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Eilat Mazar finds another seal   Message List  
Reply | Forward Message #7127 of 11633 |
Re: [ANE-2] Eilat Mazar finds another seal

Dear Itzhaq,

I just had a chat with Eilat Mazar and can now understand why she suggests the
reading 'tmh'. As words can be read mirrorwise during the Persian period (this
is often also the case with the famous YHD stamps) she reads the seal from right
to left (normally the inscriptions go from left to right as the seal is always
incised mirrorwise in order to get the 'right to left' impression on the bulla).
I told her about my reading and she found that it was interesting, but as she
had little time she could not check it now. Indeed more work must be done and
careful comparison with other seals is an absolute prerequisite. She felt that
reading a 'shin' would be somewhat problematic as the incised letter on the seal
depicts two 'V's written slightly across each other. But I believe that this is
not a problem at all. For this type has good parallels in the late Iron Age and
Persian periods. (parallels can be found in N. Avigad and Benny Sass' Corpus of
West Semitic Stamp Seals e.g. WSS 805, 1071).

Reading a 'het' here also requests that the letter had two vertical strokes on
the left, which is very unusual. The only problem with my reading is that the
'lamed' would have been executed merely as a vertical long stroke without a
horizontal side bar. This may be due to the carelessness of the engraver, but
needs to be observed and parallels for this need to be found.

Hence two readings stand at the moment:

'tmh' (i.e. reading the 'wrong' way round) as per Eilat Mazar,
'sh-l-m-t' (i.e. reading the 'right' way round) as per my suggestion,

Best wishes

Peter van der Veen PhD
-------- Original-Nachricht --------
> Datum: Thu, 17 Jan 2008 13:12:07 +0100
> Von: "Peter van der Veen" <van_der_Veen@...>
> An: ANE-2@yahoogroups.com
> Betreff: Re: [ANE-2] Eilat Mazar finds another seal

> Dear Yitzhaq,
>
> I looked at the picture of the seal very carefully. Indeed the iconography
> with the two flanking worshippers at the altar does suggest a date
> somewhere in the 6th or 5th cent. BC. The name however does not seem to read
> 'temech' at all. I do not understand how such a reading came about. I suggest
> reading 'Schelomit' (sh-l-m-t) and already have had confirmations from
> colleagues with whom I shared the find this morning.
>
> best wishes
> Peter van der Veen PhD
>
> -------- Original-Nachricht --------
> > Datum: Thu, 17 Jan 2008 14:05:43 +0200
> > Von: "Yitzhak Sapir" <yitzhaksapir@...>
> > An: biblical-studies@yahoogroups.com, canaanite@yahoogroups.com,
> ane-2@yahoogroups.com
> > Betreff: [ANE-2] Eilat Mazar finds another seal
>
> > According to the Jerusalem Post, pointed out by Joseph Lauer and a
> reader
> > on Jim West's blog, Eilat Mazar found another seal during excavations:
> >
> >
>
http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1200475897717&pagename=JPost%2FJPArti\
cle%2FShowFull

> >
> > The seal reads "tmx" (TamaH) and Mazar dates it to 538-445 BCE. It
> > includes
> > an image of two priests sacrificing to the moon god Sin. A photo of
> > the seal is
> > included in the above link.
> >
> > Yitzhak Sapir



Thu Jan 17, 2008 12:53 pm

shedsunefertem
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Message #7127 of 11633 |
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According to the Jerusalem Post, pointed out by Joseph Lauer and a reader on Jim West's blog, Eilat Mazar found another seal during excavations: ...
Yitzhak Sapir
ysapir
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Jan 17, 2008
12:08 pm

Dear Yitzhaq, I looked at the picture of the seal very carefully. Indeed the iconography with the two flanking worshippers at the altar does suggest a date...
Peter van der Veen
shedsunefertem
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Jan 17, 2008
12:41 pm

Could it be that you and Mazar are reading the seal from opposite directions, you from left to right and she from right to left? Obviously if the letters on...
victor
victor@...
Send Email
Jan 17, 2008
12:54 pm

Dear Itzhaq, I just had a chat with Eilat Mazar and can now understand why she suggests the reading 'tmh'. As words can be read mirrorwise during the Persian...
Peter van der Veen
shedsunefertem
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Jan 17, 2008
12:58 pm

I presume that you are reading L -> R rather than R -> L. george gfsomsel search for truth, hear truth, learn truth, love truth, speak the truth, hold the...
George F Somsel
gfsomsel
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Jan 17, 2008
3:54 pm

Ah! It just occured to me. In a seal it would be carved so as to reproduce in the the opposite direction. My error. george gfsomsel search for truth,...
George F Somsel
gfsomsel
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Jan 17, 2008
3:54 pm

It is instructive how the rush to press produced a mis-identification of the patron god of Babylon, Marduk not Sin. Alas there is nothing in the imagery of the...
Trudy Kawami
corvina_9
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Jan 17, 2008
4:54 pm

As I suggested to Jim West on his excellent site a little while ago, I do not see "TMX" but in comparing the script to earlier seal and ostraca scripts as well...
Jack Kilmon
jkilmon_2000
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Jan 17, 2008
7:03 pm

It is unlikely that the seal shows Inanna mourning or worshipping Tammuz(Dummuzi) as these Sumerian deities were not worshipped in the first millennium BCE. As...
Trudy Kawami
corvina_9
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Jan 17, 2008
7:21 pm

Could this seal be interpreted as Jewish priests burning incense at the time of the new moon? Joan Griffith...
Joan Griffith
despinne
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Jan 17, 2008
7:42 pm

The cult of Tammuz was alive and well in first millennium Israel. Cf. Ezek. 8:14. However, I agree that it is unlikely that the iconography of this seal ...
Robert M Whiting
whiting35
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Jan 17, 2008
9:56 pm

It appears to me to be the seal of the owner of the $almāta pizzeria located in the lower east side of the city. Notice the two cooks spinning the dough! ...
Kevin P. Edgecomb
kedgecom2002
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Jan 17, 2008
10:04 pm

I am aware of the paucity of exemplar iconographic material from Iron IIc Jerusalem but was focussing primarily on the inscription which does look to me like...
Jack Kilmon
jkilmon_2000
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Jan 18, 2008
12:26 am

... To make my objections to the interpretation of the iconography as Tammuz worship more clear: a) Seal inscriptions seldom, if ever, describe the scene...
Robert M Whiting
whiting35
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Jan 18, 2008
10:53 am

Dear Dr. Van Der Veen and Others: Hi!!! This is Michael Welch from Deltona, Florida. I, of course believe that Dr. Van Der Veen has it correct. The tsade is...
lmlkes
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Jan 18, 2008
10:51 pm

Dear List, Hi!!! I should have previously said tsade and Shin. I left out Shin. I just looked up the Hestrin and Dayagi-Mendels number 97 seal mentioned by Dr....
lmlkes
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Jan 18, 2008
10:51 pm

Booooo george gfsomsel search for truth, hear truth, learn truth, love truth, speak the truth, hold the truth, defend the truth till death. - Jan Hus ...
George F Somsel
gfsomsel
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Jan 18, 2008
12:26 am

Dear list, Ammonite seals of this sort have been found in the past and have been documented. For those interested, please see Hestrin and Dayagi-Michaels....
Phil Jones
taesan
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Jan 18, 2008
5:20 pm

... This is a very pertinent parallel. The seal shows two worshippers flanking an altar of very similar shape, except there is no crescent at the top of the ...
Yitzhak Sapir
ysapir
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Jan 19, 2008
4:59 pm
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