First post! UK based near Lymington. Thinking of the Arrow 14 at the moment.

This UK supplier of kevlar tow may be able to help. 7p a metre.

http://www.freeflightsupplies.co.uk/hitech.htm#cloth%20&%20tow

The Kevlar is .33 grm/m is that ok?

Brian

--- In Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com, Nick Wood <nwood660@...> wrote:
>
> Hi Keith
>  
> Thanks for the information on Skycraft, much appreciated. I think either LAS
or possibly GA Boats is going to be the way to go for the kevlar depending on
price, P&P, VAT etc.
>  
> Kind Regards
>  
> Nick
>
> --- On Thu, 10/9/09, keithbcjeremiah <keith.jeremiah@...> wrote:
>
>
> From: keithbcjeremiah <keith.jeremiah@...>
> Subject: [Airolite_Boats] Re: Covering Fabrics etc: Alternative Suppliers in
UK / Europe
> To: Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com
> Date: Thursday, 10 September, 2009, 9:00 PM
>
>
>  
>
>
>
> Hi
>
> I am similarly placed, being in UK (SE London) and contemplating building a
Snowshoe 14.
> I have found a firm called Skycraft Ltd who offer a material called Diatex
which they claim is equivalent to Ceconite but is wider.
> I hope this helps.
> LAS look the best way to get the Kevlar at least.
> Keith
>
> --- In Airolite_Boats@ yahoogroups. com, "nwood660" <nwood660@ .> wrote:
> >
> > Good Evening All
> >
> > I am considering building a Classic 12 for use on the local rivers and in
Christchurch Harbour here on the south coast of England. However, before I buy
the plans from Bette Monfort I thought it best to check UK/European suppliers of
the various materials used in building one.
> >
> > Timber (lumber), epoxy/glue , paint are no problems but dacron fabric,
kevlar roving and possibily HeatnBond adhesive tape may be. I'm wondering if
members of this group could advise me on whether my net searching has revealed
suitable alternatives.
> >
> > The dacron fabric available from GA Boats appears to be (from it's price)
the uncertified fabric sold by Aircraft Spruce and Speciality Co. In the UK, I
can get ceconite 102 which appears to be the same expect that it's a) CAA / FAA
certified; b) 70" width instead of 72" and c) 3.5 oz/ sq yd instead of 3.7.
Bearing in mind the postage and handling costs and the VAT (UK sales tax)
payable here as well as the Royal Mail's fee for collecting the VAT, it's
cheaper to buy the ceconite here.
> >
> > As far as I can see, the kevlar roving is unavailable in the UK but it is
available from the Aircraft Spruce and Speciality Co who have a UK dealer not
far from me (LAS Aerospace Ltd). Their site states they can get anything from
AS&S within a week so I may as well buy the ceconite or possibly dacron fabric
and the roving from them. The question I have is; does anyone know of an
alternative supplier?
> >
> > The HeatnBond (TM) tape available here is manufactured by Therm O Web and
sold as a needlework craft adhesive. From the web descriptions it appears to be
the same as that sold by GA Boats (ie same melting temperatures, sizes and
lenghts etc. Could someone confirm this for me?
> >
> > My apologies for such a long first post.
> >
> > Kind Regards to all,
> >
> > Nick
> >
>

The Dacron is available in the UK from Skycraft. They sell Diatex which has an
equivalent to ceconite
Diatex 1000 substitutes Ceconite 103 and is 60" wide
Diatex 1500 substitutes Ceconite 102 and is 75" wide
Diatex 2000 substitutes Ceconite 101 and is 75" wide

http://www.sky-craft.co.uk/acatalog/Skycraft_Sales_Diatex_250.html

Brian



--- In Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com, "keyhavenpotterer" <brianpearson@...>
wrote:
>
> First post! UK based near Lymington. Thinking of the Arrow 14 at the moment.
>
> This UK supplier of kevlar tow may be able to help. 7p a metre.
>
> http://www.freeflightsupplies.co.uk/hitech.htm#cloth%20&%20tow
>
> The Kevlar is .33 grm/m is that ok?
>
> Brian
>
> --- In Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com, Nick Wood <nwood660@> wrote:
> >
> > Hi Keith
> >  
> > Thanks for the information on Skycraft, much appreciated. I think either LAS
or possibly GA Boats is going to be the way to go for the kevlar depending on
price, P&P, VAT etc.
> >  
> > Kind Regards
> >  
> > Nick
> >
> > --- On Thu, 10/9/09, keithbcjeremiah <keith.jeremiah@> wrote:
> >
> >
> > From: keithbcjeremiah <keith.jeremiah@>
> > Subject: [Airolite_Boats] Re: Covering Fabrics etc: Alternative Suppliers in
UK / Europe
> > To: Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com
> > Date: Thursday, 10 September, 2009, 9:00 PM
> >
> >
> >  
> >
> >
> >
> > Hi
> >
> > I am similarly placed, being in UK (SE London) and contemplating building a
Snowshoe 14.
> > I have found a firm called Skycraft Ltd who offer a material called Diatex
which they claim is equivalent to Ceconite but is wider.
> > I hope this helps.
> > LAS look the best way to get the Kevlar at least.
> > Keith
> >
> > --- In Airolite_Boats@ yahoogroups. com, "nwood660" <nwood660@ .> wrote:
> > >
> > > Good Evening All
> > >
> > > I am considering building a Classic 12 for use on the local rivers and in
Christchurch Harbour here on the south coast of England. However, before I buy
the plans from Bette Monfort I thought it best to check UK/European suppliers of
the various materials used in building one.
> > >
> > > Timber (lumber), epoxy/glue , paint are no problems but dacron fabric,
kevlar roving and possibily HeatnBond adhesive tape may be. I'm wondering if
members of this group could advise me on whether my net searching has revealed
suitable alternatives.
> > >
> > > The dacron fabric available from GA Boats appears to be (from it's price)
the uncertified fabric sold by Aircraft Spruce and Speciality Co. In the UK, I
can get ceconite 102 which appears to be the same expect that it's a) CAA / FAA
certified; b) 70" width instead of 72" and c) 3.5 oz/ sq yd instead of 3.7.
Bearing in mind the postage and handling costs and the VAT (UK sales tax)
payable here as well as the Royal Mail's fee for collecting the VAT, it's
cheaper to buy the ceconite here.
> > >
> > > As far as I can see, the kevlar roving is unavailable in the UK but it is
available from the Aircraft Spruce and Speciality Co who have a UK dealer not
far from me (LAS Aerospace Ltd). Their site states they can get anything from
AS&S within a week so I may as well buy the ceconite or possibly dacron fabric
and the roving from them. The question I have is; does anyone know of an
alternative supplier?
> > >
> > > The HeatnBond (TM) tape available here is manufactured by Therm O Web and
sold as a needlework craft adhesive. From the web descriptions it appears to be
the same as that sold by GA Boats (ie same melting temperatures, sizes and
lenghts etc. Could someone confirm this for me?
> > >
> > > My apologies for such a long first post.
> > >
> > > Kind Regards to all,
> > >
> > > Nick
> > >
> >
>

a recent request for suppliers got me to thinking.
  if you have a local sailmaking shop, check with them. hard core racing boats
wear out their sails and replace them regularly. "wearing out" in their case
means they have stretched and worn slightly, making them available as used
sails. i suspect that eventually they are really worn out and discarded or sold
cheaply for recycling by someone who isn't as critical of the condition.
nowadays dacron is the lowest of the high tech materials. spectra, kevlar and
whatever other new materials should be available this way. i would think at
least the bottom of the hull could use some nice bulletproof(literally!) fabric
at the expense of a few ounces, especially if you will be in waters that have
sharp stones, oyster bars, etc.
bill keiser
florida USA

ah, good question. i haven't built my airolite yet, so that didn't immediately
occur to me. thus demonstrating the value of this list!
  i guess the only way to use it would be to glue over the stretched dacron on
the bottom panels.
bk


> But the bigger question si, how do you heat shrink dacron or kevlar that's
> used for sails?
> Beau Schless
>

Hi guys, couple of questions:

1. The kevlar from aircraft spruce do you triple it before using?
2. Approx how much tention do you pull on it while installing?
3. Does the kevlar get glued to every point of contact with the structure?
4. Does the final pull or tentioning of the kevlar occure after the boat is
covered?
5. Approx what total length of yarn do you need?
6. Is it recomended to put in seats or sit on the bottom?
7.. Any recomendations for a clear bottom ie: boat shrink wrap,not monokote?

Thanks  Chris

Hi Chris, I don't know about the kevlar, just think that it should be as much as
possible in contact with your boat from a structural point of view. About the
clear bottom: don't use shrink wrap. In a very excellent book Building
skin-on-frame boats by Robert Morris (
http://www.amazon.com/Building-Skin-Frame-Robert-Morris/dp/0881791911 ) he gives
a hilarious account of what happens if you shrinkwrap your boat. It lasts about
5 minutes then the water seeps through and the boat sinks.
For a clear skin maybe you should go for an architectural skin like ETFE which
is used to cover buildings etc.

Best regards, Casper

--- In Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com, "cmrv6" <cmrv6@...> wrote:
>
> Hi guys, couple of questions:
>
> 1. The kevlar from aircraft spruce do you triple it before using?
> 2. Approx how much tention do you pull on it while installing?
> 3. Does the kevlar get glued to every point of contact with the structure?
> 4. Does the final pull or tentioning of the kevlar occure after the boat is
covered?
> 5. Approx what total length of yarn do you need?
> 6. Is it recomended to put in seats or sit on the bottom?
> 7.. Any recomendations for a clear bottom ie: boat shrink wrap,not monokote?
>
> Thanks  Chris
>

Has anyone in Michigan built one of these boats?

If anyone's interested in seeing a non-Monfort design built using his
construction method, I've posted some  pictures of my nearly complete canoe. 
Back in the 80s I set out to build a replica of a smooth skin cedar canoe by JH
Rushton, the noted 19th century Adirondack builder.  I lofted it, set up molds,
installed a keel and stems, and then a back injury put the project on hold for
about 20 years.  This August I started looking into alternative construction
methods that might let me actually complete the boat despite my still very bad
back.  I considered doing a kevlar/epoxy layup or a cedar strip, but settled on
the Monfort method due to the promise of super light weight.

This Rushton model is 15' in length with a 30" beam, so I bought a set of plans
for the Snowshoe 16 to get the dimensions of members and general construction
information, and then improvised a bit.  Many thanks to all group members who
have posted questions and answers and photos—they were very, very helpful.

I thoroughly enjoyed building this boat, and even managed—just barely!—to get it
in the water this season.  Sunday, November 8th was nearly windless, with an air
temperature of around 70 degrees—rather unusual for the Boston area this time of
year—so with the boat about 98% complete we headed to the lake.  It handles
nicely with the two of us aboard, but with just one person it draws very little
water and needs extra ballast to track well.  I haven't weighed the hull, but I
don't think it's even 20 pounds.

For anyone interested, here's a link to a photo of the boat I had originally
planned to build (Atwood Manley, the gentleman in the boat, was the author of a
Rushton biography—his book was my source for offsets):

http://history.nnyln.org/cdm4/item_viewer.php?CISOROOT=/slcha&CISOPTR=154&REC=14

And here's a 19th century photo of the same or a very similar model
(foreground):

http://history.nnyln.org/cdm4/item_viewer.php?CISOROOT=%2Fslcha&CISOPTR=160&DMSC\
ALE=80.21390&DMWIDTH=600&DMHEIGHT=600&DMMODE=viewer&DMFULL=0&DMOLDSCALE=26.73797\
&DMX=0&DMY=0&DMTEXT=&DMTHUMB=1&REC=8&DMROTATE=0&x=136&y=100

Photos of my Monfort-style version are in the album "Rushton 15'Ugo".  I've
included quite a few photos of construction details in the hope that they might
be useful to someone.

Thanks again for all of the very good information obtained from this group.

Jim

Does anyone know where to purchase green ash or green white oak in PA for ribs
(Snowshoe 14)?  I anticipated this would be easy, but it's turned out not to be.
I live in central PA, but am willing to drive a ways or pay shipping if need be.
Thanks for any suggestions!  Jeff

I don't know how far you're willing to drive, but I just found air dried
ash, 10 ft planks for ~$1.30/bf available at

Hicksville Planing Mill
14464 Hicksville Road
Clear Spring, MD 21722-1240
(301) 842-3474
0700-1700 MTuWF, 0700-1200 Sa

Hi gmouys thanks for your help last time. Some new question:

1.For two person use I wanted to move the front seat back one bay?
2.To make room for the back seat person I wanted to move the thorwpe forward one
bay and the front thorwap back one bay?
3.how critical is symetric loading of the two persons and their weight?

Thanks for the help. Chris

I ended up using ash from a lcl hardwood co. Yes it was kiln dried but I cut it
up soaked it in the pool for 24 hours then steamed it and it worked fine. cm

--- In Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com, "Jeff" <jlaman@...> wrote:
>
> Does anyone know where to purchase green ash or green white oak in PA for ribs
(Snowshoe 14)?  I anticipated this would be easy, but it's turned out not to be.
I live in central PA, but am willing to drive a ways or pay shipping if need be.
Thanks for any suggestions!  Jeff
>

Start to Finish: a beautiful job. I hope my Black Fly (not started yet) turns
out half as good!

Peter.

--- In Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com, "jsinjpma" <jsinjpma@...> wrote:
>
> If anyone's interested in seeing a non-Monfort design built using his
construction method, I've posted some  pictures of my nearly complete canoe. 
Back in the 80s I set out to build a replica of a smooth skin cedar canoe by JH
Rushton, the noted 19th century Adirondack builder.  I lofted it, set up molds,
installed a keel and stems, and then a back injury put the project on hold for
about 20 years.  This August I started looking into alternative construction
methods that might let me actually complete the boat despite my still very bad
back.  I considered doing a kevlar/epoxy layup or a cedar strip, but settled on
the Monfort method due to the promise of super light weight.
>
> This Rushton model is 15' in length with a 30" beam, so I bought a set of
plans for the Snowshoe 16 to get the dimensions of members and general
construction information, and then improvised a bit.  Many thanks to all group
members who have posted questions and answers and photos—they were very, very
helpful.
>
> I thoroughly enjoyed building this boat, and even managed—just barely!—to get
it in the water this season.  Sunday, November 8th was nearly windless, with an
air temperature of around 70 degrees—rather unusual for the Boston area this
time of year—so with the boat about 98% complete we headed to the lake.  It
handles nicely with the two of us aboard, but with just one person it draws very
little water and needs extra ballast to track well.  I haven't weighed the hull,
but I don't think it's even 20 pounds.
>
> For anyone interested, here's a link to a photo of the boat I had originally
planned to build (Atwood Manley, the gentleman in the boat, was the author of a
Rushton biography—his book was my source for offsets):
>
>
http://history.nnyln.org/cdm4/item_viewer.php?CISOROOT=/slcha&CISOPTR=154&REC=14
>
> And here's a 19th century photo of the same or a very similar model
(foreground):
>
>
http://history.nnyln.org/cdm4/item_viewer.php?CISOROOT=%2Fslcha&CISOPTR=160&DMSC\
ALE=80.21390&DMWIDTH=600&DMHEIGHT=600&DMMODE=viewer&DMFULL=0&DMOLDSCALE=26.73797\
&DMX=0&DMY=0&DMTEXT=&DMTHUMB=1&REC=8&DMROTATE=0&x=136&y=100
>
> Photos of my Monfort-style version are in the album "Rushton 15'Ugo".  I've
included quite a few photos of construction details in the hope that they might
be useful to someone.
>
> Thanks again for all of the very good information obtained from this group.
>
> Jim
>

Jeff,

I concur with cm below that kiln dried wood will work fine, and I think if you
search the archives you'll find several other posts that confirm this.  I used
kiln dried white oak that had sat around my shop for about 20 years.  I milled
out the ribs to width and thickness, and did not bother to pre-soak them--I
loaded them dry into the steam box, steamed them for about 25-30 minutes, and
they bent quite readily.  Because I steamed them dry, and because this
particular white oak was pretty dense and heavy, I gave them a few minutes
longer than recommended, but I'm not sure that they really needed it.

Wetter wood definitely steam bends more easily than drier wood, though, so if
you want to you can easily bring kiln dried wood back to the moisture content of
green wood by just soaking it in water, as cm did.

In my opinion, much more important than the green vs. kiln-dried issue is to try
to find the clearest, straightest grained wood possible.  Tiny knots, wavy grain
and other imperfections can give you problems.  Planing and sanding the ribs
very smooth, and slightly rounding the edges before bending helps.

I've only built one boat, so take my advice for what it's worth, but I would say
if you can get green wood without too much trouble, fine. If not, don't hesitate
to use air dried or kiln dried--just get the best grained board you can find,
and all will go well.  The main thing is not to let this delay your getting
started.  If your experience is anything like mine, once you get going you'll be
having so much fun building your boat you'll wish you'd started sooner...

Jim



--- In Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com, "cmrv6" <cmrv6@...> wrote:
>
> I ended up using ash from a lcl hardwood co. Yes it was kiln dried but I cut
it up soaked it in the pool for 24 hours then steamed it and it worked fine. cm
>
> --- In Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com, "Jeff" <jlaman@> wrote:
> >
> > Does anyone know where to purchase green ash or green white oak in PA for
ribs (Snowshoe 14)?  I anticipated this would be easy, but it's turned out not
to be.  I live in central PA, but am willing to drive a ways or pay shipping if
need be.  Thanks for any suggestions!  Jeff
> >
>

Jeff,

I concur with cm below that kiln dried wood will work fine, and I think if you search the archives you'll find several other posts that confirm this. I used kiln dried white oak that had sat around my shop for about 20 years. I milled out the ribs to width and thickness, and did not bother to pre-soak them--I loaded them dry into the steam box, steamed them for about 25-30 minutes, and they bent quite readily. Because I steamed them dry, and because this particular white oak was pretty dense and heavy, I gave them a few minutes longer than recommended, but I'm not sure that they really needed it.

Wetter wood definitely steam bends more easily than drier wood, though, so if you want to you can easily bring kiln dried wood back to the moisture content of green wood by just soaking it in water, as cm did.

In my opinion, much more important than the green vs. kiln-dried issue is to try to find the clearest, straightest grained wood possible. Tiny knots, wavy grain and other imperfections can give you problems. Planing and sanding the ribs very smooth, and slightly rounding the edges before bending helps.

I've only built one boat, so take my advice for what it's worth, but I would say if you can get green wood without too much trouble, fine. If not, don't hesitate to use air dried or kiln dried--just get the best grained board you can find, and all will go well. The main thing is not to let this delay your getting started. If your experience is anything like mine, once you get going you'll be having so much fun building your boat you'll wish you'd started sooner...

Jim

--- In Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com, "cmrv6" <cmrv6@...> wrote:
>
> I ended up using ash from a lcl hardwood co. Yes it was kiln dried but I cut it up soaked it in the pool for 24 hours then steamed it and it worked fine. cm
>
> --- In Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com, "Jeff" <jlaman@> wrote:
> >
> > Does anyone know where to purchase green ash or green white oak in PA for ribs (Snowshoe 14)? I anticipated this would be easy, but it's turned out not to be. I live in central PA, but am willing to drive a ways or pay shipping if need be. Thanks for any suggestions! Jeff
> >
>

I'm thinking this is worth a try and appreciate your passing on the experience. 
I can get kiln dried ash near by.

--- In Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com, "cmrv6" <cmrv6@...> wrote:
>
> I ended up using ash from a lcl hardwood co. Yes it was kiln dried but I cut
it up soaked it in the pool for 24 hours then steamed it and it worked fine. cm
>
> --- In Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com, "Jeff" <jlaman@> wrote:
> >
> > Does anyone know where to purchase green ash or green white oak in PA for
ribs (Snowshoe 14)?  I anticipated this would be easy, but it's turned out not
to be.  I live in central PA, but am willing to drive a ways or pay shipping if
need be.  Thanks for any suggestions!  Jeff
> >
>

Thanks for the white oak warning.  I have read that elsewhere, so will stay away
from that!

Not sure if I'm ready to drive to MD just yet.  May try soaking kiln dried first
-- cheaper than the drive.

--- In Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com, bschless@... wrote:
>
> I sure wouldn't use White Oak.  It's heavy and splintery as heck!
>
> Beau Schless
> President/CEO
> NOTEbookS Library Automation Systems
> HTTP://WWW.RASCO.COM
> PH: 1.(978) 443-2996
>
>
>
> Dave <dave@...>
> Sent by: Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com
> 11/28/2009 06:00 PM
> Please respond to
> Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com
>
>
> To
> Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com
> cc
>
> Subject
> [Airolite_Boats] Green Ash or White Oak in PA?
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> I don't know how far you're willing to drive, but I just found air dried
> ash, 10 ft planks for ~$1.30/bf available at
>
> Hicksville Planing Mill
> 14464 Hicksville Road
> Clear Spring, MD 21722-1240
> (301) 842-3474
> 0700-1700 MTuWF, 0700-1200 Sa
>

Jim,
Thanks for taking the time to pass on all the advice/knowledge.  You and cm have
convinced me to give the kiln dried a try.  I'll take your advice and get
started!
Jeff

--- In Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com, "jsinjpma" <jsinjpma@...> wrote:
>
>
>
>
> Jeff,
>
> I concur with cm below that kiln dried wood will work fine, and I think if you
search the archives you'll find several other posts that confirm this.  I used
kiln dried white oak that had sat around my shop for about 20 years.  I milled
out the ribs to width and thickness, and did not bother to pre-soak them--I
loaded them dry into the steam box, steamed them for about 25-30 minutes, and
they bent quite readily.  Because I steamed them dry, and because this
particular white oak was pretty dense and heavy, I gave them a few minutes
longer than recommended, but I'm not sure that they really needed it.
>
> Wetter wood definitely steam bends more easily than drier wood, though, so if
you want to you can easily bring kiln dried wood back to the moisture content of
green wood by just soaking it in water, as cm did.
>
> In my opinion, much more important than the green vs. kiln-dried issue is to
try to find the clearest, straightest grained wood possible.  Tiny knots, wavy
grain and other imperfections can give you problems.  Planing and sanding the
ribs very smooth, and slightly rounding the edges before bending helps.
>
> I've only built one boat, so take my advice for what it's worth, but I would
say if you can get green wood without too much trouble, fine. If not, don't
hesitate to use air dried or kiln dried--just get the best grained board you can
find, and all will go well.  The main thing is not to let this delay your
getting started.  If your experience is anything like mine, once you get going
you'll be having so much fun building your boat you'll wish you'd started
sooner...
>
> Jim
>
>
>
> --- In Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com, "cmrv6" <cmrv6@> wrote:
> >
> > I ended up using ash from a lcl hardwood co. Yes it was kiln dried but I cut
it up soaked it in the pool for 24 hours then steamed it and it worked fine. cm
> >
> > --- In Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com, "Jeff" <jlaman@> wrote:
> > >
> > > Does anyone know where to purchase green ash or green white oak in PA for
ribs (Snowshoe 14)?  I anticipated this would be easy, but it's turned out not
to be.  I live in central PA, but am willing to drive a ways or pay shipping if
need be.  Thanks for any suggestions!  Jeff
> > >
> >
>

Thanks for another vote to go ahead with kiln dried.  I'm convinced.


--- In Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com, bschless@... wrote:
>
> I concur.  I used kiln dried wood and it worked fine.
>
> Beau Schless
> President/CEO
> NOTEbookS Library Automation Systems
> HTTP://WWW.RASCO.COM
> PH: 1.(978) 443-2996
>
>
>
> "jsinjpma" <jsinjpma@...>
> Sent by: Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com
> 11/30/2009 07:15 AM
> Please respond to
> Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com
>
>
> To
> Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com
> cc
>
> Subject
> [Airolite_Boats] Re: Green Ash or White Oak in PA?
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Jeff,
>
> I concur with cm below that kiln dried wood will work fine, and I think if
> you search the archives you'll find several other posts that confirm this.
> I used kiln dried white oak that had sat around my shop for about 20
> years. I milled out the ribs to width and thickness, and did not bother to
> pre-soak them--I loaded them dry into the steam box, steamed them for
> about 25-30 minutes, and they bent quite readily. Because I steamed them
> dry, and because this particular white oak was pretty dense and heavy, I
> gave them a few minutes longer than recommended, but I'm not sure that
> they really needed it.
>
> Wetter wood definitely steam bends more easily than drier wood, though, so
> if you want to you can easily bring kiln dried wood back to the moisture
> content of green wood by just soaking it in water, as cm did.
>
> In my opinion, much more important than the green vs. kiln-dried issue is
> to try to find the clearest, straightest grained wood possible. Tiny
> knots, wavy grain and other imperfections can give you problems. Planing
> and sanding the ribs very smooth, and slightly rounding the edges before
> bending helps.
>
> I've only built one boat, so take my advice for what it's worth, but I
> would say if you can get green wood without too much trouble, fine. If
> not, don't hesitate to use air dried or kiln dried--just get the best
> grained board you can find, and all will go well. The main thing is not to
> let this delay your getting started. If your experience is anything like
> mine, once you get going you'll be having so much fun building your boat
> you'll wish you'd started sooner...
>
> Jim
>
> --- In Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com, "cmrv6" <cmrv6@> wrote:
> >
> > I ended up using ash from a lcl hardwood co. Yes it was kiln dried but I
> cut it up soaked it in the pool for 24 hours then steamed it and it worked
> fine. cm
> >
> > --- In Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com, "Jeff" <jlaman@> wrote:
> > >
> > > Does anyone know where to purchase green ash or green white oak in PA
> for ribs (Snowshoe 14)? I anticipated this would be easy, but it's turned
> out not to be. I live in central PA, but am willing to drive a ways or pay
> shipping if need be. Thanks for any suggestions! Jeff
> > >
> >
>

anyone with experience in the seat placment of the snowshoe 14? I'd like to
bring the front seat back another bay to make leg room? cm

anyone with experience in the seat placment of the snowshoe 14? I'd like to bring the front seat back another bay to make leg room? cm

Hello
I am new to this group. I have never built a boat before but I have much
experience with woodworking and creating intricate artifacts. I am considering
several geodesic models for my first attempt. I think the Arrow 14, Snowshoe 14
or a Classic would work on the rivers and lakes here in New Mexico. I would
appreciate any input to help me make a decision for the first boat project.
Ed Bennett