and store it in spring.

This idea could be used in any house that has a south wall with a door or
windows to help heat the home in winter.

LaMar
www.simplesolarhomesteading.com

--- In HeathenHomestead@yahoogroups.com, S <drakaran@...> wrote:
>
> Heya Greg,
>
> I'm not sure why you're bringing this up here instead of some of the
> other Heathen forums, but I haven't been hearing people use the word
> "myth" very much at all, especially in relation to the sagas etc that we
> have for reference. Maybe this is barking up a tree that doesn't really
> exist? In fact, if anything, it seems people are getting better about
> referring to specific resources and not making vague claims in general.
> Or specifying that something is UPG vs VCG.
>
> S

I guess I was just trying things out to see how they went - and this was the
only heathen forum that did not reject the post with some choice words.  Thanks
for your thoughts, on this S.

Greg
>
> Gregkaye wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --- In HeathenHomestead@yahoogroups.com
> > <mailto:HeathenHomestead%40yahoogroups.com>, "Gregkaye"
> > <gregoriousity@> wrote:
> > >
> > > Hi, I have a hunch that this may not be the most appropriate post to
> > put up on this board and yet, as I have posted it on the boards of a
> > number of religious groups, I thought it might be of interest here as
> > well.
> > >
> >
> ...
>

We use No Monthly Fees: www.nomonthlyfees.com for all our websites. It's $70
a year or $200 for life. I have 8 websites with them, some for as long as 10
years. Any time there's a problem, maybe 3 times in 10 years, their teach
guys fix it immediately. We've never been down for more than 24 hours and
that was when they moved us to a bigger, faster server.

If you go with them and if they as who recommended you, use either
www.bmtomahawks.com or www.northstarpreparedness.org  I don't know if they
do that but it can't hurt.

Suzanne
Continuity Director
Falcon Kindred
www.falconkindred.com

         Need Help:  Trying to find new web host

     Posted by:      "Ilse
Plaisance"
       ilseplaisance@...


           ilseplaisance



       Wed Nov 11, 2009 2:23 pm        (PST)



       Hail Y'all!
     As most of you know I run the Mother Holda and Louisiana Heathens
webpage, as well as one for my own business.  I own my domain names but want
to avoid my $70 a month charge.  I am currently with Intuit / Homestead and
hear bad things about Godady.com.   I want to ask y'all if you know anyone
or any company to 1.) avoid or 2.) if you can suggest a good cheap
one. Would appreciate any help or ideas y'all could give me.
Bright blessings,
Ilsa
p.s.  what about a blog or a facebook page in place of the website
itself..

We use No Monthly Fees: www.nomonthlyfees.com for all our websites. It's $70
a year or $200 for life. I have 8 websites with them, some for as long as 10
years. Any time there's a problem, maybe 3 times in 10 years, their teach
guys fix it immediately. We've never been down for more than 24 hours and
that was when they moved us to a bigger, faster server.

If you go with them and if they as who recommended you, use either
www.bmtomahawks.com or www.northstarpreparedness.org  I don't know if they
do that but it can't hurt.

Suzanne
Continuity Director
Falcon Kindred
www.falconkindred.com

         Need Help:  Trying to find new web host

     Posted by:      "Ilse
Plaisance"
       ilseplaisance@...


           ilseplaisance



       Wed Nov 11, 2009 2:23 pm        (PST)



       Hail Y'all!
     As most of you know I run the Mother Holda and Louisiana Heathens
webpage, as well as one for my own business.  I own my domain names but want
to avoid my $70 a month charge.  I am currently with Intuit / Homestead and
hear bad things about Godady.com.   I want to ask y'all if you know anyone
or any company to 1.) avoid or 2.) if you can suggest a good cheap
one. Would appreciate any help or ideas y'all could give me.
Bright blessings,
Ilsa
p.s.  what about a blog or a facebook page in place of the website
itself..

We use No Monthly Fees: www.nomonthlyfees.com for all our websites. It's $70
a year or $200 for life. I have 8 websites with them, some for as long as 10
years. Any time there's a problem, maybe 3 times in 10 years, their teach
guys fix it immediately. We've never been down for more than 24 hours and
that was when they moved us to a bigger, faster server.

If you go with them and if they as who recommended you, use either
www.bmtomahawks.com or www.northstarpreparedness.org  I don't know if they
do that but it can't hurt.

Suzanne
Continuity Director
Falcon Kindred
www.falconkindred.com

         Need Help:  Trying to find new web host

     Posted by:      "Ilse
Plaisance"
       ilseplaisance@...


           ilseplaisance



       Wed Nov 11, 2009 2:23 pm        (PST)



       Hail Y'all!
     As most of you know I run the Mother Holda and Louisiana Heathens
webpage, as well as one for my own business.  I own my domain names but want
to avoid my $70 a month charge.  I am currently with Intuit / Homestead and
hear bad things about Godady.com.   I want to ask y'all if you know anyone
or any company to 1.) avoid or 2.) if you can suggest a good cheap
one. Would appreciate any help or ideas y'all could give me.
Bright blessings,
Ilsa
p.s.  what about a blog or a facebook page in place of the website
itself..

We use No Monthly Fees: www.nomonthlyfees.com for all our websites. It's $70
a year or $200 for life. I have 8 websites with them, some for as long as 10
years. Any time there's a problem, maybe 3 times in 10 years, their teach
guys fix it immediately. We've never been down for more than 24 hours and
that was when they moved us to a bigger, faster server.

If you go with them and if they as who recommended you, use either
www.bmtomahawks.com or www.northstarpreparedness.org  I don't know if they
do that but it can't hurt.

Suzanne
Continuity Director
Falcon Kindred
www.falconkindred.com

         Need Help:  Trying to find new web host

     Posted by:      "Ilse
Plaisance"
       ilseplaisance@...


           ilseplaisance



       Wed Nov 11, 2009 2:23 pm        (PST)



       Hail Y'all!
     As most of you know I run the Mother Holda and Louisiana Heathens
webpage, as well as one for my own business.  I own my domain names but want
to avoid my $70 a month charge.  I am currently with Intuit / Homestead and
hear bad things about Godady.com.   I want to ask y'all if you know anyone
or any company to 1.) avoid or 2.) if you can suggest a good cheap
one. Would appreciate any help or ideas y'all could give me.
Bright blessings,
Ilsa
p.s.  what about a blog or a facebook page in place of the website
itself..

I use Drak.net and pay $9 a month for my service.  they are amazing! =)

Angelia in OR
   ----- Original Message -----
   From: Ilse Plaisance
   To: Homestead Heathen ; Terresa Lotz ; Mark Miller ;
LouisianaHeathens@yahoogroups.com ; rovena ; hexenkunst@yahoogroups.com ;
crescent_circle@yahoogroups.com ; Frau_Holda@yahoogroups.com ;
ShreveportPaganNightOut@yahoogroups.com ; urglaawe@yahoogroups.com ;
Irminenschaft@yahoogroups.com
   Sent: Wednesday, November 11, 2009 2:23 PM
   Subject: [HeathenHomestead] Need Help: Trying to find new web host



   Hail Y'all!
       As most of you know I run the Mother Holda and Louisiana Heathens webpage,
as well as one for my own business.  I own my domain names but want to avoid my
$70 a month charge.  I am currently with Intuit / Homestead and hear bad things
about Godady.com.   I want to ask y'all if you know anyone or any company to 1.)
avoid or 2.) if you can suggest a good cheap one. Would appreciate any help or
ideas y'all could give me.
   Bright blessings,
   Ilsa
   p.s.  what about a blog or a facebook page in place of the website itself.

   [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






------------------------------------------------------------------------------



   No virus found in this incoming message.
   Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
   Version: 8.5.425 / Virus Database: 270.14.60/2496 - Release Date: 11/11/09
07:40:00


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I use Hostmonster (http://www.HostMonster.Com/track/tygerlily). I've had them
for a few years now and they've been great. Great support, uptime, extras, and
unlimited space, bandwith & domains (so you can resell space to other websites
if you want to host for them - I host a few small websites that really helps pay
for my annual hosting fees). Free domain name too. I'm currenly paying $107.40
per year (equals $8.95 a month if paid annually). They many times have a special
promo price for new signups for the first year.

~Lily M. Plasse
Othala Acres Heritage Poultry
Troy, NH

--- In HeathenHomestead@yahoogroups.com, Ilse Plaisance <ilseplaisance@...>
wrote:
>
> Hail Y'all!
>     As most of you know I run the Mother Holda and Louisiana Heathens webpage,
as well as one for my own business.  I own my domain names but want to avoid my
$70 a month charge.  I am currently with Intuit / Homestead and hear bad things
about Godady.com.   I want to ask y'all if you know anyone or any company to 1.)
avoid or 2.) if you can suggest a good cheap one. Would appreciate any help or
ideas y'all could give me.
> Bright blessings,
> Ilsa
> p.s.  what about a blog or a facebook page in place of the website itself.
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

Drak.net

Great service, woman owned in Texas. I was very happy with them, used them till
I took my site down. I never had any complaints; support tickets usually cleared
in 24 hours. If I need a site again, it will be with Drak.

Loved it when RAID backup went down, on a holiday weekend, and the first we
heard about it was Jen (the owner) telling us she was working on it already.


Tara


--- On Wed, 11/11/09, Ilse Plaisance <ilseplaisance@...> wrote:


Hail Y'all!
    As most of you know I run the Mother Holda and Louisiana Heathens webpage,
as well as one for my own business.  I own my domain names but want to avoid my
$70 a month charge.  I am currently with Intuit / Homestead and hear bad things
about Godady.com.   I want to ask y'all if you know anyone or any company to 1.)
avoid or 2.) if you can suggest a good cheap one. Would appreciate any help or
ideas y'all could give me.
Bright blessings,
Ilsa
p.s.  what about a blog or a facebook page in place of the website itself.






[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

look at webs.com. Thats who I use and they have been good.

LaMar

--- In HeathenHomestead@yahoogroups.com, Ilse Plaisance <ilseplaisance@...>
wrote:
>
> Hail Y'all!
>     As most of you know I run the Mother Holda and Louisiana Heathens webpage,
as well as one for my own business.  I own my domain names but want to avoid my
$70 a month charge.  I am currently with Intuit / Homestead and hear bad things
about Godady.com.   I want to ask y'all if you know anyone or any company to 1.)
avoid or 2.) if you can suggest a good cheap one. Would appreciate any help or
ideas y'all could give me.
> Bright blessings,
> Ilsa
> p.s.  what about a blog or a facebook page in place of the website itself.
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20091111/ap_on_re_la_am_ca/lt_brazil_blackouts

I got home from work one day and was on the porch when the neighbor lady drove
up and asked me if my power was out ?

I said no cuz I knew it wasn't and she said "well how can that be mine is out
and so is the rest of the town ?"

I guess she didn't see my solar panels and wind generator on my roof or didn't
know what they were for.

I use a small 350 watt solar and wind power system in my off grid cabin and the
only time I have a blackout is if the sun doesn't shine, the wind doesn't blow,
and I ran out of gas for the genny.

Blackouts are a common occurrence here in the country and most cities have at
least one major blackout every winter.

People do die in blackouts from street lights not working, home health equipment
failures, and burning down their own house trying to stay warm.

If you have an all electric house you are especially vulnerable and should
consider replacing some appliances with propane or NG or at least have a propane
barbecue to cook on and a propane furnace or wood stove for heat. keep extra
propane on hand in 20 pound bottles and several 1 pound cans for smaller propane
appliances.

I have added several of these products to my website:

LaMar
http://www.simplesolarhomesteading.com/reccomendedproducts.htm

Hail Y'all!
    As most of you know I run the Mother Holda and Louisiana Heathens webpage,
as well as one for my own business.  I own my domain names but want to avoid my
$70 a month charge.  I am currently with Intuit / Homestead and hear bad things
about Godady.com.   I want to ask y'all if you know anyone or any company to 1.)
avoid or 2.) if you can suggest a good cheap one. Would appreciate any help or
ideas y'all could give me.
Bright blessings,
Ilsa
p.s.  what about a blog or a facebook page in place of the website itself.




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Thanks, Amanda. I like this.

Randolph

--- In HeathenHomestead@yahoogroups.com, Amanda Kenney <ceilteach79@...> wrote:
>
> Hailsa!
>  
> Certainly the original use of the word myth was intended to describe beliefs
seen as fictitious.  I think your post very much ignores the change in
connotation the word has undergone as the study of mythology has increased and
beliefs long put aside have been resurrected.  Here's another Oxford source
from 2000:
>  
> Myths are "stories about divine beings, generally arranged in a coherent
system; they are revered as true and sacred; they are endorsed by rulers and
priests; and closely linked to religion. Once this link is broken, and the
actors in the story are not regarded as gods but as human heroes, giants or
fairies, it is no longer a myth but a folktale. Where the central actor is
divine but the story is trivial ... the result is religious legend, not myth."
[J. Simpson & S. Roud, "Dictionary of English Folklore," Oxford, 2000, p.254]
>  
> I have no issue referring to the tales of my religion as myth, just as I have
no issue with referring to the tales of any other religion as myth as well. 
Religion is something larger than the tales.
>
> --- On Tue, 11/10/09, r_scherp <r_scherp@...> wrote:
>
>
> From: r_scherp <r_scherp@...>
> Subject: [HeathenHomestead] Re: The right to hold a belief that isn't
systematically classified as a myth
> To: HeathenHomestead@yahoogroups.com
> Date: Tuesday, November 10, 2009, 1:55 PM
>
>
>  
>
>
>
> Hailsa!
>
> 'Creation Story' still evokes fiction.
>
> Randolph
>
> --- In HeathenHomestead@ yahoogroups. com, "Gregkaye" <gregoriousity@ ...>
wrote:
> >
> > Hi, I have a hunch that this may not be the most appropriate post to put up
on this board and yet, as I have posted it on the boards of a number of
religious groups, I thought it might be of interest here as well.
> >
> > I am not in any way saying that various views should not be criticised. I'm
just saying that judgement should not be enforced before the relevant threads of
information have been considered. Anyway - here goes:
> >
> > The word 'myth' carries meanings associated either with fictitious
narratives usually involving supernatural persons, actions, or events, with
untrue or popular tales or rumours or with fictitious or imaginary people or
objects.
> > (see: THE OXFORD ENGLISH DICTIONARY, 2001)
> >
> > Despite this situation, or perhaps because of it, the word `myth' has become
systematically used to describe many religious stories and all forms of
supernatural explanation of (origin via) 'creation'.
> >
> > The result is abuse. There is an abuse of the individual who holds a belief
as, before discussion may start, the belief has been judged, merely by its
assumed categorisation, to be false; there is an abuse of the system of
education system as discussion and dialogue may easily be shut down and I am
also curious to know if there has been at least a misuse of language.
> >
> > The Samuel Johnson's "Dictionary of the English Language" (1755) clearly
indicates that a myth was considered to be a synonym of FA´BLE. Words can be
flexible things that change their meanings over time and this is fine in non
abusive situations. This has not been the case with regard to the word myth
which, from before the time of Samuel Johnson, has been regularly applied over
time to describe a wide range of traditional beliefs.
> >
> > We can note that stories of supernatural creation, by their very natures,
tend to call on the powers of supernatural agencies such as 'God'. This raises
the question how might 'God' have done it. Indeed, it may be imagined that an
entity with divine ability could do whatever he (or she) wanted.
> >
> > In case anyone is interested there is a philosophical argument that may be
presented to stimulate an open minded view of the possibilities. René
Descartes, the widely esteemed French sceptic, considered the view that a
`demon' might have deluded him with regard to various aspects of his awareness.
The conclusion to which Descartes personally arrived indicated that the
existence of a god was necessary to disprove his doubts and yet it may be
interpreted that such a god might also choose to validate any particular method
of creation of choice.
> >
> > Reference is made to "creation myths" and "religious myths" on a regular
basis in various forms of media. For instance, one encyclopaedia article
entitled "Creation myth" begins with the words: A creation myth or cosmogonic
myth is a supernatural story or explanation that describes the beginnings of
humanity, earth, life, and the universe... and yet, amazingly, the organisation
concerned present the view that their title adheres to the organisations Neutral
Point of View policy.
> >
> > I recommend that we collectively encourage the use of other terminologies
related to all traditional stories. Perhaps we can encourage talk of such things
as "creation stories" or even "supernatural stories of creation". Perhaps it is
time for unpressured freedoms of interpret to be protected and for the abusive
use of the word myth to be busted.
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

Heya Greg,

I'm not sure why you're bringing this up here instead of some of the
other Heathen forums, but I haven't been hearing people use the word
"myth" very much at all, especially in relation to the sagas etc that we
have for reference. Maybe this is barking up a tree that doesn't really
exist? In fact, if anything, it seems people are getting better about
referring to specific resources and not making vague claims in general.
Or specifying that something is UPG vs VCG.

S

Gregkaye wrote:
>
>
>
>
> --- In HeathenHomestead@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:HeathenHomestead%40yahoogroups.com>, "Gregkaye"
> <gregoriousity@...> wrote:
> >
> > Hi, I have a hunch that this may not be the most appropriate post to
> put up on this board and yet, as I have posted it on the boards of a
> number of religious groups, I thought it might be of interest here as
> well.
> >
>
...

Hailsa!
 
Certainly the original use of the word myth was intended to describe beliefs
seen as fictitious.  I think your post very much ignores the change in
connotation the word has undergone as the study of mythology has increased and
beliefs long put aside have been resurrected.  Here's another Oxford source
from 2000:
 
Myths are "stories about divine beings, generally arranged in a coherent system;
they are revered as true and sacred; they are endorsed by rulers and priests;
and closely linked to religion. Once this link is broken, and the actors in the
story are not regarded as gods but as human heroes, giants or fairies, it is no
longer a myth but a folktale. Where the central actor is divine but the story is
trivial ... the result is religious legend, not myth." [J. Simpson & S. Roud,
"Dictionary of English Folklore," Oxford, 2000, p.254]
 
I have no issue referring to the tales of my religion as myth, just as I have no
issue with referring to the tales of any other religion as myth as well. 
Religion is something larger than the tales.

--- On Tue, 11/10/09, r_scherp <r_scherp@...> wrote:


From: r_scherp <r_scherp@...>
Subject: [HeathenHomestead] Re: The right to hold a belief that isn't
systematically classified as a myth
To: HeathenHomestead@yahoogroups.com
Date: Tuesday, November 10, 2009, 1:55 PM


 



Hailsa!

'Creation Story' still evokes fiction.

Randolph

--- In HeathenHomestead@ yahoogroups. com, "Gregkaye" <gregoriousity@ ...>
wrote:
>
> Hi, I have a hunch that this may not be the most appropriate post to put up on
this board and yet, as I have posted it on the boards of a number of religious
groups, I thought it might be of interest here as well.
>
> I am not in any way saying that various views should not be criticised. I'm
just saying that judgement should not be enforced before the relevant threads of
information have been considered. Anyway - here goes:
>
> The word 'myth' carries meanings associated either with fictitious narratives
usually involving supernatural persons, actions, or events, with untrue or
popular tales or rumours or with fictitious or imaginary people or objects.
> (see: THE OXFORD ENGLISH DICTIONARY, 2001)
>
> Despite this situation, or perhaps because of it, the word `myth' has become
systematically used to describe many religious stories and all forms of
supernatural explanation of (origin via) 'creation'.
>
> The result is abuse. There is an abuse of the individual who holds a belief
as, before discussion may start, the belief has been judged, merely by its
assumed categorisation, to be false; there is an abuse of the system of
education system as discussion and dialogue may easily be shut down and I am
also curious to know if there has been at least a misuse of language.
>
> The Samuel Johnson's "Dictionary of the English Language" (1755) clearly
indicates that a myth was considered to be a synonym of FA´BLE. Words can be
flexible things that change their meanings over time and this is fine in non
abusive situations. This has not been the case with regard to the word myth
which, from before the time of Samuel Johnson, has been regularly applied over
time to describe a wide range of traditional beliefs.
>
> We can note that stories of supernatural creation, by their very natures, tend
to call on the powers of supernatural agencies such as 'God'. This raises the
question how might 'God' have done it. Indeed, it may be imagined that an entity
with divine ability could do whatever he (or she) wanted.
>
> In case anyone is interested there is a philosophical argument that may be
presented to stimulate an open minded view of the possibilities. René
Descartes, the widely esteemed French sceptic, considered the view that a
`demon' might have deluded him with regard to various aspects of his awareness.
The conclusion to which Descartes personally arrived indicated that the
existence of a god was necessary to disprove his doubts and yet it may be
interpreted that such a god might also choose to validate any particular method
of creation of choice.
>
> Reference is made to "creation myths" and "religious myths" on a regular basis
in various forms of media. For instance, one encyclopaedia article entitled
"Creation myth" begins with the words: A creation myth or cosmogonic myth is a
supernatural story or explanation that describes the beginnings of humanity,
earth, life, and the universe... and yet, amazingly, the organisation concerned
present the view that their title adheres to the organisations Neutral Point of
View policy.
>
> I recommend that we collectively encourage the use of other terminologies
related to all traditional stories. Perhaps we can encourage talk of such things
as "creation stories" or even "supernatural stories of creation". Perhaps it is
time for unpressured freedoms of interpret to be protected and for the abusive
use of the word myth to be busted.
>











[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hailsa!

'Creation Story' still evokes fiction.

Randolph

--- In HeathenHomestead@yahoogroups.com, "Gregkaye" <gregoriousity@...> wrote:
>
> Hi, I have a hunch that this may not be the most appropriate post to put up on
this board and yet, as I have posted it on the boards of a number of religious
groups, I thought it might be of interest here as well.
>
> I am not in any way saying that various views should not be criticised.  I'm
just saying that judgement should not be enforced before the relevant threads of
information have been considered.  Anyway - here goes:
>
> The word 'myth' carries meanings associated either with fictitious narratives
usually involving supernatural persons, actions, or events, with untrue or
popular tales or rumours or with fictitious or imaginary people or objects.
> (see: THE OXFORD ENGLISH DICTIONARY, 2001)
>
> Despite this situation, or perhaps because of it, the word `myth' has become
systematically used to describe many religious stories and all forms of
supernatural explanation of (origin via) 'creation'.
>
> The result is abuse.  There is an abuse of the individual who holds a belief
as, before discussion may start, the belief has been judged, merely by its
assumed categorisation, to be false; there is an abuse of the system of
education system as discussion and dialogue may easily be shut down and I am
also curious to know if there has been at least a misuse of language.
>
> The Samuel Johnson's "Dictionary of the English Language" (1755) clearly
indicates that a myth was considered to be a synonym of FA´BLE.  Words can be
flexible things that change their meanings over time and this is fine in non
abusive situations.  This has not been the case with regard to the word myth
which, from before the time of Samuel Johnson, has been regularly applied over
time to describe a wide range of traditional beliefs.
>
> We can note that stories of supernatural creation, by their very natures, tend
to call on the powers of supernatural agencies such as 'God'. This raises the
question how might 'God' have done it. Indeed, it may be imagined that an entity
with divine ability could do whatever he (or she) wanted.
>
> In case anyone is interested there is a philosophical argument that may be
presented to stimulate an open minded view of the possibilities.  René
Descartes, the widely esteemed French sceptic, considered the view that a
`demon' might have deluded him with regard to various aspects of his awareness. 
The conclusion to which Descartes personally arrived indicated that the
existence of a god was necessary to disprove his doubts and yet it may be
interpreted that such a god might also choose to validate any particular method
of creation of choice.
>
> Reference is made to "creation myths" and "religious myths" on a regular basis
in various forms of media.  For instance, one encyclopaedia article entitled
"Creation myth" begins with the words: A creation myth or cosmogonic myth is a
supernatural story or explanation that describes the beginnings of humanity,
earth, life, and the universe...  and yet, amazingly, the organisation concerned
present the view that their title adheres to the organisations Neutral Point of
View policy.
>
> I recommend that we collectively encourage the use of other terminologies
related to all traditional stories.  Perhaps we can encourage talk of such
things as "creation stories" or even "supernatural stories of creation". 
Perhaps it is time for unpressured freedoms of interpret to be protected and for
the abusive use of the word myth to be busted.
>

--- In HeathenHomestead@yahoogroups.com, "Gregkaye" <gregoriousity@...> wrote:
>
> Hi, I have a hunch that this may not be the most appropriate post to put up on
this board and yet, as I have posted it on the boards of a number of religious
groups, I thought it might be of interest here as well.
>
> I am not in any way saying that various views should not be criticised.  I'm
just saying that judgement should not be enforced before the relevant threads of
information have been considered.  Anyway - here goes:
>
> The word 'myth' carries meanings associated either with fictitious narratives
usually involving supernatural persons, actions, or events, with untrue or
popular tales or rumours or with fictitious or imaginary people or objects.
> (see: THE OXFORD ENGLISH DICTIONARY, 2001)
>
> Despite this situation, or perhaps because of it, the word `myth' has become
systematically used to describe many religious stories and all forms of
supernatural explanation of (origin via) 'creation'.
>
> The result is abuse.  There is an abuse of the individual who holds a belief
as, before discussion may start, the belief has been judged, merely by its
assumed categorisation, to be false; there is an abuse of the system of
education system as discussion and dialogue may easily be shut down and I am
also curious to know if there has been at least a misuse of language.
>
> The Samuel Johnson's "Dictionary of the English Language" (1755) clearly
indicates that a myth was considered to be a synonym of FA´BLE.  Words can be
flexible things that change their meanings over time and this is fine in non
abusive situations.  This has not been the case with regard to the word myth
which, from before the time of Samuel Johnson, has been regularly applied over
time to describe a wide range of traditional beliefs.
>
> We can note that stories of supernatural creation, by their very natures, tend
to call on the powers of supernatural agencies such as 'God'. This raises the
question how might 'God' have done it. Indeed, it may be imagined that an entity
with divine ability could do whatever he (or she) wanted.
>
> In case anyone is interested there is a philosophical argument that may be
presented to stimulate an open minded view of the possibilities.  René
Descartes, the widely esteemed French sceptic, considered the view that a
`demon' might have deluded him with regard to various aspects of his awareness. 
The conclusion to which Descartes personally arrived indicated that the
existence of a god was necessary to disprove his doubts and yet it may be
interpreted that such a god might also choose to validate any particular method
of creation of choice.
>
> Reference is made to "creation myths" and "religious myths" on a regular basis
in various forms of media.  For instance, one encyclopaedia article entitled
"Creation myth" begins with the words: A creation myth or cosmogonic myth is a
supernatural story or explanation that describes the beginnings of humanity,
earth, life, and the universe...  and yet, amazingly, the organisation concerned
present the view that their title adheres to the organisations Neutral Point of
View policy.
>
> I recommend that we collectively encourage the use of other terminologies
related to all traditional stories.  Perhaps we can encourage talk of such
things as "creation stories" or even "supernatural stories of creation". 
Perhaps it is time for unpressured freedoms of interpret to be protected and for
the abusive use of the word myth to be busted.
>


I also should have added this:

It may be clearly interpreted that there are strong arguments for the
institution of a general change in the use of myth related terminologies and the
purpose of the change would be to clear the way for freedom of thought and
freedom of communication.  It has been with this goal in mind that a number of 
facebook groups have also been set up as follows:

The right to hold a belief that isn't systematically classified as a myth
http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=188346055947

This is the group for people who would like a change in the use of terminologies
but is open to all people of any faith (or, as is the case with the
administrator of the group [me], of no particular faith).  It is hoped that this
neutral basis will provide an opportunity for people from a range of faiths to
come together to push towards a common goal.  The group is not intended as a
place for individuals to push their faith but to aim for a goal of greater
freedom of faith.

A large number of facebook groups have been designed to meet the specific needs
generated by specific religious views.  This group is not one of them.

It is also acknowledged that, even as a visitor to this fath based group, you
may not share in any particular faith.  Another couple of groups have been
provisionally set up.

I have a belief that is classified as a myth AND approve of this classification
http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=194661040529
and:

I don't believe in stories of supernatural creation AND view them as myths
http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=169605990043

It should be noted, however, that there is a strong argument to say that the
accounts (or stories) of a particular religion belong to that religion.  A
decision needs to be reached relating to the way in which these stories are
presented.

Religious stories are commonly categorised as myths and this is a situation that
certain people may want to address.  This page may serve as a useful location to
discuss the "myth" issue from all angles while the first facebook group may
serve as a useful interfaith meeting point.

(The facebook groups are intended for one person to join one group).


I was just a bit embarrassed that I had not done much with the groups that
represent opposing views.  I am open to thoughts about content that might be
permanently posted so if anyone has ideas they would be appreciated.

Hi, I have a hunch that this may not be the most appropriate post to put up on
this board and yet, as I have posted it on the boards of a number of religious
groups, I thought it might be of interest here as well.

I am not in any way saying that various views should not be criticised.  I'm
just saying that judgement should not be enforced before the relevant threads of
information have been considered.  Anyway - here goes:

The word 'myth' carries meanings associated either with fictitious narratives
usually involving supernatural persons, actions, or events, with untrue or
popular tales or rumours or with fictitious or imaginary people or objects.
(see: THE OXFORD ENGLISH DICTIONARY, 2001)

Despite this situation, or perhaps because of it, the word `myth' has become
systematically used to describe many religious stories and all forms of
supernatural explanation of (origin via) 'creation'.

The result is abuse.  There is an abuse of the individual who holds a belief as,
before discussion may start, the belief has been judged, merely by its assumed
categorisation, to be false; there is an abuse of the system of education system
as discussion and dialogue may easily be shut down and I am also curious to know
if there has been at least a misuse of language.

The Samuel Johnson's "Dictionary of the English Language" (1755) clearly
indicates that a myth was considered to be a synonym of FA´BLE.  Words can be
flexible things that change their meanings over time and this is fine in non
abusive situations.  This has not been the case with regard to the word myth
which, from before the time of Samuel Johnson, has been regularly applied over
time to describe a wide range of traditional beliefs.

We can note that stories of supernatural creation, by their very natures, tend
to call on the powers of supernatural agencies such as 'God'. This raises the
question how might 'God' have done it. Indeed, it may be imagined that an entity
with divine ability could do whatever he (or she) wanted.

In case anyone is interested there is a philosophical argument that may be
presented to stimulate an open minded view of the possibilities.  René
Descartes, the widely esteemed French sceptic, considered the view that a
`demon' might have deluded him with regard to various aspects of his awareness. 
The conclusion to which Descartes personally arrived indicated that the
existence of a god was necessary to disprove his doubts and yet it may be
interpreted that such a god might also choose to validate any particular method
of creation of choice.

Reference is made to "creation myths" and "religious myths" on a regular basis
in various forms of media.  For instance, one encyclopaedia article entitled
"Creation myth" begins with the words: A creation myth or cosmogonic myth is a
supernatural story or explanation that describes the beginnings of humanity,
earth, life, and the universe...  and yet, amazingly, the organisation concerned
present the view that their title adheres to the organisations Neutral Point of
View policy.

I recommend that we collectively encourage the use of other terminologies
related to all traditional stories.  Perhaps we can encourage talk of such
things as "creation stories" or even "supernatural stories of creation". 
Perhaps it is time for unpressured freedoms of interpret to be protected and for
the abusive use of the word myth to be busted.

Hi folks,

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In Indiana, it's a fence stock in State, and line fences  must be erected
on a 50/50 basis.  Each owner is responsible for the  half  of the Line that
is on his right hand as he faces the fence. It's  rare, very rare that it
ever goes so far as an owner being taken to court to  provide solid fence.
Generally, it is 48" woven wire, with one or two strands of  barbed wire above
it. However, if the two owner agree it could be 4 strands of  barbed wired
with posts a maximum of 10 feet apart, IIRC.I think 4 strands of  barbed wire
is probably the minimum.

' Til Later, Frith
John Grimsteinr-OAC
Gothi-HofBrau  Kindred
Asatru Folk Assembly, Asatru Alliance.
Hail the Gods!


In a message dated 11/3/2009 10:22:16 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
angelia.r@... writes:

Oregon  only has a few areas that allow open range, everywhere else is
fence em in.
and those areas that are open range, have to be fenced in some way to keep
the animals out of the non open range areas.

Most states have  gone to fence em in options.

Angelia in OR

-----  Original Message -----
From: Carol NORTON
To:  HeathenHomestead
Sent: Tuesday, November 03, 2009 7:28 AM
Subject: [HeathenHomestead] RE: Free range cattle.


I  thought free range was fairly common but then I live here in Colo. so
that's  what we're used to. It's also the law in Wyoming and Nebraska, and I'm
  guessing several others. Almost got a few longhorns that way. Our problem
there wasn't deer ruining fence but antelope. They just destroy any kind of
  fence. Deer usually hop them, antelope go right through them and they
taste so  sagey there you don't want to eat them.

fr

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' Til  Later, Frith
John Grimsteinr-Gothi
HofBrau Kindred
Asatru Folk  Assembly, Asatru Alliance

Live Right! Live Well!
We Are Our  Ancestors!
Hail the Northern Gods! Hail the Northern  Folk!




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