I did rice fritters for one. It's just rice cooked in almond milk with
cinnamon and then you scoop out doughnut-hole-sized chunks and deep-fry them
and sprinkle with sugar. It's Italian, though what cookbook I took it from I
don't recall now.

We were dealing with a lot of people who had wheat gluten, milk, and egg
issues that day, though. They kept well cold and were tasty cold, too,
though, I thought, much better when straight out of the hot oil. But that's
always true of fried things.



Al vostro servizio,
Signora Giovanna d'Este

Vert, on a billet Or three fleurs-de-lys, one and two, sable, a bordure
dancetty Or.

"Numquam Succumbe"

_________________________________________________________________
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--- In Authentic_SCA@yahoogroups.com, "rachelaleclair"
<rachelaleclair@...> wrote:
>
> My shire is having a demonstration, and we were discussing making
> treats to pass out at the event.  Does anyone have any good period
> recipees/ideas that have worked well for you?

http://www.pbm.com/~lindahl/cariadoc/recipe_toc.html
I've had His Grace's khushkananaj, it's lovely.

Jehanne de Wodeford
West

You might also try hedgehogs (a medieval meatball). The cooks in my shire
do these all the time at demos, and they are extremely popular.

Arlys

On Thu, 31 May 2007 12:38:30 -0400 "Sarah Michele Ford"
<saramichelef@...> writes:
> On 5/31/07, rachelaleclair <rachelaleclair@...> wrote:
> >
> > My shire is having a demonstration, and we were discussing making
> > treats to pass out at the event.  Does anyone have any good period
> > recipees/ideas that have worked well for you?
>
>
> Period gingerbread is really, really easy (the only "period cooking"
> I've
> ever done, actually).  There's a pretty long thread about it in
> Stephan's
> Florilegium -
> http://www.florilegium.org/files/FOOD-SWEETS/gingerbread-msg.html -
> probably
> a good starting spot.  The only warning I'd give is that it can be
> kinda
> stickymessy.
>
> Alianor de R.
>
> --
> *****************************
> saramichelef@...
> http://snowplow.org/sarah/pers/
> http://alphasarah.livejournal.com
> http://www.flickr.com/people/sarahmichelef
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

In a message dated 6/2/2007 7:10:50 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
Authentic_SCA@yahoogroups.com writes:

<<You might also try hedgehogs (a medieval meatball). The cooks  in my shire
do these all the time at demos, and they are extremely popular.  >>

Actually, if you follow the hedgehog recipe properly, it's not a meatball  at
all.  It's a stuffed pig's stomach.  People make meatballs out of  the
stuffing and call them hedgehogs, but the period recipe does not support  that
practice.

Brangwayna Morgan




************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.

Of possible interest:
http://www.needlenthread.com/2006/10/video-library-of-hand-embroidery.html

Enjoy,
Jehanne de Wodeford

Greetings All,
    I need advice please. I have costumed Middle Eastern
for ladies for a number of years, but have never done
much Middle Eastern sewing for men.
    I am set and good with the actual clothing. It's the
headwear that I'm having trouble with right now.
    The gentleman I am sewing for doesn't care for
turbans and I have always understood that the Kafeya
with cording band seen today is a rather modern type
of headwear. The climate here in summer is quite hot
and he is not comfortable with the turban.
     I am looking around about 1000 ce, and any help
or ideas would really be appreciated.
     Cheers,  Sine

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Sine wrote:
>    The gentleman I am sewing for doesn't care for
>turbans

SCAdians (and other non-Muslims) use the term "turban" far far far
too loosely. There is a difference between a turban and a head wrap,
but i hear people over and over call a head wrap a turban.

A *genuine* turban is a very specific marker of high political or
religious status "in period". A turban was for royalty, important
religious figures, etc., and its use is often proscribed by law - the
method of wrapping denoted the individual's status, was well as the
type of hat over which the turban was wrapped. So turbans are
generally inappropriate for SCAdians

Head wraps, on the other hand, are often quite appropriate for
SCAdians. Head wraps are a great deal simpler than turbans and are
relatively common.

Head wraps are still commonly seen throughout Dar al-Islam. Turbans
are quite rare. I'm not trying to sell you (or the gentleman) on one,
just to inform.

(just as the word "veil" is used for an item of clothing for Muslim
women and non-Muslim women in the Muslim world in such a way as to be
almost meaningless)

>and I have always understood that the Kafeya
>with cording band seen today is a rather modern type
>of headwear.

Acutally, there is evidence for a *pure white* head cloth and a
*simple* filet (not those big thick black and gold agals i see) at
least in al-Andalus. I have some pictures on my website... if the
gentleman is a Maghribi or Andalusi.

>The climate here in summer is quite hot
>and he is not comfortable with the turban.

And i bet he isn't a shah, a sultan, a caliph, or an imam who has
gone on the hajj... so a turban is likely to be inappropriate,
although a common and simple head wrap might be appropriate.

>     I am looking around about 1000 ce, and any help
>or ideas would really be appreciated.

In fact, what just about anyone - adult, child, male, female - just
about anyplace could wear is a cap. The style varies from time to
time and place to place.

So, where is this gentleman from? I can better suggest a style when i
know his locale.

--
Urtatim (that's err-tah-TEEM)
the persona formerly known as Anahita

Ride your camel to Dar Anahita
http://home.earthlink.net/~lilinah
SCA-period Near and Middle Eastern Costuming,
including Persian, Ottoman, Maghribi, and Andalusian,
Medieval Muslim Egyptian knitting, and
complete menus and period recipes from seven SCA feasts
(from German to Persian), 23 German mushroom recipes,
an analysis of the spices used in two different 13th C. Arabic
language cookbooks, and more Medieval food-related stuff

Urtatim (that's err-tah-TEEM) wrote.........
>SCAdians (and other non-Muslims) use the term "turban" far far far
>too loosely. There is a difference between a turban and a head wrap,
>but i hear people over and over call a head wrap a turban....snips......

.........well, OK.....yes - there is indeed a difference between
a turban and a headwrap. As the gentleman I am costuming
for will be Royal I guess it really was appropriate! Our equivalent
to the Shah, Sultan, Caliph etc., However, as I said he is just not
comfortable in a Turban. He really doesn't much care for
a headwrap either - even if that would seem to be more
acceptable.  It seems he gets extremely warm about
the head and layers of cloth make him very, very uncomfortable.

......>Acutally, there is evidence for a *pure white* head cloth and a
>*simple* filet (not those big thick black and gold agals i see) at
>least in al-Andalus. I have some pictures on my website... if the
>gentleman is a Maghribi or Andalusi.

Now this would be of more interest to him. Something simple
and cooler to the head........I understand a one strand cord (filet),
is there a colour restriction for that?  He does agree with me that
it feels more mediaeval to have something on the head - he just
doesn't want to be miserable in it.

Apparently he is about 1000 C.E. Persian. You also mentioned a
cap?  Rather like the short Fez, embroidered type?
Thank you for your time,   Sine

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Sine wrote:
>Urtatim (that's err-tah-TEEM) wrote.........
>......>Actually, there is evidence for a *pure white* head cloth and a
>  >*simple* filet (not those big thick black and gold agals i see) at
>>least in al-Andalus. I have some pictures on my website... if the
>>gentleman is a Maghribi or Andalusi.
>
>Now this would be of more interest to him. Something simple
>and cooler to the head........I understand a one strand cord (filet),
>is there a colour restriction for that?  He does agree with me that
>it feels more mediaeval to have something on the head - he just
>doesn't want to be miserable in it.
>
>Apparently he is about 1000 C.E. Persian. You also mentioned a
>cap?  Rather like the short Fez, embroidered type?
>Thank you for your time,

Uh, mmm, alas, that white head cloth is not appropriate for a
Persian. I think a cap of some sort is going to be more appropriate
for the rest of his clothing.

Is he Sogdian or Seljuk?

--
Urtatim (that's err-tah-TEEM)
the persona formerly known as Anahita

.........Urtatim...wrote
>Uh, mmm, alas, that white head cloth is not appropriate for a
>Persian. I think a cap of some sort is going to be more appropriate
>for the rest of his clothing.
>
>Is he Sogdian or Seljuk?
>
I understand him to be Seljuk........now I'm not actually positive
about that, just seem to remember that in conversation, can't
contact him until tomorrow to clarify.
Cheers,  Sine

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MODERATOR NOTE (please sign all posts to the list and please do not top post to
this list, thank you) Despina moderator

You might look at Burnoose. In my research for a play they are a
popular alternative to the turban. Though I dont know if they go so
far back to 1000 ce.

Sine wrote:
>I understand him to be Seljuk........now I'm not actually positive
>about that, just seem to remember that in conversation, can't
>contact him until tomorrow to clarify.

OK, if he's Seljuk, he's Turkish. They conquered a large part of
Persia, but they are Turkish linguistically, ethnically, and
culturally.

In art i see that he would have adapted to wear a turban as royalty,
but if he's dead set against it, a fur lined had is the next best
thing (yeah, right, i'm sure he'll love that idea :-) You can fake it
by making a cap and have the fur on the outside...

One hat (but it's for mortals less that the "King") is a basic cap
with a rectangular band around the head and the top made of triangles
- six would be best, although i've seen simplified versions with only
four, but c'mon, if he's royalty he deserves the best :-) Make the
parts of the hat that show of the richest jacquard silk fabric you
can fine - since it won't use a lot. Then that simple band around the
head should be of a nice rich dark brown fur - you can make it on the
outside only so it won't be so hot, with a simple comfy fabric on the
inside (cotton or linen).

One feature of royal caps, at least in the Minai style Seljuk art (i
have a real soft spot for Minai style art) is a sort of triangle
shape in the center front that sticks up and is gold, at least in
paintings, and appears to be backed or edged with fur. In reality it
might have been gold metal, but if you can find gilded leather that
might be less uncomfortable and quicker to make.

This web page has some nice Minai style manuscript illuminations,
although they're a bit fuzzy.
http://www.geocities.com/egfroth1/Seljuqs.htm

The large painting about 2/5 of the way down the page with the caption:
"A Seljuq court, from Kitab al Diryaq (the Book of Antidotes) by
Pseudo-Gallen, probably from Iraq, mid 13th century. National
Bibliothek, Vienna." (i figure that should say Pseudo-Galen)
shows the ruler in very large size almost centered. He's wearing that
hat i mentioned.

Granted, this is about 200 years later than you're looking for, but
clothing for rulers was often more conservative than that for
ordinary folks, so it may be close to what he could use.

Those pointed white hats with the brims do not appear to be for
royalty, and in period it was always important to look the part,
whatever one's part was. Personal comfort of royalty when out in
public didn't matter as much as looking impressive, although in
private i'm sure royalty could be a bit more informal.

In some versions of the Maqamat of al-Hariri produced in Seljuk
controlled Syria in a Seljuk influenced style, shows some men with
head wraps around caps - one in particular looks like a qalansuwa - a
somewhat tall somewhat pointy hat, generally associated with the
ruling class.

In a copy of Kalila wa-Dimna dated to 1220 and produced in Seljuk
controlled Baghdad all the human men appear to be wearing either
turbans or head wraps :-( Many of the illustrations from this book,
Ms. arabe 3465,

Both books are on-line at the site of the Biblioteque Nationale de France
http://expositions.bnf.fr/livrarab/
I seem to recall that the section in English has a lot fewer pieces
of art than the section in French.

Another Seljuk book, the story of Warka wa-Gulshah, the tale of two
lovers (his name is variously Romanized into Warqa and Varka; as for
her name, "Gul" means "rose"), is also from the early 13th century. I
can only assume these early 13th C. works were all pre-Mongol
invasion. Again, nearly all the men are shown wearing turbans or head
wraps. Most of the illustrations are on-line, scanned from a book
that reproduced them mostly in black-and-white (alas).
http://www.geocities.com/qilich/varga/

There are some color pictures from it at:
http://www.ee.bilkent.edu.tr/~history/early.html

And there are some illustrations from the 1300s... some before the
Mongol invasion and some after here:
www.ehttp://e.bilkent.edu.tr/~history/pers-II.html
but this is definitely getting rather late for your gentleman's persona.

I hope some of this is useful.
--
Urtatim (that's err-tah-TEEM)
the persona formerly known as Anahita

Unsigned wrote:
>You might look at Burnoose. In my research for a play they are a
>popular alternative to the turban. Though I dont know if they go so
>far back to 1000 ce.

Also called selHam in Morocco (i use the capital H to indicate a
strong H sound). I've found evidence for them in North Africa going
back to Roman times, but i haven't read about or seen them outside
North Africa.

And in art from Central Asia - original home of the Seljuks, this
gentleman's culture - i've seen no suggestion that a hooded cloak was
part of the clothing system. Nor have i seen any in any Persian
culture from Greco-Roman times to the 17th century. What i see over
and over are front-opening "coats".

If you have an historical source for Central Asian hooded cloaks,
please share, because i've got one that would be comfy to wear for
those times i'm wearing Persian rather than North African clothing at
events.

--
Urtatim (that's err-tah-TEEM)
the persona formerly known as Anahita

Greetings !
We have made some seldjuk/turkish/arabic garbs from end of XIIth century here
http://www.1186-583.org/rubrique.php3?id_rubrique=21
You can see some sharbush style hats here :
http://www.1186-583.org/article.php3?id_article=101
http://www.1186-583.org/article.php3?id_article=145
(sorry it is just in French but pictures are useful)
An excellent article about it is here :
http://www.havenonline.com/moas/northstar/vol2no1/An%20Islamic%20Military%20Cap%\
20
(Tarik).htm
Atakan al Vefa is an a Seldjuk character, Zahr is Turkish but with some
Arabic/Kurdish/Turkmen influences.
Hope it can help.
Yann aka Per Braz aka Abu Hamir

--
Per Braz - perbraz@...
webmestre http://www.1186-583.org

Greetings:

Cool! I've been admiring the 1186-583 website for quite a while.
There's some excellent stuff on it.

>We have made some seldjuk/turkish/arabic garbs from end of XIIth century here
>http://www.1186-583.org/rubrique.php3?id_rubrique=21
>You can see some sharbush style hats here :
>http://www.1186-583.org/article.php3?id_article=101
>http://www.1186-583.org/article.php3?id_article=145

Yes!!! These are really useful pages on the hat i mentioned. I've
saved them and bookmarked them, but forgot about it when i made my
recommendations :-(

>(sorry it is just in French but pictures are useful)

I can help translate...

>An excellent article about it is here :
>http://www.havenonline.com/moas/northstar/vol2no1/An%20Islamic%20Military%20Cap\
%20(Tarik).htm

Alas, the illustrations are missing (and from most of the articles on
this site)... did you (or someone else), by chance, save them?

--
Urtatim (that's err-tah-TEEM)
the persona formerly known as Anahita

Terrific help Urtatim, thanks very much.
From the email this morning my gentleman is Seljuk. So....
he is Turkish eh?  hmmm.....he has a determination to
follow Persian inspirations.
     So, having the strong Turkish influence there might
be an opportunity for some minor changes.......more
elaborate fabrics etc.?
     Thanks again for all your help.  Sine

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Le mardi 5 juin 2007, Lilinah a écrit :
> Cool! I've been admiring the 1186-583 website for quite a while.
> There's some excellent stuff on it.
Thanks a lot. I plan to upgrade the website to a new CMS engine before the end
of the year, with the possibility to have foreign languages, including
English of course. And we haven't pusblished a lot recently as we are working
hard on a book project to be released for next year. We should begin again to
put stuff during Summer I think, we have quite some new things to show and a
lot of ideas :)

> >(sorry it is just in French but pictures are useful)
> I can help translate...
So do I of course :)

> Alas, the illustrations are missing (and from most of the articles on
> this site)... did you (or someone else), by chance, save them?
I don't think
I will ask on our internal forum, by chance.
All the best
Yann aka Per Braz

--
Per Braz - perbraz@...
webmestre http://www.1186-583.org

Sine wrote:
>From the email this morning my gentleman is Seljuk. So....
>he is Turkish eh?  hmmm.....he has a determination to
>follow Persian inspirations.

As did many Seljuks after they conquered much of Persia :-) Persian
culture was THE culture to emulate - even the 'Abbasid Arabs copied
many aspects of Persian culture.

>So, having the strong Turkish influence there might
>be an opportunity for some minor changes...more
>elaborate fabrics etc.?

Unfortunately, the Mongols followed on the heels of the Seljuks and
were quite destructive, so there's a very limited amount of clothing
left. There are some garments in modern Turkey, in the Anatolian city
of Konya, which was the capital city of the Seljuks of Rum in the
12th& 13th centuries. They're in a museum, the Mevlana Museum,
dedicated to the famous poet Rumi (so-called because he lived in Rum,
i.e., a region that had formerly belonged to the "Romans", what the
Byzantines called themselves). Mevlana Celaleddin (or Jalaluddin)
Rumi was born in Balkh, a city in medieval Persia, now in
Afghanistan. His family fled westward to escape the Mongols. He was a
Sufi, the Mevlevi order, sometimes called "whirling dervishes".

There are some not-terribly good photos from the museum on-line.
[http://rubens.anu.edu.au/raid1/turkey2/cd10/konya/mevlana_tekke/MUSEUM/textiles\
/clothing/]
the graphics are freakin' huge (mostly around 1mg!) but should be helpful.

As for fabric to use to look royal in, some 2-color damask with small
patterns might be good. Colors to go for are rich red, golden yellow,
white, and various shades of indigo blue.

Another typical early Persian motif is the roundel featuring either a
mounted warrior (i.e., on horseback) or a "big cat" attacking an
herbivore (deer, camel, bull, other) and often with a "pearl" border
(i.e., having a circumference of small solid circles). From what i
can tell, roundels were still featured on lampas weave fabric during
the Seljuk period.

These sorts of patterns are admittedly hard to find in modern fabric
- but you never know, you might find some. A few years ago i actually
found some white cellulose rayon with indigo printed cintamani (a
typical royal Ottoman pattern). The scale was wrong (it was small and
Ottomans liked BIG patterns) but i HAD to get some. It's the only
time in 8 years i've seen modern commercial cintamani.

--
Urtatim (that's err-tah-TEEM)
the persona formerly known as Anahita

I wrote:
>As for fabric to use to look royal in, some 2-color damask with
>small patterns might be good. Colors to go for are rich red, golden
>yellow, white, and various shades of indigo blue.
>
>Another typical early Persian motif is the roundel featuring either
>a mounted warrior (i.e., on horseback) or a "big cat" attacking an
>herbivore (deer, camel, bull, other) and often with a "pearl" border
>(i.e., having a circumference of small solid circles). From what i
>can tell, roundels were still featured on lampas weave fabric during
>the Seljuk period.

Here are a couple Seljuk period fabric fragments i found some time
ago at the website of the Cleveland Museum of Art:
-- Lampas weave fabric with animals in roundels
[http://www.clevelandart.org/Explore/departmentWork.asp?deptgroup=3&recNo=299]
-- Lampas weave fabric of simurghs in medium indigo blue silk and metallic gold
[http://www.clevelandart.org/Explore/work.asp?searchText=1945%2E14&recNo=0&tab=2\
&display=]

--
Urtatim (that's err-tah-TEEM)
the persona formerly known as Anahita

Whew! I finally found the "thumbnail" pages for those huge Mevlana Tekke files.
http://rubens.anu.edu.au/turkey/konya/mevlana_tekke/museum/textiles/clothing/ind\
ex.php?page=1
and
http://rubens.anu.edu.au/turkey/konya/mevlana_tekke/museum/textiles/clothing/ind\
ex.php?page=2

So, if you've been holding back, now you can preview before clicking...
--
Urtatim (that's err-tah-TEEM)
the persona formerly known as Anahita

From another list.... wool flannel on sale for $6.95 per yard. Well worth
the price if you're a wool wearing person.  - Despina

I know it may seem odd to be thinking about wool when it is going to be 96
degrees this week, but here is a good special from B Black & Sons. They have
Taupe, Pewter, Plum, Smoke and Turquoise on sale*
*

http://www.bblackandsons.com/store/woolens_specials_order_now.html



.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I can totally recommend them too. The website is good and if you have
a chance to go to their store in the L.A. fabric district I recommend
that too since they have so many color and fabric weight choices.
Happy sewing!
                Johanna


>
> From another list.... wool flannel on sale for $6.95 per yard. Well
worth
> the price if you're a wool wearing person.  - Despina

>From another list.... wool flannel on sale for $6.95 per yard. Well worth
>the price if you're a wool wearing person.  - Despina
>
>I know it may seem odd to be thinking about wool when it is going to be 96
>degrees this week, but here is a good special from B Black & Sons. They have
>Taupe, Pewter, Plum, Smoke and Turquoise on sale*
>*
>http://www.bblackandsons.com/store/woolens_specials_order_now.html

Until a couple years ago (when my responsibilities at SCA events
meant i couldn't go to many fairs) i was an actor at small
Renaissance Fairs (from March to November, here in California).
Another member of my "guild" (a group of actors) wore a woolen outfit
(and wool flannel, at that!). She said that her outfit - a basic
simple skirt and bodies, with a cotton or linen shift - was no hotter
than upholstery weight cotton, and cooler than synthetic blends.

--
Urtatim (that's err-tah-TEEM)
the persona formerly known as Anahita

At 09:14 PM 6/6/2007, you wrote:
> From another list.... wool flannel on sale for $6.95 per yard. Well worth
>the price if you're a wool wearing person. - Despina


Oooh...wouldn't that just make a loverly loose gown for cool nights at Pennsic?

Laurensa

--- In Authentic_SCA@yahoogroups.com, Lilinah <lilinah@...> wrote:
<<,snipped>>>
>
> Another member of my "guild" (a group of actors) wore a woolen outfit
> (and wool flannel, at that!). She said that her outfit - a basic
> simple skirt and bodies, with a cotton or linen shift - was no hotter
> than upholstery weight cotton, and cooler than synthetic blends.


This is what friends who've done Rev War re-enacting (but are playing
in SCA, too) have said to me, too.  Wool outer clothing (and the
British military uniforms are required to be a specific weight of wool,
I believe---heavier than tropical) and linen "small clothes" were/are
as comfortable, or more so, as wearing modern cotton T's and jeans or
denim skirts.

Yseult the Gentle

In Authentic_SCA@yahoogroups.com, Lilinah <lilinah@...> wrote:
>
> Another member of my "guild" (a group of actors) wore a woolen outfit
> (and wool flannel, at that!). She said that her outfit - a basic
> simple skirt and bodies, with a cotton or linen shift - was no hotter
> than upholstery weight cotton, and cooler than synthetic blends.

If that was a reference to me (and it could have been, she and I used to play in
the same guild) then I'd qualify that slightly: while I sometimes felt "warm" in
that outfit in hot weather, I never felt damp or sweaty, which was a big
advantage and took much of the misery out of being hot. And guess where I got
that wool? Yup, from B. Black. Very reasonable price, very nice quality, lovely
color.

OTOH, I would use a much lighter-weight wool another time, simply because an
Elizabethan gown made from wool flannel, with all the lining, stiffening et
cetera that takes, weighs a ton -- or at least, it's heavy enough to make it
actually tiring to carry that much sheer poundage around. If I lived in a
chilly, drafty castle I'd probably be willing to put up with a heavy outfit for
warmth, but not in 106-degree California summers.

I should also add that that particular gown -- the second wool one I've owned --
has some structural problems and I've never been very happy with it. The maker
(who was not me) also used a fairly heavy cotton lining for it, adding to the
excess weight. Modern cottons are often so tightly woven that I find they don't
"breathe" well despite being a natural fiber. I'd make the extra effort to look
for an appropriate dark-colored linen for lining another time.

(Dame) Christian de Holacombe

____________________________________________________________
0  Chris Laning
|  <claning@...>
+  Davis, California
http://paternoster-row.org  -  http://paternosters.blogspot.com
____________________________________________________________

From another list -- a fascinating little website!

Begin forwarded message:

> From: Ann Ball <AnnAlert@...>
> Date: June 9, 2007 7:40:45 AM PDT
> To: MEDIEVAL-RELIGION@...
> Subject: [M-R] Interesting website on saints and spectacles
>
> Some of you will certainly enjoy this website; I had no clue about
> saints wearing glasses this far back!
> http://www.antiquespectacles.com/topics/religious_leaders/
> religious_leaders.htm
>
> By the way, the man who does the site is looking for more artworks
> from your time period of study so if any of you have links to
> suggest please let me know and I'll pass them on.
>
> Happy summer,
> ann
>
> Am still having lots of fun writing 101 Saints for a Bad Hair Day.
> As patron for the embarrassing times one expells gas in public I am
> nominating ----- Saint Bean!  And yes, there are actually two of
> them!  Not much known of either probably because they intuited that
> one day I might nominate them as patron of such an ignominious thing.
>
>
>
> See what's free at AOL.com.
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____________________________________________________________

O   (Dame) Christian de Holacombe, OL - Shire of Windy Meads
+    Kingdom of the West - Chris Laning  <claning@...>
         http://paternoster-row.org - http://paternosters.blogspot.com
____________________________________________________________

I was carving a new needle out today and was wondering when crochet
came about...........Hmmmmmmmm....
~Elisha

--- In Authentic_SCA@yahoogroups.com, "ecreech81" <ecreech81@...> wrote:
>
> I was carving a new needle out today and was wondering when crochet
> came about...........Hmmmmmmmm....
> ~Elisha
>

19th century, to the best of my knowledge.  18th at the earliest; I've
seen no evidence that it was done in our period.

Knitting, on the other hand, is quite ancient.

Tasha

On 6/10/07, ecreech81 <ecreech81@...> wrote:
> I was carving a new needle out today and was wondering when crochet
> came about...........Hmmmmmmmm....
> ~Elisha
>
Early Victorian or perhaps just before.

Onaree


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