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#1182 From: "gmac49@..." <gmac49@...>
Date: Sat May 28, 2011 8:08 pm
Subject: Yikes 		gmac49...
Send Email Send Email
  
I bought a cheap iron to use on my 16 ft canoe.  It had a heat surge just as I

was finishing attaching the Dacron to gunwales.  So, I now have a 2"x1/2" burn

hole in the Dacron on the gunwale about 18 inches from the stem.  I was planning

on apply another layer of Heat N Bound and patch. But, I am afraid of what will

happen when I shrink the Dacron.  Should I patch it after I shrink?

I would really welcome any and all suggestions.


Reply
#1183 From: Martyn Long <martyn.long@...>
Date: Sat May 28, 2011 8:43 pm
Subject: Re: Yikes 		martyn.long
Send Email Send Email
 
I bet when it happened you said 'oh dear me'.
My commiserations.
However, I reckon you are doing the right thing in patching, rather than ripping it all off.
 
Now, the HeatnBond doesn't really bond to the Dacron, it is a meltable plastic which penetrates a fabric, then solidifies.
This seems fine for a longitudinal pull as you are using all of the surface - but a vertical pull stresses just one small part at a time, and the HeatnBond plastic gives way.
 
You do have a longitudinal bond, but when you shrink the Dacron, you will be using a hotter setting, and the HeatnBond will soften and give way. You might be able to work round it though, by shrinking everywhere else. Tricky. There are usually small wrinkles left close to the gunwale which have to be sort of mopped up, although you could leave them if they were not too big.
 
Dacron is polyester and is funny stuff to glue as the surface is quite inert (doesn't form bonds). You need a specialist system like Loctite Super Glue, All Plastic, which does the trick. It has a priming pen (which presumably activates the surface), then you just superglue as normal with the other tube of glue. This seems to result in a really strong bond, which should be ok to heat - although I have not tried the heating/shrinking myself. Best try it out with a couple of scraps of Dacron first.
You should not need to overlap much - half an inch would be plenty and give lots of strength, then shrink as normal.
 
By the way, if your iron was fluctuating, then you may also have already taken up some of the shrinkage in the Dacron - I certainly did, and only had limited capacity/leeway at the very end (just made it though).
 
I think all irons tend to cycle - heat up, then cool down, so it's best to try to be on the cautious side. Luckily, the iron I used ( also a cheap one) would not burn the Dacron even at it's highest setting.
 
Cheers

From: "gmac49@..." <gmac49@...>
To: Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, 28 May 2011, 21:08
Subject: [Airolite_Boats] Yikes

 
I bought a cheap iron to use on my 16 ft canoe. It had a heat surge just as I was finishing attaching the Dacron to gunwales. So, I now have a 2"x1/2" burn hole in the Dacron on the gunwale about 18 inches from the stem. I was planning on apply another layer of Heat N Bound and patch. But, I am afraid of what will happen when I shrink the Dacron. Should I patch it after I shrink?
I would really welcome any and all suggestions.




Reply
#1184 From: "Aaron Wood" <a_wood_@...>
Date: Sun May 29, 2011 1:35 am
Subject: Re: Yikes 		a_wood_...
Send Email Send Email
 
Shrink it first, then patch. Its pretty easy to patch actually. I have my iron set up with two marks, one is Heat n'Bond activation temp and the next shrink temp. Once you've shrunk the fabric, cut yourself a patch, preferably with pinking shears, 2" overlap at least. Apply the heat n' bond, glue it on and gently shrink the centre only till its tight. While you shrink try not to re-activate the glue, just pass over the glued area briefly if needed.

I cut the fabric on the bottom of my Arrow 14 running through a little rapid. Whatever did it was pretty sharp, probably glass or metal. The cut was 8" long, the patch took less than 10 min to do, and a few minutes more to paint. Its barely noticeable now. Very easily accomplished.

Hope that helps!

Aaron

Sent from my BlackBerry

From: Martyn Long <martyn.long@...>
Sender: Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com
Date: Sat, 28 May 2011 21:43:38 +0100 (BST)
To: Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com<Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com>
ReplyTo: Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Airolite_Boats] Yikes

 

I bet when it happened you said 'oh dear me'.
My commiserations.
However, I reckon you are doing the right thing in patching, rather than ripping it all off.
 
Now, the HeatnBond doesn't really bond to the Dacron, it is a meltable plastic which penetrates a fabric, then solidifies.
This seems fine for a longitudinal pull as you are using all of the surface - but a vertical pull stresses just one small part at a time, and the HeatnBond plastic gives way.
 
You do have a longitudinal bond, but when you shrink the Dacron, you will be using a hotter setting, and the HeatnBond will soften and give way. You might be able to work round it though, by shrinking everywhere else. Tricky. There are usually small wrinkles left close to the gunwale which have to be sort of mopped up, although you could leave them if they were not too big.
 
Dacron is polyester and is funny stuff to glue as the surface is quite inert (doesn't form bonds). You need a specialist system like Loctite Super Glue, All Plastic, which does the trick. It has a priming pen (which presumably activates the surface), then you just superglue as normal with the other tube of glue. This seems to result in a really strong bond, which should be ok to heat - although I have not tried the heating/shrinking myself. Best try it out with a couple of scraps of Dacron first.
You should not need to overlap much - half an inch would be plenty and give lots of strength, then shrink as normal.
 
By the way, if your iron was fluctuating, then you may also have already taken up some of the shrinkage in the Dacron - I certainly did, and only had limited capacity/leeway at the very end (just made it though).
 
I think all irons tend to cycle - heat up, then cool down, so it's best to try to be on the cautious side. Luckily, the iron I used ( also a cheap one) would not burn the Dacron even at it's highest setting.
 
Cheers

From: "gmac49@..." <gmac49@...>
To: Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, 28 May 2011, 21:08
Subject: [Airolite_Boats] Yikes

 
I bought a cheap iron to use on my 16 ft canoe. It had a heat surge just as I was finishing attaching the Dacron to gunwales. So, I now have a 2"x1/2" burn hole in the Dacron on the gunwale about 18 inches from the stem. I was planning on apply another layer of Heat N Bound and patch. But, I am afraid of what will happen when I shrink the Dacron. Should I patch it after I shrink?
I would really welcome any and all suggestions.




Reply
#1187 From: gmac49 <gmac49@...>
Date: Mon May 30, 2011 11:52 am
Subject: Re: Yikes 		gmac49...
Send Email Send Email
 
Aaron,
Thanks for the help.

From: Aaron Wood <a_wood_@...>
To: Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sat, May 28, 2011 9:35:28 PM
Subject: Re: [Airolite_Boats] Yikes

 

Shrink it first, then patch. Its pretty easy to patch actually. I have my iron set up with two marks, one is Heat n'Bond activation temp and the next shrink temp. Once you've shrunk the fabric, cut yourself a patch, preferably with pinking shears, 2" overlap at least. Apply the heat n' bond, glue it on and gently shrink the centre only till its tight. While you shrink try not to re-activate the glue, just pass over the glued area briefly if needed.

I cut the fabric on the bottom of my Arrow 14 running through a little rapid. Whatever did it was pretty sharp, probably glass or metal. The cut was 8" long, the patch took less than 10 min to do, and a few minutes more to paint. Its barely noticeable now. Very easily accomplished.

Hope that helps!

Aaron

Sent from my BlackBerry

From: Martyn Long <martyn.long@...>
Sender: Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com
Date: Sat, 28 May 2011 21:43:38 +0100 (BST)
To: Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com<Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com>
ReplyTo: Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Airolite_Boats] Yikes

 

I bet when it happened you said 'oh dear me'.
My commiserations.
However, I reckon you are doing the right thing in patching, rather than ripping it all off.
 
Now, the HeatnBond doesn't really bond to the Dacron, it is a meltable plastic which penetrates a fabric, then solidifies.
This seems fine for a longitudinal pull as you are using all of the surface - but a vertical pull stresses just one small part at a time, and the HeatnBond plastic gives way.
 
You do have a longitudinal bond, but when you shrink the Dacron, you will be using a hotter setting, and the HeatnBond will soften and give way. You might be able to work round it though, by shrinking everywhere else. Tricky. There are usually small wrinkles left close to the gunwale which have to be sort of mopped up, although you could leave them if they were not too big.
 
Dacron is polyester and is funny stuff to glue as the surface is quite inert (doesn't form bonds). You need a specialist system like Loctite Super Glue, All Plastic, which does the trick. It has a priming pen (which presumably activates the surface), then you just superglue as normal with the other tube of glue. This seems to result in a really strong bond, which should be ok to heat - although I have not tried the heating/shrinking myself. Best try it out with a couple of scraps of Dacron first.
You should not need to overlap much - half an inch would be plenty and give lots of strength, then shrink as normal.
 
By the way, if your iron was fluctuating, then you may also have already taken up some of the shrinkage in the Dacron - I certainly did, and only had limited capacity/leeway at the very end (just made it though).
 
I think all irons tend to cycle - heat up, then cool down, so it's best to try to be on the cautious side. Luckily, the iron I used ( also a cheap one) would not burn the Dacron even at it's highest setting.
 
Cheers

From: "gmac49@..." <gmac49@...>
To: Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, 28 May 2011, 21:08
Subject: [Airolite_Boats] Yikes

 
I bought a cheap iron to use on my 16 ft canoe. It had a heat surge just as I was finishing attaching the Dacron to gunwales. So, I now have a 2"x1/2" burn hole in the Dacron on the gunwale about 18 inches from the stem. I was planning on apply another layer of Heat N Bound and patch. But, I am afraid of what will happen when I shrink the Dacron. Should I patch it after I shrink?
I would really welcome any and all suggestions.




Reply
#1185 From: Bassman4940 <bassman4940@...>
Date: Sun May 29, 2011 1:37 am
Subject: Re: Yikes 		bassman4940
Send Email Send Email
 
Hi Gmac,
You indicated that the burn hole was on the gunwale (or very close to it), you may want to consider just making your gunwale strips a little bigger than the plans call for and that will cover it up.  Attaching the gunwale will sandwich the dacron around it and it probably won't even be noticible.  
Just a thought...   Good luck!


--- On Sat, 5/28/11, Martyn Long <martyn.long@...> wrote:

From: Martyn Long <martyn.long@...>
Subject: Re: [Airolite_Boats] Yikes
To: "Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com" <Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Saturday, May 28, 2011, 4:43 PM

 

I bet when it happened you said 'oh dear me'.
My commiserations.
However, I reckon you are doing the right thing in patching, rather than ripping it all off.
 
Now, the HeatnBond doesn't really bond to the Dacron, it is a meltable plastic which penetrates a fabric, then solidifies.
This seems fine for a longitudinal pull as you are using all of the surface - but a vertical pull stresses just one small part at a time, and the HeatnBond plastic gives way.
 
You do have a longitudinal bond, but when you shrink the Dacron, you will be using a hotter setting, and the HeatnBond will soften and give way. You might be able to work round it though, by shrinking everywhere else. Tricky. There are usually small wrinkles left close to the gunwale which have to be sort of mopped up, although you could leave them if they were not too big.
 
Dacron is polyester and is funny stuff to glue as the surface is quite inert (doesn't form bonds). You need a specialist system like Loctite Super Glue, All Plastic, which does the trick. It has a priming pen (which presumably activates the surface), then you just superglue as normal with the other tube of glue. This seems to result in a really strong bond, which should be ok to heat - although I have not tried the heating/shrinking myself. Best try it out with a couple of scraps of Dacron first.
You should not need to overlap much - half an inch would be plenty and give lots of strength, then shrink as normal.
 
By the way, if your iron was fluctuating, then you may also have already taken up some of the shrinkage in the Dacron - I certainly did, and only had limited capacity/leeway at the very end (just made it though).
 
I think all irons tend to cycle - heat up, then cool down, so it's best to try to be on the cautious side. Luckily, the iron I used ( also a cheap one) would not burn the Dacron even at it's highest setting.
 
Cheers

From: "gmac49@..." <gmac49@...>
To: Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, 28 May 2011, 21:08
Subject: [Airolite_Boats] Yikes

 
I bought a cheap iron to use on my 16 ft canoe. It had a heat surge just as I was finishing attaching the Dacron to gunwales. So, I now have a 2"x1/2" burn hole in the Dacron on the gunwale about 18 inches from the stem. I was planning on apply another layer of Heat N Bound and patch. But, I am afraid of what will happen when I shrink the Dacron. Should I patch it after I shrink?
I would really welcome any and all suggestions.




Reply
#1188 From: gmac49 <gmac49@...>
Date: Mon May 30, 2011 11:53 am
Subject: Re: Yikes 		gmac49...
Send Email Send Email
 
Good thought, more than one way.....


From: Bassman4940 <bassman4940@...>
To: Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sat, May 28, 2011 9:37:49 PM
Subject: Re: [Airolite_Boats] Yikes

 

Hi Gmac,
You indicated that the burn hole was on the gunwale (or very close to it), you may want to consider just making your gunwale strips a little bigger than the plans call for and that will cover it up.  Attaching the gunwale will sandwich the dacron around it and it probably won't even be noticible.  
Just a thought...   Good luck!


--- On Sat, 5/28/11, Martyn Long <martyn.long@...> wrote:

From: Martyn Long <martyn.long@...>
Subject: Re: [Airolite_Boats] Yikes
To: "Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com" <Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Saturday, May 28, 2011, 4:43 PM

 

I bet when it happened you said 'oh dear me'.
My commiserations.
However, I reckon you are doing the right thing in patching, rather than ripping it all off.
 
Now, the HeatnBond doesn't really bond to the Dacron, it is a meltable plastic which penetrates a fabric, then solidifies.
This seems fine for a longitudinal pull as you are using all of the surface - but a vertical pull stresses just one small part at a time, and the HeatnBond plastic gives way.
 
You do have a longitudinal bond, but when you shrink the Dacron, you will be using a hotter setting, and the HeatnBond will soften and give way. You might be able to work round it though, by shrinking everywhere else. Tricky. There are usually small wrinkles left close to the gunwale which have to be sort of mopped up, although you could leave them if they were not too big.
 
Dacron is polyester and is funny stuff to glue as the surface is quite inert (doesn't form bonds). You need a specialist system like Loctite Super Glue, All Plastic, which does the trick. It has a priming pen (which presumably activates the surface), then you just superglue as normal with the other tube of glue. This seems to result in a really strong bond, which should be ok to heat - although I have not tried the heating/shrinking myself. Best try it out with a couple of scraps of Dacron first.
You should not need to overlap much - half an inch would be plenty and give lots of strength, then shrink as normal.
 
By the way, if your iron was fluctuating, then you may also have already taken up some of the shrinkage in the Dacron - I certainly did, and only had limited capacity/leeway at the very end (just made it though).
 
I think all irons tend to cycle - heat up, then cool down, so it's best to try to be on the cautious side. Luckily, the iron I used ( also a cheap one) would not burn the Dacron even at it's highest setting.
 
Cheers

From: "gmac49@..." <gmac49@...>
To: Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, 28 May 2011, 21:08
Subject: [Airolite_Boats] Yikes

 
I bought a cheap iron to use on my 16 ft canoe. It had a heat surge just as I was finishing attaching the Dacron to gunwales. So, I now have a 2"x1/2" burn hole in the Dacron on the gunwale about 18 inches from the stem. I was planning on apply another layer of Heat N Bound and patch. But, I am afraid of what will happen when I shrink the Dacron. Should I patch it after I shrink?
I would really welcome any and all suggestions.




Reply
#1186 From: gmac49 <gmac49@...>
Date: Mon May 30, 2011 11:51 am
Subject: Re: Yikes 		gmac49...
Send Email Send Email
 
"on dear me" is not exactly what I said; but close.  
Thanks for the advise.

From: Martyn Long <martyn.long@...>
To: "Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com" <Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sat, May 28, 2011 4:43:38 PM
Subject: Re: [Airolite_Boats] Yikes

 

I bet when it happened you said 'oh dear me'.
My commiserations.
However, I reckon you are doing the right thing in patching, rather than ripping it all off.
 
Now, the HeatnBond doesn't really bond to the Dacron, it is a meltable plastic which penetrates a fabric, then solidifies.
This seems fine for a longitudinal pull as you are using all of the surface - but a vertical pull stresses just one small part at a time, and the HeatnBond plastic gives way.
 
You do have a longitudinal bond, but when you shrink the Dacron, you will be using a hotter setting, and the HeatnBond will soften and give way. You might be able to work round it though, by shrinking everywhere else. Tricky. There are usually small wrinkles left close to the gunwale which have to be sort of mopped up, although you could leave them if they were not too big.
 
Dacron is polyester and is funny stuff to glue as the surface is quite inert (doesn't form bonds). You need a specialist system like Loctite Super Glue, All Plastic, which does the trick. It has a priming pen (which presumably activates the surface), then you just superglue as normal with the other tube of glue. This seems to result in a really strong bond, which should be ok to heat - although I have not tried the heating/shrinking myself. Best try it out with a couple of scraps of Dacron first.
You should not need to overlap much - half an inch would be plenty and give lots of strength, then shrink as normal.
 
By the way, if your iron was fluctuating, then you may also have already taken up some of the shrinkage in the Dacron - I certainly did, and only had limited capacity/leeway at the very end (just made it though).
 
I think all irons tend to cycle - heat up, then cool down, so it's best to try to be on the cautious side. Luckily, the iron I used ( also a cheap one) would not burn the Dacron even at it's highest setting.
 
Cheers

From: "gmac49@..." <gmac49@...>
To: Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, 28 May 2011, 21:08
Subject: [Airolite_Boats] Yikes

 
I bought a cheap iron to use on my 16 ft canoe. It had a heat surge just as I was finishing attaching the Dacron to gunwales. So, I now have a 2"x1/2" burn hole in the Dacron on the gunwale about 18 inches from the stem. I was planning on apply another layer of Heat N Bound and patch. But, I am afraid of what will happen when I shrink the Dacron. Should I patch it after I shrink?
I would really welcome any and all suggestions.




Reply
 
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